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Francone said..

Francone said..
Hi
I am envisaging to buy a wing ( Duotone or other). For the moment I'd use it on a Bic Sup, without a foil, to have fun in light winds, as an alternative to paddling or windsurfing . Among other things, the advantage is that I don't have to go through the hassle of rigging and tuning the sail.. A wing is ready to go ! Eventually, though, I will buy a foil.

Whether eventually I buy a foil or not, I'll probably replace my 12 ft windsup with a smaller and shorter board as soon as I get a hang on using a wing. Probably a 135-145 lt volume .,
I'd like to know :

1 Can older, non dedicated boards be used for foiling, with a Deep Tuttle finbox?
Due to the wing and foil craze, the prices of dedicated foil boards are getting crazy, as sellers no doubt take advantage of this new hype to jack up their prices.I have seen packages over $ 3000 ! Why not an older Deep Tuttle board?

2. What board( even an older one) , is recommended for maximum stability when using a wing ?( No foil) Formula boards?

I have been doing some balance training on my SUP, trying to get on an off like I would do with a wing..
The width is about 85 cm in the middle , which is fine, except that it tapers considerably in the back, which makes it still wobbly without a mast and wishbone to hold on, even though the centerboard helps
I have seen people doing winGsurfing or wingfoiling on boards that are not only wide, but don't taper off as much in the rear. They seem to have practically the same width all along, which should make them very stable.
Any comments suggestions?

Thanks

Francone

Thanks for the input DSpace

I gather you are using a foil. I won't, as yet. I'll just use the wing on my.... LLLONG SUP, without a foil. . I am looking at the 5 m Duotone wing (the previous model, though) for more traction. Will it work in light winds( 12-15 knts) without a foil ?
If it works, I'll buy a shorter board , preferably an older non-dedicated board. I can find one for $ 400-500, which is a far cry for the $ 1000 + dedicated boards...Will the finbox be strong enough if eventually I want to put a foil on it? .

Thanks

Francone

Francone

get a saw. Cut the front 6" off your sup and you have a wind foil board ready to go.

Wondered how heavy the Echo is compared to the Fone (lightest I think). The Swing 5m is 2kg, what's is the Echo 5m?

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IanInca said..
Wondered how heavy the Echo is compared to the Fone (lightest I think). The Swing 5m is 2kg, what's is the Echo 5m?

Echo 5m is 1.9 kg plus boom weight.

This video includes reviews of the new Duotone Echo 6M, Slingwing V2 5.4M, new wingfoiler prototype, and Skymount:

Great video Robert , I'll have try the no hand gybe .

Great video Robert , I'll have try the no hand gybe .

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knatti said..
@Francone
Last year I did the same - 5m Duotone + ISUP
You should be fine with your SUP you just need a daggerboard or driftstopper (more here www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Stand-Up-Paddle/Foiling/Windwing-on-a-longboard)

But since I have my 2020 7m Duotone + Foilboard I haven't used the 5m anymore (wind on lake here mostly between 10 and 18 kts)

Glad to hear this. Will a 4.25 wing work, though? The 5 m. Duotone is hard to come by here in Canada, because of a protracted b/o situation with all the local dealers. I could buy a Slingshot, though, but their max size is 4.25 m. It is also cheaper. Will it be sufficient for light winds?

THanks

Francone

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Francone said..

knatti said..
@Francone
Last year I did the same - 5m Duotone + ISUP
You should be fine with your SUP you just need a daggerboard or driftstopper (more here www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Stand-Up-Paddle/Foiling/Windwing-on-a-longboard)

But since I have my 2020 7m Duotone + Foilboard I haven't used the 5m anymore (wind on lake here mostly between 10 and 18 kts)

Glad to hear this. Will a 4.25 wing work, though? The 5 m. Duotone is hard to come by here in Canada, because of a protracted b/o situation with all the local dealers. I could buy a Slingshot, though, but their max size is 4.25 m. It is also cheaper. Will it be sufficient for light winds?

THanks

Francone

Slingwing v2 goes up to 6.25m. Do not buy a v1 they are crap.

The boom stiffness with this upgrade.....stiffer than the old boom. Stiffer than the new boom in the short body. A hair less stiff than the new boom in the long body.

Dealers should be screaming for this upgrade from the factory ;D ;D

Great work DWF. I have been running an old broken paddle which I gripped and put a starboard adjustable paddle end on for 12 month now. Super light and has not broken. But admittedly i am riding a small sup without foot-straps so dunno how it would go with a strapped board and jumping.

The big problem with the duotone v1 was that it flapped around when holding it neutral Position on a wave.
does the V2 echo solve this? Does anyone have first hand experience?

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Yuppy said..
The big problem with the duotone v1 was that it flapped around when holding it neutral Position on a wave.
does the V2 echo solve this? Does anyone have first hand experience?

