Just making the move from one rabbit hole to another. I was an Armie frother but the focus on HA wings recently leaves me cold. Hard to turn, wobbly at transitions and locked in at speed. I love to turn (in my lunchbox I know, very aware of my average ability) and was waiting for a 1050V2 to take on Takuma Kujira but we got HA - boo hiss. FG has stepped up to the plate after years of HA crap wings, awesome for pump/speed but no turn unless you are Austin and can ride tiny wings. The new generation looks exceptionally good indeed for average foilers like me. Nice to have these first world problems
Recommend a demo to make up your own mind.

Select to expand quote

hilly said..
Just making the move from one rabbit hole to another. I was an Armie frother but the focus on HA wings recently leaves me cold. Hard to turn, wobbly at transitions and locked in at speed. I love to turn (in my lunchbox I know, very aware of my average ability) and was waiting for a 1050V2 to take on Takuma Kujira but we got HA - boo hiss. FG has stepped up to the plate after years of HA crap wings, awesome for pump/speed but no turn unless you are Austin and can ride tiny wings. The new generation looks exceptionally good indeed for average foilers like me. Nice to have these first world problems
Recommend a demo to make up your own mind.

So Hilly are you now saying that you prefer Go Foil and are you thinking of not using Armstrong gear anymore?, also what is the main reason / your preferred Go Foil foil/s?:-)

Select to expand quote

hilly said..
Just making the move from one rabbit hole to another. I was an Armie frother but the focus on HA wings recently leaves me cold. Hard to turn, wobbly at transitions and locked in at speed. I love to turn (in my lunchbox I know, very aware of my average ability) and was waiting for a 1050V2 to take on Takuma Kujira but we got HA - boo hiss. FG has stepped up to the plate after years of HA crap wings, awesome for pump/speed but no turn unless you are Austin and can ride tiny wings. The new generation looks exceptionally good indeed for average foilers like me. Nice to have these first world problems
Recommend a demo to make up your own mind.

We've been riding mid-aspect foils for years - Infinity 65cm, 840 cm2 and recently Phantasm PTM 83cm, 1,020 cm2.
I reckon less width = better rail carves.

Select to expand quote

Johndesu said.So Hilly are you now saying that you prefer Go Foil and are you thinking of not using Armstrong gear anymore?, also what is the main reason / your preferred Go Foil foil/s?:-)

After a foil that is fast, turns like the Armie 1050 but has the glide of the HA1125. The GF RS1000 is the closest I have felt. Nice and balanced with no dippy feel. Undecided if I will sell my Armstrong kit, they may reset soon.

Select to expand quote

azymuth said..

hilly said..
Just making the move from one rabbit hole to another. I was an Armie frother but the focus on HA wings recently leaves me cold. Hard to turn, wobbly at transitions and locked in at speed. I love to turn (in my lunchbox I know, very aware of my average ability) and was waiting for a 1050V2 to take on Takuma Kujira but we got HA - boo hiss. FG has stepped up to the plate after years of HA crap wings, awesome for pump/speed but no turn unless you are Austin and can ride tiny wings. The new generation looks exceptionally good indeed for average foilers like me. Nice to have these first world problems
Recommend a demo to make up your own mind.

We've been riding mid-aspect foils for years - Infinity 65cm, 840 cm2 and recently Phantasm PTM 83cm, 1,020 cm2.
I reckon less width = better rail carves.

Armstrong have heaps of mid aspects that carve well, they just feel a bit slow and lack glide compared to the RS.

+1 there Hilly, been waiting for the HA pendulum to swing back to reality. Like you - think the HS1050 is an amazing surf foil, but now been spoilt by the 1125 glide, so want both. But when guys like Oskar are warning to ride the HA's on an 85cm mast because of the pitch sensitivity, the wing is asking a lot of us normal riders.

HA has a place. You don't see any low aspect gliders. Then again you don't see any HA aerobatic planes.
Think of all the extra time you now have with only have 6 screws total.
Glad you liked it Hilly. As for the rest of you stay away, stock is hard enough to get. ??

I am the opposite as i am very light (65kgs) and have been wondering if the the 925 or the lift 120 could provide the turning, glide and pump in small surf for the light weights. The larger GF riders have performed extremely on the NL160 and Nl190 but the even the 160 is too big for me in all but the smallest surf. So my curiosity was the opposite way.

