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Peahi said..

Plummet said..

bene313 said..
So what about the opposite:

- a light weight, non rigid, flexible harness you can ride loose so it slides around a bit, no sliding spreader, want to unhook.

What about that kind of wave harness? That's what I want.

I used an ozone snow kite harness for a while. That fits you description. I worked great. Toeside is better on the slider but that's about it.

More than that i often find after doing a tight turn/carve from toeside to backside the kite loses some power at the end of the turn, turning back upwind. I let the kite follow me from behind by pushing the bar to the opposite side of the slider. This gives a moment for the kite to power up again as it comes back in the window.

And yes I used to be a firm believer of the loose sliding harness.

What I don't get about these set-ups is that it completely rules out unhooking in the surf.

Never unhook?

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bene313 said..

Peahi said..

Plummet said..

bene313 said..
So what about the opposite:

- a light weight, non rigid, flexible harness you can ride loose so it slides around a bit, no sliding spreader, want to unhook.

What about that kind of wave harness? That's what I want.

I used an ozone snow kite harness for a while. That fits you description. I worked great. Toeside is better on the slider but that's about it.

More than that i often find after doing a tight turn/carve from toeside to backside the kite loses some power at the end of the turn, turning back upwind. I let the kite follow me from behind by pushing the bar to the opposite side of the slider. This gives a moment for the kite to power up again as it comes back in the window.

And yes I used to be a firm believer of the loose sliding harness.

What I don't get about these set-ups is that it completely rules out unhooking in the surf.

Never unhook?

Mine currently has the sliding hook pulley (c/w J-bar), so yes you can and I do unhook occasionally, just a bit tricky to rehook

before and after shots. Need to figure out a way of losing the C/L

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bene313 said..

Peahi said..

Plummet said..

bene313 said..
So what about the opposite:

- a light weight, non rigid, flexible harness you can ride loose so it slides around a bit, no sliding spreader, want to unhook.

What about that kind of wave harness? That's what I want.

I used an ozone snow kite harness for a while. That fits you description. I worked great. Toeside is better on the slider but that's about it.

More than that i often find after doing a tight turn/carve from toeside to backside the kite loses some power at the end of the turn, turning back upwind. I let the kite follow me from behind by pushing the bar to the opposite side of the slider. This gives a moment for the kite to power up again as it comes back in the window.

And yes I used to be a firm believer of the loose sliding harness.

What I don't get about these set-ups is that it completely rules out unhooking in the surf.

Never unhook?

Never,

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Peahi said..
before and after shots. Need to figure out a way of losing the C/L

Mate, get yourself a low friction ring.

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toppleover said..

Peahi said..
before and after shots. Need to figure out a way of losing the C/L

Mate, get yourself a low friction ring.

Got one on order, this just to tie me over (also while waiting for new ropes to be spliced) and does the job.

Good move mate, you will be amazed how much better the LFR is.

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toppleover said..
Good move mate, you will be amazed how much better the LFR is.

indeed. Super duper smooth :)

Be careful that shackle can come undone underload, once they come loose from the friction they are more likely to keep undoing than they are to tighten.
Also very unlikely if you have to use your quick release that it will freely run through the swivel. Not sure if you have tried it yet.

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pezza said..
Be careful that shackle can come undone underload, once they come loose from the friction they are more likely to keep undoing than they are to tighten.
Also very unlikely if you have to use your quick release that it will freely run through the swivel. Not sure if you have tried it yet.

Yep thats a very dodgy unsafe setup.

I'm completely used to the rope and lfr now. Was boosting stupid off wave lips and didn't even notice it. For a while the rope slider and lfr felt a bit weird for jumping.

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Ozone Kites Aus said..

pezza said..
Be careful that shackle can come undone underload, once they come loose from the friction they are more likely to keep undoing than they are to tighten.
Also very unlikely if you have to use your quick release that it will freely run through the swivel. Not sure if you have tried it yet.

Yep thats a very dodgy unsafe setup.

Have tested QR goes through OK. Have tightened the shackle with pliers has not loosened after 3 or 4 so sessions but will keep an eye on it. After all what's the worst that can happen - become unhooked?

If it all goes pear shaped I will promise to post it here.

Also re-commissioned the "oh-shizt" pin with the red ball that releases both ropes if does go haywire.

I seem to recall Mr Ozone/ Terry Mcttool that you said to get rid of this red ball, so not sure you're one to give safety advice.

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Peahi said..

Ozone Kites Aus said..

pezza said..
Be careful that shackle can come undone underload, once they come loose from the friction they are more likely to keep undoing than they are to tighten.
Also very unlikely if you have to use your quick release that it will freely run through the swivel. Not sure if you have tried it yet.

