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Kamikuza said..

Macroscien said..

Kamikuza said..

remery said..
Or if the product had not been invented, many people would have died and the health system collapsed.

Data disagrees. Mo' vaccines, mo' death.



And the UK saw the same lack of hospital "collapse" that models predicted. Remember the Nightingale hospitals that were built in early 2020 to cope with the flood of patients? Yeah, they all shut down in a couple of months because there were no patients.



If the products are as effective as you claim they are... why don't we see that in the data?

Don't you see description on the left?
Death Rate among SEVERE CASES.

What if vaccination cause that people almost do not suffer SEVERE ? almost non at all? If protection is 99.995% and just one person get suffer and died?

Probably not.
You cant see or understand relation in this graph.

This is a mainly reason that complicated stuff should be left to specialists in area to analyze, not just plain mob drawing missleading conclusions. That statement could be true re all fields of expertise.

Top graph? Severe cases are by definition those that require hospitalization...

You're making spurious connections and that point is invalid.

What the data is showing is that the more vaccines you have, when you develop a severe case of COVID you are at higher risk of negative outcomes ie. death.

Vaccines protecting from severe cases would be a different data set ... but what that data is showing is again mo' vaccine, mo' severe cases, especially for those at greater risk of COVID ie. over 60s. It really isn't looking good for mRNA vaccines, which is disappointing.

The vaccines are promoted as giving protection from death and severe illness (ie. hospitalization) and ... they just don't. Even Pfizer/Moderna admit that "protection" is somewhere in the order of 30% and wanes rapidly, requiring multiple boosters and we see how well that works with side-effects of negative outcomes and other complications.

You're right, this is complicated stuff ... that has been dumbed down by experts in their field for general consumption. I can't see how you can argue with the data in the top graph, it really is quite simple.

OK so you are telling us that your
field of expertise and full time job is
pulling trolleys at busy supermarket.

But now you want to give us sound medical advice ! (?)

You have actually no idea what are you talking above,
Similarly to your audience that can not even differentiate between nonsense and utter nonsense.

To close this exchange I will ask you to show us : The graph from the same Israelites source presenting:

Total death due to COVID

divided by this 3 categories:
-non vaccinated
-vaccinated
- and those with added booster
Total must come to 100%

In simple language.This graph will tell us how many people that died from Covid have been vaccinated and how many hasn't.

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Flying Dutchman said..
Wonder if Australian media will touch this.




twitter.com/davidzweig/status/1607378386338340867

Elon is re tweeting this now ,so its out there.

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Rango said..

Flying Dutchman said..
Wonder if Australian media will touch this.




twitter.com/davidzweig/status/1607378386338340867

Elon is re tweeting this now ,so its out there.

Yep Elon is your expert here, now

He could give you best advice now:

How to loose 150 bln dollars
of personal wealth in 1 year!

I gave a guy advice how to build better rockets once, but Elon didn't listen.
His rockets crap is stack on Earth and self driving cars do not drive by themselves , drilling tunnels failed, solar tiles faded,
tweteter squicking quicking , Hyper loop belly up, all his ladies left , and
by the end of year 2023 will be as rich as FTX bitcoin Sam

Opps Starlink still works by Ukras don't want to pay a penny, so doesn't count as success too.

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Flying Dutchman said..
But Bill said the vax was safe?

So, what is your point?

As a wind up, a while back I posted on here my genuine reaction to "the vaccine". I think I got a few people telling me that they told me so. I then revealed that it was the tetanus booster that I was talking about. People forget that this can be a normal reaction to vaccination. This woman in your video talks about these sorts of reactions to Moderna.

I have had Moderna after two doses of Pfizer, and I think I had a headache for a day or so. It was like I had a cold. Isn't that what people would expect? Afterall you are dosing the body with something that looks like a cold virus and the body tries to fight it off. Which heats up the body and generates a response to the virus. At least I think that's what a healthy immune system is supposed to do. I would be a little bit worried if it just sat there and ignored the invading virus completely....

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FormulaNova said..

Flying Dutchman said..
But Bill said the vax was safe?

So, what is your point?

As a wind up, a while back I posted on here my genuine reaction to "the vaccine". I think I got a few people telling me that they told me so. I then revealed that it was the tetanus booster that I was talking about. People forget that this can be a normal reaction to vaccination. This woman in your video talks about these sorts of reactions to Moderna.

