I thought that I would be a good idea to set myself a goal to work towards. So I decided that A Melbourne to Rye cruise would be a good trip on a N NW wind.

Now I have only been windsurfing about 3 months so this is quite ambitious for me, but I feel that without some goals to work towards I cant progress.

Now I have set a deadline. The Anzac Day weekend. 2 months away.

I have also managed to (almost) convince 3 other fools to join me!

Has anyone undertaken such a trip? Got any advice? Hazards?

I was considering a rest stop at Frankston would be a good idea. Maybe Lunch and a Beer?

Open invitation to those that would like to join us, I'll post more updates on our progress in the weeks to come.

Hope you can sail upwind well

Not a bad idea - but would be very tough in a S SW wind I would have thought a Westerly might be a bit more favourable....

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Rox said...

Hope you can sail upwind well

On N NW it would be all down wind to Rye... wouldn't it?

Coming back via car.

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jermaldan said...

Rox said...

Hope you can sail upwind well

On N NW it would be all down wind to Rye... wouldn't it?

Coming back via car.

yeah N - NW would be downwind but your post originally said S SW - cheeky!

I reckon you'd want a W or WNW to make it a nice easy reach - sailing downwind is almost as hard as upwind - although I guess if you could at least change tacks to give the muscles a rest if it was NW

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FletcHuz said...

jermaldan said...

Rox said...

Hope you can sail upwind well

On N NW it would be all down wind to Rye... wouldn't it?

Coming back via car.

yeah N - NW would be downwind but your post originally said S SW - cheeky!
M
I reckon you'd want a W or WNW to make it a nice easy reach - sailing downwind is almost as hard as upwind - although I guess if you could at least change tacks to give the muscles a rest if it was NW

What you talkin' 'bout Willis? ;)

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jermaldan said...

FletcHuz said...

jermaldan said...

Rox said...

Hope you can sail upwind well

On N NW it would be all down wind to Rye... wouldn't it?

Coming back via car.

yeah N - NW would be downwind but your post originally said S SW - cheeky!
M
I reckon you'd want a W or WNW to make it a nice easy reach - sailing downwind is almost as hard as upwind - although I guess if you could at least change tacks to give the muscles a rest if it was NW

What you talkin' 'bout Willis? ;)

And here I was thinking I was hallucinating from too much coffee and a suspect Chinese lunch

Good luck and don't hit the Fort on the way down...probably your only obstacle

Huge undertaking but a great goal. Northerlies do create some serious swell at times from Frankston to Rye. I agree a westerly may be easier. Perhaps trial some trips half way.

Most I've done is Mornington to Mt.martha then up to Frankston and back to Mornington. This was in a SE offshore breeze on a formula board tho so the water was quite flat. Back was getting a little achy but fairly comfortable.

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jermaldan said...

FletcHuz said...

jermaldan said...

Rox said...

Hope you can sail upwind well

On N NW it would be all down wind to Rye... wouldn't it?

Coming back via car.

yeah N - NW would be downwind but your post originally said S SW - cheeky!
M
I reckon you'd want a W or WNW to make it a nice easy reach - sailing downwind is almost as hard as upwind - although I guess if you could at least change tacks to give the muscles a rest if it was NW

What you talkin' 'bout Willis? ;)

Old skool - not heard that for years. He's in the slammer now for drink/drug related offences and pimpin his mum (allegedly). He'd need a very small sailboard.

I reckon it's a great idea. Pretty easy too under the right conditions. If it's a comfortable reach it could be a pretty lazy exercise really. Several have talked about this before and the consensus was that a backup boat would be a good idea. I've had too many booms break without warning to be comfortable unless I could paddle/limp back to land. Alternatively an EPIRB and a mobile phone might be good. Doing it with several others is also a very good idea. If I didn't have kids would throw caution to the wind and do it any old way, but being a father of two changes things.

Has anyone seen that documentary from the 80's about the trio that sailboarded around Tasmania? It pops up after midnight sometimes and is a good laugh. And does anyone recall the stories of Nick Maloney (the fella who crossed Bass Strait on a Mistral One Design, sailed solo round the world, etc) sailing back and forth to Falkner Beacon several times in the moonlight?

Maybe there should be an annual Port Phillip Bay sailboard expedition. A good long slog to make you feel alive. Or we could just do long coast hugging downwinders like the kiteboarders...

Ending the alcohol induced ramble now.

Plan it pretty well. You would need an eperb and boat support on hand and waterproof mobile phone cover.

Make sure you look at a camelback.

Make sure you take fluid, great wetsuitm shark repellent and lifejacket.

