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D3 said..
Think of it like this, Aboriginal is something pertaining to Aborigines.

Such as: an Aboriginal artefact would have been made by an Aborigine

Wow.

here's what I thought you were going to come back with:

www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjf_aKsz_qBAxX-r1YBHZCTCJkQFnoECBwQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.amnesty.org%2Fen%2Flatest%2Fcampaigns%2F2015%2F08%2Fwhy-saying-aborigine-isnt-ok-8-facts-about-indigenous-people-in-australia%2F&usg=AOvVaw1dBKtTO0TJ_ZjS1-BrHT_9&opi=89978449

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Subsonic said..

D3 said..

Subsonic said..

D3 said..

Subsonic said..

FormulaNova said..

Subsonic said..

sgo said..
The irony of it all is that the yes crew know they have lost something,
The no crew think they have won something

That looks like a very twisted point of view, so let me correct that for you.

The irony of it all is that the yes crew think they have lost something,
The no crew knew they had to vote no, but now we can talk about actual ways forward.

That looks like a very twisted point of view, so let me correct that for you.

The irony of it all is that the no crew think they would have lost something,
The no crew knew they had to vote no, but now we can not talk about actually doing anything at all.

I think this is the saddest part of the whole saga. The yes supporters have now just written it all off, and proceeded to call everyone that voted no bigots. They're not looking for other ways forward. And that seems to be a common ideology when it comes to the indigenous outlook. Too busy looking at the past, and seeking a never ending acknowledgment that they were wronged, with financial reparations to boot. Not looking at what's actually needed to improve the state of affairs looking forward. It's a pretty poor outlook on life.



it's not the train wreck you all make it out to be. The only thing that has actually changed is an increase in the amount of vitriol coming from the mouths of people who tied themselves too heavily to the idea it was going to succeed.



why don't you start talking about ways to improve the Indigenous situation, rather than carrying on about what has occurred in the past?

Looking forward to hearing how your initiatives and programs work out.

Please provide regular updates

Lol, and this^^^


now we've voted no overall as a nation, some how (out of nowhere) the yes proponents figure its up to the no voters to provide the answers to the problem.



i've got a news flash for you (and sgo), it is highly unlikely that anyone that voted no even wanted, or saw a need for a referendum on the matter. A referendum was called, anyone with a basic level of comprehension and a degree of common sense could see there were potential problems with what was being presented. And voted no.

the answers aren't simple, voting no to shut down said potential problems was. None of which means the majority of the nation don't want to see the situation improve for the indigenous population.

Just calling out Subsonic for a crap post.

What on earth makes him think that Yes campaigners are any more or less committed to improving the situation for indigenous Australians than the No campaign?

Suddenly Adam Goodes and Cathy Freeman are just going to just stop their advocacy?

These assumptions (conclusions?) you fellas are coming up with in response are just getting wilder and weirder. Maybe go have a collective sit down. Come back when you've gotten over the fact it didn't go the way you thought it should last Saturday. The world hasn't ended.

Do you even read what the person before you wrote, or do you just reply to the voices in your head? I am starting to see a pattern. Sadly it is in your head.

He just essentially said that Yes campaigners are no more or less committed to improving things. How is that either wilder or weirder?

Are you trying to be condescending but feeling a bit dissapointed that no one cares?

Select to expand quote

D3 said..
Think of it like this, Aboriginal is something pertaining to Aborigines.

Such as: an Aboriginal artefact would have been made by an Aborigine

You clearly don't know

Select to expand quote

FormulaNova said..

Subsonic said..

D3 said..

Subsonic said..

D3 said..

Subsonic said..

FormulaNova said..

Subsonic said..

sgo said..
The irony of it all is that the yes crew know they have lost something,
The no crew think they have won something

That looks like a very twisted point of view, so let me correct that for you.

The irony of it all is that the yes crew think they have lost something,
The no crew knew they had to vote no, but now we can talk about actual ways forward.

That looks like a very twisted point of view, so let me correct that for you.

The irony of it all is that the no crew think they would have lost something,
The no crew knew they had to vote no, but now we can not talk about actually doing anything at all.

