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Razzonater said..
Its called fishing........

Insert emotion....cull.......insert emotion.......lightning strike bee............insert emotion........

SO your post above this you talked about shark fishing when you were commercial craying. Can i ask what you using the sharks that your caught for? Were you targeting great whites? A lot of people talk about commercial fishing being the answer, but i cant think of any commercial fishing operation in Aus that would target great whites Can you..

I think its very silly for people to refer to the problems of attacks as being from "Sharks" in a general term. Many different sharks in the ocean, but Great whites are different then most. Also from NSW to WA their is also a different problem and possibly even a different issue to resolve. NSW they are being attacked by smaller GW's and WA much bigger GWs. For commonsense says two different issues and you could even say will require two different answers to try and make those two different wild locations safe to surf and recreate in. Thats why again, id suggest the smart option is to make ourselves safer when using the ocean seems like commonsense..

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jbshack said..

I cant think of any commercial fishing operation in Aus that would target great whites Can you..

Could be a good business for tourism, fishing for Great Whites.

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oz surf said..

jbshack said..

I cant think of any commercial fishing operation in Aus that would target great whites Can you..

Could be a good business for tourism, fishing for Great Whites.

Like shooting Rhinos or Lions in the Savannah..I don't think that form of tourism is very popular anymore..

shark hooks catch sharks

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jbshack said...

oz surf said..

jbshack said..

I cant think of any commercial fishing operation in Aus that would target great whites Can you..

Could be a good business for tourism, fishing for Great Whites.

Like shooting Rhinos or Lions in the Savannah..I don't think that form of tourism is very popular anymore..

Not that i agree with it...but shooting animals like lions and such is legal and is a massive profit spinner for many African countries. Geez many australians sporting players have been a part of it but you knew That...winking emoticon inserted.

They had legal bullshark fishing on the goldcoast . The people had pontoons with monster chairs to fish from ..

But once again we will kill a dingo if it nips someone...and most dingoes only started coming towards camps because peeps where feeding them..oh is there any light bulbs going off now? No...

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Razzonater said..
shark hooks catch sharks

Come on really, are you talking smaller sharks for bait, for sale to fish markets? Surely you were not out to catch great whites Im genuinely interested as I've not heard of that happening before. What area were you fishing, local, more up north or down south..

Shark hooks do not target one demographic of shark , statistically you might catch over a one or two month period 20-30 sharks. Depending on time of year and location 0 of them may be great whites or in reality it would be 1-2 out of 50, out of the one or two great whites one may be DOA. Dead on arrival, this is a dead shark, a dead great white shark. It's by catch. Estimated 1-200 great whites a year from shark hooks in that period.
Now before everyone gets all huggy about the Sharks.
Do you want to keep doing nothing until we end up with indiscriminate walls of nets?
All fishing has by catch, I don't like trawlers or net boats and as such do not eat prawns,scallops,fish caught in traps, trawled fish, farmed salmon etc etc.
Really you are wait her part of the solution or part of the problem.

There is a few problems here,

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Razzonater said..
Shark hooks do not target one demographic of shark , statistically you might catch over a one or two month period 20-30 sharks. Depending on time of year and location 0 of them may be great whites or in reality it would be 1-2 out of 50, out of the one or two great whites one may be DOA. Dead on arrival, this is a dead shark, a dead great white shark. It's by catch. Estimated 1-200 great whites a year from shark hooks in that period.
Now before everyone gets all huggy about the Sharks.
Do you want to keep doing nothing until we end up with indiscriminate walls of nets?
All fishing has by catch, I don't like trawlers or net boats and as such do not eat prawns,scallops,fish caught in traps, trawled fish, farmed salmon etc etc.
Really you are wait her part of the solution or part of the problem.

There is a few problems here,

So whats you answer then?

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DARTH said..

