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dools111 said..

AndyrooMac said..

dools111 said..
bit of mention of the SDR boards here - i've picked up a true midlength he is doing, an evo hull at 7 2 x 22 x 2 7/8 with modern rails, can't wait to get hold of it when i'm up on the sunshine/gold coast in a few weeks... got a great review from a guy who owns one...

SDR is an amazing shaper so i'm super keen to hear more about how this one goes... My best LB is an SDR, my mates best SB is an SDR so if this skill translates to a Mid then i'd be keen. I'm planning on checking one out when i'm on the GC later this year

Andy any time you are coming up to the surfcoast let me know i'll have you covered for boards!

Cheers dude, Autumn on the surf coast is on the bucket list for sure

Yeah it looks pretty sweet...I'll get down and pick it up next week!
just gotta get the fin worked out.....maybe a 6.5 Greenough in an Amber colour?
yieeew

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glide77 said..
Yeah it looks pretty sweet...I'll get down and pick it up next week!
just gotta get the fin worked out.....maybe a 6.5 Greenough in an Amber colour?
yieeew

I reckon thats the go, my FT was 7'6" and the 7" Brother Nielsen which is a real foiled Greenough was perfect. Your's was a 7'2"?

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AndyrooMac said..

glide77 said..
Yeah it looks pretty sweet...I'll get down and pick it up next week!
just gotta get the fin worked out.....maybe a 6.5 Greenough in an Amber colour?
yieeew

I reckon thats the go, my FT was 7'6" and the 7" Brother Nielsen which is a real foiled Greenough was perfect. Your's was a 7'2"?

Yeah mine is 7,6....I've got a 7,5 inch that may work but i suspecting is too big. I'll give it a run and adjust from there.
Last time the guys were cool for me to swap afew fins til I got it sorted.

You guys like your fins little! How far up are you setting these little foils?


Meantime, first minute of this video is worth watching. Joel Tudor riding a pretty chunky looking single fin mid in some supernice looking waves.

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saltyheaven said..
You guys like your fins little! How far up are you setting these little foils?


Meantime, first minute of this video is worth watching. Joel Tudor riding a pretty chunky looking single fin mid in some supernice looking waves.

Yeah that's a nice wave...sure does get some speed down the line.
ive got this board made for a Sumatra trip in July so hopefully point it in the right direction on afew drainers!
ive never owned a comparable board so not sure if fin set up...best I can figure is the C buckets seem to like less fin from all reports. The Brothers Nelson looks to be a popular choice.
I also really like the captain fin in my 11ft Glider, so may go with a smaller one of those?
If all else fails a 7 inch 4a will do the trick!

That C-Bucket looks sick! Always wanted to get a custom done in matte green/olive.

I've tried a few fins in my 7'0 Flat Tracker and the 7" 4a is definitely the pick??

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glide77 said..

AndyrooMac said..

glide77 said..
Yeah it looks pretty sweet...I'll get down and pick it up next week!
just gotta get the fin worked out.....maybe a 6.5 Greenough in an Amber colour?
yieeew

I reckon thats the go, my FT was 7'6" and the 7" Brother Nielsen which is a real foiled Greenough was perfect. Your's was a 7'2"?

Yeah mine is 7,6....I've got a 7,5 inch that may work but i suspecting is too big. I'll give it a run and adjust from there.
Last time the guys were cool for me to swap afew fins til I got it sorted.

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saltyheaven said..
You guys like your fins little! How far up are you setting these little foils?


Meantime, first minute of this video is worth watching. Joel Tudor riding a pretty chunky looking single fin mid in some supernice looking waves.

I tried the FT with a larger fin and it really made a huge difference, made it bog down badly on the bottom turn.

My understanding is that the really foiled out rails are creating hold to support the fin so a larger fin creates too much hold and drag. Same applies to Lizzy, she don't like a bigger fin but the location doesn't seem to be so critical, mines middle of the box as Ryan suggested, I'd actually love one with a glass in if he comes back to Aus again. Happy to measure up if you like.

Interestingly, my Tim Clarke can handle a bigger fin but does seem better with the one he shaped, Its 7.5". I think the thicker tail makes the tail float more so it doesn't lock in as well, The TC is 8'4" and actually doesn't cheater 5 as well as Lizzy and I think thats the tail hold as well...