I think this is the saddest part of the whole saga. The yes supporters have now just written it all off, and proceeded to call everyone that voted no bigots. They're not looking for other ways forward. And that seems to be a common ideology when it comes to the indigenous outlook. Too busy looking at the past, and seeking a never ending acknowledgment that they were wronged, with financial reparations to boot. Not looking at what's actually needed to improve the state of affairs looking forward. It's a pretty poor outlook on life.



it's not the train wreck you all make it out to be. The only thing that has actually changed is an increase in the amount of vitriol coming from the mouths of people who tied themselves too heavily to the idea it was going to succeed.



why don't you start talking about ways to improve the Indigenous situation, rather than carrying on about what has occurred in the past?

Looking forward to hearing how your initiatives and programs work out.

Please provide regular updates

Lol, and this^^^


now we've voted no overall as a nation, some how (out of nowhere) the yes proponents figure its up to the no voters to provide the answers to the problem.



i've got a news flash for you (and sgo), it is highly unlikely that anyone that voted no even wanted, or saw a need for a referendum on the matter. A referendum was called, anyone with a basic level of comprehension and a degree of common sense could see there were potential problems with what was being presented. And voted no.

the answers aren't simple, voting no to shut down said potential problems was. None of which means the majority of the nation don't want to see the situation improve for the indigenous population.

Just calling out Subsonic for a crap post.

What on earth makes him think that Yes campaigners are any more or less committed to improving the situation for indigenous Australians than the No campaign?

Suddenly Adam Goodes and Cathy Freeman are just going to just stop their advocacy?

These assumptions (conclusions?) you fellas are coming up with in response are just getting wilder and weirder. Maybe go have a collective sit down. Come back when you've gotten over the fact it didn't go the way you thought it should last Saturday. The world hasn't ended.

Do you even read what the person before you wrote, or do you just reply to the voices in your head? I am starting to see a pattern. Sadly it is in your head.

He just essentially said that Yes campaigners are no more or less committed to improving things. How is that either wilder or weirder?

Are you trying to be condescending but feeling a bit dissapointed that no one cares?

I would ask you the same question..


Read the whole dialogue before commenting? Maybe it'll bring you some clarity as to why his post makes no sense. If you still can't make sense of it then perhaps its just not worth the argument. It's hard to have a discussion when the other side are only reading their own comments, or the comments they want to hear.

Select to expand quote

Subsonic said..

These assumptions (conclusions?) you fellas are coming up with in response are just getting wilder and weirder. Maybe go have a collective sit down. Come back when you've gotten over the fact it didn't go the way you thought it should last Saturday. The world hasn't ended.

Last Saturday went very close to the way I thought it would weeks ago.

Select to expand quote

TonyAbbott said..

Rebel news LOL
Maybe was meant for funny pics thread?

Select to expand quote

Subsonic said..

FormulaNova said..

Subsonic said..

These assumptions (conclusions?) you fellas are coming up with in response are just getting wilder and weirder. Maybe go have a collective sit down. Come back when you've gotten over the fact it didn't go the way you thought it should last Saturday. The world hasn't ended.

Do you even read what the person before you wrote, or do you just reply to the voices in your head? I am starting to see a pattern. Sadly it is in your head.

He just essentially said that Yes campaigners are no more or less committed to improving things. How is that either wilder or weirder?

Are you trying to be condescending but feeling a bit dissapointed that no one cares?

I would ask you the same question..


Read the whole dialogue before commenting? Maybe it'll bring you some clarity as to why his post makes no sense. If you still can't make sense of it then perhaps its just not worth the argument. It's hard to have a discussion when the other side are only reading their own comments, or the comments they want to hear.

Oh, I see. When I have conversations, it is generally in response to what the other person said, on topic, or branching off onto a related tangent. In this case, its replying to what the other person wrote. Especially when its the text quoted.

It seems when you have conversations its just a chance for you to talk when the other person has stopped. No need to respond to what they have said or written. Even when you quote it.

My mistake. As you were. No need to change.