Razzonater said..
Shark hooks do not target one demographic of shark , statistically you might catch over a one or two month period 20-30 sharks. Depending on time of year and location 0 of them may be great whites or in reality it would be 1-2 out of 50, out of the one or two great whites one may be DOA. Dead on arrival, this is a dead shark, a dead great white shark. It's by catch. Estimated 1-200 great whites a year from shark hooks in that period.
Now before everyone gets all huggy about the Sharks.
Do you want to keep doing nothing until we end up with indiscriminate walls of nets?
All fishing has by catch, I don't like trawlers or net boats and as such do not eat prawns,scallops,fish caught in traps, trawled fish, farmed salmon etc etc.
Really you are wait her part of the solution or part of the problem.

There is a few problems here,

So whats you answer then?

Harpoons!

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LateStarter said..

DARTH said..

Razzonater said..
Shark hooks do not target one demographic of shark , statistically you might catch over a one or two month period 20-30 sharks. Depending on time of year and location 0 of them may be great whites or in reality it would be 1-2 out of 50, out of the one or two great whites one may be DOA. Dead on arrival, this is a dead shark, a dead great white shark. It's by catch. Estimated 1-200 great whites a year from shark hooks in that period.
Now before everyone gets all huggy about the Sharks.
Do you want to keep doing nothing until we end up with indiscriminate walls of nets?
All fishing has by catch, I don't like trawlers or net boats and as such do not eat prawns,scallops,fish caught in traps, trawled fish, farmed salmon etc etc.
Really you are wait her part of the solution or part of the problem.

There is a few problems here,

So whats you answer then?

Harpoons!

Intelligent

Watching the Mid North coast news last night and they had a segment on the reinstalling the beacon in Port Macquarie that picks up the Sharks that are tagged which then sends the signal to the shark app.
One of the local surfers interviewed mentioned it would be a better idea if the signal went to a warning alarm/beacon on land that would be visible for people surfing rather than someone on the beach with their phone.
Not a bad idea
Obviously it wouldn't warn against the sharks that aren't tagged but I personally think the apps are a waste of time

^^ Agree.

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TimKay said...
Watching the Mid North coast news last night and they had a segment on the reinstalling the beacon in Port Macquarie that picks up the Sharks that are tagged which then sends the signal to the shark app.
One of the local surfers interviewed mentioned it would be a better idea if the signal went to a warning alarm/beacon on land that would be visible for people surfing rather than someone on the beach with their phone.
Not a bad idea
Obviously it wouldn't warn against the sharks that aren't tagged but I personally think the apps are a waste of time

I think a light would ruin the surf. You would constantly be checking it just in case,so your mind would never relax....

A siren on the same principal would be better imo. Just surf,hear the hooter and make a choice.

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TimKay said..
Watching the Mid North coast news last night and they had a segment on the reinstalling the beacon in Port Macquarie that picks up the Sharks that are tagged which then sends the signal to the shark app.
One of the local surfers interviewed mentioned it would be a better idea if the signal went to a warning alarm/beacon on land that would be visible for people surfing rather than someone on the beach with their phone.
Not a bad idea
Obviously it wouldn't warn against the sharks that aren't tagged but I personally think the apps are a waste of time

The same system was implemented at one of my local beaches. A warning system goes directly to the tower on shore. Diverts from going to a satellite, then Canada than Canberra then WA Surf life saving association, then eventually the beach in concern..

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Razzonater said..
Shark hooks do not target one demographic of shark , statistically you might catch over a one or two month period 20-30 sharks. Depending on time of year and location 0 of them may be great whites or in reality it would be 1-2 out of 50, out of the one or two great whites one may be DOA. Dead on arrival, this is a dead shark, a dead great white shark. It's by catch. Estimated 1-200 great whites a year from shark hooks in that period.
Now before everyone gets all huggy about the Sharks.
Do you want to keep doing nothing until we end up with indiscriminate walls of nets?
All fishing has by catch, I don't like trawlers or net boats and as such do not eat prawns,scallops,fish caught in traps, trawled fish, farmed salmon etc etc.
Really you are wait her part of the solution or part of the problem.

