Select to expand quote

Mr Milk said..
Last time I checked, bricks were all pretty much the same size, so take about the same amount of energy to pick up, butter up and lay on a wall. That's basic physics.

Not the case sorry Mr Milk, if you read my post you would see that I referred to the size of the person not the brick. And unfortunately your way off, it's thermo dynamics at play here and not physics.

The amount of energy expended per task (same task) will vary from one individual to another and in some cases double the energy expended. For instance, I now weigh approx 78kgs and am sitting at about 20% body fat. 3 years ago I was 78kgs and 8% body fat. My expenditure 3 years ago for the same task was about 10% more as I had more muscle mass which burns more energy with every muscle movement.

Therefore, even as I sit on my couch at this very moment typing,I am burning less energy than I did 3 years ago due to my weight distribution (fat, muscle, bone etc).... it's interesting stuff.

Now I am not making excuses for people, but the mere connotation that one needs to make an excuse is a unhealthy attitude in itself.

Some cultures and traditions actually view heavier people as the ideal weight and more attractive. As fat is a sign of health and wealth.

However in the west, this is not the case, people are shamed for being perceived as fat and anorexia is the "in thing" for most models.

Have a look at the hash tag #thinspiration for a good look at some of the side effects of Fat Shaming.

Thanks for the friendly banter, hope you've learnt something

I did learn something today, but it was really just confirmation of a suspicion about the degradation of fish oil supplements. And, you're right, it's not oxidation, it's photolytic reduction. That's thermodynamics, I might say, since there is certainly a change in entropy involved.

Anyway, stud, have you got the before photo's that show you when you were as skinny as a pro cyclist? How many holes bigger has your belt gone?

Select to expand quote

Mr Milk said..
I did learn something today, but it was really just confirmation of a suspicion about the degradation of fish oil supplements. And, you're right, it's not oxidation, it's photolytic reduction. That's thermodynamics, I might say, since there is certainly a change in entropy involved.

Anyway, stud, have you got the before photo's that show you when you were as skinny as a pro cyclist? How many holes bigger has your belt gone?

Aww don't get me started on snake oil and shonky supplements... That's yet another subject I will have a rant over.

And to answer your questions, I have a few before and afters and one extra belt notch in 3 years.

Select to expand quote

Ted the Kiwi said..
Poor form or ok ?

What exactly is "fat shaming"?
If it is telling a fat person, you ought to be ashamed of yourself you fat pig, then that is poor form and not ok.
If it is acknowledging that obesity is a real danger to a fat person's health and encouraging them either directly or otherwise to eat better and move more, then yes, it's ok.
Whether they're crap lifestylers or genuine medical cases, they need help.

Normalising it and celebrating it is just ****ing weird. If you like your or her flabby, cellulitey ass, ankles and arm flaps, fine, but don't expect me or anyone else to like it. Common sense should never have become an old fashioned trait...

Select to expand quote

Mr Milk said..
I did learn something today, but it was really just confirmation of a suspicion about the degradation of fish oil supplements. And, you're right, it's not oxidation, it's photolytic reduction. That's thermodynamics, I might say, since there is certainly a change in entropy involved.

What? Where is fish oil mentioned? or photolytic reduction whatever that is?

Select to expand quote

petermac33 said..
6kg in the last 10 years,now 71kg.

Best advice to lose weight - don't shop at supermarkets!

Smorgasboard for the most part of poison.

And stay away from KFC,Maccas.Hungry Jacks etc.

No tin food,cheese,milk,cakes,white bread or rice. And definitely no margarine.

Its a 'secret' how 'they' are able to solidify veggie oil in to that.

I should add no chocolate too. FK me drunk,might as well be dead.

I do my shopping at Coles every week. Pretty much buy the same stuff every week.
Typically I eat a lot of rye bread, eggs, cheese, olives, silverside, lamb, dark chocolate, millk, yogurt, fruit, and nuts..
Usually a few beers most days as well. I look and feel pretty healthy..

I always try to buy the best quality stuff with the least amount of chemicals. I'm happy to keep using my 6 year old iPhone but I will never skimp on food.. Cheap, processed food will make you sick eventually if you eat it on a regular basis.

You can buy decent food at supermarkets. If you read the labels you can for the most part avoid eating things that will make you sick. Doesn't matter how careful you are anyway.. You're still going to get old and die.. Might as well enjoy eating..

Select to expand quote

Mr Milk said..
I did learn something today, but it was really just confirmation of a suspicion about the degradation of fish oil supplements. And, you're right, it's not oxidation, it's photolytic reduction. That's thermodynamics, I might say, since there is certainly a change in entropy involved.

