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Windxtasy said..

So here I am waterstarting with the belly of the sail pushed the wrong way as well

That does make it hard.

I use my leg to flip the cams over. From the mast side, I put my foot on the inside of the boom at around about the widest part, and bend the leg. I am holding the mast as I do this.This makes the knee push up against the sail and the cams flip over easily. It is really quick and you don't even need to have the mast out of the water. I find it easier than flipping the cams with a good pump, even with small sails.

As Kazza says depends on the sail..I've tried that too.. The Sailworks NX was much harder to pop the Severenes seem to pop easier although the full on race ones would be harder than the overdrives..

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sboardcrazy said..

Windxtasy said..

So here I am waterstarting with the belly of the sail pushed the wrong way as well

That does make it hard.

I use my leg to flip the cams over. From the mast side, I put my foot on the inside of the boom at around about the widest part, and bend the leg. I am holding the mast as I do this.This makes the knee push up against the sail and the cams flip over easily. It is really quick and you don't even need to have the mast out of the water. I find it easier than flipping the cams with a good pump, even with small sails.

As Kazza says depends on the sail..I've tried that too.. The Sailworks NX was much harder to pop the Severenes seem to pop easier although the full on race ones would be harder than the overdrives..

Don't know about that, the guys seem to have no worry's popping their Reflex's. I've always found my OD's hard to rotate, but maybe it is too much batten tension, something to do with my tuning I reckon. Need Mr Severne himself for rigging lessons
My friend Kaleb (Buzzy) reckons not to do the bottom strap at the foot of the sail too tight, he finds that helps with the rotation, he also said his new OD R5's rotate really well, mine are R4's. I think I'ld better play with the tuning a bit.

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[quote

My friend Kaleb (Buzzy) reckons not to do the bottom strap at the foot of the sail too tight, he finds that helps with the rotation, he also said his new OD R5's rotate really well, mine are R4's. I think I'ld better play with the tuning a bit.

I used to have the foot strap only just tightened on one particular sail(not all), it seemed to help with rotation a little bit, or it may of just been me thinking it helped.

I think there is a point where a sail is simply be to big for you to water start or handle comfortably.

Let me explain:

If you are 100kg, 6'2 man, a 11.5m sail may be quite manageable to maneuver and handle.
But if you are a 50kg, 5'0 women than this same sail will probably be too much of a handful and too hard to water start.
The equivalent may be (and i have used no science here) a 6.0m sail.

There is a reason that you don't see 15m sails on the market. They are just to big to reasonably handle even if you are a strong 100kg bloke.

For myself (on slalom gear) i find that a 8.5m sail is larger than i am comfortable with. Though a 7.8m is super comfortable. And im a reasonably strong 90kg bloke, competent sailor.

Right on the money, boardboy.

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boardboy said..

I think there is a point where a sail is simply be to big for you to water start or handle comfortably.

Let me explain:

If you are 100kg, 6'2 man, a 11.5m sail may be quite manageable to maneuver and handle.
But if you are a 50kg, 5'0 women than this same sail will probably be too much of a handful and too hard to water start.
The equivalent may be (and i have used no science here) a 6.0m sail.

There is a reason that you don't see 15m sails on the market. They are just to big to reasonably handle even if you are a strong 100kg bloke.

For myself (on slalom gear) i find that a 8.5m sail is larger than i am comfortable with. Though a 7.8m is super comfortable. And im a reasonably strong 90kg bloke, competent sailor.

I am 57 Kg and my biggest sail is a 7.5 Koncept. I feel I can handle it comfortably and waterstart it in most situations, but I don't think I'd want to go any bigger. My optimum sail size is about 5.8.

I am guessing Kazza is a bit bigger than me (and a better sailor) so she should be able to handle a 7m.

I've read this this thread and have to say that I have learnt to clue first start my 8.6 for exactly the same reasons. Once u loose control for 3 to 5 seconds u have.to plan b. In 4kts of tide in the shear water that's about 10 seconds later. Once that's up u panic and its plan for plan c aka swim or go upwind off the plane. If u could start the rig clue first and then flip the rig you have options. doest always work in all circumstances in my opinion a clue first creates options. once the clue goes under u have to swim to to fly the the mast tip. that rig scoop trick works too but u have to practice too as I've tried it (lots of hours for a crap sailer like me, u might be different) it defiantly works!

I've shown a few People the trick and and as a unfit sailer I appreciate a few less seconds in the water worrying about the men in Grey suits ;)

slalom guys won't worry about this as if they drop a gybe amd the are screwed but us gps guys a gals want to be alive for next spring :)

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Windxtasy said..

boardboy said..

