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icesurf said...


Here is my selective 500 meter stats from the GPSSS site.
Western Aus States (pop 22 million), 19 sailors over 40 knots for 500 meters.

In the far poorer, smaller Eastern Island State (NZ),
with no "Sandy Point status" & no "consistent wind"
~ 8 sailors have exceeded "40 knots for 500 meters".

5 of those 40 knots Sailors used KA Koncepts & 5 home made boards,
What is most surprising from the homeland of Carbon Art,
Not one Sailor used a Carbon Art speed board.

All but bar 1 of these 500 meters was recorded many moons/ 500 meters ago.


For GTC to be fairer, 500m should be included!
If the Far Eastern State weather returns back to normal,
NZ may be able to compete in the GTC & the 500 meter will make it fairer comp.



We know 500m! Its here to there.

Time of 10 seconds, can't see, can't feel!.....

Bring on 500m to the GTC!

Tradition can not be discarded!

I,ve found your problem.........No ones on a CA

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sailquik said...

Interesting to see where the best Nautical Miles have been done in Australia. Sandy Point comes in at 24th @30.51 knots. ( Al Green)

MVP comes in with the best at 36.52 knots from Burrum Heads and Hardies Run features prolifically with 10 out of the top 15 rankings.

Daffy Snides is right, ....

gpsteamchallenge.com.au/sailor_session/show?date=2009-01-01&team=16

remember Sandy Pt 2009 NYD? ~35.4 knt NM with 44knt pk, wait till my new NM weapon arrives to deal with the gusty/tight section near the carpark and we may see the PiT NM increase.

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Spotty said...

sailquik said...

Interesting to see where the best Nautical Miles have been done in Australia. Sandy Point comes in at 24th @30.51 knots. ( Al Green)

MVP comes in with the best at 36.52 knots from Burrum Heads and Hardies Run features prolifically with 10 out of the top 15 rankings.

Daffy Snides is right, ....

gpsteamchallenge.com.au/sailor_session/show?date=2009-01-01&team=16

remember Sandy Pt 2009 NYD? ~35.4 knt NM with 44knt pk, wait till my new NM weapon arrives to deal with the gusty/tight section near the carpark and we may see the PiT NM increase.

Don't tell me you purchased a bulldozer to level that sand dune Spotty

i really like the idea of a 500m category.

finally a class i can be competitive in. i can sail 500m no problems at all.

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snides8 said...

gpsteamchallenge.com.au/sailor_session/show?date=2009-01-01&team=16

looks like the pit does have the goods

Well, yeah, Spotty is an exception. He just irons out the chop and creates his own flat water!

But he went faster at Rye, so the best Sandy Point NM in the rankings is still 25th:

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sailquik said...

ata said...

I also think 500m is also important. It doesn't have to be high ranked, but it will be great if it is shown.
Ok, Sandy is great, but there are also other countries that compete, and we are fighting like crazy to reach 30 on 500 meters, and we will never be as fast as you on Sandy, but it is great to know difference.

www.GPS-speedsurfing

It's always great to see ya supporting that GP3S sponno Daffy
These days some of us can't afford the GOLD in MEMBER..
Just kidden' really,they have done a hell of a lot to get the speed seen where it is now!
It is only natural that every other country player would want to compare there stats to the world record.
Personally I'm against it as a PiT HeaD because it makes the Westies sad when we flog 'em

looks like the Hamma doesn't post on GPS-speedsurfing !
his 38.036 is missing from the top of the list !

as much as i like the idea of a 500m category
i also like the challenge the way it is.

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S018 said...

looks like the Hamma doesn't post on GPS-speedsurfing !
his 38.036 is missing from the top of the list !

as much as i like the idea of a 500m category
i also like the challenge the way it is.

He did post his times

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choco said...

S018 said...

looks like the Hamma doesn't post on GPS-speedsurfing !
his 38.036 is missing from the top of the list !

as much as i like the idea of a 500m category
i also like the challenge the way it is.