Anyway, stud, have you got the before photo's that show you when you were as skinny as a pro cyclist? How many holes bigger has your belt gone?

Did someone find google?

The difference between the knowledge in this post and your previous post is astounding.
Dont try and come across as knowing what cheaterfive is taking about. You obviously didn't until you did a crash research session.

He knows what's up.

Sorry, Little Fella. I learned all that stuff when Sergei Brin was in primary school.

And it wasn't me who started using the big words, it was CheaterFive. "thermo dynamics not physics" Silly me thought that thermodynamics is just a subset of physics dealing with heat transfer in the universe.

I admit the crash research. I was half listening to the Health Report on RN, and some guy was weighing in on the recent minor controversy among nutrition neurotics about the poor quality of fish oil found in supplements by which he claimed to prove that the fish oil doesn't go off. What he had been doing was bubble O2 through fish oil and see if it oxidised.
Shock, Horror! there was no reaction........ Maybe he should have added a spark, 'cos that's what it takes to get petrol to oxidise in the presence of O2.

Anyway, I thought, what a 'tard. Fish oils contain unsaturated fatty acids, possibly conjugated, 'though I can't be bothered checking their structures. Those double bonds can be turned into single bonds in the presence of water by the action of light. That's photolysis. So I did use Google, as originally devised by Larry Page and Sergei Brin, to check the hypothesis that the fish oil isn't going off because it is being oxidised, but rather that it is being photolytically reduced. I rapidly found a research paper that said just that. And just like POTUS, since I had seen something that confirmed my belief, I shouted it out to the world.

Any more big words that you would like to use?

Get back to nature or as close to it as you can from your urban lifestyle.


www.sott.net/article/345622-Proof-modern-life-really-does-kill-as-remote-Amazon-tribe-have-healthiest-arteries-ever-studied

Select to expand quote

petermac33 said..
Get back to nature or as close to it as you can from your urban lifestyle.


www.sott.net/article/345622-Proof-modern-life-really-does-kill-as-remote-Amazon-tribe-have-healthiest-arteries-ever-studied

LOL and what's their life expectancy?

Select to expand quote

AUS1111 said..


LOL and what's their life expectancy?

"They measured their risk of heart disease by taking CT scans of the hearts of 705 adults, aged 40 to 94"

"They discovered, almost nine in 10 of the Tsimane people (85 per cent) had no risk of heart disease, and only three per cent had moderate or high risk.

That continued into old age, where almost two-thirds (65 per cent) of those aged over 75 had almost no risk. The results are the lowest reported levels of vascular ageing of any population recorded to date. "

That is lifted from the article.
It's a common misunderstanding that lower life expectancy at birth means that life spans are short. What it usually means is that infant mortality is high. People who survive to adulthood have normal length lives.

It doesn't matter how you cut, slice and dice it, obesity is a real problem for the developed and developing worlds. Sure, cut the obese folks some slacks as some of them just couldn't help it due to all kinds of reasons. However, such problem, now classes as a "disease", is not something we should ignore, or provide excuses.

I read an article today on the ABC site about the elevated risk of cancer to obese people. Apparently excess fat can cause inflammation of body tissues. And inflammations may eventually lead to cancer. The risk is 8.5% as oppose to smoking at 10.5%.

So my take is this...The facts are out there. it is entirely up to you to ignore them or do something about it. No point in arguing about who is right, or more knowledgeable about some obscure facts.

I've just been to the local primary school on business at out time. There be a whole lot of mums/dads who are well insulated.It seems the kids very much follow suit.

I won't blame genetics.
I will point at lifestyle choices/habits.


Honestly, some of the prepubescent rotundity...!

Select to expand quote

Buster fin said..
I've just been to the local primary school on business at out time. There be a whole lot of mums/dads who are well insulated.It seems the kids very much follow suit.

I won't blame genetics.
I will point at lifestyle choices/habits.


Honestly, some of the prepubescent rotundity...!

It was interesting driving across my hometown at school let out time...you could spot the poor areas by how fat the families were.

Select to expand quote

Kamikuza said..

Buster fin said..
I've just been to the local primary school on business at out time. There be a whole lot of mums/dads who are well insulated.It seems the kids very much follow suit.

I won't blame genetics.
I will point at lifestyle choices/habits.


Honestly, some of the prepubescent rotundity...!

It was interesting driving across my hometown at school let out time...you could spot the poor areas by how fat the families were.

It is interesting in that it is cheap to eat junk food and comparatively expensive to eat good healthy food. That said, I grew up in a family without much money and none of us were fat, so its not set in stone. You can eat healthily even on a budget.

