Mike, seeing I have absolutely no idea what you (or anybody else has been saying) Im waiting for the 400 page book titled "GW60 for complete imbeciles" comes out after Xmas. Then I will attempt to set my new GW60 up (once Xmas day has passed) with everyone's help.
Bring on Boxing day.

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ka43 said..
Mike, seeing I have absolutely no idea what you (or anybody else has been saying) Im waiting for the 400 page book titled "GW60 for complete imbeciles" comes out after Xmas. Then I will attempt to set my new GW60 up (once Xmas day has passed) with everyone's help.
Bring on Boxing day.

Nah, 1 or 2 pages should do it. I'll try and condense everything you need to know and start a separate page so you don't have to troll through this thread.

I've just talked to Daffy and given him all my tests on a usb stick, he seems reasonably confident it will be approved before Xmas.

Awesome Decrepit,

Good on you guys for doing all the hard work collecting and analyzing data.

Thanks

Decrepit has done an awesome job testing the GW-60.Thanks from all of us for your efforts Mike!

The only reason to not automatically approve the GW-60 (as it uses 99% the same hardware and software as the GW-52) was to check two things:

1. That the error band for underhand v's overhand wearing was well within acceptable bounds (no more than GT-31)

2. That there were not surprise anomalies created by slightly altered packaging and firmware.

I am pretty confident we can give it a tick on both counts.

Decrepits testing shows the difference between underhand and overhand error band to be around double. But, the error band is outstandingly small. Even in underhand grip orientation it is on a par with common error band figures from the GW-52, and in overhand orientation is is significantly better in some tests. In any case, all the test show it is far better @ 5hz than common GT-31 figures.

So far, we have seen no anomalies (as hoped and expected), with the new packaging.

On the basis of these tests and analysis I see no reason not to provisionally approve the GW-60 for general GPSTC use.

We would like sailors using it to keep a close eye on SDOP range and any possible errors. Please report any possible anomalies that might come up.

Those of you who can continue to use it with GT-31's and GW-52's, it would be great if you can continue to keep and eye on any anomalies and report them to Mike and myself via email if you see any.

I will report our conclusions to the GPSTC committee for official approval.

Happy sailing.

In the immortal words of our dearly departed Leonard Cohen, HALLELUJAH!!!

Thanks for the hard work Mike and Andrew.

Nice one guys, well done

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sailquik said..
Decrepit has done an awesome job testing the GW-60.Thanks from all of us for your efforts Mike!

The only reason to not automatically approve the GW-60 (as it uses 99% the same hardware and software as the GW-52) was to check two things:

1. That the error band for underhand v's overhand wearing was well within acceptable bounds (no more than GT-31)

2. That there were not surprise anomalies created by slightly altered packaging and firmware.

I am pretty confident we can give it a tick on both counts.

Decrepits testing shows the difference between underhand and overhand error band to be around double. But, the error band is outstandingly small. Even in underhand grip orientation it is on a par with common error band figures from the GW-52, and in overhand orientation is is significantly better in some tests. In any case, all the test show it is far better @ 5hz than common GT-31 figures.

So far, we have seen no anomalies (as hoped and expected), with the new packaging.

On the basis of these tests and analysis I see no reason not to provisionally approve the GW-60 for general GPSTC use.

We would like sailors using it to keep a close eye on SDOP range and any possible errors. Please report any possible anomalies that might come up.

Those of you who can continue to use it with GT-31's and GW-52's, it would be great if you can continue to keep and eye on any anomalies and report them to Mike and myself via email if you see any.

I will report our conclusions to the GPSTC committee for official approval.

Happy sailing.

Why am I not surprise.

I wear a Suunto Ambit 3 on my wrist while sailing and a GT31 on my shoulder.
Every now and then I achieve a high speed reading for Max speed on my watch compared to my GT31 worn on my shoulder. Mostly due an over the handle bars dismount.
From memory one day I had 37and bit kts on my watch but only high 20's on the GT31. The 37kt was done during a catapult.
It has only happened a couple of times and mostly they both read within a couple of points of a kt. And it is a rare occasion that there is a big discrepancy between the units.

Something too watch out for with wrist mounted units with the extra movement out on the end of your arm.

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PKenny said..
Something too watch out for with wrist mounted units with the extra movement out on the end of your arm.

So put the watch on the trailing arm in speed runs - it will travel further in a catapult !

