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clarence said..
I always carry a small drybag with flares and epirb for offshore sailing.

The separation of board from rig is one of the big issues, as a board with no rig will generally get away pretty quickly.

This raises the biggest point regarding epirbs- and that is where/how they are carried.There is no point carrying an EPIRB if it is on the board if it becomes separated from the rig/sailor.

I always tie a length of cord from the mast track eyelet on to the downhaul. In a sail of a few hours I probably only do a dozen tacks or gybes, do even if the the number of sequential tacks and gybes do not even out, it is not a real big deal as far as things getting tangled up.

Which leads me to the question, where/how do most people prefer to carry epirbs and other safety gear.

Clarence

you dont carry an epirb, you carry a plb . weighs between 116 and 170g , About the size of a nokia 5110

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dusta said...

clarence said..
I always carry a small drybag with flares and epirb for offshore sailing.

The separation of board from rig is one of the big issues, as a board with no rig will generally get away pretty quickly.

This raises the biggest point regarding epirbs- and that is where/how they are carried.There is no point carrying an EPIRB if it is on the board if it becomes separated from the rig/sailor.

I always tie a length of cord from the mast track eyelet on to the downhaul. In a sail of a few hours I probably only do a dozen tacks or gybes, do even if the the number of sequential tacks and gybes do not even out, it is not a real big deal as far as things getting tangled up.

Which leads me to the question, where/how do most people prefer to carry epirbs and other safety gear.

Clarence

you dont carry an epirb, you carry a plb . weighs between 116 and 170g , About the size of a nokia 5110

Quite possible as some older model EPIRB's were around the same size as many current model PLB's.

As mentioned in my earlier post, I recently purchased a Neil Pryde high hook bouyancy vest which has a large front mesh pocket to carry my PLB with room for some rope or other smallish bits.

I have the Mcmurdo 220, I store it in one of these ^

What about corrosion, those that have one or similar do you use it an a waterproof pouch? I know its waterproof, but the antenna is outside of the sealed plastic, have you had any
corrosion issues? I would prefer to have it on a lanyard attached to my harness, which is a bit tricky if it's in a waterproof pouch.

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sonny2727 said..
what bugs me most is that you have to carry so many separate devices, I already have a GPS watch for recording speed, and now this PLB thing, cant wait for the day all these devices are combined!

mmmm, been thinking about a waterproof cover for my phone, and researching some GPS apps for speed. If I get one I think I will get one with earphones as well.

GPS, music and safety device all in one.

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pirrad said..

sonny2727 said..
what bugs me most is that you have to carry so many separate devices, I already have a GPS watch for recording speed, and now this PLB thing, cant wait for the day all these devices are combined!

mmmm, been thinking about a waterproof cover for my phone, and researching some GPS apps for speed. If I get one I think I will get one with earphones as well.

GPS, music and safety device all in one.

Yes, those cheap Android phones I have been carrying with GPS-Logit installed don't currently have SIM cards in them. Here is a good reason to install and activate them.

So, what is best? Or what are the reasons for choice of EPERB or PLB?

Can someone also list some cost effective options?

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sailquik said..
So, what is best? Or what are the reasons for choice of EPERB or PLB?

Can someone also list some cost effective options?

EPIRB or PLB? When it comes down to it they're pretty much the same thing inside the case.

www.oroliamaritime.com/2019/03/20/what-is-an-epirb/

I was hoping someone who really knows what they are talking about could tell us all which one to buy and why :)

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AUS1111 said...
I was hoping someone who really knows what they are talking about could tell us all which one to buy and why :)

IMO no one here on this forum fitting that description!!!!

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sailquik said...

pirrad said..

sonny2727 said..
what bugs me most is that you have to carry so many separate devices, I already have a GPS watch for recording speed, and now this PLB thing, cant wait for the day all these devices are combined!

mmmm, been thinking about a waterproof cover for my phone, and researching some GPS apps for speed. If I get one I think I will get one with earphones as well.

GPS, music and safety device all in one.

Yes, those cheap Android phones I have been carrying with GPS-Logit installed don't currently have SIM cards in them. Here is a good reason to install and activate them.

Just installed " phone tracker" app free version to play with, get the missus( or windsurf buddy to install) and your location can be tracked. At the rate phones are advancing I would be reluctant to part with the coin for stand alone gps and plb devices.

