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JP Slalom vs Supersport

Created by Maddlad Maddlad  > 9 months ago, 27 May 2020
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kato
kato

kato

VIC

3513 posts

29 May 2020 10:11pm
Select to expand quote
Maddlad said..

kato said..
Cribby's slow . Try a narrower set up as you're talking about all the same issues that I had. Dropping the boom solves one problem by creating another. Remember try one change at a time



Haha well he's faster than me, so that's a good start.

When you fo your measurements from front to back straps, are you measuring from the front of the straps or from the middle where your foot goes?


Middle of back strap to back of front strap.
LeeD
LeeD

LeeD

3939 posts

30 May 2020 12:39am
Slightly smaller fin.
Maddlad
Maddlad

Maddlad

WA

925 posts

30 May 2020 7:22am
Select to expand quote
kato said..

Maddlad said..


kato said..
Cribby's slow . Try a narrower set up as you're talking about all the same issues that I had. Dropping the boom solves one problem by creating another. Remember try one change at a time




Haha well he's faster than me, so that's a good start.

When you fo your measurements from front to back straps, are you measuring from the front of the straps or from the middle where your foot goes?



Middle of back strap to back of front strap.


Ok cheers, and are you going by the middle of your middle finger or index?
Maddlad
Maddlad

Maddlad

WA

925 posts

30 May 2020 9:38am
Select to expand quote
kato said..

Maddlad said..


izaak said..



LeeD said..
Still depends if you actually have the skills and energy to ride Slalom over fast freeride.
Since a meter sail bigger is normal for slalom, and normally more, it's a handful to jibe, rig, and carry. The shorter flat off the tail requires more constant power, and the lighter weight, while accelerating well when fully powered, also SLOWS DOWN quicker with the slightest loss of sail power or momentum, mainly hurting in jibes.
This is why both are made....different skill sets.
'10 Futura and '10 Isonic 111's.
'12 JP SS 109 vs Slalom
'16 Tabou Speedster vs Manta 100 and 103.







Are we in the PWA?
Exactly what my first sentence suggests? What exactly is he wanting to get out of it... For the general sailor, as I stated, the right set up, there would be bugger all performance loss or gain. Any average sailor would notice. Both have pros and cons. Hence the original question, wanting to know how they perform/compare

So you've owned a 8-10 year old JP board SS?




Thanks for your input mate. To answer your question in a roundabout way, I race and use slalom boards, but I have issues with my front foot wanting to bounce out of the footstrap at speed which apart from being dangerous, slows me down because I'm having to fight my gear constantly. I have tried so many different ways to fix the issue, including talking directly with PWA pros and even the sailmaker of my gear and nothing seems to get rid of the problem. I have tried different brands of sail and boards, tried changing my stance etc, but still the same problem. The only board that I can ride comfortably is my Rocket, but then its not as quick as I need it to be for racing. I was wondering if the SS was a bit more like the rocket being a freerace style board, yet still quick enough for me to use it racing because im desperately searching for a way to enjoy my slalom sailing again.



I had the same issue of losing the front foot with a major brand. After trying all different set up changes I moved to a different brand that builds for normal people with a closer strap setup. My test now is this ... elbow to mid finger distance is my idea foot strap distance between the front and back straps. Then from the front strap to centre of mast track is the same measurement.
This setup Then allows me to push and dance off the fin with lots of confidence. You could make up a plate to move the front strap and narrow your stance without costing dollars that may not help.


Ok I tried to get my straps close enough to meet the elbow to mid finger distance but the closest I can get it is to the end of my fingers and that's with my back straps fully forward and the front straps fully back. I don't think I can get them far enough back to meet your measurements.
AUS 808
AUS 808

AUS 808

WA

510 posts

30 May 2020 10:54am
Select to expand quote
Maddlad said..

izaak said..


LeeD said..
Still depends if you actually have the skills and energy to ride Slalom over fast freeride.
Since a meter sail bigger is normal for slalom, and normally more, it's a handful to jibe, rig, and carry. The shorter flat off the tail requires more constant power, and the lighter weight, while accelerating well when fully powered, also SLOWS DOWN quicker with the slightest loss of sail power or momentum, mainly hurting in jibes.
This is why both are made....different skill sets.
'10 Futura and '10 Isonic 111's.
'12 JP SS 109 vs Slalom
'16 Tabou Speedster vs Manta 100 and 103.