I have had Moderna after two doses of Pfizer, and I think I had a headache for a day or so. It was like I had a cold. Isn't that what people would expect? Afterall you are dosing the body with something that looks like a cold virus and the body tries to fight it off. Which heats up the body and generates a response to the virus. At least I think that's what a healthy immune system is supposed to do. I would be a little bit worried if it just sat there and ignored the invading virus completely....

For some time I read your posts FN
I must that sadly I can not disagree
with you completely.
So I kept quiet.

That must be that new big Pumpkin head with light ON.

Now you radiate all that wisdom to whole SB community.

My role is finish here..

Getting us in a state of confusion so we just turn off and do not try to rebel. These two nail it.




gab.com/SonOfEnos/posts/109583976696055480


gab.com/BeachMilk/posts/109584784282519031

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Pcdefender said..
Getting us in a state of confusion so we just turn off and do not try to rebel. These two nail it.




gab.com/SonOfEnos/posts/109583976696055480


gab.com/BeachMilk/posts/109584784282519031

Using gab.com as a source, lol
Says it all.

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sgo said..

Pcdefender said..
Getting us in a state of confusion so we just turn off and do not try to rebel. These two nail it.




gab.com/SonOfEnos/posts/109583976696055480


gab.com/BeachMilk/posts/109584784282519031

Using gab.com as a source, lol
Says it all.

Thanks for the pointer. I guess if reality doesn't suit the CTers, then they can make their own.

It does worry me a bit though. If you are crazy and make your own echo chamber with other crazies, you will no doubt begin to believe everything and that everyone is out to get you and everything is a conspiracy.

"Gab is an American alt-tech microblogging and social networking service known for its far-right userbase.[2][3][4][5] Widely described as a haven for neo-Nazis, racists, white supremacists, white nationalists, antisemites, the alt-right, supporters of Donald Trump, conservatives, right-libertarians, and believers in conspiracy theories such as QAnon,[6] "

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Pcdefender said..do not try to rebel.

What a rebel you are posting CT stuff on a water sports forum.

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hilly said..
I think they (nut bag CTists) are just not happy with life and need something (one) to blame as they perceive they drew the short straw in life. They really need to get out and smell the roses because we live in an amazing time. Western society is so rich and safe compared to anything in the past. My parents lived through WW2 getting bombed every night. Not much I can complain about growing up in Oz in the 70s and 80s.

I'm curious... are you talking about flat earthers who refuse to take any of the long established and well tested standard vaccines, (polio, measles etc. that have been proven to be both extremely safe and effective) etc, or are you talking about the people on this forum who have always taken all the recommended childhood vaccinations, but who's life has now been ruined from trying to do the right thing to stop the spread of COVID by taking a vaccine they were told was safe, only to later find out that the vaccine wasn't even tested for it's ability to prevent transmission of the virus and now have serious debilitating health effects as a result? Yes, be glad it's not you that has gone from being a competitor in the state running titles and leading goal scorer in your netball competition, to being barely able to walk or sit and are now bedridden for 95% of the day from a condition that specialist doctors acknowledge was caused by the vaccine and that the Australian government and major world health authorities now recognise as a known side effect of the vaccine.

Drew a short straw? Had a choice to refuse taking it? All 5 out of 5 members of my household would have lost their jobs if they didn't get vaccinated. Plus it was safe and needed to stop the spread, right? Well, 4 out of 5 in my household have now caught COVID, but not until after being triple-vaxxed, which aligns with the experience of most of my extended family and friends. Sure, implement general isolation until anyone that wants to get vaccinated has had the chance to weigh up the pros and cons and get jabbed if they wish, but just what was achieved by coercing everyone to do so?

I think someone in an age group that had minimal risk of having serious symptoms from COVID, but who took the 'safe' vaccine to protect the elderly and can now only stand or sit for a few minutes a day as a result has a fair reason to not be happy with what has happened. You think Kerryn Phelps, former president of the AMA is making her story up? Several people close to this forum are affected....my daughter knows 2 other girls in her circle of friends that have also developed her 'very rare' condition, but most of this is being reported in official statistics.

Again, please explain which bit of this is CT?

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Harrow said..
I'm curious... are you talking about flat earthers who refuse to take any of the long established and well tested standard vaccines, (polio, measles etc. that have been proven to be both extremely safe and effective) etc, or are you talking about the people on this forum who have always taken all the recommended childhood vaccinations, but who's life has now been ruined from trying to do the right thing to stop the spread of COVID by taking a vaccine they were told was safe, only to later find out that the vaccine wasn't even tested for it's ability to prevent transmission of the virus and now have serious debilitating health effects as a result? Yes, be glad it's not you that has gone from being a competitor in the state running titles and leading goal scorer in your netball competition, to being barely able to walk or sit and are now bedridden for 95% of the day from a condition that specialist doctors acknowledge was caused by the vaccine and that the Australian government and major world health authorities now recognise as a known side effect of the vaccine.