Here's a summary of what I read:

Select to expand quote

Subsonic said..
The no crew knew they had to vote no, but now we can talk about actual ways forward.
....
why don't you start talking about ways to improve the Indigenous situation, rather than carrying on about what has occurred in the past?....
the answers aren't simple, voting no to shut down said potential problems was. None of which means the majority of the nation don't want to see the situation improve for the indigenous population.

D3 said.. "Looking forward to hearing how your initiatives and programs work out.
Please provide regular updates"

Subsonic then said.. 'now we've voted no overall as a nation, some how (out of nowhere) the yes proponents figure its up to the no voters to provide the answers to the problem. '

Select to expand quote

FormulaNova said..
Here's a summary of what I read:

Subsonic said..
The no crew knew they had to vote no, but now we can talk about actual ways forward.
....
why don't you start talking about ways to improve the Indigenous situation, rather than carrying on about what has occurred in the past?....
the answers aren't simple, voting no to shut down said potential problems was. None of which means the majority of the nation don't want to see the situation improve for the indigenous population.

D3 said.. "Looking forward to hearing how your initiatives and programs work out.
Please provide regular updates"

Subsonic then said.. 'now we've voted no overall as a nation, some how (out of nowhere) the yes proponents figure its up to the no voters to provide the answers to the problem. '

Well, it looks to me like you either have problems with comprehension, or you're being disingenuous for the sake of an argument.

either way thats enough i think.

Select to expand quote

D3 said.


Looking forward to hearing how your initiatives and programs work out.

Please provide regular updates

Look forward to it as well, in the mean time

I can provide updates on some other conservative policies that the left claimed were motivated by racism as well, such as stopping the boats

Turned out to stop the boats, the boats had to be stopped, Who would have thought....thank you Scomo
I remember Formula Nova et al argue about push and pull factors and a whole heap of other rubbish, well....
Turned out a practical solution worked far better than the ideological ones all the left were sprouting
Turned out that once the boats were stopped people stopped drowning
Turned out that once the boats were stopped people stopped getting put in detention centres
Turned out that once the boats were stopped the billions of dollars being spent on asylum seekers could be spent elsewhere it was needed
Turned out conservatives with their practical solutions were correct and the left activists with their ideological solutions, including calling everyone racist who didn't agree with them, were wrong.

Even Labor accept that now.

Select to expand quote

Subsonic said..

D3 said..
Think of it like this, Aboriginal is something pertaining to Aborigines.

Such as: an Aboriginal artefact would have been made by an Aborigine

Wow.

here's what I thought you were going to come back with:

www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjf_aKsz_qBAxX-r1YBHZCTCJkQFnoECBwQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.amnesty.org%2Fen%2Flatest%2Fcampaigns%2F2015%2F08%2Fwhy-saying-aborigine-isnt-ok-8-facts-about-indigenous-people-in-australia%2F&usg=AOvVaw1dBKtTO0TJ_ZjS1-BrHT_9&opi=89978449

Cheers for the link.
Turns out that in my efforts to be stickler for accuracy I've likely been an insensitive d***.

I usually try to follow Wheaton's law, but I'm just as capable of causing offence due ignorance of specifics as the next person.

Always good to learn new things.

Select to expand quote

Well maybe I misread the comment below to mean Subsonic saying that The Yes Campaign was no longer interested in looking for ways to improve the state of affairs for indigenous Australians?

Select to expand quote

I read this as him implying only No Campaign supporters were going to continue to work towards improving the situation for indigenous Australians.

Select to expand quote

I'm hoping he'll be one of those people who continues with positive discussions and initiatives for ways forward along with many of the Yes Campaigners.

Select to expand quote

"I think this is the saddest part of the whole saga. The yes supporters have now just written it all off, and proceeded to call everyone that voted no bigots. They're not looking for other ways forward. And that seems to be a common ideology when it comes to the indigenous outlook. Too busy looking at the past, and seeking a never ending acknowledgment that they were wronged, with financial reparations to boot. Not looking at what's actually needed to improve the state of affairs looking forward. It's a pretty poor outlook on life.