I've used the Duotone v1 and v2. v1 sucked holding by the front handle... pretty much useless unless in very light wind. v2 (Echo) is much better in this regard but also not as free/stable as other popular center strut wings. that said, i hooked up a Coast Guard pilot boat wake and held the front handle on my Echo 4m for about a mile and it flipped over after 3/4 mile.... then the rest of the time i rode with the wing upside down with zero consequence... the ending crash was the same.

there was a video by Nik Baker riding the Echo and showing how much better it flags... even just holding onto the leash. my experience is that it is not quite as stable as Nik's experience on video... maybe i'm doing something wrong.

New Echo has quite a bit more tension on the trailing edge... so much so that you cannot reliably adjust the outhaul tension/boom length in the water (or on the land for that matter with the wing inflated). That said, the wind range of the Echo is much greater that I don't really feel a need to tune the outhaul. The wing backwinding violently OP'd is a thing of the past.

Now, they need to release a super light carbon boom with a smaller diameter... that would really round out the package. This big diameter aluminum boom feels kind of archaic and a downside to a high end product.

I might also add some PU tubing to the draft control rope as I sometimes grab it accidentally and it's not that friendly on the hands.

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sunsetsailboards said..

Yuppy said..
The big problem with the duotone v1 was that it flapped around when holding it neutral Position on a wave.
does the V2 echo solve this? Does anyone have first hand experience?

I've used the Duotone v1 and v2. v1 sucked holding by the front handle... pretty much useless unless in very light wind. v2 (Echo) is much better in this regard but also not as free/stable as other popular center strut wings. that said, i hooked up a Coast Guard pilot boat wake and held the front handle on my Echo 4m for about a mile and it flipped over after 3/4 mile.... then the rest of the time i rode with the wing upside down with zero consequence... the ending crash was the same. The original foil wing would have started oscillating and become uncontrollable after 5 or 10 seconds.

there was a video by Nik Baker riding the Echo and showing how much better it flags... even just holding onto the leash. my experience is that it is not quite as stable as Nik's experience on video... maybe i'm doing something wrong.

New Echo has quite a bit more tension on the trailing edge... so much so that you cannot reliably adjust the outhaul tension/boom length in the water (or on the land for that matter with the wing inflated). That said, the wind range of the Echo is much greater that I don't really feel a need to tune the outhaul. The wing backwinding violently OP'd is a thing of the past.

Now, they need to release a super light carbon boom with a smaller diameter... that would really round out the package. This big diameter aluminum boom feels kind of archaic and a downside to a high end product.

I might also add some PU tubing to the draft control rope as I sometimes grab it accidentally and it's not that friendly on the hands.

I think it flies off the nose handle as stable, as all the best wings on the market. A big bonus with the boom, is the alternate hand position of reaching under, and wrapping your hand on the boom front end fitting.

Where it still acts weird, is when you crash and let it flag out fully until the end of leash goes tight. It always flips upside down and lands on the water back up. Then you have to flip it to start again. So less kook crashing and you're good.

The carbon tube I used is a smaller diameter grip. Feels great.

I picked up a new 7m Echo today and I am quite surprised at how small the plastic boom plate is compared to the leading edge. It essentially indents and warps the leading edge.

If I did not know better, I would say they had a surplus of the small ones left over from V1 days and have used them on the 6m and 7m.

Because I think I will puncture the leading edge I have added a small loop to lower connection point.





I will pull it down just a little more.

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bigtone667 said..
I picked up a new 7m Echo today and I am quite surprised at how small the plastic boom plate is compared to the leading edge. It essentially indents and warps the leading edge.

If I did not know better, I would say they had a surplus of the small ones left over from V1 days and have used them on the 6m and 7m.

Because I think I will puncture the leading edge I have added a small loop to lower connection point.





I will pull it down just a little more.

I am surprised you had any strength left to post after pumping that monster up.??

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warwickl said..

bigtone667 said..
I picked up a new 7m Echo today and I am quite surprised at how small the plastic boom plate is compared to the leading edge. It essentially indents and warps the leading edge.

If I did not know better, I would say they had a surplus of the small ones left over from V1 days and have used them on the 6m and 7m.

Because I think I will puncture the leading edge I have added a small loop to lower connection point.





I will pull it down just a little more.

I am surprised you had any strength left to post after pumping that monster up.??

It pumps up quite easily compared to the WASP 6m!!!

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bigtone667 said..

warwickl said..

bigtone667 said..
I picked up a new 7m Echo today and I am quite surprised at how small the plastic boom plate is compared to the leading edge. It essentially indents and warps the leading edge.

If I did not know better, I would say they had a surplus of the small ones left over from V1 days and have used them on the 6m and 7m.

Because I think I will puncture the leading edge I have added a small loop to lower connection point.





I will pull it down just a little more.

I am surprised you had any strength left to post after pumping that monster up.??

