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Mark _australia said..
This ball weight thing varies from state to state, in WA its only 10% so that is obviously safe if you have a brain.
Other states want 15% so hey ........

The ball weight limit could very easily be increased with air bag suspensiion added to rear.
Or, as per big caravans a load levelling hitch (torsion bars) so the ball weight is perfect.
Its all possible.... if you really need to.

As long as the trailer weight does not exceed the vehicle weight of course, its really not fun when the tail wags the dog......

You are incorrect . The manufacturer Ball weight can not be changed without a full certification process which is expensive and requires engineering sign off.

Many people are either over the Ball weight rating or exceeding the Gross Vehicle Mass when towing.

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Bertie said..

Cocky2 said..

Bertie said..
VW T5 has 2T tow capacity. Mine has easily towed that across the country twice!
get the 2.5L 5cylinder diesel. gear driven cams so no belts or chains to replace.

The Tow Ball weight is legally only 100KG for the Transporter.

Well my towbar is rated to 200kg down and 2000kgs. As stated on my compliance sticker on the door frame.
The towbar is not genuine VW, from some mob in SA.

Maybe its coz I have the transporter LWB 4motion it allows more? dunno but it tows heavy loads amazingly and u can still even overtake trucks if need be!

The manufacturer Towing limits are 100kg Ball weight. The tow bar itself can not override them.

Good comparison of various models in this old review...
www.caradvice.com.au/291602/van-comparison-toyota-hiace-v-hyundai-iload-v-ford-transit-custom-v-renault-trafic-v-fiat-scudo-v-mercedes-benz-vito-v-volkswagen-transporter/

having owned a caravan park for 40 years , the trend now is for over weight caravans and the owners just think i can tow 3500 kgs with there ute so they buy a caravan that weights 3500 kgs and its so dodgy we see it all the time and they just dont understand , my caravan is 1500kgs and my towing capacity is 3500 and that feels just right to me i wouldnt want any more weight on the back ,

^^ EXACTLY! Bit off topic. But Most modern 4x4s have advertised 3500kg limit. Thats an intermittant rating. Have seen heaps of the newer models breaking chassis bcoz of continual towing heavy loads. While the brakes n gearbox n engine may be up to the task the chassis is not.
Did a Lake Eyre trek in 2011. Brand new vehicle towing poptop camper. An air bag on rear blew as we headed down Birdsville track. No accessible repairs. By the time we got to Maree one chassis rail had large crack n other side showing signs of fatigue. Vehicle less than 14000km on the clock. We cautiously limped back to Qld. Lesson learned.

Here is my example for your perusal: my criteria was that it had to be cheap to buy, run and service.

I've been using a 2005 Kia Pregio for the past year and it has been great.
Picked it up for $3500 including rwc and 6 months rego. Bought privately.
It now has 320 000 km (I put 20 000 km on it this year).
Cosmetic condition isn't great but I didn't buy it for its looks.
Perfect for hauling loads of kit. Have a fold out bed too in there for camping/road trips.
Fits in carparks! 1,95m tall. Quite narrow. Having a van which fits in carparks makes life so much easier.

The van has a naturally aspirated 2.7L diesel. It is slow but gets about 800-1000km per tank. A full tank costs about $90.
I think that the fuel economy is probably better than an equivalent petrol van (at least from the same era). Have you considered an LPG converted van?
Having come from Europe, fuel in Australia still seems very cheap to me.
Towing capacity is only 1500kg .
I probably wouldn't recommend an auto as it is so slow to begin with!

As far as servicing, it is cheap. It uses a timing gears so only need to do the oil and oil filter regularly. I do it myself every 7500km.
Fuel filter and air filter once a year.
I buy some injector cleaner twice a year (the kind you pour in the fuel tank).
Changing the other fluids it no more expensive than equivalent vans.
I agree with what has been mentionned with regards to DPFs and turbos: these can become problematic and expensive. Buying used is always a risk.
Things that have needed repair/replacement: glow plugs (had cold start problems when I bought it), windscreen wipers.

