Hey all, quick question. When you are heading out for a session, are you walking out with the para flying or do you have it stowed and then deployed when you have paddled out enough. I am finding getting on the board a little tricky while flying the para, but not impossible. Cheers in advance

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dafish said..
Hey all, quick question. When you are heading out for a session, are you walking out with the para flying or do you have it stowed and then deployed when you have paddled out enough. I am finding getting on the board a little tricky while flying the para, but not impossible. Cheers in advance

I have done both, it depends on the entry and wind. If it's deep and steady wind right off the beach, I'll launch on the beach. If the wind is bad on the inside or there's shorebreak, I'll paddle out a bit. The balance/getting up part gets easier with practice

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JonahL said..

dafish said..
Hey all, quick question. When you are heading out for a session, are you walking out with the para flying or do you have it stowed and then deployed when you have paddled out enough. I am finding getting on the board a little tricky while flying the para, but not impossible. Cheers in advance

I have done both, it depends on the entry and wind. If it's deep and steady wind right off the beach, I'll launch on the beach. If the wind is bad on the inside or there's shorebreak, I'll paddle out a bit. The balance/getting up part gets easier with practice

Plus 1

Nice to start with this.
What about water start?, I found it needs lots of wind to start.
Some advice needed here.

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pp4 said..
Nice to start with this.
What about water start?, I found it needs lots of wind to start.
Some advice needed here.

Yep I need advice as well. 2.9m BRM needs a shed ton of wind to get going. When going apparent wind is huge so seriously powered. Is there a cheat code to get up on foil? 6 2 x 20 x 95l, foil is 11 AR 900cm2 90kg.

On my first sessions I went out with the wing flying. Now I stow the wing by stuffing it under my rash top, and paddle out or in at the end of a session.

The reason being the real benefit of having a wing is being able to stow it and essentially be unencumbered. Once it's stowed shore breaks and turbulence and lulls and wind shadows and all the other crap that happens is no longer an issue.

Possibly more importantly, by paddling you can get yourself out to a comfortable place and manage the wing at your leisure. If the wing falls into the water, which it will, it'll have about 50 kilos of water sitting in it. You have to pull it in from one end and let the water flow off, then sort it and throw it up to launch. It's easy enough to do with a little practice.

That's particularly important when you're coming in. It can be a pain trying to keep the wing flying and manage a biggish board and foil in a shore break. It's very much easier if the wing is stowed.

Even if you get onto the sand with your flying wing, when you bring it down it's going to hit the sand which will stick to the wet fabric. It's better to have a wet, clean stowed wing, than a wet sandy wing dragging on the ground.

The other issue is that I did my first sessions starting in a quiet spot near a boat harbour. The wind funnels over a headland and there was heaps of wind near the beach to get sorted and get out into the water. Problem is that once out the wind is very turbulent and parawings simply don't like to fly in grotty, holey wind. Things improved a heap when I moved to another spot about a km away in cleaner wind .... and paddled out past the shore break.

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Gorgo said..On my first sessions I went out with the wing flying. Now I stow the wing by stuffing it under my rash top, and paddle out or in at the end of a session.

The reason being the real benefit of having a wing is being able to stow it and essentially be unencumbered. Once it's stowed shore breaks and turbulence and lulls and wind shadows and all the other crap that happens is no longer an issue.

Possibly more importantly, by paddling you can get yourself out to a comfortable place and manage the wing at your leisure. If the wing falls into the water, which it will, it'll have about 50 kilos of water sitting in it. You have to pull it in from one end and let the water flow off, then sort it and throw it up to launch. It's easy enough to do with a little practice.

That's particularly important when you're coming in. It can be a pain trying to keep the wing flying and manage a biggish board and foil in a shore break. It's very much easier if the wing is stowed.

Even if you get onto the sand with your flying wing, when you bring it down it's going to hit the sand which will stick to the wet fabric. It's better to have a wet, clean stowed wing, than a wet sandy wing dragging on the ground.

The other issue is that I did my first sessions starting in a quiet spot near a boat harbour. The wind funnels over a headland and there was heaps of wind near the beach to get sorted and get out into the water. Problem is that once out the wind is very turbulent and parawings simply don't like to fly in grotty, holey wind. Things improved a heap wheI moved to another spot about a km away in cleaner wind .... and paddled out past the shore break.

