As MB and others have suggested, to give yourself a break when single handing, heave to.
So if I want to go from Sydney to FNQ without day hopping, could I sail for say 16 hrs then
heave to for 8 hrs ?? and if I'm in tandem with a similar sized boat doing the same thing, do
you raft up overnight or just find each other in the morning.

Sam, the east coast is very busy. It would be unsafe to sleep for 20 minutes, let alone eight hours. Look what happened to Jessica Watson. And you can't raft up in the open ocean.

Right....so the only option is to day hop, or, get to a state where you are totally sleep deprived
and end up lost like the guy in that recent thread. So why on earth do people sail solo. ???

Select to expand quote

samsturdy said..
Right....so the only option is to day hop, or, get to a state where you are totally sleep deprived
and end up lost like the guy in that recent thread. So why on earth do people sail solo. ???

Theres many ways. sleep for 30 min, do a check, back to sleep.
Some people sleep in the day for longer with an ais alarm on and in the hope that other ships will see them then spend more time awake at night keeping watch
You can heave to out at sea for many hours, but the same watchkeeping applies. You gotta keep watch.

Catching up on sleep and reserving your energy in benign conditions i think is the go, so resting as much as possible so youve got fuel to burn if things get tricky.

Select to expand quote

samsturdy said..
Right....so the only option is to day hop, or, get to a state where you are totally sleep deprived
and end up lost like the guy in that recent thread. So why on earth do people sail solo. ???

Sam in 24 hours you would usually get to somewhere you could stop.
Given that 20 minutes is an accepted safe sleeping time. Set a timer and wake every 20 minutes look around and then sleep for 20 more.
Most people can do 36 hours straight in normal conditions.

its amazing how many places there are to stop in nsw. look at google earth or alan lucas books. you can day sail most the way

Select to expand quote

Sectorsteve said..
its amazing how many places there are to stop in nsw. look at google earth or alan lucas books. you can day sail most the way

Absolutely agree, Sectorsteve,
I think the Lucas books are fantastic. All the details you need.
There's a great deal of heavy shipping coming and going up and down the NSW coast......need to keep your eyes on the ball...those big mother ore carriers come up on you really fast!!
Safe sailing

Select to expand quote

samsturdy said..
As MB and others have suggested, to give yourself a break when single handing, heave to.
So if I want to go from Sydney to FNQ without day hopping, could I sail for say 16 hrs then
heave to for 8 hrs ?? and if I'm in tandem with a similar sized boat doing the same thing, do
you raft up overnight or just find each other in the morning.

Sam, I know your question is a hypothetical and I hate to put a dampener on things but I think these questions, they aren't bad questions but do reveal a sailing naivety, indicate you probably don't yet have the sailing skills to go up the coast as skipper? I like your enthusiasm and encourage you to keep it up but...

The thought of rafting up at sea or heaving to in coastal traffic, with the implication you would be able to sleep for 8 hours, gives me the impression you need a bit more experience before considering such a venture. There are so many things to consider when skippering a yacht offshore you need to have the basics weighed off.

I'd suggest you do a multi day coastal passage or three with someone experienced.

im planning to sail for about 36 hours from Syd to Laurieton cause you cant go past Laurieton in a tophat and not go see philip from Seaka!
THere'll be 2 of us but ill be doing the whole trip on watch. probably leave about 2am from Sydney.

The next leg would be laurieton to gold coast and with enough of a weather window and right conditions i want to 24 hour sail this also and we will have a proper watch system in place notsure if it would be 2 on 2 off. stil yet to decide!

Ill save the exploring of the nsw coast when coming down. Want to get to warm ASAP and need to get to yard in moreton bay at a booked date.

SectorSteve, I am almost in Townsville (Cape Upstart then Cape Bowling Green tomorrow). Left the Whitsundays today. I haven't found "warm" yet

Hi Sam, I'm with Morningbird with this one regarding the watch issue. You will be amazed how quick those ships can appear. Twice in between Morten Is and Caloundra a ship seemed to appear out of nowhere .
If you are planing on going in convoy with another boat (referencing the raft up question), could the two of you possibly go on the one boat and share the watch and other duties??

Select to expand quote

Toph said..
SectorSteve, I am almost in Townsville (Cape Upstart then Cape Bowling Green tomorrow). Left the Whitsundays today. I haven't found "warm" yet

really? a bit chilly there? cant be colder than where i am in the highlands!. we've had frosts and im currently sitting in front of the fire. Im sure itll warm up , up there soon. i found in the past once you get to Cairns and cape trib the temp goes right up to those lovely 30 degree days.
You got up there quick! last i heard you were still at fraser!

Select to expand quote

Sectorsteve said..
im planning to sail for about 36 hours from Syd to Laurieton cause you cant go past Laurieton in a tophat and not go see philip from Seaka!
THere'll be 2 of us but ill be doing the whole trip on watch. probably leave about 2am from Sydney.

