Yes Light winds are much easier to learn in. I first tried to learn in strong winds and it was very unforgiving: you pick up way too much speed and have no time to correct your mistakes let alone understand what when wrong and why it went wrong.

Just like the original poster said, even after 3-4 combined hours of practice I thought it would be impossible to learn and wanted to give up so many times... Lots of crashes and cuts from the foil for sure.

I then decided to go out in 8-12 knots winds, which was far easier and 3-4 hours later I was foiling long distances on both sides. The biggest advantage of light winds is that the water is flatter (easier to control the foil) and you can ride the foil at lower speeds and get used to balancing on it without crashing. When you do a mistake you have more time to correct it and you can usually keep riding instead of crashing hard.

The biggest problem is if you want to learn in very low winds you need to pretty much be a light wind expert with excellent light wind flying skills and light wind relaunching skills, otherwise it will simply be too hard as you can stall the kite easily and end up focusing too much on what the kite is doing. Having a big board with volume and buoyancy really helps with this, which not every foil board has...

I taught a few friends already (experienced kiters on directional boards and excellent flying skills) and in 2-3 hours they get up and going especially when using radio helmets so I can give them instant feed-back. With the right approach you can cut down dramatically on the learning curve and prevent injuries as well. Although kite foiling is definitely not for everyone, it was worth the steep the learning curve. You can kite powered and ride upwind easily nearly every day as you only need 7 knots to do so.

Christian

So what kind of foil do we want?

Is the Liquid Force foil significantly easier to learn and fun for long term free ride fun?

Or should we deal with the difficulty of learning on a more high performance foil but have something better for the longer term? Possibly getting a low and high aspect foils for versatility.

My instincts are pointing me towards the Liquid Force as a foil equivalent of the Sector 60. I want to slice along in glassy light wind conditions, and play with waves.

Exactly the dilemma I faced Gorgo - sold my Sector and a largekite to finance the LF and liked the idea of the fish board for occaisional messing in Perths little metro waves. there was a used Spotz on Seabreeze for same amount and may have been easier with higher volume board but I reckon I would have damaged the foil by now. Also, LF will bring out different wings in time apparently . If not, I may have a go at shaping my own in time......

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Gorgo said..
So what kind of foil do we want?

Is the Liquid Force foil significantly easier to learn and fun for long term free ride fun?

Or should we deal with the difficulty of learning on a more high performance foil but have something better for the longer term? Possibly getting a low and high aspect foils for versatility.

My instincts are pointing me towards the Liquid Force as a foil equivalent of the Sector 60. I want to slice along in glassy light wind conditions, and play with waves.

I don't think the liquid force is easier to learn on because the wings are close together. That means less pitch control, which makes it more twitchy and unstable. Especially less directional control. The LF front foil is big so it starts foiling at fairly low speeds. Top speed is around 20knts.Sword1 and KFA Mk3 are the easiest foils i have tried. They have a lot of positive lift and foil very easy and stable in all directions. Tacks and gybes are a lot easier than on any other foils i have tried. Also important is a light board with enough volume and a stable platform to foil on. Two front straps are essential. I recommend to foil without a backstrap in the beginning as you need to find your balance point, plus you can bail easier without a backstrap. GOLDEN RULE! ALWAYS KEEP YOUR FRONT FOOT IN THE STRAP WHEN YOU CRASH AS THE FOIL WONT CHASE OR HIT YOU!

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INTHELOOP said..
...Sword1 and KFA Mk3 are the easiest foils i have tried. They have a lot of positive lift and foil very easy and stable in all directions.....

Where did you get them from? A full kit from Taaroa is Euro 2750-2950. That's around $4500, say $5000 by the time you pay for shipping. KFA prices are similar.

That might make sense if you're a hard core racer. It's nuts if all you want to do is go kite foiling.

I don't want to dick around chasing dodgey used gear, or buy a foil then have to source a board.

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Gorgo said..

INTHELOOP said..
...Sword1 and KFA Mk3 are the easiest foils i have tried. They have a lot of positive lift and foil very easy and stable in all directions.....

Where did you get them from? A full kit from Taaroa is Euro 2750-2950. That's around $4500, say $5000 by the time you pay for shipping. KFA prices are similar.

That might make sense if you're a hard core racer. It's nuts if all you want to do is go kite foiling.

I don't want to dick around chasing dodgey used gear, or buy a foil then have to source a board.

You can check Sroka foil, the guy is a legend. It looks way better than the LF and prices are similar.

IMO - the best advice is to catch up with the local foiling crew - in Perth that's about 20 strong with most hanging out at either Melville beach or Pinnaroo Point up north , its easy for a more advanced kiters to give any new or developing kiters relevant tips to help them advance quicker and hopefully with less pain and suffering.

AS ABOVE posts suggest A low aspect foil is way easier to learn on - I personally learnt on a low aspect 2nd hand Spotz 1 free ride head which is super stable and slow which I loved at the time - but also many in Perth have jumped on full racing foils and made it work ( they were already formula kite racers though) - I now ride a high aspect race foil which is crazy fast and needs 90% more concentration to ride but fantastic once you developed the skills necessary.