Are we in the PWA?
Exactly what my first sentence suggests? What exactly is he wanting to get out of it... For the general sailor, as I stated, the right set up, there would be bugger all performance loss or gain. Any average sailor would notice. Both have pros and cons. Hence the original question, wanting to know how they perform/compare

So you've owned a 8-10 year old JP board SS?



Thanks for your input mate. To answer your question in a roundabout way, I race and use slalom boards, but I have issues with my front foot wanting to bounce out of the footstrap at speed which apart from being dangerous, slows me down because I'm having to fight my gear constantly. I have tried so many different ways to fix the issue, including talking directly with PWA pros and even the sailmaker of my gear and nothing seems to get rid of the problem. I have tried different brands of sail and boards, tried changing my stance etc, but still the same problem. The only board that I can ride comfortably is my Rocket, but then its not as quick as I need it to be for racing. I was wondering if the SS was a bit more like the rocket being a freerace style board, yet still quick enough for me to use it racing because im desperately searching for a way to enjoy my slalom sailing again.


Compare the settings on the Rocket with the Slalom board & try to match them.
The other thing is try & tee up with Slowy or Jesper & try some different fins.
Ask a few guys to test your set-up, Jesper, Shane or Steve Stratfold are probably a good match size wise or dare I say even Peter Mac

Remember comfortable can sometimes be faster, some guys on Slalom go slower in chop than others on Freeride.
Maybe concentrate on tuning the Rocket for the best performance.
Maddlad
Maddlad

Maddlad

WA

925 posts

30 May 2020 11:01am
Select to expand quote
AUS 808 said..


Maddlad said..



izaak said..




LeeD said..
Still depends if you actually have the skills and energy to ride Slalom over fast freeride.
Since a meter sail bigger is normal for slalom, and normally more, it's a handful to jibe, rig, and carry. The shorter flat off the tail requires more constant power, and the lighter weight, while accelerating well when fully powered, also SLOWS DOWN quicker with the slightest loss of sail power or momentum, mainly hurting in jibes.
This is why both are made....different skill sets.
'10 Futura and '10 Isonic 111's.
'12 JP SS 109 vs Slalom
'16 Tabou Speedster vs Manta 100 and 103.








Are we in the PWA?
Exactly what my first sentence suggests? What exactly is he wanting to get out of it... For the general sailor, as I stated, the right set up, there would be bugger all performance loss or gain. Any average sailor would notice. Both have pros and cons. Hence the original question, wanting to know how they perform/compare

So you've owned a 8-10 year old JP board SS?





Thanks for your input mate. To answer your question in a roundabout way, I race and use slalom boards, but I have issues with my front foot wanting to bounce out of the footstrap at speed which apart from being dangerous, slows me down because I'm having to fight my gear constantly. I have tried so many different ways to fix the issue, including talking directly with PWA pros and even the sailmaker of my gear and nothing seems to get rid of the problem. I have tried different brands of sail and boards, tried changing my stance etc, but still the same problem. The only board that I can ride comfortably is my Rocket, but then its not as quick as I need it to be for racing. I was wondering if the SS was a bit more like the rocket being a freerace style board, yet still quick enough for me to use it racing because im desperately searching for a way to enjoy my slalom sailing again.




Compare the settings on the Rocket with the Slalom board & try to match them.
The other thing is try & tee up with Slowy or Jesper & try some different fins.
Ask a few guys to test your set-up, Jesper, Shane or Steve Stratfold are probably a good match size wise or dare I say even Peter Mac

Remember comfortable can sometimes be faster, some guys on Slalom go slower in chop than others on Freeride.
Maybe concentrate on tuning the Rocket for the best performance.



Hi mate, thanks for your input. Believe it or not I have tried all of that. I have measured my rocket straps and try to match it with the slalom board and it's pretty much exactly the same. I've also had all those top guys like Jasper, Issak, snides and all guys who are good sailors try my gear and to them it all feels fine. Most of those guys are a bit heavier than me, but they're all saying the same thing that it feels okay to them. Unfortunately it doesn't help me because it doesn't feel right to me.
kato
kato

kato

VIC

3513 posts

30 May 2020 2:25pm
Select to expand quote
Maddlad said..

kato said..