But when i rode the RS1000 my HA aspirations mellowed and can't wait for my own RS1000 to turn up. (3 days) It was so nice to be able to just dive into a turn. Riding the RS1150 a week later also made me realize these stepped wings seem to turn like they have a smaller wingspan than they have. I will get both as the 1150 will be great for free-winging but it does make me think heavy riders will rip on the 1150 as a daily rider.

Prior to these super high aspects i think most brands designed well for the heavier riders and now their Super HA wings will be good for the lighter riders but their necessary wingspan will be prohibitive to performance for the heavier riders.

Select to expand quote

hilly said..

Johndesu said.So Hilly are you now saying that you prefer Go Foil and are you thinking of not using Armstrong gear anymore?, also what is the main reason / your preferred Go Foil foil/s?:-)

After a foil that is fast, turns like the Armie 1050 but has the glide of the HA1125. The GF RS1000 is the closest I have felt. Nice and balanced with no dippy feel. Undecided if I will sell my Armstrong kit, they may reset soon.

Ok I see Andrew, also I originally started on Go Foil but I think / know that Armstrong gear / design is almost perfect but I understand that you want the best behaved front foil wing that will suit you, actually I read about a company that can adapt most brands front wing onto the fuselage of your choice which might be another option?:-)

Select to expand quote

Johndesu said..

hilly said..

Johndesu said.So Hilly are you now saying that you prefer Go Foil and are you thinking of not using Armstrong gear anymore?, also what is the main reason / your preferred Go Foil foil/s?:-)

After a foil that is fast, turns like the Armie 1050 but has the glide of the HA1125. The GF RS1000 is the closest I have felt. Nice and balanced with no dippy feel. Undecided if I will sell my Armstrong kit, they may reset soon.

Ok I see Andrew, also I originally started on Go Foil but I think / know that Armstrong gear / design is almost perfect but I understand that you want the best behaved front foil wing that will suit you, actually I read about a company that can adapt most brands front wing onto the fuselage of your choice which might be another option?:-)

I don't know about that! Gofoil is light years stiffer. Real thin, fast mast. I know the pedestal tail stuff isn't the cleanest but that Armstrong mast fuse wing connection is some bad design. Tons of flex(even on the A+) and just a ugly transition to the back end of the fuse. Far from perfect!

Select to expand quote

TooMuchEpoxy said..

Johndesu said..

hilly said..

Johndesu said.So Hilly are you now saying that you prefer Go Foil and are you thinking of not using Armstrong gear anymore?, also what is the main reason / your preferred Go Foil foil/s?:-)

After a foil that is fast, turns like the Armie 1050 but has the glide of the HA1125. The GF RS1000 is the closest I have felt. Nice and balanced with no dippy feel. Undecided if I will sell my Armstrong kit, they may reset soon.

Ok I see Andrew, also I originally started on Go Foil but I think / know that Armstrong gear / design is almost perfect but I understand that you want the best behaved front foil wing that will suit you, actually I read about a company that can adapt most brands front wing onto the fuselage of your choice which might be another option?:-)

I don't know about that! Gofoil is light years stiffer. Real thin, fast mast. I know the pedestal tail stuff isn't the cleanest but that Armstrong mast fuse wing connection is some bad design. Tons of flex(even on the A+) and just a ugly transition to the back end of the fuse. Far from perfect!

Really ok well maybe the new gear has improved since I last looked at it - fist generation stuff about a year ago now, and you think the Armstrong mast / fuse connection is not a good design? do you think you could explain that perhaps, and I know that Armstrong wanted / went for a bit of flex etc:-)

There is nothing wrong with the Armstrong mast fuse connection or tail on A+. I like the flex and the lightness. The GoFoil is crude in comparison and heavy but stiff. The only reason I am changing is for performance. I wish Armie would update the 1050 to match the RS1000 performance.

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hilly said..
There is nothing wrong with the Armstrong mast fuse connection or tail on A+. I like the flex and the lightness. The GoFoil is crude in comparison and heavy but stiff. The only reason I am changing is for performance. I wish Armie would update the 1050 to match the RS1000 performance.

Well that is what I think also and with time new wings & developments will come out in the future, and it takes time as I have just eventually started to dial in the 1850 & 1550v2 with rear shim/s, mast placement, etc, - next will soon have to test the Ha wings and also different boards etc:-)

Good move Hilly trying your Kalama board with the go foil setup. They have been developed together.
I am sticking with armstrong as invested with foils and board. Still have much improvement to make.
Maybe you could review your Kalama board as they look very different to all others.