Select to expand quote

It's not the train wreck you all make it out to be. The only thing that has actually changed is an increase in the amount of vitriol coming from the mouths of people who tied themselves too heavily to the idea it was going to succeed.

Select to expand quote

why don't you start talking about ways to improve the Indigenous situation, rather than carrying on about what has occurred in the past?"
why don't you start talking about ways to improve the Indigenous situation, rather than carrying on about what has occurred in the past?"


Edit: no idea what's going on with the formatting here

Select to expand quote

D3 said..
Well maybe I misread the comment below to mean Subsonic saying that The Yes Campaign was no longer interested in looking for ways to improve the state of affairs for indigenous Australians?

I read this as him implying only No Campaign supporters were going to continue to work towards improving the situation for indigenous Australians.


I'm hoping he'll be one of those people who continues with positive discussions and initiatives for ways forward along with many of the Yes Campaigners.

"I think this is the saddest part of the whole saga. The yes supporters have now just written it all off, and proceeded to call everyone that voted no bigots. They're not looking for other ways forward. And that seems to be a common ideology when it comes to the indigenous outlook. Too busy looking at the past, and seeking a never ending acknowledgment that they were wronged, with financial reparations to boot. Not looking at what's actually needed to improve the state of affairs looking forward. It's a pretty poor outlook on life.

It's not the train wreck you all make it out to be. The only thing that has actually changed is an increase in the amount of vitriol coming from the mouths of people who tied themselves too heavily to the idea it was going to succeed.

why don't you start talking about ways to improve the Indigenous situation, rather than carrying on about what has occurred in the past?"
why don't you start talking about ways to improve the Indigenous situation, rather than carrying on about what has occurred in the past?"

Edit: no idea what's going on with the formatting here

I tried to fix it up for you. If you go into 'plain text editor' and make sure that the quote text has the quote word in square brackets before the text and the / quote word in square brackets after the text, that makes that block into a quoted section.

If you mess it up and get it where there is no matching 'end quote' then the editor will add one to fix it up, but usually at the end where you don't want it.

You can move the text in the square brackets around to show things correctly. Sometimes it can be a bit of an effort but it becomes easy when you understand what it is doing.

Select to expand quote

D3 said..

Subsonic said..

D3 said..
Think of it like this, Aboriginal is something pertaining to Aborigines.

Such as: an Aboriginal artefact would have been made by an Aborigine

Wow.

here's what I thought you were going to come back with:

www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=&ved=2ahUKEwjf_aKsz_qBAxX-r1YBHZCTCJkQFnoECBwQAQ&url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.amnesty.org%2Fen%2Flatest%2Fcampaigns%2F2015%2F08%2Fwhy-saying-aborigine-isnt-ok-8-facts-about-indigenous-people-in-australia%2F&usg=AOvVaw1dBKtTO0TJ_ZjS1-BrHT_9&opi=89978449

Cheers for the link.
Turns out that in my efforts to be stickler for accuracy I've likely been an insensitive d***.

I usually try to follow Wheaton's law, but I'm just as capable of causing offence due ignorance of specifics as the next person.

Always good to learn new things.

I read something similar, but I am not sure I am going to get my mouth around 'First Nations People". In different areas there seem to be different preferred names anyway.

With Australian's overwhelming saying NO to the voice of division - one thing the referendum results have shown is that we have a governing political class in Canberra completely out of touch with the rest of the nation.

I say we partition off Qld and send them all there!

No. I think that the NO camp ran a better campaign and the YES didn't understand the level of distrust of Goverment.
In the end enough loonys believed the crap rather than the question that was being asked.
110 groups provide advice to Govement, this would have removed 4 groups and made one voice that would remain despite changes of Goverment. Thats it!.....Nothing more.

The Racist, Uninformed, Uneducated, Conspiracists and couldn't be bothered all voted for the current treatment to continue.

Select to expand quote

TonyAbbott said..

Strangely enough no positive suggestions from you, just more negativity.

Select to expand quote

kato said..

No. I think that the NO camp ran a better campaign and the YES didn't understand the level of distrust of Goverment.
In the end enough loonys believed the crap rather than the question that was being asked.
110 groups provide advice to Govement, this would have removed 4 groups and made one voice that would remain despite changes of Goverment. Thats it!.....Nothing more.