Maddlad said..



izaak said..




LeeD said..
Still depends if you actually have the skills and energy to ride Slalom over fast freeride.
Since a meter sail bigger is normal for slalom, and normally more, it's a handful to jibe, rig, and carry. The shorter flat off the tail requires more constant power, and the lighter weight, while accelerating well when fully powered, also SLOWS DOWN quicker with the slightest loss of sail power or momentum, mainly hurting in jibes.
This is why both are made....different skill sets.
'10 Futura and '10 Isonic 111's.
'12 JP SS 109 vs Slalom
'16 Tabou Speedster vs Manta 100 and 103.








Are we in the PWA?
Exactly what my first sentence suggests? What exactly is he wanting to get out of it... For the general sailor, as I stated, the right set up, there would be bugger all performance loss or gain. Any average sailor would notice. Both have pros and cons. Hence the original question, wanting to know how they perform/compare

So you've owned a 8-10 year old JP board SS?





Thanks for your input mate. To answer your question in a roundabout way, I race and use slalom boards, but I have issues with my front foot wanting to bounce out of the footstrap at speed which apart from being dangerous, slows me down because I'm having to fight my gear constantly. I have tried so many different ways to fix the issue, including talking directly with PWA pros and even the sailmaker of my gear and nothing seems to get rid of the problem. I have tried different brands of sail and boards, tried changing my stance etc, but still the same problem. The only board that I can ride comfortably is my Rocket, but then its not as quick as I need it to be for racing. I was wondering if the SS was a bit more like the rocket being a freerace style board, yet still quick enough for me to use it racing because im desperately searching for a way to enjoy my slalom sailing again.




I had the same issue of losing the front foot with a major brand. After trying all different set up changes I moved to a different brand that builds for normal people with a closer strap setup. My test now is this ... elbow to mid finger distance is my idea foot strap distance between the front and back straps. Then from the front strap to centre of mast track is the same measurement.
This setup Then allows me to push and dance off the fin with lots of confidence. You could make up a plate to move the front strap and narrow your stance without costing dollars that may not help.



Ok I tried to get my straps close enough to meet the elbow to mid finger distance but the closest I can get it is to the end of my fingers and that's with my back straps fully forward and the front straps fully back. I don't think I can get them far enough back to meet your measurements.


Ok try this. Get a SS plate made up to fit 2 of the last footstrap holes and have some extra length to attach the foot strap further back from your furthest current position. Its an easy cheap look to check if this will work. Slowlys set up is usually pretty close to mine except he's 5 kts faster ;) I hope this helps
Maddlad
Maddlad

Maddlad

WA

925 posts

30 May 2020 12:55pm
Select to expand quote
kato said..

Maddlad said..


kato said..



Maddlad said..




izaak said..





LeeD said..
Still depends if you actually have the skills and energy to ride Slalom over fast freeride.
Since a meter sail bigger is normal for slalom, and normally more, it's a handful to jibe, rig, and carry. The shorter flat off the tail requires more constant power, and the lighter weight, while accelerating well when fully powered, also SLOWS DOWN quicker with the slightest loss of sail power or momentum, mainly hurting in jibes.
This is why both are made....different skill sets.
'10 Futura and '10 Isonic 111's.
'12 JP SS 109 vs Slalom
'16 Tabou Speedster vs Manta 100 and 103.









Are we in the PWA?
Exactly what my first sentence suggests? What exactly is he wanting to get out of it... For the general sailor, as I stated, the right set up, there would be bugger all performance loss or gain. Any average sailor would notice. Both have pros and cons. Hence the original question, wanting to know how they perform/compare

So you've owned a 8-10 year old JP board SS?