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johndg said..
Good move Hilly trying your Kalama board with the go foil setup. They have been developed together.
I am sticking with armstrong as invested with foils and board. Still have much improvement to make.
Maybe you could review your Kalama board as they look very different to all others.

Love the board. Did a brief review here www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Stand-Up-Paddle/Foiling/New-Kalama-Performance-E3?page=2 but looking forward to using the GoFoil foil with it as stated before they go hand in hand.

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Johndesu said..

TooMuchEpoxy said..

Johndesu said..

hilly said..

Johndesu said.So Hilly are you now saying that you prefer Go Foil and are you thinking of not using Armstrong gear anymore?, also what is the main reason / your preferred Go Foil foil/s?:-)

After a foil that is fast, turns like the Armie 1050 but has the glide of the HA1125. The GF RS1000 is the closest I have felt. Nice and balanced with no dippy feel. Undecided if I will sell my Armstrong kit, they may reset soon.

Ok I see Andrew, also I originally started on Go Foil but I think / know that Armstrong gear / design is almost perfect but I understand that you want the best behaved front foil wing that will suit you, actually I read about a company that can adapt most brands front wing onto the fuselage of your choice which might be another option?:-)

I don't know about that! Gofoil is light years stiffer. Real thin, fast mast. I know the pedestal tail stuff isn't the cleanest but that Armstrong mast fuse wing connection is some bad design. Tons of flex(even on the A+) and just a ugly transition to the back end of the fuse. Far from perfect!

Really ok well maybe the new gear has improved since I last looked at it - fist generation stuff about a year ago now, and you think the Armstrong mast / fuse connection is not a good design? do you think you could explain that perhaps, and I know that Armstrong wanted / went for a bit of flex etc:-)

The armstrong mast/fuse and fuse wing are both compression fitting s that you can't compress! On the gofoil compression fitting for the wing fuse the screw goes in a slot. This means you wack it with the hammer until the joint is fully seated, then put the screw in. On the armie setup your limited to the one point where the bolt lines up, you can never really get those joints fully seated. Also, the octagonal shape is less resistant to torsion than square(square drive screws anyone?) Also, carbon isn't a great material on those removable connections 1 connection (gofoil, lift) always is going to be better than 2. If i was trying to market an inferior connection and construction i'd go straight to "Engineered flex".

i had put hands on older armie gear on the beach and noticed the flex and movement in the setup and assumed it was an outlier or fixed on the A+. Bought the A+, rode it a few sessions and hated the creaky connections and crazy flex, lined it up on the beach with the crew's Lift, GoFoil, and Naish setups. Naish and armie were at the bottom, lift in the middle, and gofoil was at the top by a mile. Sent the armie home, pulled the trigger on the gofoil as soon as i saw the RS series was coming out (needed to see a "fast enough" wing from gofoil in the pipe)

I mean its probably fine for winging or smaller riders but I'm a 220 lb surf foiler.

Select to expand quote

TooMuchEpoxy said..

Johndesu said..

TooMuchEpoxy said..

Johndesu said..

hilly said..

Johndesu said.So Hilly are you now saying that you prefer Go Foil and are you thinking of not using Armstrong gear anymore?, also what is the main reason / your preferred Go Foil foil/s?:-)

After a foil that is fast, turns like the Armie 1050 but has the glide of the HA1125. The GF RS1000 is the closest I have felt. Nice and balanced with no dippy feel. Undecided if I will sell my Armstrong kit, they may reset soon.

Ok I see Andrew, also I originally started on Go Foil but I think / know that Armstrong gear / design is almost perfect but I understand that you want the best behaved front foil wing that will suit you, actually I read about a company that can adapt most brands front wing onto the fuselage of your choice which might be another option?:-)

I don't know about that! Gofoil is light years stiffer. Real thin, fast mast. I know the pedestal tail stuff isn't the cleanest but that Armstrong mast fuse wing connection is some bad design. Tons of flex(even on the A+) and just a ugly transition to the back end of the fuse. Far from perfect!