Select to expand quote

FormulaNova said..

Kamikuza said..

Buster fin said..
I've just been to the local primary school on business at out time. There be a whole lot of mums/dads who are well insulated.It seems the kids very much follow suit.

I won't blame genetics.
I will point at lifestyle choices/habits.


Honestly, some of the prepubescent rotundity...!

It was interesting driving across my hometown at school let out time...you could spot the poor areas by how fat the families were.

It is interesting in that it is cheap to eat junk food and comparatively expensive to eat good healthy food. That said, I grew up in a family without much money and none of us were fat, so its not set in stone. You can eat healthily even on a budget.

Education is another factor--some people simply don't know how to do that.

I'm often amused by people who think their families were "low income"... When they're actually fairly well off and hadn't explained actual poverty.

Select to expand quote

petermac33 said..
Get back to nature or as close to it as you can from your urban lifestyle.


www.sott.net/article/345622-Proof-modern-life-really-does-kill-as-remote-Amazon-tribe-have-healthiest-arteries-ever-studied

Quote from article
"
They live a subsistence lifestyle that involves hunting, gathering, fishing and farming, where men spend an average of six to seven hours of their day being physically active and women spend four to six hours.

Their diet is largely carbohydrate-based (72 per cent) and includes non-processed carbs which are high in fiber such as rice, plantain, corn, nuts and fruits.

Protein constitutes 14 per cent of their diet and comes from animal meat. The diet is very low in fat with fat compromising only 14 per cent of the diet - equivalent to an estimated 38 grams of fat each day, including 11g saturated fat and no trans fats.
"

Select to expand quote

FormulaNova said..

Kamikuza said..

Buster fin said..
I've just been to the local primary school on business at out time. There be a whole lot of mums/dads who are well insulated.It seems the kids very much follow suit.

I won't blame genetics.
I will point at lifestyle choices/habits.


Honestly, some of the prepubescent rotundity...!

It was interesting driving across my hometown at school let out time...you could spot the poor areas by how fat the families were.

It is interesting in that it is cheap to eat junk food and comparatively expensive to eat good healthy food. That said, I grew up in a family without much money and none of us were fat, so its not set in stone. You can eat healthily even on a budget.

"It is interesting in that it is cheap to eat junk food and comparatively expensive to eat good healthy food. That said, I grew up in a family without much money and none of us were fat, so its not set in stone. You can eat healthily even on a budget."

I don't know that it is expensive to eat healthy food, unless you can't be bothered to cook a bit. And you swallow the line that food has to be fresh to be nutritious. Tinned tomatoes are just as good for you as the fresh ones, although I will concede that they aren't very good in salads. Similarly, tinned or frozen fruit and veges are cheap and easy, but lack snob appeal.
What I really hate about supermarket fruit is that it is almost always picked green and sold green. No wonder nobody wants to eat it.

Select to expand quote

FormulaNova said..

It is interesting in that it is cheap to eat junk food and comparatively expensive to eat good healthy food.


Just look at the adverts on specials. Chips, softdrinks, processed foods are aplenty. But these are not "foods". are they? But people will buy them for taste, convenience, and probably lower prices.

Basically, I don't buy the "genetic" excuses. Not that many tubby folks during the old days, were there ?

Take the time to watch, could be a life saver

Select to expand quote

Mr Milk said.
"I don't know that it is expensive to eat healthy food, unless you can't be bothered to cook a bit. And you swallow the line that food has to be fresh to be nutritious. Tinned tomatoes are just as good for you as the fresh ones.

Well I'll be darned, we actually agree on something Mr Milk .

I honestly can't go past frozen veg, the Woolworths stir fry mix is actually pretty decent (and cheap as hell... leaving me with more money for new toys). And every study I have ever read confirms no nutritional benefit in organic or fresh foods.

Select to expand quote

Jupiter said..

FormulaNova said..

It is interesting in that it is cheap to eat junk food and comparatively expensive to eat good healthy food.


Just look at the adverts on specials. Chips, softdrinks, processed foods are aplenty. But these are not "foods". are they? But people will buy them for taste, convenience, and probably lower prices.

Basically, I don't buy the "genetic" excuses. Not that many tubby folks during the old days, were there ?

Right! Watch some documentaries from before the 70s, or even up to the 80s... Where are all the fat people?!

Right about the time they start using HFCS and Coke becomes a dietary staple, people start packing on the pounds...

Right.....every study you have read confirms.....

What you meant to say of course was.....every one of 'their' studies confirms.

Organic food is much healthier than frozen or tinned food - it's common sense.

Never mind the obvious BPA and other toxins that thru time will leach into the product from the container.