The next leg would be laurieton to gold coast and with enough of a weather window and right conditions i want to 24 hour sail this also and we will have a proper watch system in place notsure if it would be 2 on 2 off. stil yet to decide!

Ill save the exploring of the nsw coast when coming down. Want to get to warm ASAP and need to get to yard in moreton bay at a booked date.

I think your estimates for a top hat are a little optimistic add another 30 % to your times

Sam: To a degree I agree with MB, although I think it's quite OK, and very satisfying, to learn on your own - provided you do it in a staged way and don't put yourself (and potential rescuers) in harms way. I'd recommend you spend a year getting coastal experience before considering embarking on a solo trip to NQ. EG From Sydney, spend a week or 10 days doing Hawkesbury, Lake Macquarie, then Port Stephens, and back. Believe me, do that round trip twice in different weather patterns, and your knowledge will be hugely increased.

NSW is the hard part of your trip north - the distances between anchorages are greater, there are lots of coastal bars, you've got the EAC to deal with when going north, and the weather is arguably more problematic too (east coast lows and southerly busters are more prevalent than in Qld).

Steve: my experience is that you'll find it easy to put in the big miles when heading south - go wide and you'll get 2-4kt for free from the EAC. On the other hand, going north and hugging the coast to avoid the EAC, it might be more convenient to do the short hops.

Select to expand quote

boty said..

Sectorsteve said..
im planning to sail for about 36 hours from Syd to Laurieton cause you cant go past Laurieton in a tophat and not go see philip from Seaka!
THere'll be 2 of us but ill be doing the whole trip on watch. probably leave about 2am from Sydney.

The next leg would be laurieton to gold coast and with enough of a weather window and right conditions i want to 24 hour sail this also and we will have a proper watch system in place notsure if it would be 2 on 2 off. stil yet to decide!

Ill save the exploring of the nsw coast when coming down. Want to get to warm ASAP and need to get to yard in moreton bay at a booked date.

I think your estimates for a top hat are a little optimistic add another 30 % to your times

Maybe but my boats pretty fast as it's not laden down with loads of stuff. I've taken a lot from racing when cruising and setting up my boat. So far my estimates have been spot on when logging on and off with vmr between broken bay and jervis bay. These latest ones are based on doing a consistent 5knots which I always try to do even if I have to motor. In a good breeze Kia kaha does 6.5 tops.

Select to expand quote

QLDCruiser said..
Sam: To a degree I agree with MB, although I think it's quite OK, and very satisfying, to learn on your own - provided you do it in a staged way and don't put yourself (and potential rescuers) in harms way. I'd recommend you spend a year getting coastal experience before considering embarking on a solo trip to NQ. EG From Sydney, spend a week or 10 days doing Hawkesbury, Lake Macquarie, then Port Stephens, and back. Believe me, do that round trip twice in different weather patterns, and your knowledge will be hugely increased.

NSW is the hard part of your trip north - the distances between anchorages are greater, there are lots of coastal bars, you've got the EAC to deal with when going north, and the weather is arguably more problematic too (east coast lows and southerly busters are more prevalent than in Qld).

Steve: my experience is that you'll find it easy to put in the big miles when heading south - go wide and you'll get 2-4kt for free from the EAC. On the other hand, going north and hugging the coast to avoid the EAC, it might be more convenient to do the short hops.

That's right with the coastal trips around broken bay, port Stephen etc. it gives you massive confidence doing these and you gotta do them in all conditions I reckon as was advised to me on here which I've been doing.
Good point regarding the EAC . Anyone know where it is ATM? At Xmas coming up from jervis it was all the way to the coast nearly according to the Kiama fisherman which would explain why it was yuk sailing in a southerly from jb one rough day. All this is speculation right now. I'm might get out there and wanna come home. In fact I probably will but won't be able to as someone else will be living in my house!

The EAC as at today

www.windy.com/?sea,currents,-32.916,150.645,6

Select to expand quote

Sectorsteve said..

boty said..

Sectorsteve said..
im planning to sail for about 36 hours from Syd to Laurieton cause you cant go past Laurieton in a tophat and not go see philip from Seaka!
THere'll be 2 of us but ill be doing the whole trip on watch. probably leave about 2am from Sydney.

The next leg would be laurieton to gold coast and with enough of a weather window and right conditions i want to 24 hour sail this also and we will have a proper watch system in place notsure if it would be 2 on 2 off. stil yet to decide!

Ill save the exploring of the nsw coast when coming down. Want to get to warm ASAP and need to get to yard in moreton bay at a booked date.