Have seen people do it and spoken to others. The bay is one of the most unpredicatble waters and i would suggets that you get even a few years of sailing onboard before you trial this. 3 months of sailing experince is probably not enough unless sialing all day everyday and you can sail in any winds that the bay has to offer.

Dont want to burst any bubbles of excitement but dont want any poor outcomes.

Something like this may take more than 2 months to plan. We are looking at swimming across heads between quarntine and queenscliff.. been planning for several years and plan to do next year.

Search for the article of the guys who sail the English channel. Sailing on one tack wonts seem so appealing.

The water police arnt the happinest chaps when saving people doing thigs like this. :)

But has anyone done it before?

I plan to stick pretty close to shore all along the way. Dependant on how we are doing pit-stop in Frankston and decide to continue or not.

Its not a race, its a cruise. So I am not planning on cutting straight accross the bay or anything or breaking any speed records along the way.

iphone with GPS and waterproof case I have. Also have the ability to track the phone from shore using instamapper software, pin pointing my location in the bay at ant point in time. The phone sends co-ords every 5 sec's to a website and plots it in googlemaps. Almost as good as a eperb?

Hydration pack I will need to get, perhaps a better PFD with compartments for flare, whistle, etc..

Anything else.

I honestly cant believe that no one has done it.

I would love it if more people get on board, and we could make a ragatta out of it. Imagine 50 sails on the way down the bay to Rye, it would be brilliant!

You'll find lots of people have done similar. They mag speak up on forum. iPhone on bay is useless for gps. Tried to use recently to find some scuba spiots. May be ok as phone. Tracking coast is extremely difficult due to howuch it bends means that not suitable to many winc directions that will enable many stops. Also spend some time on nearmaps.com to look at coast and deadspots. Get a great idea of Tide times and directions as this will affect you on a windsurfer heaps over this distance. Advice is like fletch. Pick a solid wind consistent day 20+ knots. Cruising is not as appealing as bay blasting.

howdy,
we've done sorrento to mt martha, but like Leman it was on a SE not a NW.
Back in the old longboard days, a mate and I set off at about 10am and ran a downwinder with a rule that we stay no more than 500 metres offshore.
It was great fun, but definately a test....there's a lot of deep dark water out there (particularly off Mt Martha!)
We did the "downhill" run in a few hours but then (stupidly) decided to turn around and head back....the breeze stiffenned and we slogged for hours and hours against a sharp chop and wind between 5-30 knots. At one point my mate was ready to throw it in but we were under the cliffs past Mt Martha...and I didn't particularly want to retrieve gear from a cliff face. Eventually we made it back after dark...absolutely rooted!

Jermaldan, its a great idea and awesome challenge, but I agree with some of the comments.
There should be a bit of planning particulary with the way you intend to have support (ie boat, land based etc). It's a serious distance to try to take on, particularly if all you have experienced in the Bay previously is a short blast session in the arvo, or the flat water of Sandringham Harbour.

The other thing that you could try is sail the route in segments first, so you know what to expect. Being a local down that way, I reckon Leman would be a good bloke to chat to about what to look out for around Mornington/ Mt Martha, so maybe a session out there would be a good idea. The last thing you want is to come unstuck, so I'd suggest you build up to the full distance.
Good luck with it and we'll fly the flag for you as you pass Edithvale beach!
Mick

What you talkin about Willis!!!!

Off topic but I have a funny true story about little Mr Coleman

About 94 I was at either Detroit Airport or Chicago Airport, can't remember, returning from GM Detroit.
He,s in front of me in the check line with his 2 big Gorrila's. Gets to the desk and starts argueing. I didn't really pay much attention of what was going on. He took bloody ages though.
So I get to the desk and they say, "Sorry Mr Love we have a problem and there are no businness Class seats. We are very,very sorry .
My reply was , " He just took my seat didn't he"
It,s seems I was correct. The little "s..t" demanded a bussiness class upgrade and shafted me.
When I got to LA I found they had ugraded me to first class to Melbourne, so he did me a favour!!!! Ha Ha

I'd be looking at a NW wind on a colder day rather than a N (NE) on a hot day. The Northerly winds don't fill in as much down the southern end of the bay, you may run into sub planing conditions anywhere from Frankston onwards.

NW isn't effected by the heat and blows nice and strong in the Carrum Bight (Rickets to Frankston)

You might be able to organise different sailors along the way to join you in stints like a relay as you come through their local spots especially if you are trackable via the web.

Well I tested my waterproof iphone case and iphone from about 500m out in the bay on Sunday and it worked a gem.

GPS also worked well. I'll need to try this from around 1km out to make sure.

Next purchase - hydration pack.

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mr love said...