There is a few problems here,

So were those sharks then sold as catch, they would have been recorded in data

Also any great whites caught, did they also get sold

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jbshack said...

TimKay said..
Watching the Mid North coast news last night and they had a segment on the reinstalling the beacon in Port Macquarie that picks up the Sharks that are tagged which then sends the signal to the shark app.
One of the local surfers interviewed mentioned it would be a better idea if the signal went to a warning alarm/beacon on land that would be visible for people surfing rather than someone on the beach with their phone.
Not a bad idea
Obviously it wouldn't warn against the sharks that aren't tagged but I personally think the apps are a waste of time

The same system was implemented at one of my local beaches. A warning system goes directly to the tower on shore. Diverts from going to a satellite, then Canada than Canberra then WA Surf life saving association, then eventually the beach in concern..

And...

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jbshack said...

Razzonater said..
Shark hooks do not target one demographic of shark , statistically you might catch over a one or two month period 20-30 sharks. Depending on time of year and location 0 of them may be great whites or in reality it would be 1-2 out of 50, out of the one or two great whites one may be DOA. Dead on arrival, this is a dead shark, a dead great white shark. It's by catch. Estimated 1-200 great whites a year from shark hooks in that period.
Now before everyone gets all huggy about the Sharks.
Do you want to keep doing nothing until we end up with indiscriminate walls of nets?
All fishing has by catch, I don't like trawlers or net boats and as such do not eat prawns,scallops,fish caught in traps, trawled fish, farmed salmon etc etc.
Really you are wait her part of the solution or part of the problem.

There is a few problems here,

So were those sharks then sold as catch, they would have been recorded in data

Also any great whites caught, did they also get sold

Any fish and chip shop you have bought flake from in the period from the 70s to 90s would buy the sharks from the fishmarket( for those in perth its canningvale auction near where the fruit an veg.are) fishermans co_ops would buy as well.
From memory up to a 6 footer trunked was fit for consumption. (mercury heavy metal build up in larger) this is around 8 or 9 feet prior to.being trunked.
crayboats, net boats, trawlers, longliners, wetliners all benefited from this, where records become a little murky are,
People would not always announce to fisheries a DOA as unwanted attention when your an alcoholic bong smoking ( generalisation and not my personal view) fisho is not desirable.
Another factor is that all cray licences where in essence a wet coast demersal line licence endorsed with craypots.. Every single one, the problem is with that is most had these taken away due to poor or no records of the actual tonnes of fish or shark thatwere caught. See that would attract things like tax so inessemce by dodging a few hunfred grand of tax, fisheries laughed last when they took the demersal licences back for not being used.
Evet wonder why fish an chips is all imported and overpriced nowadays...............

So we get to the great white, any caught were never sold, however every house 30 years or older on our whole coast that id a fishing family still has a couple sets of jaws hanging in the shed.

So much missed data and records, tax dodges and licence cancellations its avery very slippery slope to find anything near what could be a record...in one of the few scenarios where listening to the old salty will give you closer to the truth than can be found in a file

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jbshack said..

TimKay said..
Watching the Mid North coast news last night and they had a segment on the reinstalling the beacon in Port Macquarie that picks up the Sharks that are tagged which then sends the signal to the shark app.
One of the local surfers interviewed mentioned it would be a better idea if the signal went to a warning alarm/beacon on land that would be visible for people surfing rather than someone on the beach with their phone.
Not a bad idea
Obviously it wouldn't warn against the sharks that aren't tagged but I personally think the apps are a waste of time

The same system was implemented at one of my local beaches. A warning system goes directly to the tower on shore. Diverts from going to a satellite, then Canada than Canberra then WA Surf life saving association, then eventually the beach in concern..

I think putting your trust in the Clubbies is probably not the best idea
Don't get me wrong, they do save lives but there is still a bit of animosity between surfers and Clubbies
And by the time they arrive most surfers have already been and gone.

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TimKay said..

jbshack said..