Personally after foiling for about 1 year and seriously for about 4 months I find that getting into a group of riders and comparing notes after each session is the way to go. Other riders will help you get over the fear of trying new techniques as you progress - Your 1st attempt at a full speed foiling gybe is truly terrifying ...

As you progress fairly quickly to more advanced techniques asking other foilers on the water who are trying to learn or already have mastered them is the best way to go - all of the below will test all of your kiting skills and push your kiting to new levels.

- riding any reach
- blast down wind with speed and control
- down loop kite through turns
- tacking with touch down
- water gybe
- ride toe side
- tack foiling
- foiling gybe
- riding in 25knots

Have fun and see you out there.


P.S - wear an impact vest & helmet

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JohnnoKeys said..



P.S - wear an impact vest & helmet

and a neck brace

and booties

and carry bandaids

Defs worth it I reckon, from the show put on by the foilers at the Merimbula Classic. Brad Hampson was out and tacking hundreds of metres upwind when no other kiters were out there. Jordan Girdis came and showed us how to ride a foil on a wave the next day. I'm gonna get one as soon as the wallet allows.

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Gorgo said..

INTHELOOP said..
...Sword1 and KFA Mk3 are the easiest foils i have tried. They have a lot of positive lift and foil very easy and stable in all directions.....

Where did you get them from? A full kit from Taaroa is Euro 2750-2950. That's around $4500, say $5000 by the time you pay for shipping. KFA prices are similar.

That might make sense if you're a hard core racer. It's nuts if all you want to do is go kite foiling.

I don't want to dick around chasing dodgey used gear, or buy a foil then have to source a board.

mate there is 2nd hand foil on market you can get half price. I didn't say anything about prices so not sure what you mean.However, obviously full carbon is a lot more expensive than alloy and plastic.

At last!!! - Got some runs of reasonable length without painful falls. Great to be using a 9m when I would otherwise be on my 19M




Also glued on a twin-tip fin to help with directional stability - seems to help.....

awesome stuff daddycool!

Great thread, watching intently.
Btw, any foils available here in aus.?

A list of local suppliers / builders would be great. Thanks in advance.

KFA is Australian and some shops have got first lots of the Liquid Force Foil Fish - also check Buy and Sell under Race boards .

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INTHELOOP said..

Gorgo said..
So what kind of foil do we want?

Is the Liquid Force foil significantly easier to learn and fun for long term free ride fun?

Or should we deal with the difficulty of learning on a more high performance foil but have something better for the longer term? Possibly getting a low and high aspect foils for versatility.

My instincts are pointing me towards the Liquid Force as a foil equivalent of the Sector 60. I want to slice along in glassy light wind conditions, and play with waves.

I don't think the liquid force is easier to learn on because the wings are close together. That means less pitch control, which makes it more twitchy and unstable. Especially less directional control. The LF front foil is big so it starts foiling at fairly low speeds. Top speed is around 20knts.Sword1 and KFA Mk3 are the easiest foils i have tried. They have a lot of positive lift and foil very easy and stable in all directions. Tacks and gybes are a lot easier than on any other foils i have tried. Also important is a light board with enough volume and a stable platform to foil on. Two front straps are essential. I recommend to foil without a backstrap in the beginning as you need to find your balance point, plus you can bail easier without a backstrap. GOLDEN RULE! ALWAYS KEEP YOUR FRONT FOOT IN THE STRAP WHEN YOU CRASH AS THE FOIL WONT CHASE OR HIT YOU!

And you obviously don't sell them

Try West Oz for the LF foil

Practice behind a boat or cable park instead of kite until you get the hang of it i reckon.

Is that seriously how you learnt Salt? you must be kidding. Why not just Just use a kite like every other person.
Do 2 or 3 hours and you're sorted. Waiting for boat to turn around every-time you crash, or swim to shore every-time at cable park will take you AGGGGES to learn.

My opinion about Foils is

uninteresting, tedious, dull, dreary, mind-numbing, tiresome, lackluster, unexciting, monotonous, , wearisome, humdrum, uninspiring, lifeless, mundane, stale, stodgy, stuffy, stupid, tame, tiring, trite, bummer, cloying, dead, drab, drag, drudging, flat, nothing, nowhere, plebeian, stereotyped, zero, arid, bromidic, characterless, colorless, ho hum, insipid, interminable, irksome, platitudinous, prosaic,

But that's just my opinion

Wednesday afternoon 11 foilers on the swan river having a blast ripping around, Maybe 4-5 freestylers and a few people learning.
Who was having more fun? There all were having a great time!
How is your chosen stoke better than theirs, an opinion post like that looks a bit like a religious door knocker wanting to coming in and explain their opinion in better than all the others.

Thanks for the heads up about KFA, their gear looks skmick, reasonable price and local here in Vic. Also saw they have an aluminiom entry level unit for only 1200.
Anyone seen one of those, thoughts.

Salt: re cable park.....Thought about that but it's actually harder than a kite to keep tension in the lines as you accelerate onto the foil.