Thanks for your input mate. To answer your question in a roundabout way, I race and use slalom boards, but I have issues with my front foot wanting to bounce out of the footstrap at speed which apart from being dangerous, slows me down because I'm having to fight my gear constantly. I have tried so many different ways to fix the issue, including talking directly with PWA pros and even the sailmaker of my gear and nothing seems to get rid of the problem. I have tried different brands of sail and boards, tried changing my stance etc, but still the same problem. The only board that I can ride comfortably is my Rocket, but then its not as quick as I need it to be for racing. I was wondering if the SS was a bit more like the rocket being a freerace style board, yet still quick enough for me to use it racing because im desperately searching for a way to enjoy my slalom sailing again.





I had the same issue of losing the front foot with a major brand. After trying all different set up changes I moved to a different brand that builds for normal people with a closer strap setup. My test now is this ... elbow to mid finger distance is my idea foot strap distance between the front and back straps. Then from the front strap to centre of mast track is the same measurement.
This setup Then allows me to push and dance off the fin with lots of confidence. You could make up a plate to move the front strap and narrow your stance without costing dollars that may not help.




Ok I tried to get my straps close enough to meet the elbow to mid finger distance but the closest I can get it is to the end of my fingers and that's with my back straps fully forward and the front straps fully back. I don't think I can get them far enough back to meet your measurements.



Ok try this. Get a SS plate made up to fit 2 of the last footstrap holes and have some extra length to attach the foot strap further back from your furthest current position. Its an easy cheap look to check if this will work. Slowlys set up is usually pretty close to mine except he's 5 kts faster ;) I hope this helps


Ok thanks mate. Are your back straps in the front holes at the back of the board or are they towards the back to make the board faster?
AUS 808
AUS 808

AUS 808

WA

510 posts

30 May 2020 2:44pm
Select to expand quote
Maddlad said..


AUS 808 said..




Maddlad said..





izaak said..






LeeD said..
Still depends if you actually have the skills and energy to ride Slalom over fast freeride.
Since a meter sail bigger is normal for slalom, and normally more, it's a handful to jibe, rig, and carry. The shorter flat off the tail requires more constant power, and the lighter weight, while accelerating well when fully powered, also SLOWS DOWN quicker with the slightest loss of sail power or momentum, mainly hurting in jibes.
This is why both are made....different skill sets.
'10 Futura and '10 Isonic 111's.
'12 JP SS 109 vs Slalom
'16 Tabou Speedster vs Manta 100 and 103.










Are we in the PWA?
Exactly what my first sentence suggests? What exactly is he wanting to get out of it... For the general sailor, as I stated, the right set up, there would be bugger all performance loss or gain. Any average sailor would notice. Both have pros and cons. Hence the original question, wanting to know how they perform/compare

So you've owned a 8-10 year old JP board SS?







Thanks for your input mate. To answer your question in a roundabout way, I race and use slalom boards, but I have issues with my front foot wanting to bounce out of the footstrap at speed which apart from being dangerous, slows me down because I'm having to fight my gear constantly. I have tried so many different ways to fix the issue, including talking directly with PWA pros and even the sailmaker of my gear and nothing seems to get rid of the problem. I have tried different brands of sail and boards, tried changing my stance etc, but still the same problem. The only board that I can ride comfortably is my Rocket, but then its not as quick as I need it to be for racing. I was wondering if the SS was a bit more like the rocket being a freerace style board, yet still quick enough for me to use it racing because im desperately searching for a way to enjoy my slalom sailing again.






Compare the settings on the Rocket with the Slalom board & try to match them.
The other thing is try & tee up with Slowy or Jesper & try some different fins.
Ask a few guys to test your set-up, Jesper, Shane or Steve Stratfold are probably a good match size wise or dare I say even Peter Mac

Remember comfortable can sometimes be faster, some guys on Slalom go slower in chop than others on Freeride.
Maybe concentrate on tuning the Rocket for the best performance.





Hi mate, thanks for your input. Believe it or not I have tried all of that. I have measured my rocket straps and try to match it with the slalom board and it's pretty much exactly the same. I've also had all those top guys like Jasper, Issak, snides and all guys who are good sailors try my gear and to them it all feels fine. Most of those guys are a bit heavier than me, but they're all saying the same thing that it feels okay to them. Unfortunately it doesn't help me because it doesn't feel right to me.