Drew a short straw? Had a choice to refuse taking it? All 5 out of 5 members of my household would have lost their jobs if they didn't get vaccinated. Plus it was safe and needed to stop the spread, right? Well, 4 out of 5 in my household have now caught COVID, but not until after being triple-vaxxed, which continues to be the experience amongst the most of my extended family and friends as well. Sure, implement general isolation until anyone that wants to get vaccinated has had the chance to do so, but just what was achieved by coercing everyone to do so?

I think someone in an age group that had minimal risk of having serious symptoms from COVID, but who took the 'safe' vaccine to protect the elderly and can now only stand or sit for a few minutes a day as a result has a fair reason to not be happy with what has happened. You think Kerryn Phelps, former president of the AMA is making her story up? Several people close to this forum are affected....my daughter knows 2 other girls in her circle of friends that have also developed her 'very rare' condition, but none of this is being reported in official statistics.

Again, please explain which bit of this is CT?

Is there something in particular that makes you believe it's the vaccine that made your family members ill and not long covid?

I hope your family members recover.

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myscreenname said..
Is there something in particular that makes you believe it's the vaccine that made your family members ill and not long covid?

I hope your family members recover.

They developed their illness well before catching COVID and it is unlikely that any of us had COVID without knowing as the whole family was testing twice a week right through isolation due to work requirements.

P.S. Genuine thanks for the well wishes.

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FormulaNova said..

"Gab is an American alt-tech microblogging and social networking service known for its far-right userbase.[2][3][4][5] Widely described as a haven for neo-Nazis, racists, white supremacists, white nationalists, antisemites, the alt-right, supporters of Donald Trump, conservatives, right-libertarians, and believers in conspiracy theories such as QAnon,[6] "

" Nature is a British weekly scientific journal founded and based in London, England. As a multidisciplinary publication, Nature features peer-reviewed research from a variety of academic disciplines, mainly in science and technology. It has core editorial offices across the United States, continental Europe, and Asia under the international scientific publishing company Springer Nature. Nature was one of the world's most cited scientific journals by the Science Edition of the 2019 Journal Citation Reports (with an ascribed impact factor of 42.778),[1] making it one of the world's most-read and most prestigious academic journals."

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Harrow said..

hilly said..
I think they (nut bag CTists) are just not happy with life and need something (one) to blame as they perceive they drew the short straw in life. They really need to get out and smell the roses because we live in an amazing time. Western society is so rich and safe compared to anything in the past. My parents lived through WW2 getting bombed every night. Not much I can complain about growing up in Oz in the 70s and 80s.

I'm curious... are you talking about flat earthers who refuse to take any of the long established and well tested standard vaccines, (polio, measles etc. that have been proven to be both extremely safe and effective) etc, or are you talking about the people on this forum who have always taken all the recommended childhood vaccinations, but who's life has now been ruined from trying to do the right thing to stop the spread of COVID by taking a vaccine they were told was safe, only to later find out that the vaccine wasn't even tested for it's ability to prevent transmission of the virus and now have serious debilitating health effects as a result? Yes, be glad it's not you that has gone from being a competitor in the state running titles and leading goal scorer in your netball competition, to being barely able to walk or sit and are now bedridden for 95% of the day from a condition that specialist doctors acknowledge was caused by the vaccine and that the Australian government and major world health authorities now recognise as a known side effect of the vaccine.

Drew a short straw? Had a choice to refuse taking it? All 5 out of 5 members of my household would have lost their jobs if they didn't get vaccinated. Plus it was safe and needed to stop the spread, right? Well, 4 out of 5 in my household have now caught COVID, but not until after being triple-vaxxed, which aligns with the experience of most of my extended family and friends. Sure, implement general isolation until anyone that wants to get vaccinated has had the chance to do so, but just what was achieved by coercing everyone to do so?

I think someone in an age group that had minimal risk of having serious symptoms from COVID, but who took the 'safe' vaccine to protect the elderly and can now only stand or sit for a few minutes a day as a result has a fair reason to not be happy with what has happened. You think Kerryn Phelps, former president of the AMA is making her story up? Several people close to this forum are affected....my daughter knows 2 other girls in her circle of friends that have also developed her 'very rare' condition, but none of this is being reported in official statistics.

