Small doownwind boards for winging

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Created by

ninjatuna > 9 months ago, 4 Jul 2023

Thatspec

443 posts

16 Jul 2023 10:30pm

The biggest benefit to the long skinny shape is easy starts/re-starts. So easy that a wing or paddle isn't even necessary for some. Just hop up and down.

I experimented the other day in light wind with my 4.5 V2 Strike, lows were 10mph or less sometimes via the wind meter archives. Board is 115L and not a super skinny, 6' 5 x 23" x 12# custom Kalama, 68cm mast (big factor), 1300cm2 Go Foil RS1300. I'm close to 90Kg all up and with a lot of pumping I could get going in 10mph. Is it fun? Meh... But on a hot day you can kill an hour or two.

AlexF

537 posts

18 Jul 2023 12:29am

Why is the 68cm short mast such a big factor? Stiffness, drag?

Taavi

417 posts

18 Jul 2023 1:21am

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omg said..

Taavi said..
Had my first sessions with the KT Ginxu Dragonfly today, Not so small - 6'9'' x 18.5'', 95 L. First session with a Sabfoil WL1350, and when the wind picked up slightly switched to a Sabfoil WR880 (starting from 02:08 in the video).

No more windless days now, always "full power" : )

Awesome! What's your weight and how do you find the board in turning and also pumping (other than it's a game changer for light winds??)

@omg You asked about turning. I have spent a few windier days on this board now, with various foils. Well...

JKick3r

6 posts

18 Jul 2023 1:33pm

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AlexF said..

- Handpaddles generate much more speed than the "real" paddle, avoiding the balance issues when standing up. But after ten minutes my shoulders where wasted.

Were you able to successfully paddle up the inflatable with hand paddles? I'm super interested in this board right now, but the only video I can find of anyone paddling this up is the Gong sponsored rider in their promo video, and you can't even see how he starts the paddle.It would be amazing to hear from a non-pro how paddle-able this inflatable is, especially compared to a rigid board. People talk about how inflatables tend to stick to the water more, but I wonder if this super narrow shape negates much of that issue and makes this a reasonably easy paddle-up.Glad it is working well for winging!

JKick3r

6 posts

18 Jul 2023 1:40pm

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UisceBeatha said..

AlexF said..
I just got my preordered Gong 7'6 inflatable (without strap option) last weekend and today they launch the strapped versions

(to be fair they come only end of august so i cover our summer strapless

)
With two sessions on the board flatwater paddling and winging my conclusions so far are:
- It took some getting used to to balance and paddle for me, even on a dead flat lake and despite being an advanced wavesupper using 130 liter SUPs (me 93 kg)
- Paddlespeed is higher than with a standard SUP, despite the mounted foil under the board
- I had no chance getting on foil with the Leviathan 1150, too less paddle speed and/or too less lift or technique (i guess i need a Levi 1550 or 1750 or try my good, old Moses 873)
- Handpaddles generate much more speed than the "real" paddle, avoiding the balance issues when standing up. But after ten minutes my shoulders where wasted.
- Winging: Lightwind gamechanger, my 5.7 Ozone Flux will be my biggest wing in future, no need for a bigger wing, since the board accelerates with the slightest pull in the wing, even using just a 102/1240 frontwing
- Balance is more sensible than the 132 liters suggest, but nevertheless starting is much easier than with my 5'1 x 24, 89 liter wingboard. With this board the wing session woud've been hard work, with the DW board it was fun.
- Maybe other brands refine the shape of their coming inflatable DW boards a little more, with some nose rocker and sharp edges at the tail using the carbon/foil plate by expanding the plate to the bevels.

But my goal is achieved, avoiding the need for a 7m or 8m wing for lightwind. Everything else is a bonus.

Same as me, the 7'6" arrived on Monday this week and have had a few wing sessions on it. It was a bit of an impulse buy. I am really interested in dw boards and would like to eventually sup downwind but the cost was putting me off. At 700 euros, sure why not.
Straps on a board like this don't interest me at all and the couple of sessions I have had I have enjoyed experimenting with foot positioning.
For lightwind winging its a win from me. I went out last night with a 4m cab mantis in 10-14knts, gusty dropping variable wind. The sort of wind I just wouldn't bother with on my regular gear for fear of a long paddle home (had a few of these in the past). Had zero issues getting flying at any stage, and that was with a 930cm foil!
There was residual wind swell which was almost glassy, was surreal riding them and was pretty impressed with it, the extra weight seems to help with momentum and it pumps decent too. Will enable a lot more water time (just don't tell my missus) !

Super interested to hear any additional feedback you have on this board as you log time with it. Namely how easy it is to paddle up on foil relative to anything else you have attempted.Hoping the inflatable "stickiness" factor is minimized by this shape, since there is so much less surface area to stick to.

I'm loving the idea of these downwind boards in general, but they are all so expensive! The Takoon definitely has the best price among rigid boards for anyone living in that region, but the $700 shipping puts in in the range of most of the other manufacturers, especially anything available for retail in the states already.

Hoping some more proof of concept footage / reviews will emerge about the paddling up qualities of this board as I contemplate a way to dip a toe into downwind without spending 2-3k

AlexF

537 posts

19 Jul 2023 12:08am

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JKick3r said..

AlexF said..

- Handpaddles generate much more speed than the "real" paddle, avoiding the balance issues when standing up. But after ten minutes my shoulders where wasted.

No, no chance for me for paddle ups so far, be it with a standard paddle or handpaddles. I guess the LEVI 1150 is too small for my 93 kgs and my noexistend technique in this category.
If the wind isn't too strong i'll be winging it tomorrow.

UisceBeatha

131 posts

19 Jul 2023 12:52am

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JKick3r said..