TimKay said..
Watching the Mid North coast news last night and they had a segment on the reinstalling the beacon in Port Macquarie that picks up the Sharks that are tagged which then sends the signal to the shark app.
One of the local surfers interviewed mentioned it would be a better idea if the signal went to a warning alarm/beacon on land that would be visible for people surfing rather than someone on the beach with their phone.
Not a bad idea
Obviously it wouldn't warn against the sharks that aren't tagged but I personally think the apps are a waste of time

The same system was implemented at one of my local beaches. A warning system goes directly to the tower on shore. Diverts from going to a satellite, then Canada than Canberra then WA Surf life saving association, then eventually the beach in concern..

I think putting your trust in the Clubbies is probably not the best idea
Don't get me wrong, they do save lives but there is still a bit of animosity between surfers and Clubbies
And by the time they arrive most surfers have already been and gone.

Im not really sure what you getting at Why would someone who volunteers their personal time to help keep beaches safe, not be interested in sharing info and clearing the water when a shark is nearby

The system was started by a guy who was involved in a great white attack. They found that fisheries were not providing the info of tagged sharks and actually the delay even when they did was a considerable time..This was a tagged shark swims past, it will set of a alarm instantly in the tower. Beach alarms and water is cleared. Self activating system. (A funny side point is they had to change the audible alarm to only be used from 8 till 5 as they didn't want to annoy nearby houses )

They also have a system being developed that will work on radar and detecting even un tagged sharks..

www.perthnow.com.au/news/wa/curtin-university-sonar-study-detects-sharks-100m-offshore-ng-f9c4d350f03f4c22ec32386bafe04791

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TimKay said...
Watching the Mid North coast news last night and they had a segment on the reinstalling the beacon in Port Macquarie that picks up the Sharks that are tagged which then sends the signal to the shark app.
One of the local surfers interviewed mentioned it would be a better idea if the signal went to a warning alarm/beacon on land that would be visible for people surfing rather than someone on the beach with their phone.
Not a bad idea
Obviously it wouldn't warn against the sharks that aren't tagged but I personally think the apps are a waste of time

You can program the dorsal app to give an alert if a shark is registered near you. For us this includes tagged & captured sharks. Helicopter, and registered sightings plus trialing of drones. For me personally I always remain in water or still go out. I hate crowds more than sharks.

I can't see large shark nets going ahead. Maybe some smaller ones in swimming zones. Too much opposition from a largely green population. Even most surfers I know are against them. They are however for removing any shark than can be linked to an attack. Without naming them.. 2 of Australia's highest profile WSL surfers I've recently spoken to were for getting rid of problem sharks even though publicly they are more 'conservative'.

I'd like to try and convey some info from when you are close to an attack. My friend was killed when we were young at tallow beach. Even back then the media would reel out a scientist ecologist, a crudely spoken fisherman (Vic Hislop) and there'd be a stack of 'shouldn't be out there', " it's there domain" comments. You just kind of take it stunned. The there are the % statistic quotes that media love. You imagine if you said to Stephanie Scott's family; she had more chance of being killed by a drink machine ????? than a deranged killer. It's irrelevant and bordering on insulting. Survivors, rescuers, witnesses and family are badly affected by these events. You have to respect and appreciate their point of view. Rant over & out.

Whats the point of the shark app when you're sitting on your board -WITH NO PHONE! DOH.It suggests to me that its more about shark research than saving lives otherwise it would alert a siren on the beach when the bouy is activated. Sharpes at Ballina pings nearly every day,Id have a device on at least one board if I surfed up there regularly.

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Ricardo1709 said..
Whats the point of the shark app when you're sitting on your board -WITH NO PHONE! DOH.It suggests to me that its more about shark research than saving lives otherwise it would alert a siren on the beach when the bouy is activated. Sharpes at Ballina pings nearly every day,Id have a device on at least one board if I surfed up there regularly.