Select to expand quote

petermac33 said..
Right.....every study you have read confirms.....

What you meant to say of course was.....every one of 'their' studies confirms.

Organic food is much healthier than frozen or tinned food - it's common sense.

Never mind the obvious BPA and other toxins that thru time will leach into the product from the container.

You're obviously a troll...but oh well why not.

Frozen food is "healthier" because snap freezing at the time of picking locks in the vitamins and minerals.Big Organic has conned people into believing it's healthier, the most common misconception being that they don't use chemicals--they often do, and the chemicals they're allowed to use are often more toxic and at higher levels than, say, ooh I dunno--RoundUp.

The other giant organic con is "GMO" but we all know about that fallacy.FDA has ruled that BPA is safe in the low levels it occurs in foods based on HUNDREDS OF STUDIES. As always, the poison is in the dose. But like all good science, they continue to review.

FWIW non-BPA plastics (or more accurately, the replacements for BPA in the containers--BPS) is coming under fire for "toxicity" too.

But do feel free to post "your" scientific studies that contradict the mountains of evidence you're railing against

Select to expand quote

rockmagnet said..
Take the time to watch, could be a life saver

Keto style diet makes sense.

Check out Bulletproof. Yes, Asprey is a multimillionaire business man and yes it might be a pyramid scheme. But you can't deny the science.

Eat fat, lose fat.

Select to expand quote

LittleFella said..

rockmagnet said..
Take the time to watch, could be a life saver

Keto style diet makes sense.

Check out Bulletproof. Yes, Asprey is a multimillionaire business man and yes it might be a pyramid scheme. But you can't deny the science.

Eat fat, lose fat.

I don't know if that is the best advise saying eat fat and lose fat, could be a dietary disaster. Scientifically proven to be bad.
Lots of fruit and veg and water Not to much grains , adequate protein from legumes but not too much from meat and dairy . High fat diets such as Atkins diet are the worst long term or short term diet. I posted earlier about this book which has been a life changer for me. "How not to Die" by Dr Michael Gregor. It's in the library so it won't cost you.

Select to expand quote

rockmagnet said..

LittleFella said..

rockmagnet said..
Take the time to watch, could be a life saver

Keto style diet makes sense.

Check out Bulletproof. Yes, Asprey is a multimillionaire business man and yes it might be a pyramid scheme. But you can't deny the science.

Eat fat, lose fat.

I don't know if that is the best advise saying eat fat and lose fat, could be a dietary disaster. Scientifically proven to be bad.
Lots of fruit and veg and water Not to much grains , adequate protein from legumes but not too much from meat and dairy . High fat diets such as Atkins diet are the worst long term or short term diet. I posted earlier about this book which has been a life changer for me. "How not to Die" by Dr Michael Gregor. It's in the library so it won't cost you.

The right fats. Fat from animals, full cream milk, nuts and so on.

No processed carbs. Pasta and breads. Get carbs from starchy veg like sweet potatoes.

Possibly not not good for the long term. But if you are initially trying to lose weight before you start to work and put muscle on then this diet will definitely help.

Team this with IF and a decent exercise plan and the weight will fall off.

Select to expand quote

LittleFella said..

The right fats. Fat from animals, full cream milk, nuts and so on.

No processed carbs. Pasta and breads. Get carbs from starchy veg like sweet potatoes.

Possibly not not good for the long term. But if you are initially trying to lose weight before you start to work and put muscle on then this diet will definitely help.

Team this with IF and a decent exercise plan and the weight will fall off.

*************
Please cease to pretend to be a dieting guru. There is no right or wrong fat. Too much of any fat is bad.

Processed carbs? Now you believe breads and pasta have processed carbs? Bread is just flour mixed with water and yeast, and baked. How is that classed as bad carb? White bread is not very good as it contains mostly carb but most of the good stuff like fibres, vitamins in the "heart" of grains are lost through refining. So eating wholegrain bread is good because you are eating all and just about everything in a grain. How can you declare breads are bad?

People rush to vitamin supplements, believing that they will compensate for the deficiency in their diets. Don't waste money. Eat whole foods which are not too processed. The reason you may need vitamin supplements is because the foods you eat have lost most, if not all the good, original nutrients nature puts in. That is why Big-Mac and Hungry Jack and such are crap.

Losing weight is not a game of chance which you cut out this, and eat a lot of that, but it is a lifestyle. That is why those fat folks on TV crap like "The biggest Losers" put the slabs back on soon after they found fame in the silly shows.

I do agree with sensible exercise helps. And vegetables and root vegetables.

Sorry Jupiter.
I forgot that this was an open forum where people discuss things and raise points of view.