Snides, he reckons my foil set-up is fine too, must simply be pilot error
Maybe we are just one level down or 2 in my case
Tardy
Tardy

Tardy

5292 posts

30 May 2020 4:04pm
Maddlad ,forgot to mention this ,another thing to try ..on my Patriks .they have this outside footstraps position ,so on a angle ..I thought How bazar ,who could sail that way ..but guess who doing it ..I had front foot bouncing too ..changed them to this setting and no more foot jumping out ..it's a little different going up wind ,but GSP its great .might be worth a try ..you have to lean back and sheet in more to get the front leg straight ..as one picture shows ..the other I was heading up wind ..on the bigger 122.

Tardy
Tardy

Tardy

5292 posts

30 May 2020 4:06pm



Tardy
Tardy

Tardy

5292 posts

30 May 2020 4:07pm


so you can see clearly on this picture the front foot is on a weird angle ,compared to free riding ,but it works .,not more front foot jumping for me on these boards .

so i think its what kato's saying a narrower stance ? heels are defiantly closer together .

its still not going to tell you which board to buy
kato
kato

kato

VIC

3513 posts

30 May 2020 6:46pm
Select to expand quote
Maddlad said..

kato said..


Maddlad said..



kato said..




Maddlad said..





izaak said..






LeeD said..
Still depends if you actually have the skills and energy to ride Slalom over fast freeride.
Since a meter sail bigger is normal for slalom, and normally more, it's a handful to jibe, rig, and carry. The shorter flat off the tail requires more constant power, and the lighter weight, while accelerating well when fully powered, also SLOWS DOWN quicker with the slightest loss of sail power or momentum, mainly hurting in jibes.
This is why both are made....different skill sets.
'10 Futura and '10 Isonic 111's.
'12 JP SS 109 vs Slalom
'16 Tabou Speedster vs Manta 100 and 103.










Are we in the PWA?
Exactly what my first sentence suggests? What exactly is he wanting to get out of it... For the general sailor, as I stated, the right set up, there would be bugger all performance loss or gain. Any average sailor would notice. Both have pros and cons. Hence the original question, wanting to know how they perform/compare

So you've owned a 8-10 year old JP board SS?







Thanks for your input mate. To answer your question in a roundabout way, I race and use slalom boards, but I have issues with my front foot wanting to bounce out of the footstrap at speed which apart from being dangerous, slows me down because I'm having to fight my gear constantly. I have tried so many different ways to fix the issue, including talking directly with PWA pros and even the sailmaker of my gear and nothing seems to get rid of the problem. I have tried different brands of sail and boards, tried changing my stance etc, but still the same problem. The only board that I can ride comfortably is my Rocket, but then its not as quick as I need it to be for racing. I was wondering if the SS was a bit more like the rocket being a freerace style board, yet still quick enough for me to use it racing because im desperately searching for a way to enjoy my slalom sailing again.






I had the same issue of losing the front foot with a major brand. After trying all different set up changes I moved to a different brand that builds for normal people with a closer strap setup. My test now is this ... elbow to mid finger distance is my idea foot strap distance between the front and back straps. Then from the front strap to centre of mast track is the same measurement.
This setup Then allows me to push and dance off the fin with lots of confidence. You could make up a plate to move the front strap and narrow your stance without costing dollars that may not help.





Ok I tried to get my straps close enough to meet the elbow to mid finger distance but the closest I can get it is to the end of my fingers and that's with my back straps fully forward and the front straps fully back. I don't think I can get them far enough back to meet your measurements.




Ok try this. Get a SS plate made up to fit 2 of the last footstrap holes and have some extra length to attach the foot strap further back from your furthest current position. Its an easy cheap look to check if this will work. Slowlys set up is usually pretty close to mine except he's 5 kts faster ;) I hope this helps



Ok thanks mate. Are your back straps in the front holes at the back of the board or are they towards the back to make the board faster?