The first time my wife tried to sail a speed board, the GT-31 showed almost 40 knots after a catapult:

She wore the GT-31 on her upper arm. In the doppler data, the speed was less than 30 knots. It was a nice catapult, though - she still sometimes talks about it .

I played around a bit with my two GW-60s (just driving around so far, it's always either dark or below freezing when it's windy here). I'm pretty impressed with ease of use, readability, and accuracy. The SDOP values appear to be pretty darn good: out of ~6000 data point pairs with speed > 10 knots, only 12 had non-overlapping ranges. If the SDOP values were simple standard deviations, then the ranges for several hundred data points would not overlap, so the SDOP numbers seem closer to defining 99% probabilities. Nice (but not surprise).

Well it looks like I could be getting one soon as my Canmore is playing up (i.e. 63kms on canmore and 48kms after downloading to KA72 and with no 2sec value. Worn in pouch on shoulder and securely clipped to maintain full sky view, like always).

So a quick question...

I want a replacement for my canmore, we are not chasing records other than within our team, Is this the unit to buy?

Or should i not get it yet because i am a MAC user.

Another new canmore will set me back $80.

Cheers Dave.

Buy I GW-60 they are good.
We did some battery testing yesterday one watch went for 9hrs another for 160k used half its charge while 2 GW-52s ran out.

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Boombuster said...
Buy I GW-60 they are good.
We did some battery testing yesterday one watch went for 9hrs another for 160k used half its charge while 2 GW-52s ran out.

+1. Used my GW60 today ?? Very happy

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BSN101 said..
Well it looks like I could be getting one soon as my Canmore is playing up (i.e. 63kms on canmore and 48kms after downloading to KA72 and with no 2sec value. Worn in pouch on shoulder and securely clipped to maintain full sky view, like always).

So a quick question...

I want a replacement for my canmore, we are not chasing records other than within our team, Is this the unit to buy?

Or should i not get it yet because i am a MAC user.

Another new canmore will set me back $80.

Cheers Dave.

The Canmore problem is probably data drop out, this doesn't seem to have anything to do with satellite signal, apparently it's a problem with write speed to the memory. Fangy was telling me a few days ago that his was having the same trouble with his Canmore. Dropouts may increase with age?

The watch has no problem with a Mac, you just can't use their utility without a windows emulator, but the watch will connect to a Mac as a usb storage device.
somebody said you need to update to the latest firm ware to get the best out of the Mac connection. But there's no details what these advantages may be, and by all reports the firmware that comes with it works fine.

When you don't upgrade the firmware of the GW-60 , it will give an error when you attach it to a Mac (something about mounting the volume). You can ignore this error and still use it as the way it should. After the upgrade of the firmware this error-message is gone, so mounting/dismounting is done the way it should be done under Mac OS. Not a big deal, but i don't like to see error messages :)

Can GW-60 improve my planing jibes?

What I mean after sailing will I be able to easily plug it into computer and see how fast I'm coming out of my jibes?

I'm a total newbie to gps tech. I'm not as interested in hitting absolute top end (yet anyway) - just obsessed with good jibe technique.

Thanks!!

Pretty sure it will improve your gibes, just use GPResults to analyse it, with the 5hz sampling you will be able to take a look at every meter of the gibe !

Hello

I just got mine, I charged its battery to full by MacBook and it worked ok (=it showed speed and it set automatically the correct time) but few minutes after that it showed time only or if i pressed any button it shows "Start Mode". I can´t do anything with it at the moment as it doesn´t let me move on as that "Start Mode" appears on the display. Could you please help me a bit?

Thanks and cheeeers, Trouble Maker

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TroubleMaker said..
Hello

I just got mine, I charged its battery to full by MacBook and it worked ok (=it showed speed and it set automatically the correct time) but few minutes after that it showed time only or if i pressed any button it shows "Start Mode". I can´t do anything with it at the moment as it doesn´t let me move on as that "Start Mode" appears on the display. Could you please help me a bit?

Thanks and cheeeers, Trouble Maker

Did you download the quick start guide off Locosys web site?
Its very simple and easy to understand if you read it.

Hi,

I read mostly it, but skipped that certain part where read "unlock" - sorry, I was in a hurry to play with it - but now it works again so many thanks .

Trouble Maker

Just tried out my GW 60 for the first time today, big improvement on the GT31.

Only problem i came across was fogging on the face glass (internally) whilst i was sailing along. it was fogging and clearing intermittently, Splashes aside the watch didnt receive a dunking at all. Has anyone else using them experienced this? Anyone know if there would be an external glass face that could be fogging against an internal face?