You may also want to consider some large MPVs with fold-flat seats such as the Chrysler Grand Voyager.
After 2005 all the Grand Voyagers have the "Stow n Go" system where the seats fold flat into the floor.
Petrol or diesel engines available and 1.6t towing capacity.

I liked this option as MPVs are more refined than vans (decent sterio, ride quality, less engine noise, sound deadening...) and that you can still use the back seats if need be with minimal effort.

I suppose the main thing will be to check that your boards and masts fit properly in the thing!

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Cavernous. Love the seat fold away though wet gear may be an issue.

Yes, I like the stowaway too. I've done the same thing with an iMax, but it doesn't have the fold down feature so I had to find somewhere in the house/shed to stow away the seats I removed. I bought a large rubber mat 2nd hand off gum tree for $40 which has been effect if in controlling moisture, but I remove any wet equipment from the van after a sail.
I love my van, but it has 170K km on it so I guess it will blow up any day now

If thats the case rob my vito should have blown up by now.

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gbm91 said..
You may also want to consider some large MPVs with fold-flat seats such as the Chrysler Grand Voyager.
...
I liked this option as MPVs are more refined than vans (decent sterio, ride quality, less engine noise, sound deadening...) and that you can still use the back seats if need be with minimal effort.

I suppose the main thing will be to check that your boards and masts fit properly in the thing!

I am driving a Nissan Elgrand as a windsurfing van. They are a touch bigger than the Grand Voyager, but its essentially the same idea, but it doesn't have fold away seats.

I bought it as a windsurfing van replacement, but I am finding I prefer to drive it most of the time, probably all of the time. It is meant to be for windsurfing or camping trips, but I prefer to drive it because its nice and quiet, plus its got a nice high up seating position. Not the best on petrol, but for a 2 tonne van with a 3.5l v6 pushing it, I suspect its normal for anything that size.

With the Elgrand you can fold up the two seats at the very back against the windows. If you want to remove them totally it requires removing two nuts and a bolt on each side but other than that they are a piece of cake to remove and install.

I have the 2nd row passenger seat removed completely, but have left the 2nd row drivers side seat. The windsurfing gear all goes on the left hand side, or any other sporting equipment if needed.

The limitation with these vans is that you can really only fit 2.3 or 2.4m behind the front seats, or close to 3m between the front seats if you have longer boards. You can fit two, maybe three boards in that space if you try.

The towing thing is an unknown as I think technically NIssan never fitted these for towing at all, but it seems like they adopt some general rule when fitting these with towbars.

Hello, Berowne,

Did you end up buying something and if so, can you advise what, as I'm sure we're all interested.

Yeah I'll be upgrading my van soon.
I've got a VW Caddy and will be going for a Transporter. Pity it won't be as economical as the Caddy ( 5.5 - 6.5ltres per 100kms).

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berowne said..
So my commodore is in the nursing home with dementia... and I've been googling vans as a replacement. I'm keen to find something second hand with a few criteria...

Hold lots of boards and sails

I've just sold my old van. Do I keep lots of boards and sails to justify replacing it? Vans are, after all, such comfy, cruisy things to get around in. (You'll wonder why you didn't ditch the commodore years ago).

Or do I complete the transition to foiling and get by with the one board that'll strap down to the roof of a small hatch?

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Ian K said..
Or do I complete the transition to foiling and get by with the one board that'll strap down to the roof of a small hatch?

The first time you sail at Lake Illawarra, you will want a non-foil setup. Obviously that is nothing to do with vehicle choice...
But you may also want to spend time in WA...

Be careful of ex ambo's as they arrive at a job and idle for very long periods which can glaze the cylinders up requiring expensive repairs. I have spoken to a couple of people who have had this issue.

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mathew said..

Ian K said..
Or do I complete the transition to foiling and get by with the one board that'll strap down to the roof of a small hatch?

The first time you sail at Lake Illawarra, you will want a non-foil setup. Obviously that is nothing to do with vehicle choice...
But you may also want to spend time in WA...