And yeah, JT is buttery smooth on that footage, real nice

I reckon you'd want a stiffer bigger fin for sumatra. A half or inch bigger then what you use here.
In both c buckets I've had I used a 7.5 or 8 Christenson or a Tudor 8.5.
Don't think they make the Christenson anymore. Think it is a different template.
The 7.5 McCallum single looks good.


If it gets bigger and I'm on a single I'll go up to a 9 or 10 pushed right up in the box.

Depends if you want it to be pivoty or draw your turns out. Small upright back it the box for pivot, bigger more rake up in the box for draw out your turns.

Rule of thumb is lay the fin flat and slide it up till 1/3rd of the tip is over the rail amd that should be pretty close to the right spot.

Enjoy the board they are great and will love indo waves.

Agreed - Fin preferences are very subjective. We all surf differently and what feels right for one person might feel so wrong for another, even on the same board. All to do with how we ride, how we weight our feet, where we stand...
I reckon the converse is true too - That a certain setup encourages a certain way of riding. An extreme example being the classic Liddle Hull, or at the other end of the spectrum a typical thruster.

I've got one of those super narrow Liddle flex fins, 9" deep but not much area. Stick that fella in and put it at the front of the box and you'd better be using your rail or you're going to eat it every time. I don't ride with this fin very often but it's good to use it from time to time as a reminder.

I'm still intrigued by reading about your little fins though so I put a 7" one in the day before yesterday, nice waves, head high offshore, bit of a tendency to closeout but a few that ran through... Meh. I guess I'd have to ride with that setup for a good few sessions to really feel it out. However when I headed out this morning I switched back to my usual 9" fin.

Again I was only commenting on the Flat Tracker as I've had other mids and used bigger fins that worked great. FT just rode terribly with anything bigger. I tried a 8.5" L-Flex that True-Ames suggested and it felt as if I was towing an anchor but that particular fin worked great in my 6'10 South Coast Egg.

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SP said..


Rule of thumb is lay the fin flat and slide it up till 1/3rd of the tip is over the rail amd that should be pretty close to the right spot.

Never ever heard of that.


But sounds good

Picked up the CBucket this arvo.
Stoked with the finish and the pigment tint I asked him to match was spot on!
ill get afew waves and take some decent pics in the next few days!

Some real nice clips from Torren Martyns new film, keen to watch this when it comes out...

www.instagram.com/p/Btlxd0tgYu1/?utm_source=ig_share_sheet&igshid=zs7odbi87y8q

Question,

I'm strictly a Poly/PU guy when it comes to materials, I like the feel and flex pattern and prefer heavier boards as they maintain better momentum and glide for me...

But then you can glass Epoxy/EPS heavier from what I have heard and it has better lamination and toughness for durability...

And you can Poly glass an EPS blank which is stiffer/more durable and apparently more eco...

So, what are you're preferences and ideals?
Am I right in my above assumptions?

Let me know you're thoughts... cheers

The other option is epoxy/bio resins over poly which Gary McNeill uses. Excellent durability while maintaining poly feel.

So we were treated to some pretty good waves to break in the new C Bucket.
Friday arvo I went fin shopping and ended up with a 7.5 Captain Fin. Was a toss up between this and the brothers Marshall....but in the end this Ellis Erickson 7.5 just felt the best in the hand. Stiffer and more upright than the Brothers Marshall but I think the right choice.
sat morning was 1to two foot...clean with a little offshore. Waxed it up and paddled out was pleasantly surprised how well it paddled...especially coming of my 11fter!
Anyways first wave was a fast left that i took off latish on...by the time I had negotiated the drop I was forced to bottom turned out on the flats and the board drove and projected off the flats and back to the pocket...was nice to feel that pep and drive.
Got a couple more rights and was just trimming and feeling out what I could.
then snagged a right set wave that walled all the way to the beach...was mid to 3/4 of the way forward of the board and the speed and trim was sweet. A couple of fade turns off the top and a floater to finish.
So was buzzing and keen for another crack in the morning.
Sunday(today)we got a solid pulse of swell over night and arrived at my fav right reef and it was pretty sic. Solid 4 foot... glassy and bloody good.
i couldn't help it...so took the 11ft Glider out. I sat wide and and snagged some solid set waves...man I tell u that Chris Craft isn't just for 1 foot waves!
Anyway after filling my boots on the 11 footer I ran back to get the C Bucket.
im **** at ride reports but the board goes unreal...it's fast, paddles good and trims like a small Glider.
There was abit of juice this morning and it handled it and confirmed it could probably do the same in anything you dared paddle out in....fin felt like a good match but I'm sure I'll play with that over time.
so yeah the C Bucket for me lived up to the hype.
Will do a post honey moon period review too....never heard anyone say their new board was rubbish !