Hear you about not liking holey wind got skunked today when it dropped

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Gorgo said..
On my first sessions I went out with the wing flying. Now I stow the wing by stuffing it under my rash top, and paddle out or in at the end of a session.

The reason being the real benefit of having a wing is being able to stow it and essentially be unencumbered. Once it's stowed shore breaks and turbulence and lulls and wind shadows and all the other crap that happens is no longer an issue.

Possibly more importantly, by paddling you can get yourself out to a comfortable place and manage the wing at your leisure. If the wing falls into the water, which it will, it'll have about 50 kilos of water sitting in it. You have to pull it in from one end and let the water flow off, then sort it and throw it up to launch. It's easy enough to do with a little practice.

That's particularly important when you're coming in. It can be a pain trying to keep the wing flying and manage a biggish board and foil in a shore break. It's very much easier if the wing is stowed.

Even if you get onto the sand with your flying wing, when you bring it down it's going to hit the sand which will stick to the wet fabric. It's better to have a wet, clean stowed wing, than a wet sandy wing dragging on the ground.

The other issue is that I did my first sessions starting in a quiet spot near a boat harbour. The wind funnels over a headland and there was heaps of wind near the beach to get sorted and get out into the water. Problem is that once out the wind is very turbulent and parawings simply don't like to fly in grotty, holey wind. Things improved a heap when I moved to another spot about a km away in cleaner wind .... and paddled out past the shore break.

Excellent advice thanks Gorgo. I think those nuggets will save me a bit of swearing.

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hilly said..

pp4 said..
Nice to start with this.
What about water start?, I found it needs lots of wind to start.
Some advice needed here.

Yep I need advice as well. 2.9m BRM needs a shed ton of wind to get going. When going apparent wind is huge so seriously powered. Is there a cheat code to get up on foil? 6 2 x 20 x 95l, foil is 11 AR 900cm2 90kg.

That's a tiny wing to start with at your weight. I'm 81kgs and using the 2.9 with a 1400sqcm front wing to learn, a lot more forgiving and easier to get flying on.

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hilly said..

pp4 said..
Nice to start with this.
What about water start?, I found it needs lots of wind to start.
Some advice needed here.

Yep I need advice as well. 2.9m BRM needs a shed ton of wind to get going. When going apparent wind is huge so seriously powered. Is there a cheat code to get up on foil? 6 2 x 20 x 95l, foil is 11 AR 900cm2 90kg.

Only my 2nd day, and haven't had chance to try more. 2.9 gets going easy, some wind is needed for sure. 5'9'' x 19.5'' 60 L, 72 kg, 850 cm2 foil, AR 9.2

Thanks everyone. I have been packing it and paddling in, much easier to manage a big board, especially when it's shallow and the foil is out of the water. Frustrating part is our wind forecast has dogged it last few sessions. Suppose to be 20 plus and it hovered from 12 to barely 15. I have a 4.2 Flow Dwing, but I need a solld 15 knots plus to learn at 86 kilos. We get a lot of chop too, so it's not so easy to get to the stance position.

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dafish said..
Thanks everyone. I have been packing it and paddling in, much easier to manage a big board, especially when it's shallow and the foil is out of the water. Frustrating part is our wind forecast has dogged it last few sessions. Suppose to be 20 plus and it hovered from 12 to barely 15. I have a 4.2 Flow Dwing, but I need a solld 15 knots plus to learn at 86 kilos. We get a lot of chop too, so it's not so easy to get to the stance position.

I see you're based in Huskisson, there is a good group parawinging regularly now from Gerroa in case you wanted some company. They're on 4 BRMs.

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ArthurAlston said..

dafish said..
Thanks everyone. I have been packing it and paddling in, much easier to manage a big board, especially when it's shallow and the foil is out of the water. Frustrating part is our wind forecast has dogged it last few sessions. Suppose to be 20 plus and it hovered from 12 to barely 15. I have a 4.2 Flow Dwing, but I need a solld 15 knots plus to learn at 86 kilos. We get a lot of chop too, so it's not so easy to get to the stance position.

I see you're based in Huskisson, there is a good group parawinging regularly now from Gerroa in case you wanted some company. They're on 4 BRMs.