Again, please explain which bit of this is CT?

My main point is that it is a water sports site. There are better places to moan and post crap from gab.com.

You say none of this is being reported in official sites, but:

More than 64 million vaccine doses have been administered across the country, as of November 16, and since December 2021 people injured by one have been able to make a claim for compensation through the vaccine claims scheme. A Services Australia spokesperson said as of November 23, the department has received 3100 applications, and 79 have been approved for claims totalling $3.9 million.

Forgot to mention this is about a liver diet and steroids. So how it got onto Covid and CTs is anyones guess.

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hilly said..
My main point is that it is a water sports site. There are better places to moan and post crap from gab.com.

You say none of this is being reported in official sites, but:

More than 64 million vaccine doses have been administered across the country, as of November 16, and since December 2021 people injured by one have been able to make a claim for compensation through the vaccine claims scheme. A Services Australia spokesperson said as of November 23, the department has received 3100 applications, and 79 have been approved for claims totalling $3.9 million.

I'm not talking about money, I'm talking about young lives pointlessly ruined. There'd could be some solace in knowing that although you were one of the unlucky ones negatively affected by the vaccine, that at least you did your part in limiting it spreading. But contracting COVID after being triple-vaxxed and then having to isolate to protect grandparents was a pretty bitter pill to swallow that crystalised the senseless tragedy of it all.

P.S. Fixed my post for you, 'most' of this isn't being reported in official statistics. As Kerryn, and many others, have said, there is a strong incentive for doctors not to report, while COVID deaths are over reported due to their definition.

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hilly said..
Forgot to mention this is about a liver diet and steroids. So how it got onto Covid and CTs is anyones guess.

Surely you've been on this forum long enough to know that having a thread remain on topic for more than two posts is the exception rather than the rule.

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Harrow said..But contracting COVID after being triple-vaxxed and then having to isolate to protect grandparents was a pretty bitter pill to swallow that crystalised the senseless tragedy of it all.

However, if there was no vaccine the outcome would have been worse.

Over and out. Off to the beach for a wingding.

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hilly said..

Harrow said..

hilly said..
I think they (nut bag CTists) are just not happy with life and need something (one) to blame as they perceive they drew the short straw in life. They really need to get out and smell the roses because we live in an amazing time. Western society is so rich and safe compared to anything in the past. My parents lived through WW2 getting bombed every night. Not much I can complain about growing up in Oz in the 70s and 80s.

I'm curious... are you talking about flat earthers who refuse to take any of the long established and well tested standard vaccines, (polio, measles etc. that have been proven to be both extremely safe and effective) etc, or are you talking about the people on this forum who have always taken all the recommended childhood vaccinations, but who's life has now been ruined from trying to do the right thing to stop the spread of COVID by taking a vaccine they were told was safe, only to later find out that the vaccine wasn't even tested for it's ability to prevent transmission of the virus and now have serious debilitating health effects as a result? Yes, be glad it's not you that has gone from being a competitor in the state running titles and leading goal scorer in your netball competition, to being barely able to walk or sit and are now bedridden for 95% of the day from a condition that specialist doctors acknowledge was caused by the vaccine and that the Australian government and major world health authorities now recognise as a known side effect of the vaccine.

Drew a short straw? Had a choice to refuse taking it? All 5 out of 5 members of my household would have lost their jobs if they didn't get vaccinated. Plus it was safe and needed to stop the spread, right? Well, 4 out of 5 in my household have now caught COVID, but not until after being triple-vaxxed, which aligns with the experience of most of my extended family and friends. Sure, implement general isolation until anyone that wants to get vaccinated has had the chance to do so, but just what was achieved by coercing everyone to do so?

I think someone in an age group that had minimal risk of having serious symptoms from COVID, but who took the 'safe' vaccine to protect the elderly and can now only stand or sit for a few minutes a day as a result has a fair reason to not be happy with what has happened. You think Kerryn Phelps, former president of the AMA is making her story up? Several people close to this forum are affected....my daughter knows 2 other girls in her circle of friends that have also developed her 'very rare' condition, but none of this is being reported in official statistics.

Again, please explain which bit of this is CT?

My main point is that it is a water sports site. There are better places to moan and post crap from gab.com.

