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Dazzler75 said..

The Alley Glider..........

surfboardsbygrantnewby.blogspot.com/search?q=Glider

I am yet to be trusted with, I mean surf the timber board, have ridden the fibreglass board and it is the ripple king for smaller days. Want to try on a larger day when the sweep is taking you from one post code to another.

NB: disclaimer / pimp alert - Grant is a mate of mine & has shaped boards for me & other people I know.

Had the pleasure of meeting Grant in March when he was over here for the Waipu fish fry Top Kiwi bloke

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Dazzler75 said..

The Alley Glider..........

surfboardsbygrantnewby.blogspot.com/search?q=Glider

I am yet to be trusted with, I mean surf the timber board, have ridden the fibreglass board and it is the ripple king for smaller days. Want to try on a larger day when the sweep is taking you from one post code to another.

NB: disclaimer / pimp alert - Grant is a mate of mine & has shaped boards for me & other people I know.

Good story on Grant on the news earlier today.

Hello to all

Thanks to all the contributors to this glider thread. Such a wealth of knowledge and perspectives.

Allow me to introduce myself before posting, since this is my 1st post here and i feel my introduction might hopefully enrich the discussion.

My background in surfing has been one of letting go of assistance as age catches up. A windsurfer in my 20-40's, open ocean surfski next and SUP'er in my later 40's. Now, in the 50's, surfing traditional, no help from sail or paddle, just my bare hands to propel onto the wave and trimming from there on. I also prone/knee paddleboard for distance or downwind. I currently surf a high volume 9'6 longboard, knee to chest mushers.

I'm very interested in acquiring a glider, most probably shaped locally. Beyond 10' longboards, haven't seen gliders here. There's two breaks locally, one 500 mts offshore, which i reach quite easily on the floaty 9'6 lb, and a host of outer reefs, some over 1 km offshore, which feature mushy waves on deep bottom, chest to head high with the possibility of long rides.

My needs are, a nice glider for the far away mushy waves, that is easy to paddle both prone and on knees for the outer reefs, specially on the return to shore, which sometimes is against the wind. Maneuver wise, I'm happy with standing and gliding on the sweet spot, the longer, the better.

I feel that a belly entry, narrow outline, pin tail and low, continuous rocker might be a starting point. What about rails, bottom contours, fin setup ?

All ideas and suggestions are welcome, thanks in advance, be well !

I'm a fat old guy who can't surf to save his life, so you can take my advice with a grain of salt, but here it is anyway.

The rail profiles you need may not be too different from the sups you've owned. You mention nothing about wanting to nose ride, so 50/50 rails won't be needed.

The rail at the nose can start off evenly rounded and then from around 15inches back, they could start to drop to a down rail, not a hard edgy one, just a nice subtle rounded one.

The rail will need to get harder at the rear, but you probably would not notice it start to happen until around 16 inches from the tail.

The tail is where I differ a lot from conventional wisdom, most modern boards have a slightly squared off or boxy tail, it's to induce speed vai a phenomenon with a weird name, I don't subscribe to it for a longboard with a single fin, I like a heavy foil that thins away to a sharp edge at the back. I feel it gives me the feel of having multiple fins in a turn.

For the bottom I prefer a very sallow bouble concave stating just behind half way and running out to a slight vee tail.

Template would be pin tail for decent turning on a big board

I'm not sure about the entry I doubt you'll need a concave, but then, I've never enjoyed riding hullish boards. Maybe flat, with just a hint of a conc

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obct said..
I'm a fat old guy who can't surf to save his life, so you can take my advice with a grain of salt, but here it is anyway.

The rail profiles you need may not be too different from the sups you've owned. You mention nothing about wanting to nose ride, so 50/50 rails won't be needed.

The rail at the nose can start off evenly rounded and then from around 15inches back, they could start to drop to a down rail, not a hard edgy one, just a nice subtle rounded one.

The rail woul need to get harder at the rear, but you probably would not notice it start to happen until around 16 inches from the tail.

The tail is where I differ a lot from conventional wisdom, most modern boards has a slightly squared off or boxy tail, it's to induce speed vai a phenomenon with a weird name, I don't subscribe to it for a longboard with a single fin, I like a heavy foil that thins away to a sharp edge at the back. I feel it gives me the feel of having multiple fins in a turn.

For the bottom I prefer a very sallow bouble concave stating jut behind half way and running out to a slight vee tail.

Template would be pin tail for decent turning on a big board

I'm not sure about the entry I doubt you'll need a concave, but then, I've never enjoyed riding hullish boards. Maybe flat, with just a hint of a conc

Thanks for your input, obct.

I forgot to include in my details, that i don't intend to noseride, my 9'6 already fits this purpose, at least, for my shaky attempts at the forward quarter. Also, i weight 80 kg and no wetsuits are needed here (Puerto Rico).

I prefer a bellied nose instead of a concave because of the smooth paddling experience with my prone paddleboard, a Bark Commander. That thing just motors against any chop and wind ! And glides like a damn torpedo. I can surf it on very small swell, downwind or on the summer flats, but on knees.
On the other hand, my 9'6 longboard features a wider nose with a concave and chines. And it slaps quite a bit whenever the chop shows up, specially when paddling back to shore against the ever present and early rising wind.
Since the outer reefs i plan on surfing on the glider are way offshore, i would definitely prefer a great paddling board to get there and leave the concave nose board to surf the inner reefs.

Do you have a picture of the foiled to sharp edge tail design you favor?

I concur with you in that really thinned out tails work wonders for reducing drag and enhancing glide. This is a picture of the tail on the prone board i have. It glides beautifully, and does initiate a turn. It is a really narrow board, at 20" wide, the tail tapering to maybe 6 or so inches. There is not a sharp edge in this bottom, other than a crest that starts behind the fin box and ends at a very sharp tail. I love pintails, no doubt.