Cheers, thanks for that. I have half a dozen friends that were all kiters, then foilers, now wing dingers that are watching my progression. They will all be converts, or at least most of them. They have flown my para on the beach and are excited by the possibilities. I didn't take up dinging because I needed a new knee, but that's behind me now and have full function. They at least have the wing technique of getting up so they will take to it quite easily.

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dafish said..

ArthurAlston said..

dafish said..
Thanks everyone. I have been packing it and paddling in, much easier to manage a big board, especially when it's shallow and the foil is out of the water. Frustrating part is our wind forecast has dogged it last few sessions. Suppose to be 20 plus and it hovered from 12 to barely 15. I have a 4.2 Flow Dwing, but I need a solld 15 knots plus to learn at 86 kilos. We get a lot of chop too, so it's not so easy to get to the stance position.

I see you're based in Huskisson, there is a good group parawinging regularly now from Gerroa in case you wanted some company. They're on 4 BRMs.

Cheers, thanks for that. I have half a dozen friends that were all kiters, then foilers, now wing dingers that are watching my progression. They will all be converts, or at least most of them. They have flown my para on the beach and are excited by the possibilities. I didn't take up dinging because I needed a new knee, but that's behind me now and have full function. They at least have the wing technique of getting up so they will take to it quite easily.

You already know how to foil, so it will be pretty easy for you.

The hardest part for you will be learning to pump the foil board in lighter wind conditions to get up and running, once you sort that you will be fine.

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dafish said..
Thanks everyone. I have been packing it and paddling in, much easier to manage a big board, especially when it's shallow and the foil is out of the water. Frustrating part is our wind forecast has dogged it last few sessions. Suppose to be 20 plus and it hovered from 12 to barely 15. I have a 4.2 Flow Dwing, but I need a solld 15 knots plus to learn at 86 kilos. We get a lot of chop too, so it's not so easy to get to the stance position.

I'm the same weight & conditions & looking at the 4.2. Would you have bought bigger if you were buying again? The 4.2 seems a good compromise between size & wind range.

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Microsurfer said..

dafish said..
Thanks everyone. I have been packing it and paddling in, much easier to manage a big board, especially when it's shallow and the foil is out of the water. Frustrating part is our wind forecast has dogged it last few sessions. Suppose to be 20 plus and it hovered from 12 to barely 15. I have a 4.2 Flow Dwing, but I need a solld 15 knots plus to learn at 86 kilos. We get a lot of chop too, so it's not so easy to get to the stance position.

I'm the same weight & conditions & looking at the 4.2. Would you have bought bigger if you were buying again? The 4.2 seems a good compromise between size & wind range.

No, I think the size is right. I also have a three coming. If I needed anything bigger than a 4.2 I would just pull out the Peak kite and foil light winds. Right now it's just about getting the time in so the techniques become easier and second nature. Oh my, it's fun to be a dork again :( Muscles are sore and stretched from the pull of the para :) It's funny, but I remember eight or nine years ago when I learned to foil how hard those first few days were. Now, it's the easiest thing in the world and never get sore, (unless I get a smackdown from coming down a wave too fast) I'm sure my progression into the para will eventually be the same.

Curious what's the narrowest mid length people are riding successfully on the PW? I let my wingfoil experience inform my board selection for parawing and I regret it. At 18" wide with a rounded bottom I feel like I am trying to stand on a log with the parawing. You can use the wing to help provide counter balance the parawing is no such help. Hopefully someone comes up with a technique but I am not optimistic. I am looking for a mid length with a relatively flat bottom and between 21 and 19 in wide now. may go up in vol some as well, currently at -25l which feels huge for wing.

And for posterity I think ideal dims are +/- 15l to weight in kg and 21-19" wide. Length is less clear. Long will help early planning which will definitely benefit earlier starts with the parawing but beyond 6ft and it starts to risk issues with the nose getting into the bridles.

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bigtone667 said..

dafish said..

ArthurAlston said..

dafish said..
Thanks everyone. I have been packing it and paddling in, much easier to manage a big board, especially when it's shallow and the foil is out of the water. Frustrating part is our wind forecast has dogged it last few sessions. Suppose to be 20 plus and it hovered from 12 to barely 15. I have a 4.2 Flow Dwing, but I need a solld 15 knots plus to learn at 86 kilos. We get a lot of chop too, so it's not so easy to get to the stance position.

I see you're based in Huskisson, there is a good group parawinging regularly now from Gerroa in case you wanted some company. They're on 4 BRMs.