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AndyrooMac said..
Question,

I'm strictly a Poly/PU guy when it comes to materials, I like the feel and flex pattern and prefer heavier boards as they maintain better momentum and glide for me...

But then you can glass Epoxy/EPS heavier from what I have heard and it has better lamination and toughness for durability...

And you can Poly glass an EPS blank which is stiffer/more durable and apparently more eco...

So, what are you're preferences and ideals?
Am I right in my above assumptions?

Let me know you're thoughts... cheers

You can't poly glass an EPS blank. The styrene monomer in the resin eats the foam.

Straight up the whole epoxy board thing is hugely misunderstood. All this bull**** about Epoxy having more float etc etc...

As far as the finished product is concerned you have total volume and the complete weight. That determines the buoyancy (float) regardless of materials. An EPS blank glassed to the same finished board weight as a PU blank will have the same 'float'. There might be very slight differences in weight distribution but really if you think you can pick it you'd better watch the way you wax up because it might mess up the feel of the board with the extra weight in unusual places.

Flex pattern - Maybe. I'm calling BS on this too but not so emphatically. If someone wants to open the discussion I'm more than game. Epoxy as a resin is both more flexible and less brittle than polyester, However the resulting laminate has greater tensile strength which is the thing that contributes most to stiffness of the board as a whole. So yes, the PU/Poly board will be a little bit more flexible, the actual amount of flex though is so minimal I just can't buy into it being a factor. People sometimes cut through stringers to install fin boxes, sometimes they don't - this will have a far greater impact on tail flex than Poly vs Epoxy. Likewise a relatively small change in the thickness of the board will impact flex way way more than the resin used.

I've been using epoxy for my own boards since the late 1980's, for ages and ages with a standard Polyurethane surfboard blank, more recently with EPS. When I use EPS I double glass - 2 x 6oz bottom, 2 x 6oz + deck patch top. All layers except the patch wrapped around the rail, so that's 4 layers of 6oz on the rails. I use a double stringer and fit the finbox in between them so as not to cut the stringers. The boards have a weight comparable to a typical Poly/PU board. They are seriously strong and durable. I have NEVER broken a board. (Edit - not true, I broke an Epoxy/EPS windsurfer once but I fell on it from a great height and it was built superlight.)

An EPS blank has a kind of springback resilience that matches well with Epoxy resin's greater flexibility. A PU blank doesn't really springback and matches well with Polyester resin's local resistance to denting. Both are good matches.
PU foam with Epoxy does work fine and is strong but is slightly more prone to deck dents due to the mismatch between the local flexibility of the epoxy layup and the non springback of the PU foam.

PU foam doesn't absorb water in any significant quantity if in good condition and a ding requires a bit of tape over it and a repair at some stage, no big rush.
EPS foam takes water on in the airspace between it's cells like a thirsty man with a straw, and a ding means getting the thing out of the water immediately and fixing it properly before getting it wet again.

You can leave a PU foam board in the sun or a hot car and it will be ok.
EPS foam allows migration of the air contained within it and as such there is a pressure build up inside the board when it gets hot, left unchecked it is possible (it does happen) to blow the laminate off the foam. I put a vent in mine, problem solved. Just don't forget to do the vent up before jumping in!

Regardless of what they say, Epoxy is not stable in UV, it discolours and degrades. Don't leave a clear (can see the foam) epoxy board stored in bright sunlight. Use a cover, take it out to use and replace it after. Or paint it. (my choice.)

EPS is more eco in production but is still a long way from a fabulous organic biodegradable product, it is recyclable but not currently in Australia.


I think we all have a responsibility to minimise our impact and as far as surfboards are concerned, the most direct way to achieve that is to make them durable. There are plenty of options for making a durable board using any of the commonly used materials.

p.s. Glide, your C-Bucket looks super super freaking sweet! Keep that baby forever.