He did post his times

Welcome to the world of GPS-speedsurfing it took them 6 months to get my times in the rankings

I've given up long ago.

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choco said...

S018 said...

looks like the Hamma doesn't post on GPS-speedsurfing !
his 38.036 is missing from the top of the list !

as much as i like the idea of a 500m category
i also like the challenge the way it is.

He did post his times

I'm pretty positive he posted his times but as 25 and Vando alluded to, GPSSS seem to treat us like that uncle you don't really want to invite to your family gathering but don't really have a choice.

Even with my rather mediocre times I post, sorry used to post on GPSSS they wouldn't validate an alpha and nautical mile speed I did at Burrum until I sent them the track. Then they decided to knock half a knot of each speed without any explaination.

BTW - Have they validated Spotty's and Tony's record ranking or are they stalling? & did they ever get back to Nebs about linking the two sites so GPSTC could have teams all over the world. Personally I think they may be threatened by the whole GPSTC thing - damn I would too because it's ten times better.

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vando said...

choco said...

S018 said...

looks like the Hamma doesn't post on GPS-speedsurfing !
his 38.036 is missing from the top of the list !

as much as i like the idea of a 500m category
i also like the challenge the way it is.

He did post his times

Welcome to the world of GPS-speedsurfing it took them 6 months to get my times in the rankings

Vando as your name sounds Dutch, just change your nationality on GPSSS and then it will only take 6 minutes to get your times in the rankings.

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sausage said...


I'm pretty positive he posted his times but as 25 and Vando alluded to, GPSSS seem to treat us like that uncle you don't really want to invite to your family gathering but don't really have a choice.

Even with my rather mediocre times I post, sorry used to post on GPSSS they wouldn't validate an alpha and nautical mile speed I did at Burrum until I sent them the track. Then they decided to knock half a knot of each speed without any explaination.

BTW - Have they validated Spotty's and Tony's record ranking or are they stalling? & did they ever get back to Nebs about linking the two sites so GPSTC could have teams all over the world. Personally I think they may be threatened by the whole GPSTC thing - damn I would too because it's ten times better.

Spotty and Tony have been visible in the rankings (at the top! ) for a few days now. Tony has a 'Record Ranking' claim in but Spotty has not because unfortunately, he was only carrying one GT-31 so this does not satisfy the more stringent record ranking rules. Spotty's fantastic speeds will continue to be displayed at the top of the normal rankings as they should.

I have noticed that quite a few "problems" people experience with having their posts come up in GPS-SS are caused by them not sending their tracks to the RTK for verification. It is a good idea to send the track file in by email direct using the button on the posting page or direct to the RTK whenever you post. If your session includes a PB or is in the top 20 or so of any ranking - even the monthly ranking - it needs to be verified by the RTK before it comes up. For Australia, the main RTK is Ian Fox. (aus001@ianfox.com) If your session does not come up in the website, he is your first port of call.

o my god, how many replies for that little question

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sailquik said...

sausage said...


I'm pretty positive he posted his times but as 25 and Vando alluded to, GPSSS seem to treat us like that uncle you don't really want to invite to your family gathering but don't really have a choice.

Even with my rather mediocre times I post, sorry used to post on GPSSS they wouldn't validate an alpha and nautical mile speed I did at Burrum until I sent them the track. Then they decided to knock half a knot of each speed without any explaination.

BTW - Have they validated Spotty's and Tony's record ranking or are they stalling? & did they ever get back to Nebs about linking the two sites so GPSTC could have teams all over the world. Personally I think they may be threatened by the whole GPSTC thing - damn I would too because it's ten times better.

Spotty and Tony have been visible in the rankings (at the top! ) for a few days now. Tony has a 'Record Ranking' claim in but Spotty has not because unfortunately, he was only carrying one GT-31 so this does not satisfy the more stringent record ranking rules. Spotty's fantastic speeds will continue to be displayed at the top of the normal rankings as they should.

