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veton said..
I've just received the T5 and I'm going to replace the flash to avoid using memory cards, can someone please tell me the right one to pick?
Is it this one reference: W25Q128JVSIQ ?

Yes, this is the 16MB flash chip (W25Q128JVSIQ). I ordered some here : nl.aliexpress.com/item/1005007401687554.html?spm=a2g0o.order_list.order_list_main.30.dbb379d2BrdK0B&gatewayAdapt=glo2nld
If you change the flash chip from the T5 from 4MB -> 16MB, you need to use another partition.csv when flashing the board over USB. This is the one on github with the name partitions_16MB.csv. So, delete the actual partitions.csv, and change then partitions_16MB.csv -> partitions.csv. When compiling then the OTA-webserver sketch, this partition is used. I still have to extend the manual for this....
Greetings, Jan.

Video that shows difference in screen refresh when full sunlight hits the screen.BE74 has no visible lag.BN does but in normal use it good to use.

Paco

Interesting PacoRappNL, But confused which is which? Bottom display looks way clearer but takes longer to refresh (BN74?). Top display changes quickly but is ghosted? I've been putting electrical tape over the BN74 sensitive area to eliminate this as sun goes straight through 3D print. I'd rather the clearer/slower display as better contrast in strong sun. Maybe I'm messed up though

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Flex2 said..
Interesting PacoRappNL, But confused which is which? Bottom display looks way clearer but takes longer to refresh (BN74?). Top display changes quickly but is ghosted? I've been putting electrical tape over the BN74 sensitive area to eliminate this as sun goes straight through 3D print. I'd rather the clearer/slower display as better contrast in strong sun. Maybe I'm messed up though

Flex2,
Both versions have blacktape over the red circled location.I found out even black 3D print in PETG give same result as white or other color versions even with black tape.

Top is 213-B74 not 213-BE74 (my fault) and refreshes better.
Bottom is 213-BN and has slower refresh.

I have used both versions for reading actual speed last year on the upper arm and do not feel the B74 is less visible.

Paco

is this a ESP?

www.instagram.com/stories/lisawindsurfing/3602070720221299073?igsh=cGF4aTcxbjlkNzYy

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veton said..
is this a ESP?

www.instagram.com/stories/lisawindsurfing/3602070720221299073?igsh=cGF4aTcxbjlkNzYy

Kind of .

With Jan's help I'm working on my own LISA prototypes/functions with color touch screen, up to 20hz, 3500mah battery, etc, and hopefully additional features such as race timer, bluetooth timer etc.. but I'm for now mainly working on the displays, securing the waterproof case and testing a lot to ensure that it's rock solid, easy to use. I will not be another mess like Motion and my policy with LISA is to provide the best products with the best service, so if I don't feel it 100% I will not sell it .

Nico

In case your still in doubt about the visibility of both versions.

I made a new video also with the speed screen.

Direct sunlight @ 11.00 o'clock from Fuerteventura island hitting the screens.

Sorry for the shaking hand.

So these are my babies




Sadly the T-Display does not have any visibility in sunlight, but the devices perform perfect and you don't even notice them, more comfortable in the arm than the Motion. All are potted and with pogo pin connectors.

My last one:














Same concept for the GDEM0213B74, but replaced the Flash chip with a 16Mb one so it doesn't need the memory card, electronics covered in polymer and all interior potted with flex resin, 2000mAh batt. The lower part is printed in transparent filament so the Led is obvious. This configuration places the Gps antenna almost horizontal and clear to the sky when sailing and the quality of the data obtained outperforms the Motion every test so far, looking at the number of sats and estimated errors. Also Im using the M10 in performance mode, having better results in 3 sat constellations (GPS galileo beidou).
I?ll test it in the next days, we'll see
regards

Nice Veton! I like the idea printing the lower part from transparent material to view the LEDs. If you have a MMU (Multi-Material-Unit) you could mix on places where needed. Do you glue the 2 ends together before potting? Where do you put in the resin? Do you cover the Epaper/LCD with potting epoxy as well?
What does it mean you use M10 in performance mode? Is it a special M10 or a specific setting? Do you have some comparison between the modes? Will it consume more power when using it?