Yep thats a very dodgy unsafe setup.

Have tested QR goes through OK. Have tightened the shackle with pliers has not loosened after 3 or 4 so sessions but will keep an eye on it. After all what's the worst that can happen - become unhooked?

If it all goes pear shaped I will promise to post it here.

Also re-commissioned the "oh-shizt" pin with the red ball that releases both ropes if does go haywire.

I seem to recall Mr Ozone/ Terry Mcttool that you said to get rid of this red ball, so not sure you're one to give safety advice.

The ring for the qr doesn't look that big. I wonder if it will bind up if released underload. Have you tested a powered release?

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Plummet said..

Peahi said..

Ozone Kites Aus said..

pezza said..
Be careful that shackle can come undone underload, once they come loose from the friction they are more likely to keep undoing than they are to tighten.
Also very unlikely if you have to use your quick release that it will freely run through the swivel. Not sure if you have tried it yet.

Yep thats a very dodgy unsafe setup.

Have tested QR goes through OK. Have tightened the shackle with pliers has not loosened after 3 or 4 so sessions but will keep an eye on it. After all what's the worst that can happen - become unhooked?

If it all goes pear shaped I will promise to post it here.

Also re-commissioned the "oh-shizt" pin with the red ball that releases both ropes if does go haywire.

I seem to recall Mr Ozone/ Terry Mcttool that you said to get rid of this red ball, so not sure you're one to give safety advice.

The ring for the qr doesn't look that big. I wonder if it will bind up if released underload. Have you tested a powered release?

Haven't tested under load but will do. I fail to see how it could not work when it slides in and out easily enough.

A larger shackle might have been a safer option but just using this setup until my LFR arrives.

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Peahi said..

Plummet said..

Peahi said..

Ozone Kites Aus said..

pezza said..
Be careful that shackle can come undone underload, once they come loose from the friction they are more likely to keep undoing than they are to tighten.
Also very unlikely if you have to use your quick release that it will freely run through the swivel. Not sure if you have tried it yet.

Yep thats a very dodgy unsafe setup.

Have tested QR goes through OK. Have tightened the shackle with pliers has not loosened after 3 or 4 so sessions but will keep an eye on it. After all what's the worst that can happen - become unhooked?

If it all goes pear shaped I will promise to post it here.

Also re-commissioned the "oh-shizt" pin with the red ball that releases both ropes if does go haywire.

I seem to recall Mr Ozone/ Terry Mcttool that you said to get rid of this red ball, so not sure you're one to give safety advice.

The ring for the qr doesn't look that big. I wonder if it will bind up if released underload. Have you tested a powered release?

Haven't tested under load but will do. I fail to see how it could not work when it slides in and out easily enough.

A larger shackle might have been a safer option but just using this setup until my LFR arrives.

Just hook CL to your rope, until LFR arrives = safer option.

That shackle is waaaay too small.

I would loctite that pin, it will come undone.

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bene313 said..

Peahi said..

Plummet said..

bene313 said..
So what about the opposite:

- a light weight, non rigid, flexible harness you can ride loose so it slides around a bit, no sliding spreader, want to unhook.

What about that kind of wave harness? That's what I want.

I used an ozone snow kite harness for a while. That fits you description. I worked great. Toeside is better on the slider but that's about it.

More than that i often find after doing a tight turn/carve from toeside to backside the kite loses some power at the end of the turn, turning back upwind. I let the kite follow me from behind by pushing the bar to the opposite side of the slider. This gives a moment for the kite to power up again as it comes back in the window.

And yes I used to be a firm believer of the loose sliding harness.

What I don't get about these set-ups is that it completely rules out unhooking in the surf.

Never unhook?

Using sliding rope most of the time. Cleaned up an old harness to try and get unhooking sorted during the Christmas break. Needs lots of practice to rehook on the rope. Keen to see what's working for most. Still got a hook/pulley setup somewhere in storage is that the best?

^^ If you're unhooking, then surely a hook would make life easier when you're trying to hook back in? Why make life harder by not using one?

All sorted now. Mr Ronstan delivered.

Returned the shackle as it was too small (on some angles the CL could catch) and the next size up weighed a ton.

First try the CL came off the LFR as I was launching but was easy enough to put it back on. Smooth as.

The Antal rings look they would wear your rope slider far less than a shackle or stainless ring. In terms of smoothness though the Ronstan RF30100 pulleys is the best setup I've used.