I intend on sending off an email to locosys as well to find out if its an issue, just wondering if anyone else has seen it happen....

No fogging problems yet. I have used my GW-60 just a couple of times, but the water here is so cold (~4 C) that things fog up quickly - I can't use glasses anymore. You should definitely contact Locosys right away, they are very responsive.

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fibersnap said..
Can GW-60 improve my planing jibes?

What I mean after sailing will I be able to easily plug it into computer and see how fast I'm coming out of my jibes?

I'm a total newbie to gps tech. I'm not as interested in hitting absolute top end (yet anyway) - just obsessed with good jibe technique.

Thanks!!

Check out GPS Action Replay, it has a nice feature to analyze your jibes. It shows a table with lots of numbers, including minimum speed during the jibe and exit speed. It also gives you a score - the percent of your entry speed you keep in your jibe. Check out this page for examples: boardsurfr.blogspot.com/2013/04/gps-jibe-analysis.html
Ignore what I wrote about Doppler vs. non-doppler speeds, though. I had the GT-31 set up a bit wrong, and the GW-60 will give you better data than the GT-31, anyway.

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fibersnap said..
Can GW-60 improve my planing jibes?

What I mean after sailing will I be able to easily plug it into computer and see how fast I'm coming out of my jibes?

I'm a total newbie to gps tech. I'm not as interested in hitting absolute top end (yet anyway) - just obsessed with good jibe technique.

Thanks!!

There's also the "alpha" division. Basically a "U" shape track. The GTC uses a max total length of 500m with a max separation between start and stop points of 50m.
If your not competing you can change these parameters to whatever suits you. A good score doesn't only depend on a good Gybe. you also need good speeds on the in/outgoing legs. So the shorter you make the total distance the more important the gybe becomes.

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decrepit said..

fibersnap said..
Can GW-60 improve my planing jibes?

What I mean after sailing will I be able to easily plug it into computer and see how fast I'm coming out of my jibes?

I'm a total newbie to gps tech. I'm not as interested in hitting absolute top end (yet anyway) - just obsessed with good jibe technique.

Thanks!!

There's also the "alpha" division. Basically a "U" shape track. The GTC uses a max total length of 500m with a max separation between start and stop points of 50m.
If your not competing you can change these parameters to whatever suits you. A good score doesn't only depend on a good Gybe. you also need good speeds on the in/outgoing legs. So the shorter you make the total distance the more important the gybe becomes.

GpsArPro doesn't show my 10sec runs, logged at 5hz. To see them I have to uncheck the "Cubic enabled" box. Then recalculate and they are yet visible, but it's impossible to upload to GP3S, because of the message that I have to check the Cubic box to upload!
Any way to work around this?
Cheers
Patrick

Patrick, Are you using the latest version of GpsArPro, I had a feeling Manfred fixed this issues.
Just checked I'm using version 5.11 and have the same problem.
I see the latest is 5.16, is anybody using this version with a 5hz device? does it do 10s with cubic spline?

Problem only seems to occur with 5hz or 18Hz (Gyro 1) sessions, this is what i have tested so far with GPSarPro. With GPSResults no issue at all, (Manfred is actually the developer of GPSResults and not GPSarPro....)

GPSAR can't find the correct sentences in the data to process. The GW60 does not use a Sirf GPS chipset, it is using one from MTK that outputs NMEA rather than binary data. Essentially GPSAR can't find the data it needs. It has the same trouble with later U-Blox GPS data, the message structure has changed so again it can't find the correct data.

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decrepit said..
Patrick, Are you using the latest version of GpsArPro, I had a feeling Manfred fixed this issues.
Just checked I'm using version 5.11 and have the same problem.
I see the latest is 5.16, is anybody using this version with a 5hz device? does it do 10s with cubic spline?

Don't think it's Manfred. GpsArPro is made by Yann Mathet, France.
I have installed the 5.16 but it has the same issue.

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Roo said..
GPSAR can't find the correct sentences in the data to process. The GW60 does not use a Sirf GPS chipset, it is using one from MTK that outputs NMEA rather than binary data. Essentially GPSAR can't find the data it needs. It has the same trouble with later U-Blox GPS data, the message structure has changed so again it can't find the correct data.

So this will probably not easy to solve
Does it mean I have to switch to GPS results If I want to analyse tracks?