Cheers, thanks for that. I have half a dozen friends that were all kiters, then foilers, now wing dingers that are watching my progression. They will all be converts, or at least most of them. They have flown my para on the beach and are excited by the possibilities. I didn't take up dinging because I needed a new knee, but that's behind me now and have full function. They at least have the wing technique of getting up so they will take to it quite easily.

You already know how to foil, so it will be pretty easy for you.

The hardest part for you will be learning to pump the foil board in lighter wind conditions to get up and running, once you sort that you will be fine.

I agree, some technique advice is needed. I'm finding it easier going a bit downwind. The roger is a bit nervous

I'm going to keep advocating for the 4mm dyneema bungie harness loop. It helps when getting going because you can stay harnessed in while getting to your knees and feet without worrying about managing the PW or having it come unhooked unexpectedly like it can with a fixed line while moving the bar around.

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MidAtlanticFoil said..
I'm going to keep advocating for the 4mm dyneema bungie harness loop. It helps when getting going because you can stay harnessed in while getting to your knees and feet without worrying about managing the PW or having it come unhooked unexpectedly like it can with a fixed line while moving the bar around.

Hmmm, I am typically a no harness guy as this is a dw vehicle for me. But two hands for the pop up stability could help with my narrow board.

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MidAtlanticFoil said..
I'm going to keep advocating for the 4mm dyneema bungie harness loop. It helps when getting going because you can stay harnessed in while getting to your knees and feet without worrying about managing the PW or having it come unhooked unexpectedly like it can with a fixed line while moving the bar around.

Do you have a link where you got one, or did you make it. Curious about the bungie part

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dafish said..

MidAtlanticFoil said..
I'm going to keep advocating for the 4mm dyneema bungie harness loop. It helps when getting going because you can stay harnessed in while getting to your knees and feet without worrying about managing the PW or having it come unhooked unexpectedly like it can with a fixed line while moving the bar around.

Do you have a link where you got one, or did you make it. Curious about the bungie part

I picked up the 4mm dyneema bungee on a US site called West Marine. I ordered like 20' so I could make a bunch of them. (each BRM wing comes with (2) harness attachment loops)

Here's an image of the harness loop I made on the right. I use a free hand to stretch in onto the hook.

Nice. How much stretch does it have?

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dafish said..
Nice. How much stretch does it have?

Not sure exactly , but it probably doubles in length until it stops.

Interesting discussion on board style and size for ParaWing (LowKite) as well as foil size to limit speed


Some interesting idea with the board selection for a parawing. Translation in video setting.

Really good info. I started watching this earlier but my French sucks and left it. Did not think to use the subtitles, (not all YouTube has them). Thanks for putting this up, worth the watch.

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dafish said..
Really good info. I started watching this earlier but my French sucks and left it. Did not think to use the subtitles, (not all YouTube has them). Thanks for putting this up, worth the watch.

I not sure if I agree with using shorter boards. The thing (roger) is a bitch when overpowered and in the gusts. With the longer board and bigger foils I can pop up with less wind and the experience is more pleasant.

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dafish said..
Really good info. I started watching this earlier but my French sucks and left it. Did not think to use the subtitles, (not all YouTube has them). Thanks for putting this up, worth the watch.

I not sure if I agree with using shorter boards. The thing (roger) is a bitch when overpowered and in the gusts. With the longer board and bigger foils I can pop up with less wind and the experience is more pleasant.

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pp4 said..

dafish said..
Really good info. I started watching this earlier but my French sucks and left it. Did not think to use the subtitles, (not all YouTube has them). Thanks for putting this up, worth the watch.

I not sure if I agree with using shorter boards. The thing (roger) is a bitch when overpowered and in the gusts. With the longer board and bigger foils I can pop up with less wind and the experience is more pleasant.

Yes, a longer board get you a larger wind range for each size parawing. A 3 mtr on a shorter board might get you up in 15knots, but on a longer board it could be 13knots due to less drag getting up to foiling speed. This makes a huge difference on marginal days.

I started with a big board and I found that it was hard to keep it from not pointing directly downwind, and when I powered the para up I was chasing it downwind and having it stall and the bridle getting tangled in the nose of the board. Or, I would get going so fast I would be on foil and not being able to control the speed. Delicate balance there. Right now there isn't a whole lot of technique or info out, so I am soaking it all in.