WA is a big place but I'd have thought it's the other way around? The waters around Fremantle, if they're anything to go by, are definitely more inducive to hiving off your stockpile of slappers than the waters of the Illawarra.

I'm also looking for a Van.

The only problem is my wife won't let me buy anything that doesn't have space for the whole family, meaning i need to have a second row of seats for the kids; and when i look at it, there aren't many vans out there where you can have a second row of seats and still enough space at the back for windsurfing gear.

The only van i have found that may fit them all in is the Toyota Commuter LWB, which i believe should be able to hold family + windsurf gear (racks and all).

Does anyone have this van and can confirm?

I'm getting desperate for a van.

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akesy said..
I'm also looking for a Van.

The only problem is my wife won't let me buy anything that doesn't have space for the whole family, meaning i need to have a second row of seats for the kids; and when i look at it, there aren't many vans out there where you can have a second row of seats and still enough space at the back for windsurfing gear.

The only van i have found that may fit them all in is the Toyota Commuter LWB, which i believe should be able to hold family + windsurf gear (racks and all).

Does anyone have this van and can confirm?

I'm getting desperate for a van.

Your wife is making you take the kids with you when you go sailing? That's a bit rough!

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FormulaNova said..

akesy said..
I'm also looking for a Van.

The only problem is my wife won't let me buy anything that doesn't have space for the whole family, meaning i need to have a second row of seats for the kids; and when i look at it, there aren't many vans out there where you can have a second row of seats and still enough space at the back for windsurfing gear.

The only van i have found that may fit them all in is the Toyota Commuter LWB, which i believe should be able to hold family + windsurf gear (racks and all).

Does anyone have this van and can confirm?

I'm getting desperate for a van.

Your wife is making you take the kids with you when you go sailing? That's a bit rough!

She wants us to use the van for camping, i.e. weekend away, long weekends, etc.... which is fine... I just need to fit everyone in.

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akesy said..
She wants us to use the van for camping, i.e. weekend away, long weekends, etc.... which is fine... I just need to fit everyone in.

In that case you need a windsurfing trailer and tow it with the van.

I have had a van for over 10 years as my travelling/windsurfing vehicle, Excellent of sleeping in when I travel, but I very rarely put my windsurfing gear inside it. Back seat folds down to fit the bed.

Advantages: Can carry a lot more windsrfing toys to cover all possibilities and also my Motorbike to explore all those interesting places along the way. Can even carry my 10 foot Mal or even the big Gemini tandem on top of it which would fit in almost no van. Don't have to move stuff for two people (and a small dog) to sleep in the van. No problem with wet stuff, I can load the trailer dripping wet - doesn't matter. Makes stuff all difference to fuel economy (11-12l/100 without, 13-14L/100 with trailer). I notice the difference up hills though.

The Van has done over 480,000km and is still strong. Body rough but sound - does not matter to me. Had to replace the engine not long after I got it with a second hand on as my daughter cooked it when lent to her for a trip - Check your cooling system regularly - but the van cost me $1200 to buy and less than $2000 after I RWC'd it and did brakes and new tyres. $4000 to replace the engine a few tears later (had about the same milage) and the cooling system. Normal maintenance since which you have with any vehicle.

It's an Auto, which was not my preference when I bought it, but it is actually perfect as It has a higher geared diff. and cruises at 110 with the trailer very well. Auto is also an advantage on sandy tracks.

2000 Mitsubishi Express Walkthrough LWB. Cant see myself replacing it for another few years and another 100.000Kays.

One of the smallest expenses of running a new, or near new vehicle is fuel. Depreciation will far outweigh it. My van has ZERO depreciation 'cause it's practically worth nothing, so maintenance, rego and fuel are really my only costs. You can buy a tankerload of fuel for what you lose on depreciation on a near new vehicle, and by my calculations, you may never break even with the initial higher price of a Diesel on some vehicles!!