im not on my computer so will update this in a couple of days
I dont have any fancy printer, just a Bambulab A1, you can do it even on the A1 mini which is probably the cheapest on the market. The two are just one piece, just put a pause and change filament and resume. So is perfctly Welded. It Is printed upside down and the first layers are in white. The transparent is great, even if you dont put very well the LED in place, it shines brightly anyway, and also you can see the GPS leds blinking.
I use PCTG, similar to PETG, a bit more difficult to find but as my trials went fine I wont change and probably it is a bit better. Is mandatory to use a dryer if you want a clean print, I dont even try over 25% humidity.
The enclosure has a lid on the bottom, first I glue the screen cover with poliurethane caulk, lately with something like Ms polymer (not silicon), the same thing I use to cover the chips on the back of the PCB and to paste the pogo pin connector. I put everything inside through the lid hole, paste de lid an later resin the inside with flex resin (doming epoxy) trough a hole that has a little cap. I've done five or six and havent got a single drop of resin out of the box, well, just the excess when inserting the cap. Also I tested the PCTG and found it waterproof. The caulk and resil easily peels off if on the screen or enclosure.
There is a 0,5 mm gap between the screen and the cover, so resin fills in, it is a bit tricky to fill it carefully and slowly so no bubbles get trapped.
About the M10 performance mode, its a bit tricky to find how to do it but once done it is very easy. You need a usb to uart converter and ublox U-center software. I should make a tutorial if interested. What you get is up to 3 constellations at 16 Hz or even 20 hz on two. No need for that but having 3 constellations is great. Ive just come back of a training and in my first use of the Epaper unit I've reached 30! stellites, most of the time around 27-28 in a place where the M8 Motion is about 18 sat (gps+galileo+beidou). probably the design of the enclosure has something to it as when in use the gps antena is almost horizontal and pointing to the sky with no interference.
So I am beggining to think with no reason that it simply works better, I've never seen this performance. I have in todays track a max error of 0,03 knots at 10 sec, 0,015 on alpha (3 const. 10Hz) isn't it great?. I would encourage some more testing. Also if Jan could enable higer frecuencies than 10 Hz even if there is no need for more than 10, but 12 or 16
The drawback is that the electric consumption is a bit more. I've been searching everywhere to find how much it is without success, but the normal mode if I'm not wrong is less than 10 mAh, and the Ublox papers just say performance mode is just "a bit more", so I guess is not much. Say is 15 or 20, still great and less than M9.
For example, today I had a session 3,5 - 4 hours aprox, I started on 4,28 volts and ended on 4,13, to me that's fine, with the T5 and a 2000 mAh battery, whatever the comsumption may be.

regards

this is the section of the enclosure

Finally had the opportunity to test it on the water. I'm wearing it on the forearm where I can easily read the values while surfing. Couldn't be happier!

This is my second attempt at designing my own casing. Where the first one leaked, was hard to assemble and hard to charge. This design is intended to be opened. This is required for charging and allows for fixing in case of some hardware problem. And if water leaks in, it will dry easily. But until now water did not find a way in.

The software is great and tracking is very accurate. Wonderful job by the developer!
Still having some trouble understanding all the screens and how the alpha measuring works, but I guess that will come with time.

Here is the unit when opened so it can be charged.
Testing on the bicycle :)

Very nice work ! Which kind of seal you are using (soft silicone ?). How did you print the sealed housing ? A interesting link about waterproofing electronics : thecavepearlproject.org/2023/03/17/waterproofing-your-electronics-project/
My advice : use conformal coating as "Last line of defence !". When salt water gets in, it will ruin the electronics within minutes. Don't forgot the flex print + connector to the screen, this will die first....
Greetings, Jan

Great, thanks for the advice. I was wondering if I should put some extra protection on the electronics but wasn't sure how to do this. But your suggestion is exactly what I need. Not surfing in salt water frequently, but it happens sometimes.

Regarding the print: this is just a simple PLA print which I sprayed a thick layer of paint on. Some of the difficult parts, where the paint couldn't get, are covered with epoxy glue. The screws are sealed with a small rubber washer (created from the inner tube of a bicycle tire) and the orange seal is just an elastic band which came with the broccoli from the supermarket
All in all, some fiddling but it seems to hold up.

It's not as fancy and compact as some of the other devices posted here, but it works. During designing I got really annoyed by the SD-card which takes a lot of space en therefore results in a larger housing. But all this extra air provides a nice benefit; it floats :) So in case it rips of my arm during a crash, there is a big chance I'll find it.