I think there is a point where a sail is simply be to big for you to water start or handle comfortably.

Let me explain:

If you are 100kg, 6'2 man, a 11.5m sail may be quite manageable to maneuver and handle.
But if you are a 50kg, 5'0 women than this same sail will probably be too much of a handful and too hard to water start.
The equivalent may be (and i have used no science here) a 6.0m sail.

There is a reason that you don't see 15m sails on the market. They are just to big to reasonably handle even if you are a strong 100kg bloke.

For myself (on slalom gear) i find that a 8.5m sail is larger than i am comfortable with. Though a 7.8m is super comfortable. And im a reasonably strong 90kg bloke, competent sailor.

I am 57 Kg and my biggest sail is a 7.5 Koncept. I feel I can handle it comfortably and waterstart it in most situations, but I don't think I'd want to go any bigger. My optimum sail size is about 5.8.

I am guessing Kazza is a bit bigger than me (and a better sailor) so she should be able to handle a 7m.

7.0 no worries about sailing around, very light and comfortable, just waterstarting it's big and awkward. I have a 7.5 OD which is a couple of years older the my 7.0 and is longer in the boom compared to the newer sails and I don't know if it's because I'm getting old but I find it so hard on my shoulder joints. So at 63 kgs & 5'6 I would say my 7.0 is the max I like to go. Your doing well at 57 kg's with a 7.5 Anita

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Kazza said..

Windxtasy said..

boardboy said..

I think there is a point where a sail is simply be to big for you to water start or handle comfortably.

Let me explain:

If you are 100kg, 6'2 man, a 11.5m sail may be quite manageable to maneuver and handle.
But if you are a 50kg, 5'0 women than this same sail will probably be too much of a handful and too hard to water start.
The equivalent may be (and i have used no science here) a 6.0m sail.

There is a reason that you don't see 15m sails on the market. They are just to big to reasonably handle even if you are a strong 100kg bloke.

For myself (on slalom gear) i find that a 8.5m sail is larger than i am comfortable with. Though a 7.8m is super comfortable. And im a reasonably strong 90kg bloke, competent sailor.

I am 57 Kg and my biggest sail is a 7.5 Koncept. I feel I can handle it comfortably and waterstart it in most situations, but I don't think I'd want to go any bigger. My optimum sail size is about 5.8.

I am guessing Kazza is a bit bigger than me (and a better sailor) so she should be able to handle a 7m.

7.0 no worries about sailing around, very light and comfortable, just waterstarting it's big and awkward. I have a 7.5 OD which is a couple of years older the my 7.0 and is longer in the boom compared to the newer sails and I don't know if it's because I'm getting old but I find it so hard on my shoulder joints. So at 63 kgs & 5'6 I would say my 7.0 is the max I like to go. Your doing well at 57 kg's with a 7.5 Anita

+1.. No wonder I can't catch her..

I'm the same size, weight ,and general age as you and I can generally cope with my 7.5m overdrive ok but I uphaul.I wouldn't want to try and waterstart it in the conditions you say. I do find it hard to pull the sail in enough with my body and go upwind when I'm planing ok and I wear out quickly. Still it gets me out in 5-15kts!
Funny I used to find the 7.2m Sailkworks Nx heavier and more tiring than the 7.5 overdrive..probably as the overdrive is only 3 cams whereas the NX was a fully cammed sail.The overdrive is also easier to rotate and gybe.

Yes the OD's are nice and light, they're a kg lighter than Severne Reflex's too.

Sboardcrazy said +1.. No wonder I can't catch her..

I'm the same size, weight ,and general age as you and I can generally cope with my 7.5m overdrive ok but I uphaul.I wouldn't want to try and waterstart it in the conditions you say.

I don't do my best speeds on the 7.5! As I only use it in light wind (up to 15 knots) I doubt I've been over 24 knots with that!

I find it easier to waterstart the 7.5 than uphaul it (obviously a little more wind is required). I am always afraid I am going to pop a disc when I uphaul it!

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Windxtasy said..

Sboardcrazy said +1.. No wonder I can't catch her..

I'm the same size, weight ,and general age as you and I can generally cope with my 7.5m overdrive ok but I uphaul.I wouldn't want to try and waterstart it in the conditions you say.

I don't do my best speeds on the 7.5! As I only use it in light wind (up to 15 knots) I doubt I've been over 24 knots with that!

I find it easier to waterstart the 7.5 than uphaul it (obviously a little more wind is required). I am always afraid I am going to pop a disc when I uphaul it!

I meant you usually end up holding a bigger sail for your size than I do.. I often use my 7.5m in non planing conditions so have to be able to uphaul..