Super interested to hear any additional feedback you have on this board as you log time with it. Namely how easy it is to paddle up on foil relative to anything else you have attempted.Hoping the inflatable "stickiness" factor is minimized by this shape, since there is so much less surface area to stick to.

I'm loving the idea of these downwind boards in general, but they are all so expensive! The Takoon definitely has the best price among rigid boards for anyone living in that region, but the $700 shipping puts in in the range of most of the other manufacturers, especially anything available for retail in the states already.

Hoping some more proof of concept footage / reviews will emerge about the paddling up qualities of this board as I contemplate a way to dip a toe into downwind without spending 2-3k

Note that I have zero sup downwind experience so I won't really be able to provide a comparison. I do agree that it would be useful info from someone that does. That said they would likely have a board already and not buy an inflatable one!

Based on my own badgered knowledge from d internet, there may be a limitation with this board in terms of flat water paddling up. I think a massive foil would probably solve that but imo thats a cheat code. However in terms of downwinding in bumps, well folks are paddling up small boards with reasonably small foils with the right technique and conditions, as well as even hand paddling up. I think this board will work and will work well. It is 132l versus my 75kg, is 7'6" long and 21 wide, obviously rail shape makes a massive difference but its all about stability which leads to speed generation and I reckon this board has the right qualities to make that happen - all for 1/3 the cost of hard dw board. Hard to argue with that.

Sure maybe in 10-15knts downwinding it may not be ideal but from 20knts up this should get ya going.

At least thats what I was telling myself when I went for the impulse buy

omg

292 posts

19 Jul 2023 4:27am

Anyone with experience on the following; DW board with +10L over body weight (80kg with 90L board) and the board dimensions are 6'3 and 18,5", would I loose a lot of light wind capabilities due to not going for a board close to/around 7'0? I would like to have as short as possible due to short wave periords here, hence the question.

Pembs Foil Club

32 posts

19 Jul 2023 10:31pm

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omg said..
Anyone with experience on the following; DW board with +10L over body weight (80kg with 90L board) and the board dimensions are 6'3 and 18,5", would I loose a lot of light wind capabilities due to not going for a board close to/around 7'0? I would like to have as short as possible due to short wave periords here, hence the question.

I've had quick go on a Axis 90l Hybrid and the Axis 120l DW. The 120 goes in ridiculously light wind, 1300 foil 6m 90kg 8 knots maybe less if you've got the technique. It felt very long though

It was windy when i used the 90L ART 999 so harder to tell, it definitely got going sooner than my 75l Sky wing but to what extent I don't know.. It did feel small/lack of swing weight under foot which would be a benefit over a traditional 90L..

AlexF

537 posts

21 Jul 2023 8:16pm

Some more impressions from another wing session with the Cruzader Hipe 7'6 and Ozone Flux 5.7 (other guys on 6.5 to 7.5 wings)
First with moderate winds, and in the end with really light winds.
I did use a Slingshot Phantasm with 82 mast, first with the PTM 926 frontwing (1230sqcm), for the light winds i changed to the SAB Leviathan 1150.
The Slingshot has 2 degree build-in rake, and i used an additonal 2 degree shimplate because the board has a complete flat rocker.
The 4 degree rake in total felt really good, freeing up the nose and reducing nose touchdowns. The takeoffs also felt like the foil popup is smoothed out a little since the frontwing has less AoA when the board is kicked up while pumping.
The Levi 1150 is a lightwind monster, i guess 6-8 knot gusts were enough the get me going fast enough to lift the board up and once flying the 1150 behaved well. Coming from small frontwings i'd to adjust my footpressure in turns slightly , the big wing doesn't like to be railed too hard so a smooth arc was mandatory.
These DWboards + big frontwings are a real gamechanger in light winds , esp. for heavier guys (me 92 kgs) that don't want to use big wings (my biggest is 5.7)

slowmotion160

31 posts

27 Aug 2023 9:53pm

Curious if anyone has anymore insights on these downwind boards for light-wind winging? Is longer than 7' necessarily better for winging or does there get to a point where the downsides of length (maneuverability) outweighs the benefits (ie speed for takeoff)? Is 18" or 19" wide significantly better than 22" wide?

PointOmega

13 posts

28 Aug 2023 2:02am

I weigh 85kg, now riding the 96l Armstrong DW exclusively from 10-25kts. 6'8 and 19.5" wide. 75l Armstrong FG has only been used once this season. More than big enough, could probably get away with an 85l without losing the early takeoff. Next up is a 17" by 5'5.

PointOmega

13 posts

28 Aug 2023 2:02am

leepasty

424 posts

28 Aug 2023 3:00am

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PointOmega said..
I weigh 85kg, now riding the 96l Armstrong DW exclusively from 10-25kts. 6'8 and 19.5" wide. 75l Armstrong FG has only been used once this season. More than big enough, could probably get away with an 85l without losing the early takeoff. Next up is a 17" by 5'5.

Let us know how the 5'5 x 17 goes. How many litres is that around 60?
cheers

PointOmega

13 posts

28 Aug 2023 6:34am

75 liters! Expect to receive it in the next couple of weeks and will report back..shape is basically a mini barracuda with a foot of tail chopped off.

BigZ

190 posts

28 Aug 2023 8:09am

I am 92kg and ride 6'2x20x90l Jimmy Lewis custom. A game changer for light wind Wing Foiling for a heavyweight.

Ciki62

17 posts

28 Aug 2023 3:17pm

I like starboard concept of X 15class. x-15class.com

randomfoiler

108 posts

28 Aug 2023 10:58pm

@75kg I went for 6.6x18 and 88L .. that was after trying a 7x19 100L
I summarized here:
www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Stand-Up-Paddle/Foiling/Ginxu-dragonfly-downwind-board?page=2#2834053

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