For those interested, I've created this with Dune3D. A very nice parametric modeler: simple yet powerful. And of course I can share the model too if anyone want to print it.

Good to see a different approach. External SD card can be exchanged for larger ONBOARD 16MB version or even larger. Scroll back for more info.

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veton said..
About the M10 performance mode, its a bit tricky to find how to do it but once done it is very easy. You need a usb to uart converter and ublox U-center software. I should make a tutorial if interested. What you get is up to 3 constellations at 16 Hz or even 20 hz on two. No need for that but having 3 constellations is great. Ive just come back of a training and in my first use of the Epaper unit I've reached 30! stellites, most of the time around 27-28 in a place where the M8 Motion is about 18 sat (gps+galileo+beidou). probably the design of the enclosure has something to it as when in use the gps antena is almost horizontal and pointing to the sky with no interference.
So I am beggining to think with no reason that it simply works better, I've never seen this performance. I have in todays track a max error of 0,03 knots at 10 sec, 0,015 on alpha (3 const. 10Hz) isn't it great?. I would encourage some more testing. Also if Jan could enable higer frecuencies than 10 Hz even if there is no need for more than 10, but 12 or 16
The drawback is that the electric consumption is a bit more. I've been searching everywhere to find how much it is without success, but the normal mode if I'm not wrong is less than 10 mAh, and the Ublox papers just say performance mode is just "a bit more", so I guess is not much. Say is 15 or 20, still great and less than M9.
For example, today I had a session 3,5 - 4 hours aprox, I started on 4,28 volts and ended on 4,13, to me that's fine, with the T5 and a 2000 mAh battery, whatever the comsumption may be.

regards

Hi Venton. This is a very neat construction indeed.

Do you get any missed points when running @10Hz on 3 x GNSS? Getting the M10 to work @10 Hz without missed points was difficult for Julian on the Motion.

I found that running my M10 ESP @10Hz on x 3 GNSS, rather than 4 GNSS, stopped me getting missed points and error values remained the same.

FYI, The motion was deliberately limited by Julien to using max 18 sats. It somehow used the 18 'strongest' signals. My ESP with the same Chip works with up to around 30 sats.

I get between none and 5 or 7 missed points, in 3-hour sessions, but many times none at all.
But amazed by the number of sats, mostly over 25, sometimes 29-30-31 so the Acc errors stays under 3 hundreds of a knot in 100m typically.
Those errors are always bigger than the measured differences between several (M10) devices when compared in the same track, so I think the Acc is a very reliable indicator.
Be aware that these ones of mine are in performance mode, so running 3 const at 10Hz would be no problem (I guess yours is too..). I also found no gain in 4 const. I found the sweet spot in GPS+Gal+Beidou. Still on trials to complete this chart:

There is a update SW6.00 available on Github : Changes :
M10 set permanent to high nav rate possible, at the cost of a higher current draw (+5mA...) (Irreversible !)
Added SD_MMC write/read speed, file test.txt of 1MB is used for this
Speed measuring SD card, file test.txt 1MB used for measurement, results saved in file.txt
Added shutdown_voltage to config : if set to 0, you can force a powercycle by draining the lipo !
Added warning in webserver as shutdown_voltage in config MMC-mode !
Proposal from Alhop for the SD NAND cards : SD_MMC 1 bit instead SD over SPI
Pullup needed on pin 2 before begin.SD_MMC needed for some cards
Pullup in deepsleep on pin 2 for minimize leakage current SD cards
Bugfix for GPIO 12,19 and 39 init with pulldown/pullup
Bugfix Logspace left calculation

More documentation in the extended build manual : docs.google.com/document/d/1XJD6BV1Xay4nXo0cDuo_IOtxC_f1LyG7DE7X6KGlAB0/edit?usp=sharing
Important for the potted designs : As the interface to the SD is changed from SPI -> SD-MMC, a power cycle for the SD card is necessary. This can be forced by set the low-bat voltage to 0 V in the config, and drain the lipo complete !
SD-nand IC is now supported (proposal from Alhop, thanks for your contribution !)


Greetings, Jan

Ouch--drain the LiPo complete will likely ruin the LiPo. Is there another way to power cycle the SD card?

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segler said..
Ouch--drain the LiPo complete will likely ruin the LiPo. Is there another way to power cycle the SD card?