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pirrad said..

sailquik said...

pirrad said..

sonny2727 said..
what bugs me most is that you have to carry so many separate devices, I already have a GPS watch for recording speed, and now this PLB thing, cant wait for the day all these devices are combined!

mmmm, been thinking about a waterproof cover for my phone, and researching some GPS apps for speed. If I get one I think I will get one with earphones as well.

GPS, music and safety device all in one.

Yes, those cheap Android phones I have been carrying with GPS-Logit installed don't currently have SIM cards in them. Here is a good reason to install and activate them.

Just installed " phone tracker" app free version to play with, get the missus( or windsurf buddy to install) and your location can be tracked. At the rate phones are advancing I would be reluctant to part with the coin for stand alone gps and plb devices.

I would assume that any 'phone tracker' App would only work when you are in range of Cell phone reception.

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GazMan said..

AUS1111 said...
I was hoping someone who really knows what they are talking about could tell us all which one to buy and why :)

IMO no one here on this forum fitting that description!!!!

You want this - GPS, Satellite based EPIRB, VHF radio, DSC.... all in one.

Since it is rated to 130m depth, it will handle those speed-sailing crashes off the coast of some remote desert beach, or you favourite hold-down break.

www.nautiluslifeline.com/

The use of VHF has been mentioned... it should be worth noting that if you have a VHF radio (particularly with DSC), you are meant to have a VHF radio license.
aka. the law hasn't kept up with technology, where only big-boat operators can afford a VHF radio.

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mathew said..
The use of VHF has been mentioned... it should be worth noting that if you have a VHF radio (particularly with DSC), you are meant to have a VHF radio license.
aka. the law hasn't kept up with technology, where only big-boat operators can afford a VHF radio.

Unfortunately, technology hasn't yet worked out a way of eliminating the inane, crass and other inappropriate use of the VHF channels by certain types, who more commonly frequent the 27Meg (and often UHF) frequencies. The VHF licence goes some way to ensuring that the frequencies are used by people who have undergone some education on appropriate use.

I couldn't see any reference to the nautilus product having an EPIRB function, just DSC. So that's fine as long as there's another vessel, land station or repeater within line-of-sight range , but that range would be quite limited (3-10 km) if the unit is only a little above sea level. Wack it on the top of the mast and that would improve things quite a bit. Sure it's receiving info from satellites to get a gps fix but it doesn't seem to be transmitting to satellites, unlike an EPIRB of PLB.

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AUS1111 said..
I was hoping someone who really knows what they are talking about could tell us all which one to buy and why :)

http://www.epirbhire.com.au/buy%20an%20EPIRB%20or%20PLB.htm


those are the guys that King of Carnac have done a deal with to hire or buy . Give the guys a call there, they are very helpful over the phone and go over the benefits and drawbacks of each model

i have the kannad safelink solo

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MikeyS said..

mathew said..
The use of VHF has been mentioned... it should be worth noting that if you have a VHF radio (particularly with DSC), you are meant to have a VHF radio license.
aka. the law hasn't kept up with technology, where only big-boat operators can afford a VHF radio.

Unfortunately, technology hasn't yet worked out a way of eliminating the inane, crass and other inappropriate use of the VHF channels by certain types, who more commonly frequent the 27Meg (and often UHF) frequencies. The VHF licence goes some way to ensuring that the frequencies are used by people who have undergone some education on appropriate use.

I couldn't see any reference to the nautilus product having an EPIRB function, just DSC. So that's fine as long as there's another vessel, land station or repeater within line-of-sight range , but that range would be quite limited (3-10 km) if the unit is only a little above sea level. Wack it on the top of the mast and that would improve things quite a bit. Sure it's receiving info from satellites to get a gps fix but it doesn't seem to be transmitting to satellites, unlike an EPIRB of PLB.

I stand corrected. I was doing some diving and read up on the various safety options... apparently there are far too many options to choose from.
In the end, the LifeLine was the way to go.... even for countries with lower populations, such as Australia and New Zealand.

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AUS1111 said..
I was hoping someone who really knows what they are talking about could tell us all which one to buy and why :)

So far to me it seems fairly simple.

EPIRB is a bit bigger and more expensive (?) but if activated it will be picked up no matter where you are, and show to the search and rescue mob an exact position who owns it etc. They also broadcast on the old system still so air traffic will pick it up also.

PLB will work just fine but only be picked up by commercial vessels in a 4nm (7ish km) radius. Ma and Pa fishing for whiting in the tinny won't get it. Neither will the search and rescue mobs.