Really ok well maybe the new gear has improved since I last looked at it - fist generation stuff about a year ago now, and you think the Armstrong mast / fuse connection is not a good design? do you think you could explain that perhaps, and I know that Armstrong wanted / went for a bit of flex etc:-)

The armstrong mast/fuse and fuse wing are both compression fitting s that you can't compress! On the gofoil compression fitting for the wing fuse the screw goes in a slot. This means you wack it with the hammer until the joint is fully seated, then put the screw in. On the armie setup your limited to the one point where the bolt lines up, you can never really get those joints fully seated. Also, the octagonal shape is less resistant to torsion than square(square drive screws anyone?) Also, carbon isn't a great material on those removable connections 1 connection (gofoil, lift) always is going to be better than 2. If i was trying to market an inferior connection and construction i'd go straight to "Engineered flex".

i had put hands on older armie gear on the beach and noticed the flex and movement in the setup and assumed it was an outlier or fixed on the A+. Bought the A+, rode it a few sessions and hated the creaky connections and crazy flex, lined it up on the beach with the crew's Lift, GoFoil, and Naish setups. Naish and armie were at the bottom, lift in the middle, and gofoil was at the top by a mile. Sent the armie home, pulled the trigger on the gofoil as soon as i saw the RS series was coming out (needed to see a "fast enough" wing from gofoil in the pipe)

I mean its probably fine for winging or smaller riders but I'm a 220 lb surf foiler.

In your humble opinion. Totally disagree and I am 230lbs plus.

I've watched my son and paddy change different fuses, different wings both front and back and indeed even a mast length in one day for different foil sports from proning then to dock starting then to beach starting / wave link ups then winging. Oh I forgot they also tow foiled in the middle of the day. Parts, screws were bloody everywhere lol!!

Never encountered such engineering problems in Armstrong connections nor such outlandish issues mentioned. Seem-less changes and all good. And watched bigger guys than you have no issues with this flex problem you seem to have. Each to their own I suppose. There's one thing exploring the stoke of a brand that seems to have some great potential qualities but it's another thing denigrating a high quality product like the armie gear in the process of this.

Select to expand quote

eppo said..
I've watched my son and paddy change different fuses, different wings both front and back and indeed even a mast length in one day for different foil sports from proning then to dock starting then to beach starting / wave link ups then winging. Oh I forgot they also tow foiled in the middle of the day. Parts, screws were bloody everywhere lol!!

Never encountered such engineering problems in Armstrong connections nor such outlandish issues mentioned. Seem-less changes and all good. And watched bigger guys than you have no issues with this flex problem you seem to have. Each to their own I suppose. There's one thing exploring the stoke of a brand that seems to have some great potential qualities but it's another thing denigrating a high quality product like the armie gear in the process of this.

All foils are great and amazing and wonderful and terrible and garbage. None is perfect, of this I am certain

Hilly surprised you did not give Axis a go,For me at 100 kegs+ no mast on the market comes close to 19mm Axis minimal flex, love to have a CF mast but in our weight class too much flex IMO winging and supfoil, plus they have so many wing options for LW or HW riders I use HPS 1050 and 980 winging and BSC 890 supfoil superb wings for heavier riders.Was a GF rider but being a heavier rider Axis had more to offer although have not tried the new GF wings or the new Axis ART either.I use my Axis 890 with my V2 Kalama 6'6" works very well supfoil.Guess the flex thing in masts is a personal thing some riders like it some don't,I'm the latter

Select to expand quote

pitbulldoug said..
Hilly surprised you did not give Axis a go,For me at 100 kegs+ no mast on the market comes close to 19mm Axis minimal flex, love to have a CF mast but in our weight class too much flex IMO winging and supfoil, plus they have so many wing options for LW or HW riders I use HPS 1050 and 980 winging and BSC 890 supfoil superb wings for heavier riders.Was a GF rider but being a heavier rider Axis had more to offer although have not tried the new GF wings or the new Axis ART either.I use my Axis 890 with my V2 Kalama 6'6" works very well supfoil.Guess the flex thing in masts is a personal thing some riders like it some don't,I'm the latter

Had axis but the mast filled with water and the corrosion was terrible. Also after using Armstrong the stiff mast felt heavy and dead.

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TooMuchEpoxy said..

Johndesu said..

TooMuchEpoxy said..

Johndesu said..

hilly said..