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fingerbone said..
My opinion about Foils is

uninteresting, tedious, dull, dreary, mind-numbing, tiresome, lackluster, unexciting, monotonous, , wearisome, humdrum, uninspiring, lifeless, mundane, stale, stodgy, stuffy, stupid, tame, tiring, trite, bummer, cloying, dead, drab, drag, drudging, flat, nothing, nowhere, plebeian, stereotyped, zero, arid, bromidic, characterless, colorless, ho hum, insipid, interminable, irksome, platitudinous, prosaic,

But that's just my opinion

yep i was the same way until i jumped on one, it is like learning to ride all over but if you have to have a kite and the wind is not strong enough its a session saver and a lot of fun!

#1 tip i think is take its slow and relax, keep the foil down till you are happy with body placement. keep both legs bent and relaxed when you get up on the foil and use small hip movements to adjust height.

+1 for the LF foil, one of the easier foils to ride according to a big name foiler!

After reading a lot of gumf about foils and people saying they are "so Hard" i thought it would be good challenge.
I don't find much point in going for a freeride foil since a race foil could do both. so i opted for the KFA Mk3. I've spent about 1 hour or less on it so far and and i can comfortably stay up on the foil going port, but i occasionally kangaroo hop going starboard. I was on a 10m North Neo in about 8-18knts gusting cross off and it wasn't easy controlling that kite, but when i got up on the foil it was a breeze. I know Dusta has a KFA MK3 and I'm keen to hear how easy he finds it.
Ive tried the Sword 2 for about 10 minutes and i found it nearly impossible.
cheers
Billy.



sorry about the pictured being flipped.

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BillyHampton said..
After reading a lot of gumf about foils and people saying they are "so Hard" i thought it would be good challenge.
I don't find much point in going for a freeride foil since a race foil could do both. so i opted for the KFA Mk3. I've spent about 1 hour or less on it so far and and i can comfortably stay up on the foil going port, but i occasionally kangaroo hop going starboard. I was on a 10m North Neo in about 8-18knts gusting cross off and it wasn't easy controlling that kite, but when i got up on the foil it was a breeze. I know Dusta has a KFA MK3 and I'm keen to hear how easy he finds it.
Ive tried the Sword 2 for about 10 minutes and i found it nearly impossible.
cheers
Billy.



sorry about the pictured being flipped.

well for starters i am no billy hampton . have only had a couple of hours on mine and still sorta hopping atm .

if you are sweet after an hour then come to states and race in the foil division :)

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dusta said..

BillyHampton said..
After reading a lot of gumf about foils and people saying they are "so Hard" i thought it would be good challenge.
I don't find much point in going for a freeride foil since a race foil could do both. so i opted for the KFA Mk3. I've spent about 1 hour or less on it so far and and i can comfortably stay up on the foil going port, but i occasionally kangaroo hop going starboard. I was on a 10m North Neo in about 8-18knts gusting cross off and it wasn't easy controlling that kite, but when i got up on the foil it was a breeze. I know Dusta has a KFA MK3 and I'm keen to hear how easy he finds it.
Ive tried the Sword 2 for about 10 minutes and i found it nearly impossible.
cheers
Billy.



sorry about the pictured being flipped.

well for starters i am no billy hampton . have only had a couple of hours on mine and still sorta hopping atm .

if you are sweet after an hour then come to states and race in the foil division :)

Im definitely not ready to race. Although it would be tempting.
ill see how i go and maybe make the states

If your kangaroo hopping, maybe put your foil as far as you can back and move your back foot really far forward. I found it very difficult when the foil was far forward.

at the rear its fine , i've moved it right forward now and just getting used to the shift in weight placement . But i haven't really had any time to dedicate to it yet :|

are you guys sure it ain't easy? this guy rides his backwards (near end of vid)



solid kiter haha

pretty sketchy riding one in those lagoons, there are heaps of super shallow and changing sandbars throughout i found - could easily come a cropper and damage the foil or yourself i imagine. must be super light winds too, because it is not a madhouse of frothers out around him haha

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BillyHampton said..
After reading a lot of gumf about foils and people saying they are "so Hard" i thought it would be good challenge.
I don't find much point in going for a freeride foil since a race foil could do both. so i opted for the KFA Mk3. I've spent about 1 hour or less on it so far and and i can comfortably stay up on the foil going port, but i occasionally kangaroo hop going starboard. I was on a 10m North Neo in about 8-18knts gusting cross off and it wasn't easy controlling that kite, but when i got up on the foil it was a breeze. I know Dusta has a KFA MK3 and I'm keen to hear how easy he finds it.
Ive tried the Sword 2 for about 10 minutes and i found it nearly impossible.
cheers
Billy.



sorry about the pictured being flipped.

......almost exactly same for except substitute 1 hour with 6 hours! Looks like a nice foil - give me a shout when your bored with it as I'd be interested potentially

Hey guys,
Here is a vid from my second hour on a foil. I'm quite confident going out but coming in I've got a bit of work to do.
Any tips will be greatly appreciated.
Cheers