The Racist, Uninformed, Uneducated, Conspiracists and couldn't be bothered all voted for the current treatment to continue.

Loonies?
Racist?

The question wasn't "Do you like Aborigines? Yes?No."

The question seemed to be "Should we put yet another useless level of bureaurocracy to the bunch of useless ones that are already failing the Aboriginal people?"

The Yes arguments were pathetic. "oh, we can't listen to Aboriginals unless you vote Yes" ....Yes you can, you just listen.

Aborigines are already well represented and well funded. Their problems are many and varied and no one has an effective solution, because there isn't one.

As I see it, they are trapped in a vacuum between cultures. They have been too affected by modern life to ever return to their old culture, yet have not been able to fast forward the 20,000 years of development required to fit into the modern world.

I believe welfarism has ,and continues to destroy their self reliance and self respect.

And yes, I have spent time in Aboriginal communities and talked to people who are trying to help them. These people are tearing their hair out as nothing seems to work.

Any young Aborigine who shows a spark of nous or motivation and wants , for instance , to start an apprenticeship on a mine site is denigrated by his peers as a "sellout to the white fella" and is basically worn down by his own people until he finally gives up and returns to doing nothing.

The Racist, Uninformed, Uneducated, Conspiracists and couldn't be bothered all voted for the current treatment to continue.

Oh dear! Maybe watch less of Walyeed on The Project.

The voice lovers in parliament today voted down a motion for a royal commission for an audit into indigenous affairs and child abuse in remote communities .They either want nothing to change or just have sour grapes toward Senator Price.

The left are still whining that it was because Australians are dumb, racist, mean, didn't understand the question, "misinformation", the Libs were playing politics, the Yes campaign was "poorly articulated" etc. etc.

I'll give you a tip: it was NONE of those things.

The only ones being had were the Yes voters who fell for the lie that a bunch of radical, racist, power-hungry left-wing activists actually spoke for the 3% of Australians who have some indigenous ancestry, just because they have some racial connection. That's the very definition of racism.

The majority have just demonstrated that in fact we don't take our constitution and our system of government for granted, we know how fortunate we are to live in Australia and that equal citizenship rights is something we will never give up because it's crucial. This concept is the very antithesis of racist.

Select to expand quote

AUS1111 said..

The only ones being had were the Yes voters who fell for the lie that a bunch of radical, racist, power-hungry left-wing activists actually spoke for the 3% of Australians who have some indigenous ancestry, just because they have some racial connection. That's the very definition of racism.

No it's not. That's not racism, That's like saying the vocal minority that speak loudest in white culture is racist towards the rest of us. Clearly they are not.

So many people call out 'racism' that it's important to recognise what it is and what it's not.

Select to expand quote

psychomub said..
Any young Aborigine who shows a spark of nous or motivation and wants , for instance , to start an apprenticeship on a mine site is denigrated by his peers as a "sellout to the white fella" and is basically worn down by his own people until he finally gives up and returns to doing nothing.

So you have identified a large problem. How do you resolve that? There must be a way. What is it? Throwing your hands up in the air and saying 'no one knows' is a terrible approach and getting us nowhere.

For everyone that thinks just because someone is Aboriginal that they know the solution, it's like saying that someone that is white knows all the answers to social problems amongst white people.

Big banks offer 'cultural leave' to Aboriginal workers after Voice defeat - Sound Health and Lasting Wealth




Indigenous workers at some of Australia's top banks are being offered paid leave to recover from the Voice referendum result.

Ntional Australia Bank (NAB) is offering cultural leave and counselling to Indigenous employees after Australia voted No in the referendum on Saturday.

Westpac and ANZ also have 'special leave' that could allow Indigenous staff to take time off to recover from the fallout, while accounting giant KPMG is offering to hold 'yarning circles' for Indigenous employees to discuss the result and 'heal in a culturally safe space'.

'KPMG Australia encourages all First Nations employees to take cultural leave and additional paid leave where required to help process the result of the referendum,' a spokesperson said.