Johndesu said.So Hilly are you now saying that you prefer Go Foil and are you thinking of not using Armstrong gear anymore?, also what is the main reason / your preferred Go Foil foil/s?:-)

After a foil that is fast, turns like the Armie 1050 but has the glide of the HA1125. The GF RS1000 is the closest I have felt. Nice and balanced with no dippy feel. Undecided if I will sell my Armstrong kit, they may reset soon.

Ok I see Andrew, also I originally started on Go Foil but I think / know that Armstrong gear / design is almost perfect but I understand that you want the best behaved front foil wing that will suit you, actually I read about a company that can adapt most brands front wing onto the fuselage of your choice which might be another option?:-)

I don't know about that! Gofoil is light years stiffer. Real thin, fast mast. I know the pedestal tail stuff isn't the cleanest but that Armstrong mast fuse wing connection is some bad design. Tons of flex(even on the A+) and just a ugly transition to the back end of the fuse. Far from perfect!

Really ok well maybe the new gear has improved since I last looked at it - fist generation stuff about a year ago now, and you think the Armstrong mast / fuse connection is not a good design? do you think you could explain that perhaps, and I know that Armstrong wanted / went for a bit of flex etc:-)

The armstrong mast/fuse and fuse wing are both compression fitting s that you can't compress! On the gofoil compression fitting for the wing fuse the screw goes in a slot. This means you wack it with the hammer until the joint is fully seated, then put the screw in. On the armie setup your limited to the one point where the bolt lines up, you can never really get those joints fully seated. Also, the octagonal shape is less resistant to torsion than square(square drive screws anyone?) Also, carbon isn't a great material on those removable connections 1 connection (gofoil, lift) always is going to be better than 2. If i was trying to market an inferior connection and construction i'd go straight to "Engineered flex".

i had put hands on older armie gear on the beach and noticed the flex and movement in the setup and assumed it was an outlier or fixed on the A+. Bought the A+, rode it a few sessions and hated the creaky connections and crazy flex, lined it up on the beach with the crew's Lift, GoFoil, and Naish setups. Naish and armie were at the bottom, lift in the middle, and gofoil was at the top by a mile. Sent the armie home, pulled the trigger on the gofoil as soon as i saw the RS series was coming out (needed to see a "fast enough" wing from gofoil in the pipe)

I mean its probably fine for winging or smaller riders but I'm a 220 lb surf foiler.

I don't agree with most of what toomuch has to say but from an engineering point of view the square self locking Morse taper of the GoFoil is far superior solution the to the compression based fixing of the Armstrong. It doesn't mean the Armstrong isn't good enough but I think in time with the extra loads of heavy riders on large wingspans Armstrong will change their design.

I agree that aluminium mast feel dead but flex should be minimised in the carbon masts for best performance and feedback which is appreciated more by heavier riders and when riding large wingspans.

Select to expand quote

TooMuchEpoxy said..

eppo said..
I've watched my son and paddy change different fuses, different wings both front and back and indeed even a mast length in one day for different foil sports from proning then to dock starting then to beach starting / wave link ups then winging. Oh I forgot they also tow foiled in the middle of the day. Parts, screws were bloody everywhere lol!!

Never encountered such engineering problems in Armstrong connections nor such outlandish issues mentioned. Seem-less changes and all good. And watched bigger guys than you have no issues with this flex problem you seem to have. Each to their own I suppose. There's one thing exploring the stoke of a brand that seems to have some great potential qualities but it's another thing denigrating a high quality product like the armie gear in the process of this.

All foils are great and amazing and wonderful and terrible and garbage. None is perfect, of this I am certain

Sounds like you are pretty certain about Armstrong gear to me.. Go foil finnally have one decent front foil that seems suited to those chasing wave riding but with glide and speed now you are rubbishing the entire structural setup of the armie gear without very little real world experience of it.


Back on a positive and informative track, a few others and I are fair dinkum about following up on this new RS foil and are already speaking to the local supplier (and others such as Richman and Hilly) to get a crack on the setup. Can't wait !

Just to make sure you guys realise my comments are not on some fanatical armie fan boy allegiance. I pay for my gear like everyone else and will change if need be.

Ah forums.

Well said Eppo. Let's keep it positive. I have always enjoyed the rides I've had on Armstrong gear and there is zero point in bagging a brand to promote a brand.
There are always going to be pros and cons.
GoFoil has some great wings out at the moment so it's a pro! Anyone ever down Margie's way give me a buzz. Welcome to have a blast on my gear.