I'd definitely have the rpela or shark safe system if I was surfing in Ballina on a regular basis.
I talk about the other methods because that's what our tax dollar is being poured into.
Its like Mike Baird feels responsible for making us safe but in reality it's up to the individual
Whether that be installing a device, wearing a prison suit, stripes on the board, Modom magnet leg rope, not surfing or whatever.
The attacks in Ballina is a weird one because you've gone from no attacks to people suddenly being on the menu.
I think even the so called experts are baffled

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Ricardo1709 said..
Whats the point of the shark app when you're sitting on your board -WITH NO PHONE! DOH.It suggests to me that its more about shark research than saving lives otherwise it would alert a siren on the beach when the bouy is activated. Sharpes at Ballina pings nearly every day,Id have a device on at least one board if I surfed up there regularly.

Yes it is exactly that. This point has been discussed at forums locally. If they use a siren onshore here it would be sounding continually. That in itself has its positives and negatives. The app acts as more a collation point. More suitable for; say a family to base their decision on which beach to use, than early warning for surfers. There is also a time lag to the updates. One helicopter has lights and sirens. I've seen it clear the water and info has either been slow to be uploaded on the app or it never makes it. There are also gyrocopters, other helicopters and drones in use that don't upload to the app; as well as surfer sightings. It's in it's infancy, but there probably will be a more cohesive approach in the future.

All of this tooing and frooing zigging and zagging.....
Set some drum lines knock a few on the head...

When we go 6 months wothout an attack reduce the drum line numbers toproblem spots....

Attacks ramp up a few yeard later set some.more drum lines....

Thats all

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Razzonater said..
All of this tooing and frooing zigging and zagging.....
Set some drum lines knock a few on the head...

When we go 6 months wothout an attack reduce the drum line numbers toproblem spots....

Attacks ramp up a few yeard later set some.more drum lines....

Thats all

Now you've made JB mad

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Razzonater said..
All of this tooing and frooing zigging and zagging.....
Set some drum lines knock a few on the head...

When we go 6 months wothout an attack reduce the drum line numbers toproblem spots....

Attacks ramp up a few yeard later set some.more drum lines....

Thats all

So attacks will still happen. Protect yourself.

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DARTH said...

Razzonater said..
All of this tooing and frooing zigging and zagging.....
Set some drum lines knock a few on the head...

When we go 6 months wothout an attack reduce the drum line numbers toproblem spots....

Attacks ramp up a few yeard later set some.more drum lines....

Thats all

So attacks will still happen. Protect yourself.

Darth you are absolutely correct, they will and only problem sharks will be killed.
However the attacks and frequency will return to pre 2000 levels where with technology rpela or shark shield varients as additional protection the attacks may be reduced to where surfing an offshore reef with your 14_15 year old kid or an early morning swim at cottesloe or a late arvo at ballina isnt considered absolute lunacy as it is currently.
No peace of mind is no peace at all.....

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DARTH said..

So attacks will still happen. Protect yourself.

Protect yourself by lobbying your local government official for more action on shark mitigation.

Less Sharks = Less attacks. Simples

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LateStarter said..

DARTH said..

So attacks will still happen. Protect yourself.

Protect yourself by lobbying your local government official for more action on shark mitigation.

Less Sharks = Less attacks. Simples

Im sure that will work. Science.

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Razzonater said..

DARTH said...

Razzonater said..
All of this tooing and frooing zigging and zagging.....
Set some drum lines knock a few on the head...

When we go 6 months wothout an attack reduce the drum line numbers toproblem spots....

Attacks ramp up a few yeard later set some.more drum lines....

Thats all

So attacks will still happen. Protect yourself.

Darth you are absolutely correct, they will and only problem sharks will be killed.
However the attacks and frequency will return to pre 2000 levels where with technology rpela or shark shield variants as additional protection the attacks may be reduced to where surfing an offshore reef with your 14_15 year old kid or an early morning swim at cottesloe or a late arvo at ballina isnt considered absolute lunacy as it is currently.
No peace of mind is no peace at all.....

No they wont and never will.

Also before these attacks really started we all knew the risk and we still surfed. So we still live with the risk as before.