To me that rules out the latter for a lot of Australian windsurfing spots. Unless u only sail metro, get an EPIRB cos in the PLB scenario :
there will be no commercial vessels passing nearby when u need it along most of the Oz coast. Then do you think Mr OilTanker who does receive it (if u r lucky) will come in shallow to look for you? Noo, he will report a 'maybe activation' at 93deg from his position, and keep going. Then u drift further and the rescue mob still have to figure out where u are 2hrs later. Be realistic it is designed for man over situations that are discovered very quickly and they are already looking for you.

A PLB will do sweet fk-all at more then half the good common wavesailing spots I can think of in WA

Then there is some crossover in the very expensive models. If that worried about it, stick an EPIRB in a impact vest. Done.

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Mark _australia said..

AUS1111 said..
I was hoping someone who really knows what they are talking about could tell us all which one to buy and why :)

So far to me it seems fairly simple.

EPIRB is a bit bigger and more expensive (?) but if activated it will be picked up no matter where you are, and show to the search and rescue mob an exact position who owns it etc. They also broadcast on the old system still so air traffic will pick it up also.

PLB will work just fine but only be picked up by commercial vessels in a 4nm (7ish km) radius. Ma and Pa fishing for whiting in the tinny won't get it. Neither will the search and rescue mobs.????????????????????????

To me that rules out the latter for a lot of Australian windsurfing spots. Unless u only sail metro, get an EPIRB cos in the PLB scenario :
there will be no commercial vessels passing nearby when u need it along most of the Oz coast. Then do you think Mr OilTanker who does receive it (if u r lucky) will come in shallow to look for you? Noo, he will report a 'maybe activation' at 93deg from his position, and keep going. Then u drift further and the rescue mob still have to figure out where u are 2hrs later. Be realistic it is designed for man over situations that are discovered very quickly and they are already looking for you.

A PLB will do sweet fk-all at more then half the good common wavesailing spots I can think of in WA??????????????

Then there is some crossover in the very expensive models. If that worried about it, stick an EPIRB in a impact vest. Done.

With respect Mark, YOU DO NOT KNOW HOW PLB'S OPERATE and can't possibly be considered as 'SOMEONE WHO REALLY KNOWS WHAT THEY ARE TALKING ABOUT' (looks like you're confusing a PLB with the Nautilus Lifeline)

Taken from: www.oroliamaritime.com/2019/03/20/what-is-an-epirb/

Personal Location Beacons work in exactly the same way as EPIRBs by sending a coded message on the 406 MHz distress frequency which is relayed via the Cospas-Sarsat global satellite system. However, there are a number of differences between them. PLBs are designed to be carried on the person so they are much smaller, some such as the Fast find are not much larger than the size of a mobile phone. PLBs are designed to be used anywhere in the world, on the sea and also on land. Some don't float but may come with an additional floatational sleeve which they should be carried in. PLBs, once activated, will transmit for a minimum of 24 hours; while the battery life on an EPIRB is at least double (a minimum of 48 hours). An EPIRB is registered to a vessel, whereas a PLB is registered to a person. This means that if you are crewing a yacht and you switch to a new yacht the plb is still correctly registered; however, if you have an EPIRB and buy a new yacht you will need to re-register it when installing in your new boat.

For anyone still considering a PLB after that half-baked response , this is worth reading with regards to PLB waterproofing standards and reliability:

nswskc.wordpress.com/2011/12/24/rescue-is-just-a-push-of-a-button-away-or-is-it/


Good review of PLB vs Spot:

gnarlydognews.blogspot.com/2010/11/gear-plb-versus-spot.html?m=1


Beacon types and models that meet Aust. Standards, if purchased here (EPIRB & PLB):

beacons.amsa.gov.au/

(Notice how much bulkier the average EPIRB is compared to a PLB)

Sailquick said,

I would assume that any 'phone tracker' App would only work when you are in range of Cell phone reception.

Could anyone confirm if that would be correct, initially I thought yes, but how does a gps tracker (stand alone unit work) when linked to your mobile phone, does the gps- gps app signal still function without reception.

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pirrad said..
Sailquick said,

I would assume that any 'phone tracker' App would only work when you are in range of Cell phone reception.

Could anyone confirm if that would be correct, initially I thought yes, but how does a gps tracker (stand alone unit work) when linked to your mobile phone, does the gps- gps app signal still function without reception.

Depends on the model/app whether it still works without mobile reception but most phones now have a GPS receiver in them, so most still work. The phone will be able to work out where it is but it cant receive the map data to overlay on your screen via mobile reception if you're out of range, nor can it transmit out your location in any way. phones/tablets and GPS will show the map overlay if it's already stored in the device.

phone tracker apps will only work when youre in range of your providers phone network, it uses the same data connection as any other app on your phone.