I think your estimates for a top hat are a little optimistic add another 30 % to your times

Maybe but my boats pretty fast as it's not laden down with loads of stuff. I've taken a lot from racing when cruising and setting up my boat. So far my estimates have been spot on when logging on and off with vmr between broken bay and jervis bay. These latest ones are based on doing a consistent 5knots which I always try to do even if I have to motor. In a good breeze Kia kaha does 6.5 tops.

I doubt you will make better than 4 knots velocity made good going north to the Queensland border. Up near Tacking Pt you might make 1-2 kts for many hours. It took Cisco and I about 8 hours to do around 5 nm in Second Wind, which will be faster than the Tophat.
As a comparison MB averages 5 kts VMG. I plan on 4 kts i.e. 100nm days.
Laurieton must be about 180nm straight, at 4 kts it is 45 hours.
Good luck.

I love the concern you guys show. Were I naive (MB) enough to set sail on such a perilous journey (for me)
I would have to think twice before setting off.
In my case, were I desperate enough to attempt it, then day hopping is the only way I could possibly succeed,
That in itself would be a huge learning curve that I'm not ready for yet...however it does not stop me imagining
doing it and in my minds eye see myself in certain situations, and, being a realist without the experience I
can refine my thoughts by asking questions. For instance..Doesn't the use of AIS mean that any commercial
vessel knows your there and what you are (small sailing vessel) and take the appropriate action even though
you're fast asleep in your bunk ??. And if you are approached by an Iberian tanker suddenly, who takes what action
to avoid a collision under col regs rules. I have heard of folks setting out on foolhardy ventures, but I don't think
I'm going to be one of them just yet.

Select to expand quote

samsturdy said..
I love the concern you guys show. Were I naive (MB) enough to set sail on such a perilous journey (for me)
I would have to think twice before setting off.
In my case, were I desperate enough to attempt it, then day hopping is the only way I could possibly succeed,
That in itself would be a huge learning curve that I'm not ready for yet...however it does not stop me imagining
doing it and in my minds eye see myself in certain situations, and, being a realist without the experience I
can refine my thoughts by asking questions. For instance..Doesn't the use of AIS mean that any commercial
vessel knows your there and what you are (small sailing vessel) and take the appropriate action even though
you're fast asleep in your bunk ??. And if you are approached by an Iberian tanker suddenly, who takes what action
to avoid a collision under col regs rules. I have heard of folks setting out on foolhardy ventures, but I don't think
I'm going to be one of them just yet.

It's all about setting your anxiety levels as high as possible based on experiences. Sail your boat to Syd harbour or Lake Macquarie on a really nice calm day. Then do it on a not so calm day. Before you know it you've raised your anxiety levels and can take on a lot more and beef or you know it your flitting up and down the coast no problem at all. Then going to north qld could be just like doing a lot of day sails. Currently the thing I'm finding hard about sailing North is getting away! So much to do here at home!

Select to expand quote

MorningBird said..

Sectorsteve said..

boty said..

Sectorsteve said..
im planning to sail for about 36 hours from Syd to Laurieton cause you cant go past Laurieton in a tophat and not go see philip from Seaka!
THere'll be 2 of us but ill be doing the whole trip on watch. probably leave about 2am from Sydney.

The next leg would be laurieton to gold coast and with enough of a weather window and right conditions i want to 24 hour sail this also and we will have a proper watch system in place notsure if it would be 2 on 2 off. stil yet to decide!

Ill save the exploring of the nsw coast when coming down. Want to get to warm ASAP and need to get to yard in moreton bay at a booked date.

I think your estimates for a top hat are a little optimistic add another 30 % to your times

Maybe but my boats pretty fast as it's not laden down with loads of stuff. I've taken a lot from racing when cruising and setting up my boat. So far my estimates have been spot on when logging on and off with vmr between broken bay and jervis bay. These latest ones are based on doing a consistent 5knots which I always try to do even if I have to motor. In a good breeze Kia kaha does 6.5 tops.

I doubt you will make better than 4 knots velocity made good going north to the Queensland border. Up near Tacking Pt you might make 1-2 kts for many hours. It took Cisco and I about 8 hours to do around 5 nm in Second Wind, which will be faster than the Tophat.
As a comparison MB averages 5 kts VMG. I plan on 4 kts i.e. 100nm days.
Laurieton must be about 180nm straight, at 4 kts it is 45 hours.
Good luck.

I'm yet to find out as I've only mapped this out on paper and GPS. I'm basing this on past trips. Woodford bay to callala bay was 105nm including hugging the coast around royal national park. Took 25 hours done over 3 day sails. 12 hours day one, 8 hours day 2 and 5 hours 3rd day.
Syd to laurieton is 167 and I could probably shave 5 miles off by hugging the coast. In the GPS it says 33 hours based on consistent 5 knots which may not happen. It will be what it will be. It's not a race but I'm a bit ocd and like to be punctual!