What you talkin about Willis!!!!

Off topic but I have a funny true story about little Mr Coleman

About 94 I was at either Detroit Airport or Chicago Airport, can't remember, returning from GM Detroit.
He,s in front of me in the check line with his 2 big Gorrila's. Gets to the desk and starts argueing. I didn't really pay much attention of what was going on. He took bloody ages though.

Trying not to deviat too much... but the chick from that show become a p0rn star... for a little while. My 2 cents on a Monday morning - I hope everyone sleeps better in this knowledge.

I do what I can

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drift said...

howdy,
we've done sorrento to mt martha, but like Leman it was on a SE not a NW.
Back in the old longboard days, a mate and I set off at about 10am and ran a downwinder with a rule that we stay no more than 500 metres offshore.
It was great fun, but definately a test....there's a lot of deep dark water out there (particularly off Mt Martha!)
We did the "downhill" run in a few hours but then (stupidly) decided to turn around and head back....the breeze stiffenned and we slogged for hours and hours against a sharp chop and wind between 5-30 knots. At one point my mate was ready to throw it in but we were under the cliffs past Mt Martha...and I didn't particularly want to retrieve gear from a cliff face. Eventually we made it back after dark...absolutely rooted!

Jermaldan, its a great idea and awesome challenge, but I agree with some of the comments.
There should be a bit of planning particulary with the way you intend to have support (ie boat, land based etc). It's a serious distance to try to take on, particularly if all you have experienced in the Bay previously is a short blast session in the arvo, or the flat water of Sandringham Harbour.

The other thing that you could try is sail the route in segments first, so you know what to expect. Being a local down that way, I reckon Leman would be a good bloke to chat to about what to look out for around Mornington/ Mt Martha, so maybe a session out there would be a good idea. The last thing you want is to come unstuck, so I'd suggest you build up to the full distance.
Good luck with it and we'll fly the flag for you as you pass Edithvale beach!
Mick

Holy streuth Mt. Martha!!! There is about 2km of cliff faces there untill you get to safety beach.

Coming from the North I would go wide around Mt Martha and then swing in towards safety beach rather then track too close to those cliffs!

I ll have to print out an A1 version of the east side of the bay and plot a course.

Back in 1983/84 there was the Dava Marathon. Mentone Beach to Mt Martha Beach.
It was about 35km, took the faster sailors about 1 1/2 hours. All on the same port tack until we got close to shore. Wind was NNE about 15-18knots.

About 200 people participated on everything from Wally's to Waylers on to Mistral Pan-Am's and a few other raceboards, heaps of people abandoned the race and sailed into shore all along the coast causing a major headache for organisers, who did have some rescue boats and a lead boat for the sailors out in front to follow as you pretty much couldn't see Mt Martha all that well when we left Mentone.

I completed it on a Mistral Pan-Am with a 6.8m2 sail, came equal 4th with Phil Lynch (Mistral Pan-Am), not sure who won, Mike Englisch was second (Mistral Pan-Am).

35km all on one tack is pretty tiring on the body, none of the lead bunch even paused for a rest.

Your idea is doable, better on a race board or even a Formula board, where you can point high to the wind and sail deep off the wind if need be.

On a northerly the bay doesn't get that rough as you head down along the coast, but if you ran into problems/broke gear the it would be Port Philip Heads here you come.

On the otherhand a southerly might be safer, but the bay conditions would get pretty rough and slow you down, tire you out faster.

I'd prefer an accompanying boat for safety.
Anyhow just my 2 cents worth...

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jermaldan said...
Holy streuth Mt. Martha!!! There is about 2km of cliff faces there untill you get to safety beach.

Coming from the North I would go wide around Mt Martha and then swing in towards safety beach rather then track too close to those cliffs!

I ll have to print out an A1 version of the east side of the bay and plot a course.

Yep lots of cliffs along Frankston, Mt. Eliza and Mornington too.

Northerlies actually get fairly rough from Mt. Eliza and down probably because it is cross/onshore in the lower half of the bay. Conversely a straight southerly is usually very flat down here, like it was today because it is offshore, although I have noticed the southerlies will churn up the water up Sandringham way because of the way the coast bends around.

Eg. today I went off Mornington Pier with a southerly wind. 20-24 knots, glass flat water in some areas and small chop further out. In a northerly I've been pinned against the cliffs a few times when I got too close because of the aggressive shore break.

Perhaps because of the way the bay bends it may be hard to decide on an ideal wind direction not only because of problems changing directions if you follow the coastline but also because of the differing wave conditions in north and south of the bay in the same wind.

More food for thought anyway.