Regarding the bottom, and making reference to a nice sup i once had, an 11' Alii Takayama, that board had no sharp edges anywhere, had a rolled bottom in the midsection, and the rails, started to become more defined (not sharp) in the rear, around the sidebites area, just as you explained. That board was an excellent glider, but, at 28", too wide for a prone paddling glider. Had to let it go when i hung up the paddle. I would prefer something in the 23" width.

You mentioned a subtle concave, in the midsection. Would be interesting to know more about this feature, regarding depth, how wide, if chines come into play, etc.

I really appreciate your wisdom in this aspect, since, as i said, i've seen no long gliders here.

I believe that extracting design features from other craft, such as the prone paddleboard above, might help in the design process, but it might also not...it's a gamble.

Thanks, be well.






I

I'm surprised you've seen no gliders over there, people like Jim Phillips turn them out on a regular basis, and I thought you would still get them from Yalter, one of the best gliders I've ever had, and still have stored up in the rafters is a 10.6 Mickey Munoz surftec, I thought there would be a lot of them over there. We are talking about prone paddle longboards aren't we?

Anyhow here's a few tail pics

This is where I got my inspiration from, it's a professionally shaped 10.2 all rounder done by an old south african guy who claimed he used to shape for Shaun Thompson and even did a couple of boards for Mickey Dora when he was in SA. The dims on the board are massive 24 wide and 3 5/8 thick , but regardless of that, I can sill manage to whip the front around relative quickly and all my mates reckon it added new dimension to my surfing right from the day I first got on it. I went from being a useless turd to a slightly useful turd.

I've always used a 9.5" dolphin fin with it.





Because I liked it so much, I wanted a copy of it, but the guy who made it said be no longer shapes, so I had a go myself, only this time, I went shorter, 9.6, and thicker, all the way to 4 inches thick and 24 wide. One thing I made sure I did was to do a sharp tail foil, I did not thin it as much as the yellow board, because I was scared it would be too thin for the finbox but then unlike the yellow board, this one had a vee tail, so the thickness was needed regardless.

I started out with a 9" dolphin fin, then I changed to the 9" cutaway you see in the pic, I think it gave me slightly more speed, and I'm sure it made my kickouts more crisp




The bottom on the home made board is a combination of a lot of ideas, but it boils down to the very shallow double concave running out to either side of the tail, starting roughly from the front of the finbox.

I like this board so much, I put the yellow one up in the rafters and I'm even considering putting my 10.2 noserider up there because I only want to ride this one, the biggest problem with it is that it's so big and fat, it's hard to carry a long way.





I thought I'd throw in one more for good measure, it's the tail of the Munoz, probably the best glider I've ever been on, and although you can make it turn, it does not turn the way I want it to. When my mates see me take this one out, they crap their board shorts and stay well out of my way, because they know I can't stay out of their way.

But it does show just how hard the down rail edges are at the tail.

Thanks a lot for the pictures, obct, there's a wealth of information just by looking at them.

Yes, very few boards locally in the over 10' range, in my side of the island. Maybe if i go to the west part, a surfing destination, some gliders may show up. But no pictures of them as of now among the surfing community.

YES !... absolutely, we're talking about prone paddle surfboards. Sup, even though it's pretty popular here, and i did it for a couple years, i started to dislike it for surfing around a year ago, and since i was already paddling prone/knee on my Bark paddleboard, i quit the paddle and the sup with ease. But that's another story....i'm one of the very few locally who moved away from sup and into traditional prone surfing.

I have the chance to make an order for one of Mickey Munoz's Surftech 11' or 12' Gliders. But something in me tells that i should research the subject, then sit down with one of the local shapers and discuss this glider concept with him. I feel i can get a better board, for my particular weight, purpose, style of paddling and surfing locally. I don't doubt Munoz's shaping credentials, and have seen some very good opinions on his Gliders. If the local shaper declines the project, or if the price goes through the roof, there's only one other shaper left in the west part of the island, with experience to spare, in the longboard department. If those two, don't work, it'll be a Munoz then.

The yellow board in your picture features a very nice smooth and thin tail, but, the one on the 2nd and 3rd picture has a beautiful double concave, and a very interesting shape in the deck. If my eyes don't fail me, there's some kind of slightly down turned rail at the very end of the pin tail.

And the Munoz on the fourth picture, even though it features sharp rails, i feel the square tail is a lot of foam to sink into a turn. Possibly, because of this, you can't turn it well. And i'm only 80 kg ! Maybe with a cutaway fin and higher aspect side bites, it could get to start a turn, but, again, it has a very thick tail and lots of foam.

I don't have issues with a heavy board. My prone paddleboard is close to 28 lbs and it helps me to build fitness for the long paddle out. In fact, i would prefer a slightly heavier board in chop and wind.

It's been a pleasure, thanks so much for the pictures and taking the time to share wisdom.

Be well.

Sorry for my incredible stupidity Jouba, I assumed you were from SoCal, I just read your profile, you're on Puerto Rico .

now it makes sense,

Doesn't Robert August have an operation there.
Or is that Costa Rica

No worries!

I believe there's no Robert August here beyond the sup boards made by Surftech. And I'm not looking there!

There's a few well reputed surfboard shapers here and a bigger sup and kite surfing board shaper. Other than that, importing is the solution. Imagine, there's only around 10 prone paddleboards that I know of!

I do have faith in those few local shapers. Will have a nice glider by summer.

Be well

Sorry if this beautiful clip has been posted already in here somewhere. but it sits well in this thread:

So smooozzzzzz!!!

Thanks for sharing this one, after a non surfing weekend due to very bad weather, watching this one brings the spirits up !

Great clip....

Awesome surfing..