Dialling triple zero or 112 only works if you're in mobile range of any cellular network, it doesn't magically connect to satellites that many think it does.

There is no substitute for an EPIRB/PLB. Spot1's are still a distance second. Smart phone and apps are so far off the mark it's scary people think they're a good alternative.

Been using one of these for windsurfing
www.whitworths.com.au/acr-resqlink-406mhz-gps-plb

No haven't tested it yet, but it ticks all the boxes that I require. Not sure that I would rely on a phone to save me, bit like using a bit of rope for a uni joint....works but wouldn't trust it

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GazMan said..

For anyone still considering a PLB after that half-baked response , this is worth reading with regards to PLB waterproofing standards and reliability:

nswskc.wordpress.com/2011/12/24/rescue-is-just-a-push-of-a-button-away-or-is-it/


Good review of PLB vs Spot:

gnarlydognews.blogspot.com/2010/11/gear-plb-versus-spot.html?m=1


Beacon types and models that meet Aust. Standards, if purchased here (EPIRB & PLB):

beacons.amsa.gov.au/

(Notice how much bulkier the average EPIRB is compared to a PLB)

Those two articles are nearly 4 and 5 years old so pointless to use them as an argument against PLB's .

The kannad safelink solo that epirbhire sells is approved by AMSA , not sure if epirbhire still sell the rescue me but when i bought mine they were selling that one as well .

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dusta said..

GazMan said..

For anyone still considering a PLB after that half-baked response , this is worth reading with regards to PLB waterproofing standards and reliability:

nswskc.wordpress.com/2011/12/24/rescue-is-just-a-push-of-a-button-away-or-is-it/


Good review of PLB vs Spot:

gnarlydognews.blogspot.com/2010/11/gear-plb-versus-spot.html?m=1


Beacon types and models that meet Aust. Standards, if purchased here (EPIRB & PLB):

beacons.amsa.gov.au/

(Notice how much bulkier the average EPIRB is compared to a PLB)

Those two articles are nearly 4 and 5 years old so pointless to use them as an argument against PLB's .

The kannad safelink solo that epirbhire sells is approved by AMSA , not sure if epirbhire still sell the rescue me but when i bought mine they were selling that one as well .

On the contrary Dusta, I'm not arguing against PLB's that in my opinion are the most suitable option around for offshore windsurfing use that ticks the most boxes (though not all) compared to other distress signalling devices on the market.

Also, the subject of EPIRB vs PLB vs Spot etc, is relatively new to windsurfing and kitesurfing but this topic has been a common talking point amongst offshore sea kayakers for ages (which I've been part of as a keen sea kayaker myself), hence my reason for sharing this 'old info' so that others making a decision to buy a beacon can hopefully be more aware of the pros and cons.

Windsurfing Taliban have decreed no boardies over wetsuit. A fatwa declared on pockets.

High hook buoyancy vests with mesh front pockets are no good. Pocket velcro is weak and flimsy. Mesh is hardly reassuring.
Storm chase guys were wearing ION crash vest with pocket for PLB's & antenna. Looked sensible. Can’t find any sign of them on line.

Question is, where do you get a crash vest with pocket for PLB, car keys and credit card (for taxi fare home)?

So after all this I just found out a PLB is the same as an EPIRB but is a bit smaller.

Lets go for 3 pages.

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Scoob said..
Windsurfing Taliban have decreed no boardies over wetsuit. A fatwa declared on pockets.

High hook buoyancy vests with mesh front pockets are no good. Pocket velcro is weak and flimsy. Mesh is hardly reassuring.
Storm chase guys were wearing ION crash vest with pocket for PLB's & antenna. Looked sensible. Can’t find any sign of them on line.

Question is, where do you get a crash vest with pocket for PLB, car keys and credit card (for taxi fare home)?

for kitesurfing i use an NPX pfd . It has a mesh pocket on the front with velcro but it also has a cord inside the pocket which you can securely attach the plb to .


gogo 3 pages

Who sells the NPX pfd's in WA?

> to page 3 please!

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GazMan said..
Who sells the NPX pfd's in WA?

> to page 3 please!

go see ol reg at Kite Addiction

http://www.kiteaddiction.com.au/gear/accessories/vests/np-high-hook-bouncy-aid-detail


there ya go Mark , 3 pages mate