Was checking out the discussion as yesterday was sup surfing and broke my paddle so grabbed a 9ft and surfed that.
On the sup was hunting the bombs but the surfboard felt awesome on the wave.

Saltyheaven, used to build epoxy sandwich windsurf boards and helped a polyester laminater build some epoxy surfboards that Ratso shaped. At this stage I didn't surf but they said different floaty feel and made the next few thinner.
From memory no stringer,3mm PVC bottom and cormat deck with 6oz so they were strong but still light.
Flex is hard to measure but had a windsurf waveboard PVC sandwich with s glass and so nice to bottom turn in smaller waves.
My next waveboard was glassed with kevlar (to bounce of Taranaki rocks) and a few design changes but stiffer in smaller waves but awesome in bigger waves.

After yesterday I'm getting my Starboard 8'4" wood surfboard out this afternoon

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515 said..
Saltyheaven, used to build epoxy sandwich windsurf boards and helped a polyester laminater build some epoxy surfboards that Ratso shaped. At this stage I didn't surf but they said different floaty feel and made the next few thinner.
From memory no stringer,3mm PVC bottom and cormat deck with 6oz so they were strong but still light.

I'm willing to bet they were lighter, so the floaty feel and then the next few thinner to compensate makes perfect sense.

Ever since Archimedes there have been few attacks on the simple physics of floatation, from boats to submarines, kids toys, carburetors, fish, lifejackets, sea ice, ice cubes in your drink, pumice, bluebottles and on and on and on.... They all follow the very simple physical laws. Except apparently, surfboards! Ha!

I used to build bagged sandwich windsurfers too, slalom boards. No stringer, lightweight EPS core, 2 oz carbon skin, 3mm Divinicell, 6 oz outer skin. Stiff, Light and large volume = floaty feel. This is the construction that I once broke that I mentioned above.

Select to expand quote

saltyheaven said..

AndyrooMac said..
Question,

I'm strictly a Poly/PU guy when it comes to materials, I like the feel and flex pattern and prefer heavier boards as they maintain better momentum and glide for me...

But then you can glass Epoxy/EPS heavier from what I have heard and it has better lamination and toughness for durability...

And you can Poly glass an EPS blank which is stiffer/more durable and apparently more eco...

So, what are you're preferences and ideals?
Am I right in my above assumptions?

Let me know you're thoughts... cheers

You can't poly glass an EPS blank. The styrene monomer in the resin eats the foam.

Straight up the whole epoxy board thing is hugely misunderstood. All this bull**** about Epoxy having more float etc etc...

As far as the finished product is concerned you have total volume and the complete weight. That determines the buoyancy (float) regardless of materials. An EPS blank glassed to the same finished board weight as a PU blank will have the same 'float'. There might be very slight differences in weight distribution but really if you think you can pick it you'd better watch the way you wax up because it might mess up the feel of the board with the extra weight in unusual places.

Flex pattern - Maybe. I'm calling BS on this too but not so emphatically. If someone wants to open the discussion I'm more than game. Epoxy as a resin is both more flexible and less brittle than polyester, However the resulting laminate has greater tensile strength which is the thing that contributes most to stiffness of the board as a whole. So yes, the PU/Poly board will be a little bit more flexible, the actual amount of flex though is so minimal I just can't buy into it being a factor. People sometimes cut through stringers to install fin boxes, sometimes they don't - this will have a far greater impact on tail flex than Poly vs Epoxy. Likewise a relatively small change in the thickness of the board will impact flex way way more than the resin used.

I've been using epoxy for my own boards since the late 1980's, for ages and ages with a standard Polyurethane surfboard blank, more recently with EPS. When I use EPS I double glass - 2 x 6oz bottom, 2 x 6oz + deck patch top. All layers except the patch wrapped around the rail, so that's 4 layers of 6oz on the rails. I use a double stringer and fit the finbox in between them so as not to cut the stringers. The boards have a weight comparable to a typical Poly/PU board. They are seriously strong and durable. I have NEVER broken a board. (Edit - not true, I broke an Epoxy/EPS windsurfer once but I fell on it from a great height and it was built superlight.)

An EPS blank has a kind of springback resilience that matches well with Epoxy resin's greater flexibility. A PU blank doesn't really springback and matches well with Polyester resin's local resistance to denting. Both are good matches.
PU foam with Epoxy does work fine and is strong but is slightly more prone to deck dents due to the mismatch between the local flexibility of the epoxy layup and the non springback of the PU foam.