I have noticed that quite a few "problems" people experience with having their posts come up in GPS-SS are caused by them not sending their tracks to the RTK for verification. It is a good idea to send the track file in by email direct using the button on the posting page or direct to the RTK whenever you post. If your session includes a PB or is in the top 20 or so of any ranking - even the monthly ranking - it needs to be verified by the RTK before it comes up. For Australia, the main RTK is Ian Fox. (aus001@ianfox.com) If your session does not come up in the website, he is your first port of call.

yer I had done that and they were verified but still did not come up in the rankings until recently.oh well all fixed now

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wkcwarrior said...

o my god, how many replies for that little question

That's the nature (and in my opinion beauty,) of this forum, it's like a big family conversation, things go off at all sorts of strange angles.

I reakon Daffy is right it will disturb the balance on the team challenge, how it is now still gives a chance for each state to compete , if the 500m was in then most of us would drop off....

But the 500m would be good for each state to have to see who is the fastest and maybe an award or a medal could be held for the fastest 500m in the states division or whole of Australia and for us to see the results through the whole year and to keep the 500m alive again in the team challenge.

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decrepit said...

wkcwarrior said...

o my god, how many replies for that little question

That's the nature (and in my opinion beauty,) of this forum, it's like a big family conversation, things go off at all sorts of strange angles.

Yeah Decrepit, now pass us up the sauce and salad dressing.

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sailquik said

Only ONE spot in the eastern state has produced 40 knot 500's. That is Chris Torcklers home spot.
When a guy as fast as Chris Torckler is stuck on 42.32 500m and has even gone over to the Kites to try to go faster, you should see the writing on the wall. Come over here to the big Western state like Dave MacInnes has done if you want a fast 500.

1/ ChrisT 42.32/ 500m was set many moons ago on older gear, bar the KA Sail ~ 2007 which is still a great sail, likely the best sail in the world still!
Sure if Chris T was to use modern boards, Fin + Wind, his speeds would be much higher at his home spot that i happen to overlook every damn day when there is no wind

2/ Coming over to the big Western state is on the drawing board, there is know denying the pit is the place to go! Our backyard is great for training thou!

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sailquik said

As for 10 seconds, that is much easier than some measured distance. Just count to yourself, 1...2...3...4...5...6...7...8...9...10... You can count and speedsail at the same time can't you?

Yes 1 to 10 is a perfect number, perfect as can be.

500m is imperfect as can be, thus imperfection is one of the attributes for athletics.
You actually have to go over 500meters before you can approach the finish line, at 500 meters you have not finished, you have to go further to finish.

This makes the 500m measure just more competitive & that much harder to achieve.

500 meters is a recognize measure for all sports, why should we discard 500 meters?

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icesurf said...



500 meters is a recognize measure for all sports, why should we discard 500 meters?

I understand where you are coming from. The 500m was for a long time THE measure of sailing speed (but actually not many other sports). Times change. It isn't the only one anymore. Technology changes. Now we use a device that counts seconds to the millisecond, but not distance to the meter. We measure the real speed the sailor travels, not an imaginary speed between two points (most likely faster because of a path that is not straight, but you can never really know). Maybe....... no, probably we will be able to measure at a high enough frequency in the future to get pretty close to a few centimeters accuracy to compare our speeds with official 500m times (converted to speeds), but at the moment we can be more accurate with, and confident in, time based speeds because of the technology we use.
Another advantage of this for us is also that there are many more places around the world where a 10 second run at 40+ knots (around 250 - 280m) is possible than there are where 500m 40+ runs can be done.
It doesn't matter much when we are comparing speeds from sailors all around the world whether it is 10 seconds or 500m. We are all doing the same thing. As a scientist once said " Speed is relative."
But, more importantly, Sailquik says "Speed is Good!"

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sailquik said...

icesurf said...



500 meters is a recognize measure for all sports, why should we discard 500 meters?