Cheers Rich

I really wish people had been more willing to share the negatives with me before I wasted a big part of my season and a lot of money on gear that is inappropriate for me and how I ride.

I'm not saying that Armstrong is worse for everyone, but for me and my riding, it's not stiff enough and the design and construction is a big part of why. That would have been some great info for my friends on the forum to share wouldn't it!

Select to expand quote

TooMuchEpoxy said..
I really wish people had been more willing to share the negatives with me before I wasted a big part of my season and a lot of money on gear that is inappropriate for me and how I ride.

I'm not saying that Armstrong is worse for everyone, but for me and my riding, it's not stiff enough and the design and construction is a big part of why. That would have been some great info for my friends on the forum to share wouldn't it!

Ha ha brilliant. Someone else's fault you did not do due diligence to test that it was stiff as **** to go straight as fast as possible. In your mind anyway

Select to expand quote

TooMuchEpoxy said..
I really wish people had been more willing to share the negatives with me before I wasted a big part of my season and a lot of money on gear that is inappropriate for me and how I ride.

I'm not saying that Armstrong is worse for everyone, but for me and my riding, it's not stiff enough and the design and construction is a big part of why. That would have been some great info for my friends on the forum to share wouldn't it!

If it worked for them how could they share negatives? I have a few friends that tear it up on Armstrong. I didn't bond with it, that's my deal. I prefer more of a Takuma and GoFoil feel, that works for me. I like to feel front foot pressure. I don't think Armstrong dna gives you that and I don't think it's a design flaw /construction issue.
There an old saying - "it's the Indian not the arrow". Maybe that applies here.

I ride foils that can do things I can't do, that's on me..
Really looking forward to your go foil "review" after Christmas!

Select to expand quote

TooMuchEpoxy said..
I really wish people had been more willing to share the negatives with me before I wasted a big part of my season and a lot of money on gear that is inappropriate for me and how I ride.

I'm not saying that Armstrong is worse for everyone, but for me and my riding, it's not stiff enough and the design and construction is a big part of why. That would have been some great info for my friends on the forum to share wouldn't it!

There was a fair few posts and discussions on the inherent flex built into the armie gear a while back. I know one of my bigger mates kept breaking carbon masts before he got the armie and said the flex actually stopped this happening.
anyhow all Part of the journey. for example a Mate of mine (an armie rider for some time) got on the axis 899 today and was raving about it to me. Just passing on the info to show there are is as little Bias possible. Plenty of good stuff out there.

looking forward to trying the GF. Over and out until I do.

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TooMuchEpoxy said..

Johndesu said..

TooMuchEpoxy said..

Johndesu said..

hilly said..

Johndesu said.So Hilly are you now saying that you prefer Go Foil and are you thinking of not using Armstrong gear anymore?, also what is the main reason / your preferred Go Foil foil/s?:-)

After a foil that is fast, turns like the Armie 1050 but has the glide of the HA1125. The GF RS1000 is the closest I have felt. Nice and balanced with no dippy feel. Undecided if I will sell my Armstrong kit, they may reset soon.

Ok I see Andrew, also I originally started on Go Foil but I think / know that Armstrong gear / design is almost perfect but I understand that you want the best behaved front foil wing that will suit you, actually I read about a company that can adapt most brands front wing onto the fuselage of your choice which might be another option?:-)

I don't know about that! Gofoil is light years stiffer. Real thin, fast mast. I know the pedestal tail stuff isn't the cleanest but that Armstrong mast fuse wing connection is some bad design. Tons of flex(even on the A+) and just a ugly transition to the back end of the fuse. Far from perfect!

Really ok well maybe the new gear has improved since I last looked at it - fist generation stuff about a year ago now, and you think the Armstrong mast / fuse connection is not a good design? do you think you could explain that perhaps, and I know that Armstrong wanted / went for a bit of flex etc:-)

The armstrong mast/fuse and fuse wing are both compression fitting s that you can't compress! On the gofoil compression fitting for the wing fuse the screw goes in a slot. This means you wack it with the hammer until the joint is fully seated, then put the screw in. On the armie setup your limited to the one point where the bolt lines up, you can never really get those joints fully seated. Also, the octagonal shape is less resistant to torsion than square(square drive screws anyone?) Also, carbon isn't a great material on those removable connections 1 connection (gofoil, lift) always is going to be better than 2. If i was trying to market an inferior connection and construction i'd go straight to "Engineered flex".