This post was about wave harnesses though and I've now tried the new Jay XTC hardshell harness several times, initially back to back with my original and favourite ever wave harness the Ride Engine 2016 model.
Now my favourite harness of all time for wave riding is the Jay XTC.
There are only a few things on the current one that need to be improved, and they have nothing to do with the overall shape and support. The male velcro is facing the wrong way, which means its going to chaff like 60 grit sandpaper if you don't wear a thick rashie or wetsuit. This change will happen soon apparently.
The current XTC harness is the lightest by far, and it does not absorb any water. The hardshell and the sealed EVA foam base are separate pieces and this allows a lot more flex in the right places. The webbing connecting the buckles is also not attached to the hardshell and this creates increased comfort and flexibilty as well as strength. Clearly a lot of thought and R&D has gone into the design.
I'm wearing a size M (not XS-S as in the pic) and have a 32/33" waist. The harness will be available from the distributor (Kitepower) and all good kiteshops soon.

I like the look of that J harness. I've been using the jay bar for the past 5 or so years.
Like you, I've found using a shackle pulley extremely smooth. And it's easy to make up your own slider ropes.

The harness looks like it's possible to replace the thicker webbing straps? I find the webbing normally wears faster than a harness, so have to normally ditch it once the webbing is worn and everything else is fine.

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SonnyRider said..
I like the look of that J harness. I've been using the jay bar for the past 5 or so years.
Like you, I've found using a shackle pulley extremely smooth. And it's easy to make up your own slider ropes.

The harness looks like it's possible to replace the thicker webbing straps? I find the webbing normally wears faster than a harness, so have to normally ditch it once the webbing is worn and everything else is fine.

I've been riding the Jay xtc since March last year. It's good. Real good when super powered. You can ride for way longer with out getting that rib crushing of non hardshell harnesses.

The answer to your question is yes the webbing is fully removable and replaceable. As is everything on the harness. It a modular system.

I have a couple of niggles with the harness. The smaller lower webbing strap is no quite long enough when putting the harness on/off. That means it sometimes pops out of the strap and needs to be re-threaded though.
The harness slowly loosens over time. It's pretty dam slow. But after a powered 3 hours it's looser than when I started. And the most annoying niggle. The female Velcro is not sticky enough. Powered sessions see the Velcro strap tearing apart and flapping around. Since the harness is hard shell it doesn't matter if the straps flap. The harness still works. But it just looks silly.

Cheers Plum.

I'm currently using an ION Team Wave, has a 'carbon' back plate, but doesn't wrap around the sides. It's the best waist harness I've tried (I've not had many).
I do not like to use it when I'm TT'ing due to getting the squeeze on the ribs. I go back to my shorts harness for boosting fun.
The ION loosens off until it's been wet through for a while, then I can tighten it up. It rides up until I can get it tight. So I'm having to get back to shore to cinch it up a couple of times.
It's a good harness for the surfboard, because I'm not jumping and seems to fit my back well. SO am looking at their new offerings of wave harness.
But a harness you can replace the webbing is a very good positive in my book.

I've been curious at the other hard shell harness' but I'm not a fan of the prices if it doesn't suit me. It's all well and good trying one on in a shop, but the true test is a couple of sessions.

Yeah, Buying before trying is a lottery. Particularly with harnesses, If you can get a demo locally that would be cool.

I've done a few powered boosting sessions lately. 25-28 knots on the 10m edge. several 30+ knots on the 8 catalyst. Also some stupid as 4m 40-50knot sessions too.

The xtc harness distributes the load and makes holding power easy. I would normally have to call it quits after an hour or so on the mystic warrior harness, with this no its all on for a long as I like.

The harness does ride up. but its easy to slide back down by flying the kite low. Jay also do harness short straps. if you don't like the harness riding up. I go a pair free with the intro offer. But they are too small.... bummer.

Decided to get rid of the LFR, it came off too easily when kite was floating / drifting. Picked up a fireball bar and back to original rings (shackle did not fit the fireball release). I think that's as close as a bar can get and with plenty of bar throw with the trimlite setup. I think I would have taken off 10-15cm off from C/L and hook.

Hey guys, anyone used the new 2018 Ion CS Wave harness (with Ion rope slider) & could share there thoughts please .

For those liking Core bar: slingshot talon can be adapted in 10 min with vise grips.
Tested in 25knots, worked fine (disclaimer, I tried once only)

No LFR needed no pullies, no bungies to re centre release and clip around rope slider clean and simple. There are several brands offering this option now.

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horey69 said..
No LFR needed no pullies, no bungies to re centre release and clip around rope slider clean and simple. There are several brands offering this option now.

Hi Horey, now that you have used yours a while - can you compare to a LFR on how smooth the sliding action is (lack of friction) & rope wear please ?

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toppleover said..
Nice work Leigh, found this pic & thought it looked pretty neat.

@ Blettie, pm me if you want to build one similar to mine mate.

Looks really pretty.
May be a naive question, but does this work without the Antal ring? Only the chicken loop attached to the line.