NAB Group chief executive Ross McEwan told The Australian the referendum was a challenging loss for some staff but it respects the democratic result.'The people of Australia have voted,' Mr McEwan said.

The announcement comes after Daily Mail Australia revealed a university had given extensions to Aboriginal students to cope with the emotional toll of the No vote.

Select to expand quote

TonyAbbott said..

With Australian's overwhelming saying NO to the voice of division - one thing the referendum results have shown is that we have a governing political class in Canberra completely out of touch with the rest of the nation.

Care to break that up by electorate?

Select to expand quote

AUS1111 said..
The left are still whining that it was because Australians are dumb, racist, mean, didn't understand the question, "misinformation", the Libs were playing politics, the Yes campaign was "poorly articulated" etc. etc.

I'll give you a tip: it was NONE of those things.

The only ones being had were the Yes voters who fell for the lie that a bunch of radical, racist, power-hungry left-wing activists actually spoke for the 3% of Australians who have some indigenous ancestry, just because they have some racial connection. That's the very definition of racism.

The majority have just demonstrated that in fact we don't take our constitution and our system of government for granted, we know how fortunate we are to live in Australia and that equal citizenship rights is something we will never give up because it's crucial. This concept is the very antithesis of racist.

I was saying The Voice would fail because of poorly educated, ignorant, racist, bigots long before referendum day.

Select to expand quote

Pcdefender said..
Big banks offer 'cultural leave' to Aboriginal workers after Voice defeat - Sound Health and Lasting Wealth




Indigenous workers at some of Australia's top banks are being offered paid leave to recover from the Voice referendum result.

Ntional Australia Bank (NAB) is offering cultural leave and counselling to Indigenous employees after Australia voted No in the referendum on Saturday.

Westpac and ANZ also have 'special leave' that could allow Indigenous staff to take time off to recover from the fallout, while accounting giant KPMG is offering to hold 'yarning circles' for Indigenous employees to discuss the result and 'heal in a culturally safe space'.

'KPMG Australia encourages all First Nations employees to take cultural leave and additional paid leave where required to help process the result of the referendum,' a spokesperson said.

NAB Group chief executive Ross McEwan told The Australian the referendum was a challenging loss for some staff but it respects the democratic result.'The people of Australia have voted,' Mr McEwan said.

The announcement comes after Daily Mail Australia revealed a university had given extensions to Aboriginal students to cope with the emotional toll of the No vote.

What did you buy with all that free GoFundMe money?

Select to expand quote

FormulaNova said..

AUS1111 said..

The only ones being had were the Yes voters who fell for the lie that a bunch of radical, racist, power-hungry left-wing activists actually spoke for the 3% of Australians who have some indigenous ancestry, just because they have some racial connection. That's the very definition of racism.

No it's not. That's not racism, That's like saying the vocal minority that speak loudest in white culture is racist towards the rest of us. Clearly they are not.

So many people call out 'racism' that it's important to recognise what it is and what it's not.

I remember our old friend Logman explaining racism to me, he posted a youtube clip that explained racism can only exist from a position of power, therefore minorities and or oppressed peoples cannot be racist. I asked him if that meant a white farmer in Sth Africa could no longer be a racist..... no reply of course.

Select to expand quote

FormulaNova said..

psychomub said..
Any young Aborigine who shows a spark of nous or motivation and wants , for instance , to start an apprenticeship on a mine site is denigrated by his peers as a "sellout to the white fella" and is basically worn down by his own people until he finally gives up and returns to doing nothing.

So you have identified a large problem. How do you resolve that? There must be a way. What is it? Throwing your hands up in the air and saying 'no one knows' is a terrible approach and getting us nowhere.

For everyone that thinks just because someone is Aboriginal that they know the solution, it's like saying that someone that is white knows all the answers to social problems amongst white people.

Maybe they need a positive role model to look up to.

Someone who wants to stop the pertpetual victimhood
someone who wants to stop the DV
someone who wants to put human rights before culture
someone who wants to stop the waste and corruption
someone with the same lived experience
Someone with a VOICE that is not afraid to upset the status quo

Any ideas?