Yes good Steve, I can see what you mean.....actually...I'm a bit envious of you heading North.

Haha love the OCD bit. I would have thought sailing was the last thing someone with OCD would do....nothing
goes to plan, does it ??.

Select to expand quote

samsturdy said..
Haha love the OCD bit. I would have thought sailing was the last thing someone with OCD would do....nothing
goes to plan, does it ??.

This is true! 5 miles off Wollongong harbour heading to greenwell point day two I went to hoist the main and a lug had managed to rotate itself sideways in the main track near the lower spreaders. Wasn't a lot of swell but the ocean was moving around while I climbed up there with a hammer and a screwdriver to knock the culprit around. Once that was done the wind built up to above 25 knots by the time entering green well point and I got there in good time, by 2 pm. So when I logged off it was before I said I'd arrive as I told vmr 3pm.

Select to expand quote

samsturdy said..
Yes good Steve, I can see what you mean.....actually...I'm a bit envious of you heading North.

Going outside is a real buzz Sam. Try and pick a day that's looking nice, no swell, sunny, about 10-15 knots. Get the tide right going in and out of broken bay although it doesn't matter too much. Practice heaving too in Pittwater. Then go outside and sail to say Avalon and back. You'll probably see some whales. Heave too. You'll get a massive confidence boost!

Steve...I'll do it....I promise.

Select to expand quote

MorningBird said..

EC31 said..
The EAC as at today

www.windy.com/?sea,currents,-32.916,150.645,6

Or this one.

Hey Morning Bird, will you please post a link to that page?

I assume it is the same as we referenced going to LHI.
Cheers Cisco.

Select to expand quote

samsturdy said..
Haha love the OCD bit. I would have thought sailing was the last thing someone with OCD would do....nothing
goes to plan, does it ??.

On the contrary. Having a bit Ocd is good on a boat. I'm constantly cleaning it, ridding it of anything not needed, checking lockers, stowing things, de cluttering. Some peoples boats look like they're used as storage units. My nightmare!

Select to expand quote

Sectorsteve said..

samsturdy said..
Haha love the OCD bit. I would have thought sailing was the last thing someone with OCD would do....nothing
goes to plan, does it ??.

On the contrary. Having a bit Ocd is good on a boat. I'm constantly cleaning it, ridding it of anything not needed, checking lockers, stowing things, de cluttering. Some peoples boats look like they're used as storage units. My nightmare!

I think that's Love, Steve.....not OCD.

Sam, I think going Nth is a little easier than going Sth, as there are many more options to day-hop, giving you a good rest overnight. You'll be sailing in close, with one foot on the boat & the other foot on land. Often inside of the reefs, weather permitting. Most of the bars will be accessible in a Sth'erly too. (You'd give many bars a miss in a strong Nth'erly).
The best fun for me is solo sailing with other solo sailors in company, you get the self-satisfaction of making a journey all by yourself but you have the comraderie, & info sharing aswell. But the thought of rafting up in the ocean is a no-no, even in an emergency, you'd be ripping the gunwhales off the boats.

Steve, I also think those are optimistic hours to do those legs in. You need to get the timing right for the bars. But the good thing about Laurieton is, you can stop at Crowdy Hbr (15nm Sth), at any time of day, to wait & time the bar right at Laurieton.
I'm looking forward to catching up with you while your in Laurieton.
The last two times this year I have gone Nth to Laurieton, once from Lake Mac & once from Pt Stephans, have been quite frustrating at times. Both times waiting for a Sther'ly & jumping on the back of it only hours after the front has passed has been disappointing with virtually nothing in the way of wind following up after the front. Not much wind, but a lot of choppy sea-state, slowing progress. Leaving me thinking it might be best to get out in front of the 'front' & let it push you up for a while??, rather than it dragging you up??

MB, I still remember seeing you fellas out in the sea battling for hours to round Tacking Pt, I think you were going into a NE'er too.

The current usually comes in close around Seal Rocks.
We went north with a southerly did botany bay to Port Stephens in 15 hours.
Stayed overnight there we were sailing at 6.5+ knts when we went around Seal Rocks hit the current and dropped to 3.5 knts at best and had to start the motor to get this. Tried going further inshore but the current was still there. Ended up about 10 hours to Crowdy Head.
I would recommend you plan on stopping at Port Stephens.
You also have a lot of fish traps from Port Stephens north hard to see in the dark.

Select to expand quote

cisco said..

MorningBird said..

EC31 said..
The EAC as at today

www.windy.com/?sea,currents,-32.916,150.645,6

Or this one.

Hey Morning Bird, will you please post a link to that page?

I assume it is the same as we referenced going to LHI.
Cheers Cisco.

Here you go.
oceancurrent.imos.org.au/LordHoweS/latest.html