i had put hands on older armie gear on the beach and noticed the flex and movement in the setup and assumed it was an outlier or fixed on the A+. Bought the A+, rode it a few sessions and hated the creaky connections and crazy flex, lined it up on the beach with the crew's Lift, GoFoil, and Naish setups. Naish and armie were at the bottom, lift in the middle, and gofoil was at the top by a mile. Sent the armie home, pulled the trigger on the gofoil as soon as i saw the RS series was coming out (needed to see a "fast enough" wing from gofoil in the pipe)

I mean its probably fine for winging or smaller riders but I'm a 220 lb surf foiler.

I don't agree about the "octagonal shape is less resistant to torsion than square(square drive screws anyone?)
The octagonal shape is overall bigger than the square shape and also has more surface contact, so I think it would be superior to a square shape is resisting torsion forces.....( think of a torx Drive compared to a square drive). I do agree that the wing compressing fitting wears loose, hence the introduction of the barrel bolt.What happens to the go foil connection when it wears and you run out of slot ?

Select to expand quote

kobo said..

TooMuchEpoxy said..

Johndesu said..

TooMuchEpoxy said..

Johndesu said..

hilly said..

Johndesu said.So Hilly are you now saying that you prefer Go Foil and are you thinking of not using Armstrong gear anymore?, also what is the main reason / your preferred Go Foil foil/s?:-)

After a foil that is fast, turns like the Armie 1050 but has the glide of the HA1125. The GF RS1000 is the closest I have felt. Nice and balanced with no dippy feel. Undecided if I will sell my Armstrong kit, they may reset soon.

Ok I see Andrew, also I originally started on Go Foil but I think / know that Armstrong gear / design is almost perfect but I understand that you want the best behaved front foil wing that will suit you, actually I read about a company that can adapt most brands front wing onto the fuselage of your choice which might be another option?:-)

I don't know about that! Gofoil is light years stiffer. Real thin, fast mast. I know the pedestal tail stuff isn't the cleanest but that Armstrong mast fuse wing connection is some bad design. Tons of flex(even on the A+) and just a ugly transition to the back end of the fuse. Far from perfect!

Really ok well maybe the new gear has improved since I last looked at it - fist generation stuff about a year ago now, and you think the Armstrong mast / fuse connection is not a good design? do you think you could explain that perhaps, and I know that Armstrong wanted / went for a bit of flex etc:-)

The armstrong mast/fuse and fuse wing are both compression fitting s that you can't compress! On the gofoil compression fitting for the wing fuse the screw goes in a slot. This means you wack it with the hammer until the joint is fully seated, then put the screw in. On the armie setup your limited to the one point where the bolt lines up, you can never really get those joints fully seated. Also, the octagonal shape is less resistant to torsion than square(square drive screws anyone?) Also, carbon isn't a great material on those removable connections 1 connection (gofoil, lift) always is going to be better than 2. If i was trying to market an inferior connection and construction i'd go straight to "Engineered flex".

i had put hands on older armie gear on the beach and noticed the flex and movement in the setup and assumed it was an outlier or fixed on the A+. Bought the A+, rode it a few sessions and hated the creaky connections and crazy flex, lined it up on the beach with the crew's Lift, GoFoil, and Naish setups. Naish and armie were at the bottom, lift in the middle, and gofoil was at the top by a mile. Sent the armie home, pulled the trigger on the gofoil as soon as i saw the RS series was coming out (needed to see a "fast enough" wing from gofoil in the pipe)

I mean its probably fine for winging or smaller riders but I'm a 220 lb surf foiler.

I don't agree about the "octagonal shape is less resistant to torsion than square(square drive screws anyone?)
The octagonal shape is overall bigger than the square shape and also has more surface contact, so I think it would be superior to a square shape is resisting torsion forces.....( think of a torx Drive compared to a square drive). I do agree that the wing compressing fitting wears loose, hence the introduction of the barrel bolt.What happens to the go foil connection when it wears and you run out of slot ?

When the Gofoil connection gets sloppy you can tighten it up with some epoxy as per the video on the Gofoil site. I have done this when I previously owned a Gofoil and it worked well, just don't skimp on the mold release agent or you'll have a one piece foil