PU foam doesn't absorb water in any significant quantity if in good condition and a ding requires a bit of tape over it and a repair at some stage, no big rush.
EPS foam takes water on in the airspace between it's cells like a thirsty man with a straw, and a ding means getting the thing out of the water immediately and fixing it properly before getting it wet again.

You can leave a PU foam board in the sun or a hot car and it will be ok.
EPS foam allows migration of the air contained within it and as such there is a pressure build up inside the board when it gets hot, left unchecked it is possible (it does happen) to blow the laminate off the foam. I put a vent in mine, problem solved. Just don't forget to do the vent up before jumping in!

Regardless of what they say, Epoxy is not stable in UV, it discolours and degrades. Don't leave a clear (can see the foam) epoxy board stored in bright sunlight. Use a cover, take it out to use and replace it after. Or paint it. (my choice.)

EPS is more eco in production but is still a long way from a fabulous organic biodegradable product, it is recyclable but not currently in Australia.


I think we all have a responsibility to minimise our impact and as far as surfboards are concerned, the most direct way to achieve that is to make them durable. There are plenty of options for making a durable board using any of the commonly used materials.

Hey dude,

Love this response... certainly answers some questions for me and raises a few more as well...

I've had a few epoxy boards and my neighbors DVS is an epoxy, all of them I havent liked "the feel" of the board but the DVS is the best of them i've seen... we really need to get together and do a board swap, see if you can convert me... because I really like the durability/eco benefits but atm not enough to be swayed.

Select to expand quote

glide77 said..
So we were treated to some pretty good waves to break in the new C Bucket.
Friday arvo I went fin shopping and ended up with a 7.5 Captain Fin. Was a toss up between this and the brothers Marshall....but in the end this Ellis Erickson 7.5 just felt the best in the hand. Stiffer and more upright than the Brothers Marshall but I think the right choice.
sat morning was 1to two foot...clean with a little offshore. Waxed it up and paddled out was pleasantly surprised how well it paddled...especially coming of my 11fter!
Anyways first wave was a fast left that i took off latish on...by the time I had negotiated the drop I was forced to bottom turned out on the flats and the board drove and projected off the flats and back to the pocket...was nice to feel that pep and drive.
Got a couple more rights and was just trimming and feeling out what I could.
then snagged a right set wave that walled all the way to the beach...was mid to 3/4 of the way forward of the board and the speed and trim was sweet. A couple of fade turns off the top and a floater to finish.
So was buzzing and keen for another crack in the morning.
Sunday(today)we got a solid pulse of swell over night and arrived at my fav right reef and it was pretty sic. Solid 4 foot... glassy and bloody good.
i couldn't help it...so took the 11ft Glider out. I sat wide and and snagged some solid set waves...man I tell u that Chris Craft isn't just for 1 foot waves!
Anyway after filling my boots on the 11 footer I ran back to get the C Bucket.
im **** at ride reports but the board goes unreal...it's fast, paddles good and trims like a small Glider.
There was abit of juice this morning and it handled it and confirmed it could probably do the same in anything you dared paddle out in....fin felt like a good match but I'm sure I'll play with that over time.
so yeah the C Bucket for me lived up to the hype.
Will do a post honey moon period review too....never heard anyone say their new board was rubbish !

Board looks unreal dude and sounds like it was love at first wave, wait till you get her dialed in though...

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AndyrooMac said...

... we really need to get together and do a board swap.....

For sure we need to do that, I'm looking forward to it! Need good waves though.... waiting patiently for some down your way and I'm on.

Great thread men good to see some serious board talk.

And speaking of Ryan, got smoked trying to buy Ryan's old VBowls, said i'd take it and the dude sold her on me... so gutted... happens though

Bummer Andy.

Macaha, love that board, 7'6 Disco right? I'm pretty taken with the outline but it always seemed too pinny to be much good in normal waves. However I recently overlaid my old 7'2 travel board over the Disco outline for interest and discovered they are a lot more similar than different. Rockers are in the same ballpark too.
I wonder if the Disco with the fin way forward and my 7'2 with the fin way back might start to feel kind of similar....

No idea but figure you guys mite like it.

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Macaha said..
No idea but figure you guys mite like it.

Haha! Gotta love someone that just jumps in because it looks like a good party!