I understand where you are coming from. The 500m was for a long time THE measure of sailing speed (but actually not many other sports). Times change. It isn't the only one anymore. Technology changes. Now we use a device that counts seconds to the millisecond, but not distance to the meter. We measure the real speed the sailor travels, not an imaginary speed between two points (most likely faster because of a path that is not straight, but you can never really know). Maybe....... no, probably we will be able to measure at a high enough frequency in the future to get pretty close to a few centimeters accuracy to compare our speeds with official 500m times (converted to speeds), but at the moment we can be more accurate with, and confident in, time based speeds because of the technology we use.
Another advantage of this for us is also that there are many more places around the world where a 10 second run at 40+ knots (around 250 - 280m) is possible than there are where 500m 40+ runs can be done.
It doesn't matter much when we are comparing speeds from sailors all around the world whether it is 10 seconds or 500m. We are all doing the same thing. As a scientist once said " Speed is relative."
But, more importantly, Sailquik says "Speed is Good!"

Just to play devil's advocate here why are the nautical mile, alpha 500 and distance all measured over a distance if the time based speeds are more accurate?

500m distance based speeds are still the most recognised sailing speed measurement in the world and the official measurement. Anytime the record is broken for the WSSRC 500m it garners press internationally and features across all forms of media. It also seems to be the focus of 3 major records attempts worldwide at the moment. Times haven't changed that much that is any less important.

Spotty's fantastic run at the PIT on "Spotty Sunday" featured his peak and 500m speed in press reports here in the USA, to quote: "The sensation of the day was KA Sailor Craig Spottiswood who was the only sailor who really looked comfortable to me. Spotty recorded a sensational peak speed of 50.01 Knots and even more impressive was his 500m speed of 48.709 Knots!!"

It's great having the time based measurements as a fun way of measuring speeds anywhere, but for the sake of consistancy shouldn't all the the speeds for the challenge be measured one way or the other rather than both?

GPSTC.....is a meant to be a "fun" site which allows all types of sailors to compete and enjoy themselves that is the foundation of GPSTC.

From what I understand the Challenge was setup to encourage windsurfers to get out on the water and develop relationships between windsurfers. Its more about personal records that relate to real world sailing, rather than world records over an arbitary distance.

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Mobydisc said...

From what I understand the Challenge was setup to encourage windsurfers to get out on the water and develop relationships between windsurfers. Its more about personal records that relate to real world sailing, rather than world records over an arbitary distance.

YEP! and GPSSS/WSSRC Roo if you want to chase records [}:)]

The Pit Crew have already got a mortgage on the 2 sec peak and 5 x 10 categories (assuming they get wind in any given month). The 500m would likewise be dominated by those sailing Sandy's epic run.

Leave it the way it is, there's a nice balance between speed, endurance and gybing ability across the six categories that levels the playing field.

GPSTC has never been about breaking world records or chasing personal glory, that's why it's so damn good!

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Pointman said...


GPSTC has never been about breaking world records or chasing personal glory, that's why it's so damn good!

To the contrary!
The tea party is over.
Soon as time/ distance is recorded its an competition,
Winning is good!

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Roo said...

Just to play devil's advocate here why are the nautical mile, alpha 500 and distance all measured over a distance if the time based speeds are more accurate?

For the Alpha 500, the distance is not critical as it can be anything under 500m. With the total distance and Nautical Mile, accuracy is not critical because the distances are so huge that a fraction of a second either side makes no significant difference.

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Roo said...

It's great having the time based measurements as a fun way of measuring speeds anywhere, but for the sake of consistency shouldn't all the the speeds for the challenge be measured one way or the other rather than both?

Nope, see above. It is better to do it the most logical way. Actually, it was debated internally for quite a while in GPS-SS whether they should have 20 seconds instead of 500m and x seconds for NM etc, but it was decided they are only fun rankings anyhow so it was better to stick with the distances, even if they are not strictly comparable with the WSSRC distances.