It pumps up quite easily compared to the WASP 6m!!!

Oh, used your electric pump

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warwickl said..

I am surprised you had any strength left to post after pumping that monster up.??

A pleasant surprise when I got my Echo, is they inflate FASTER than any wing on the market. NO CENTER STRUT

They deflate faster than any other wing too

I stopped using my electric pump. Don't need it with the Echo.

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bigtone667 said..
I picked up a new 7m Echo today and I am quite surprised at how small the plastic boom plate is compared to the leading edge. It essentially indents and warps the leading edge.

If I did not know better, I would say they had a surplus of the small ones left over from V1 days and have used them on the 6m and 7m.

Because I think I will puncture the leading edge I have added a small loop to lower connection point.





I will pull it down just a little more.

Funny thing is, even the 4m has the same dent. The dent locks the boom in better.

It is such crap design. Really a company as big as Duotone/Fanatic should do way better.

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hilly said..
It is such crap design. Really a company as big as Duotone/Fanatic should do way better.

Booooooo

www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,36236.msg417760.html#new

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hilly said..
It is such crap design. Really a company as big as Duotone/Fanatic should do way better.

Overall, it's a cracker of a wing. I just have a concern about connection on the 7m.

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bigtone667 said..

hilly said..
It is such crap design. Really a company as big as Duotone/Fanatic should do way better.

Overall, it's a cracker of a wing. I just have a concern about connection on the 7m.

Good wing my issue is with the boom connection. Heaps of issues here with V1 and I don't think they have resolved the durability in V2. lots of people making homemade carbon booms too www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,35778.60.html

When will the V3 be released, sounds like it will be great

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AUS 808 said..
When will the V3 be released, sounds like it will be great

That is funny

OK so you are sitting around a Duotone planning meeting discussing V2 and your advantage is you have a solid boom so infinite adjustment of hands. So let's propose tying some string to the boom to restrict hand movements. Head slap right there

Just thought I'd let you all know my experiences with some of the matters that have been brought up here. I have been using the 7m Echo over the last few weeks, ranging in wind from 7-19 knots. I'm 83kg and for me the sweet spot is 10-14 knots. Much over 16 knots it gets a bit of a handful but is still useable up to 18 knots, definitely maxing out at 20, but it goes without saying that I'd change to my 5m when the wind is consistently over 15 knots.
When I first pumped it up and saw how much the curved plastic end of the boom presses into the leading edge I emailed the UK Duotone rep to ask about it and he said it was designed like that to prevent the boom from twisting, and that it has been reinforced so should not cause any damage. I've been monitoring the stitching either side of the curved boom connection and so far nothing has deteriorated.
The depower/tension line has never got in my way, and I never look at the boom when I'm reaching for the boom. I have never felt the need to hold the boom past where the line loops onto the boom- there is no grip on that part anyway as it is the sliding/retractable extension.
The boom is one of the best features of the Duotone for me - being able to grab the boom ANYWHERE without even thinking about it makes transitions so much easier and more fluid, as well as sliding my hands along the boom to adjust the angle of flight - this is especially useful when holding it with one hand which is crazy easy and makes downwinding in super light winds soooo much easier and more fun as you can keep the wing on the edge of the power and then easily adjust it to give you just that bit of power to move you to the next lump whenever you need.
Love the posts about making your own carbon boom. Might have to try that myself!!!!!

Does anyone go above 6 psi?
I pumped my 4m up for the first time in my lounge room and realised my Naish pump starts measuring at 7 psi. I filled it below 7 psi to what I thought might have been 6 psi but observed the wing was incredibly hard and completely rigid. I have never owned a kite or wing so not sure how to tell there is too much inflation...

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owain said..
Does anyone go above 6 psi?
I pumped my 4m up for the first time in my lounge room and realised my Naish pump starts measuring at 7 psi. I filled it below 7 psi to what I thought might have been 6 psi but observed the wing was incredibly hard and completely rigid. I have never owned a kite or wing so not sure how to tell there is too much inflation...

Hi Owain,
We'll have the Duotone pumps back in stock in a few weeks and will swap for you but until then the I on the PSI print is about 6 psi on that gauge. Drop me a line in store tomorrow and I'll explain further or send through a pic to show. Sam.

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WINDSURFnSNOW said..

owain said..
Does anyone go above 6 psi?
I pumped my 4m up for the first time in my lounge room and realised my Naish pump starts measuring at 7 psi. I filled it below 7 psi to what I thought might have been 6 psi but observed the wing was incredibly hard and completely rigid. I have never owned a kite or wing so not sure how to tell there is too much inflation...

Hi Owain,
We'll have the Duotone pumps back in stock in a few weeks and will swap for you but until then the I on the PSI print is about 6 psi on that gauge. Drop me a line in store tomorrow and I'll explain further or send through a pic to show. Sam.

Awesome, cheers Sam.