In a non potted design, it is as simple as remove the SD card and set it back.... In a potted design, there is no alternative then drain the lipo. As these lipos have a internal protection, they are not completely drained to 0 V, but at 2.8V the internal protection cuts the lipo from the load. After charging (is still possible), and if the lipo voltage goes above 3V, normal operation is restored. The power cycle is only needed once, to get the SD-card out of SPI mode !
But if you have doubts, stay with the old 5.91 SW !
Greetings, Jan.

OK, thanks. If your LiPo has internal protection then you are good.

I fly fpv with LiPos without any kind of protection. I have to watch the voltages myself. If I get careless and fly the LiPo down below 3.0v per cell consistently, my LiPo is toast.

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segler said..
OK, thanks. If your LiPo has internal protection then you are good.

I fly fpv with LiPos without any kind of protection. I have to watch the voltages myself. If I get careless and fly the LiPo down below 3.0v per cell consistently, my LiPo is toast.

The difference is FPV drains more amps then a ESP-GPS. You have to perform the reboot only once.

My two potted devices got the screen frozen. I think will no longer make those, no clue the reason why, they still work but the bn74 pcbs dont.
The T-displays do work fine, also potted same way.

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veton said..
My two potted devices got the screen frozen. I think will no longer make those, no clue the reason why, they still work but the bn74 pcbs dont.
The T-displays do work fine, also potted same way.

Yes i have the almost the same experiene, B74 screens are more fragile, if a screen freezes its a b74. All the bn213 (micro USB and USB-C) are still function normal. Made 18 BN screens, all stil working, made 15 b74 14 still working. 1 freezes (but Freezer has more bad luck). My 2 oldest potted ESP is an b74 (i use myself) and a BN (micro-usb) (Bas Gruppen). Both still working normal and used frequently. The battery of both (1200mah) are connected through the fuse/resistor (we didn't know then). So a little timebomb, but as i say, they work still flawless and sees a lot of speed and craches.

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GaragePlant said..
Finally had the opportunity to test it on the water. I'm wearing it on the forearm where I can easily read the values while surfing. Couldn't be happier!

This is my second attempt at designing my own casing. Where the first one leaked, was hard to assemble and hard to charge. This design is intended to be opened. This is required for charging and allows for fixing in case of some hardware problem. And if water leaks in, it will dry easily. But until now water did not find a way in.

The software is great and tracking is very accurate. Wonderful job by the developer!
Still having some trouble understanding all the screens and how the alpha measuring works, but I guess that will come with time.

Here is the unit when opened so it can be charged.
Testing on the bicycle :)

Flahs back to one of our prototypes

Flash back to one of our prototypes. We called it the flat-one, designthinking was to place the weight as low a possible (close to your arm). Later we distibuted the weight and curved our design so the GPS chip is alway faceing flat upward, and the screen is angeld a littel to you for better reading. Tested a lot (surfing). Curved one won. So keep testing en developing. Nice journey.

When things are designed on a PC monitor you might get fooled about the actual size in real life...

Relayboard with High Side Switch TPS27081 and 128 MB NAND memory.
For easier mountig of the SMD parts I have choosen the 1206 size.

XNAND plus GPS plus Reed version. All working as expected.

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Alhop said..
XNAND plus GPS plus Reed version. All working as expected.

That looks awesome Alhop. Did you have to place all components on the PCB yourselve of did you order it including component placement? Are there any open improvements left or is this more or less the final version? When would it be possible to order a few to test?

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Freezer said..

Alhop said..
XNAND plus GPS plus Reed version. All working as expected.

That looks awesome Alhop. Did you have to place all components on the PCB yourselve of did you order it including component placement? Are there any open improvements left or is this more or less the final version? When would it be possible to order a few to test?

I get them made with all components soldered on from JLCPCB.

next version is 'final' - will drop the battery as not needed according to Jan.

when I order the next ones I can send you one to test if you like.

This one should sit flush with highest components on the T5 taking zero extra width.

There is a SW update on github : SW 6.01 with next changes :
Added sign to Dist point to line (), Alfa screen
Added GPIO19 for switch to AP-mode
New run detection after stop delayed until speed > 4 m/s, update directly from run and avg in speed screens.
Statscreens can be switched by GPIO39 short push if Stat screen time is set to 0. No speed screen choice then with GPIO39 short push !
Be aware that if you have a sealed unit, and SW5.xx, you need to drain the lipo complete to have a reset of the sd-card.
Actual stat screens :


Greetings, Jan.