All at the back. In my world speeed is king, control may be optional
Maddlad
Maddlad

Maddlad

WA

925 posts

31 May 2020 7:55am
Select to expand quote
Tardy said..


so you can see clearly on this picture the front foot is on a weird angle ,compared to free riding ,but it works .,not more front foot jumping for me on these boards .

so i think its what kato's saying a narrower stance ? heels are defiantly closer together .

its still not going to tell you which board to buy



Thanks Tards. I've actually got my straps in a similar position because I've tried that set up in order to squeeze the strap width closer so my foot is wedged in, but I still have the foot bounce out issue. I might have to try wearing my old skiff racing boots to see if that helps. Cheers for your effort and input. :)
Maddlad
Maddlad

Maddlad

WA

925 posts

31 May 2020 7:59am
Select to expand quote
kato said..


Maddlad said..



kato said..




Maddlad said..





kato said..






Maddlad said..







izaak said..








LeeD said..
Still depends if you actually have the skills and energy to ride Slalom over fast freeride.
Since a meter sail bigger is normal for slalom, and normally more, it's a handful to jibe, rig, and carry. The shorter flat off the tail requires more constant power, and the lighter weight, while accelerating well when fully powered, also SLOWS DOWN quicker with the slightest loss of sail power or momentum, mainly hurting in jibes.
This is why both are made....different skill sets.
'10 Futura and '10 Isonic 111's.
'12 JP SS 109 vs Slalom
'16 Tabou Speedster vs Manta 100 and 103.












Are we in the PWA?
Exactly what my first sentence suggests? What exactly is he wanting to get out of it... For the general sailor, as I stated, the right set up, there would be bugger all performance loss or gain. Any average sailor would notice. Both have pros and cons. Hence the original question, wanting to know how they perform/compare

So you've owned a 8-10 year old JP board SS?









Thanks for your input mate. To answer your question in a roundabout way, I race and use slalom boards, but I have issues with my front foot wanting to bounce out of the footstrap at speed which apart from being dangerous, slows me down because I'm having to fight my gear constantly. I have tried so many different ways to fix the issue, including talking directly with PWA pros and even the sailmaker of my gear and nothing seems to get rid of the problem. I have tried different brands of sail and boards, tried changing my stance etc, but still the same problem. The only board that I can ride comfortably is my Rocket, but then its not as quick as I need it to be for racing. I was wondering if the SS was a bit more like the rocket being a freerace style board, yet still quick enough for me to use it racing because im desperately searching for a way to enjoy my slalom sailing again.








I had the same issue of losing the front foot with a major brand. After trying all different set up changes I moved to a different brand that builds for normal people with a closer strap setup. My test now is this ... elbow to mid finger distance is my idea foot strap distance between the front and back straps. Then from the front strap to centre of mast track is the same measurement.
This setup Then allows me to push and dance off the fin with lots of confidence. You could make up a plate to move the front strap and narrow your stance without costing dollars that may not help.







Ok I tried to get my straps close enough to meet the elbow to mid finger distance but the closest I can get it is to the end of my fingers and that's with my back straps fully forward and the front straps fully back. I don't think I can get them far enough back to meet your measurements.






Ok try this. Get a SS plate made up to fit 2 of the last footstrap holes and have some extra length to attach the foot strap further back from your furthest current position. Its an easy cheap look to check if this will work. Slowlys set up is usually pretty close to mine except he's 5 kts faster ;) I hope this helps





Ok thanks mate. Are your back straps in the front holes at the back of the board or are they towards the back to make the board faster?




All at the back. In my world speeed is king, control may be optional



Haha ok fair enough. Looking at my board I'd have to drill a bunch of holes half way between my front straps and back footstraps to make your measurement work. As I mentioned above I might have to try my skiff racing boots as a last resort.
olskool
olskool

olskool

QLD

2459 posts

31 May 2020 3:43pm
Ive just scored a 2013 135 Rocket. Setting up straps for my comfy stance. Elbow to finger. Im 105kg n 6'2". On the Rocket it meant i had to use front holes on rear straps and rear holes for front foot. Seems the Rocket is made up for very wide stance. Looked weird compared to other boards ive got. So i laid one ontop of other n strap positions were exactly the same... Is the wide stance/plug spacing just a Rocket thing? Or is it meant to be ridden that way?
LeeD
LeeD

LeeD

3939 posts

1 Jun 2020 12:08am
No standard insert position between companies.
I've been going center of rear to center of front since 1985, and never could convince Seatrend to use the same measurement.
22" for me, at 5'10".
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