Oh, another advantage of a trailer is that I can carry enough Jerry Cans to cross the Nullabor without being extorted for fuel fills. Buy fuel in the cities at a 30% or more saving Saved me at least few 100$ each crossing!

I suspect the lower towing load rating for some Auto's is to do with transmission cooling. My parents had tranny coolers fitted to there Auto caravan towing cars. But I think I have also seen some auto's listed with higher towing capacities than manuals - perhaps my previous Falcon XR6?

Obviously, this setup suits me perfectly, but everybodys needs are different.

End of day, somewhere in WA:

One consideration nobody has spoken about is safety. Some of these older vans are death traps, I wouldn't touch anything less than current ANCAP 3 star with a barge pole.

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mr love said..
One consideration nobody has spoken about is safety. Some of these older vans are death traps, I wouldn't touch anything less than current ANCAP 3 star with a barge pole.

I don't think anything more than 5 years old could get 3 current ANCAP points? The thing nobody mentions about ANCAP ratings is that they assume you crash into a car of equal mass and equally yielding crumple zones. i.e.. two cars of 1000kg colliding, each going the 47kph of the ANCAP test is "equivalent" to one car hitting the stationary concrete barrier in the test. Hit a travelling heavier vehicle with its stiffer crumple zones and that 47kph could easily double. Vans are close to 2 tonnes, more if you all the gear. Just make sure it's bolted down.

Sorry to see my old van go. the best highway cruiser ever. You only get a couple of hundred for a 20yo van. It's just come back to haunt me. Unregisted and all. Not a law-abiding lot in WA!

Yeah, van plus trailer great for an epic road trip. I prefer to ditch the trailer for local sailing.

this summer, we left SW WA early Saturday morning
Through Kingston and arrived at Beachport midnight Sunday
Sailed Monday at Lake George (photo is Tuesday actually)

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Ian K said..
Sorry to see my old van go. the best highway cruiser ever. You only get a couple of hundred for a 20yo van. It's just come back to haunt me. Unregisted and all. Not a law-abiding lot in WA!

You didn't change the rego from NSW to WA when you got there? From what I have read, you have the chance to do this when you move as long as you have had the vehicle in your name for at least 12 months, and as a bonus there is no inspection requirement... just like most cars in WA! Coming from NSW it was probably better than a lot in WA.

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Ian K said..
I don't think anything more than 5 years old could get 3 current ANCAP points? The thing nobody mentions about ANCAP ratings is that they assume you crash into a car of equal mass and equally yielding crumple zones. i.e.. two cars of 1000kg colliding, each going the 47kph of the ANCAP test is "equivalent" to one car hitting the stationary concrete barrier in the test. Hit a travelling heavier vehicle with its stiffer crumple zones and that 47kph could easily double. Vans are close to 2 tonnes, more if you all the gear. Just make sure it's bolted down.

Yeah, it makes you wonder when a Nissan Micra is a 5 star vehicle.

Sure, it probably has a lot of airbags, but if something twice the weight hits it, who is going to get the best outcome? I guess its pretty hard to rate vehicles when you have to consider what they are hitting.

That said, I was happy to see my Mazda E2000 go, as I was no longer comfortable with the limited sheet metal between my feet and anything that I would have a collision with. No matter how much it weighed, it was not going to be a good result.

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sailquik said..

akesy said..
She wants us to use the van for camping, i.e. weekend away, long weekends, etc.... which is fine... I just need to fit everyone in.

In that case you need a windsurfing trailer and tow it with the van. .

Yep, I used to have a 4x4 L300 and trailer, worked well.

Andrew get a low water alarm

Pfft... you just need a bigger van.... KA360's kid-mover:

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mathew said..
Pfft... you just need a bigger van.... KA360's kid-mover:

Whaoo.. that's impressive. Never seen anything quite like it.

What kind of van is that?

You have all the space in the world at the back for kids and look at all the gear at the back... Especially impressed by the horizontal arrangement, very neat.

That may be just about what i need.

What would you recommend re getting something like it?

Cheers,

Alex.