You say none of this is being reported in official sites, but:

More than 64 million vaccine doses have been administered across the country, as of November 16, and since December 2021 people injured by one have been able to make a claim for compensation through the vaccine claims scheme. A Services Australia spokesperson said as of November 23, the department has received 3100 applications, and 79 have been approved for claims totalling $3.9 million.

Yep.
It is PCSD!
Post Covid Stress Disorder.
Let's compensate now all those vaccinated that survived Covid,
But suffer now mentlally PCSD.

What about $10,000 per head!!

Let's do $50,000 !!
All you need to do claim benefit will be vaccination certificate and prove that you are acting like crazzy madman!
Both very easy to obtain.

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hilly said..
However, if there was no vaccine the outcome would have been worse.

Over and out. Off to the beach for a wingding.

Your medical expert and peer reviewed opinion?

For an elderly person, probably so. For my daughter and her two friends, likely not. From what I've been told by the raft of specialists we have been seeing, the mechanism and incidence of her condition is more strongly linked to the mrna vaccine than it is to a young person contracting COVID. They are not the same thing.

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hilly said..
Forgot to mention this is about a liver diet and steroids. So how it got onto Covid and CTs is anyones guess.

PM33 is the answer.

To a hammer everything is a nail. To PM33 everything is a conspiracy.

It is good though as he is clearly living under a bridge, hiding his gold silver stash, but with excellent 5G reception.

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hilly said..However, if there was no vaccine the outcome would have been worse.

So to clarify hilly's opinion...science has helped solve the virus that was made by science.

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Flying Dutchman said..

hilly said..However, if there was no vaccine the outcome would have been worse.

So to clarify hilly's opinion...science has helped solve the virus that was made by science.

That's not what he said at all. How is that 'clarifying' someone's opinion?

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FormulaNova said..That's not what he said at all. How is that 'clarifying' someone's opinion?

I thought we had established that Covid was lab started? Did the science change again?

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Flying Dutchman said..

I thought we had established that Covid was lab started? Did the science change again?

No nothing has changed. Except the conspiracy theories

It came from a Wuhan Wet Market

Google. The COVID lab leak theory is dead. Here's how we know the virus came from a Wuhan market

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IanR said..
Google. The COVID lab leak theory is dead. Here's how we know the virus came from a Wuhan market

Wow you're right. I googled 'Lab Leak Theory is Dead' and guess what... I found an article that confirmed my search. I'm satisfied it's from a bat at the market now.

The COVID lab leak theory is the idea that the COVID-19 virus, which caused a global pandemic, may have accidentally escaped from a laboratory where it was being studied. However, after thorough investigations and analysis, scientists and experts have concluded that this theory is not supported by the evidence.

One reason the COVID lab leak theory is not likely is that the virus is very similar to other viruses that have been found in bats, which are known to carry many different types of viruses. The COVID-19 virus has a lot of genetic similarities to viruses that have been found in bats, and it is thought that the virus may have jumped from bats to humans through another animal, such as a pangolin.

Another reason the COVID lab leak theory is not supported is that the virus was first identified in Wuhan, China, which is a city with a large market where live animals are sold. This market is a known place where viruses can be transmitted from animals to humans, and it is more likely that the virus started there rather than in a laboratory.

Overall, while the COVID lab leak theory may have seemed like a possibility at first, scientists and experts have carefully studied the evidence and have determined that it is not supported by the facts. The most likely explanation for the origins of the COVID-19 virus is that it jumped from bats to humans through another animal, possibly at the market in Wuhan.

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Flying Dutchman said..

IanR said..
Google. The COVID lab leak theory is dead. Here's how we know the virus came from a Wuhan market

Wow you're right. I googled 'Lab Leak Theory is Dead' and guess what... I found an article that confirmed my search. I'm satisfied it's from a bat at the market now.

Haha!

Yeah I always trust anything Americans say. "The 737max is safe" "those crashes were pilot error" "the MCAS doesn't require training", not like Aussies, the wife wants to buy an Australian made mosquito device that services one acre, sounds like a sham, most of the problems in my life have been caused by Aussies, you can't trust them.

Enter FN to defend Boeing's safety record.

Can I eat liver to get buff??

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Macroscien said..
In simple language.This graph will tell us how many people that died from Covid have been vaccinated and how many hasn't.

No it doesn't dude if you can't even get that right and it's right there on the graph, ease up on insulting the intelligence of others.

It's the death RATE, not total numbers of. Yeesh.

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hilly said..
However, if there was no vaccine the outcome would have been worse.

Show us the data you're basing that assumption on...?