I get knackered sailing from williamstown to kerferd road - I couldn't imagine doing the whole bay (unless I was spotty).

Before giving it a crack I reckon maybe trying the following:

Buy yourself a Navi Gt-31 and an aquapack or similar - there should be guys on the GPS forum to help you out where to buy.
Go down to sandy point when the tides low during the day and its 20+, park your car up the dune so it doesnt float away on the high tide, chuck on the gps and sail for 8 hours straight back and forth.
see how you feel then multiply x3 because it will be rougher and you will be sailing much broader.
Checkout how far you sailed.
If that feels ok then maybe its a goer.

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latedropeddy said...

I get knackered sailing from williamstown to kerferd road - I couldn't imagine doing the whole bay (unless I was spotty).

Before giving it a crack I reckon maybe trying the following:

Buy yourself a Navi Gt-31 and an aquapack or similar - there should be guys on the GPS forum to help you out where to buy.
Go down to sandy point when the tides low during the day and its 20+, park your car up the dune so it doesnt float away on the high tide, chuck on the gps and sail for 8 hours straight back and forth.
see how you feel then multiply x3 because it will be rougher and you will be sailing much broader.
Checkout how far you sailed.
If that feels ok then maybe its a goer.

I am beginning to think that Rye may be a bit far. Not impossible, but unlikely.

Thinking that perhaps a run from Mentone to Mt Martha (before the cliffs) might be a more achievable target.

I'll probably try the Mt Martha to rye leg seperately on another day, and then piece it all togather into a complete run later in the year.

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jermaldan said...
I am beginning to think that Rye may be a bit far. Not impossible, but unlikely.

Thinking that perhaps a run from Mentone to Mt Martha (before the cliffs) might be a more achievable target.

I'll probably try the Mt Martha to rye leg seperately on another day, and then piece it all togather into a complete run later in the year.

Last winter a few were talking about doing a run from either Blairgowrie or Sorrento to South Channel island on a N-NW as that direction is pretty consistent during June-Aug. Its nice and short but would be good fun if we had a few people.

jermaldan
I have bay charts etc and you are welcome to grab them.
Let me know if you need them
Mick

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drift said...

jermaldan
I have bay charts etc and you are welcome to grab them.
Let me know if you need them
Mick

Thanks Mick, I probably will do.

Jez

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jermaldan said...

drift said...

jermaldan
I have bay charts etc and you are welcome to grab them.
Let me know if you need them
Mick

Thanks Mick, I probably will do.

Jez

Please don,t do this. On that wind your back leg will be stuffed after one hr(if your fit) your back after a few and then you,ll drift the length of the bay.A west or sw a bit more solid and steady and you can drive the board up or down wind to rest different parts of your body and if it goes wrong you,ll drift onto the shore and hopefully not be a search and rescue effort. Can you de rig your gear while in the water? Can you swim a good distance without a life jacket? Have you tried sailing one tack for more than an hr? Can you tack and jybe most times. Try Blairgowrie to Dromana on a NW first about 16km its an onshore wind or Blairgowrie to Mornington,same wind but 27km. Don,t try a goal that may kill you or place your rescuers in danger

Jermaldan

Wise words from our master Kato. The Japanese have a saying "many SMALL steps"
You are obviously keen to challenege yourself. Do the cruise in small stages and once you have achieved that, increase the legs to bigger distances and so on and so on.

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jermaldan said...


Now I have set a deadline. The Anzac Day weekend. 2 months away.
a Beer?
flipp said:
hey jermaldan dude,i have been watching the wind for the last 10 years and Anzac Day weekend we dont get much wind,it's licky to blow even 1 knot. i would plan your trip for say winter when the wind fans are switched back on.

I would have to agree with Kato and Old Salty.

Has anyone done the maths on this?
Its 80km from StKilda to Rye by car along the coastline.
If you where doing it sailing on a broad reach, that is say 5kms out and 5kms back to the coastline, you would only have covered 5kms.
That 80kms now becomes 160kms.
If you go out on a 15 to 20 knots of wind, you could do speeds of up to 20km per hours? - meaning that it will take 8 hours to complete! Thats if you are lucky, if the wind varies, which it will over that distance and time you are looking at a very long day.
Do it in winter gives more chance of a constant wind, but colder waters (11 to 13 degrees), if something goes wrong it doesnt take long for hyperthermia to set in.
I'm not saying its impossible, but you would have to be a very fit and competent sailor and know the bay very well.

maybe i missed something, but doesn't 5 + 5 = 10? those numbers don't seem to make sense to me.

and if you take a direct line from melb to rye (approx 60 km), you could probably do the run in a few hours on a reasonable day - maybe even less.