Hi guys, having a bit of trouble with my new Futura 71. Besides being on the smaller side of what I thought it was going to be (but nothing I can do about that), the footstrap position leaves much to be desired. The front needs to be more toward the rail, and the back can use another 2 cm backward. I can live with the back footstrap, but simply sliding the front foot outward adds half a gear to the board ... not sure what Starboard was thinking and why they did not use the same Isonic positions plus a more inward row ..

Anyway, question is: other than drilling in new footstrap positions, what can I do to move at least the front straps outward?

Select to expand quote

duzzi said..
Hi guys, having a bit of trouble with my new Futura 71. Besides being on the smaller side of what I thought it was going to be (but nothing I can do about that), the footstrap position leaves much to be desired. The front needs to be more toward the rail, and the back can use another 2 cm backward. I can live with the back footstrap, but simply sliding the front foot outward adds half a gear to the board ... not sure what Starboard was thinking and why they did not use the same Isonic positions plus a more inward row ..

Anyway, question is: other than drilling in new footstrap positions, what can I do to move at least the front straps outward?

bummer, not sure why manufacturers skimp on insert options, when we pay 2k+ for boards. Although a dealer told me that the only thing the buyer can compare in the store is the color and the weight.

You could get another cm by using only the outside holes for the front strap. You probably thought of that.

If you make the front strap really small eg just toes through does the heel extend to the rail?

They work used a set for a test on one of my foil boards

boardsportscalifornia.com/product/2-hole-surface-mount-insert-plates/

^^^ by the time you cut up the pads etc to do that, it would look horrid and devalue the board greatly....surely you'd be better off fitting extra real inserts (which board repairers do often) and it can look factory then.

Alternatively, some people make a piece of aluminium or stainless strap to screw into existing holes and have a captive nut at the other end so as to move the strap. At least then you're not changing anything on the board. Pic makes more sense..... Mathew just mentioned it in the GPS forum so sure someone will show here what they've done....

However if you're keeping the board and you're sure you want holes in a certain position, get more inserts put in and the pad holes routered out - it will look factory.

I use those insert plates
boardsportscalifornia.com/product/2-hole-surface-mount-insert-plates/
that Gwarn mentioned above on my "experimental" boards for tweaking footstrap positions.

They work fine, but be prepared to pull them loose sometimes. Keep a roll of 3M gray sticky foam tape handy to replace them. Auto parts stores have it. Also, you should let them "cure" to the board surface for days or weeks before using them. Make sure the board surface is chemically clean (no grease) and smooth (not rough sanded) for adhesion. The gray tape is designed for smooth painted surfaces on cars.

The other really important thing: make sure you don't screw the screws down lower than the lowest edge of the metal insert. If you go further, the screw tip lifts the plate up off the board. It took me a long time to figure this out. So, I purchased a set of screws in various lengths to get it right. Different footstraps have different thicknesses. Spend some time figuring out how many turns the screw needs to be fully engaged, then never go beyond that.

Now after 28 months, they are stuck down very well.

Select to expand quote

thedoor said..

duzzi said..
Hi guys, having a bit of trouble with my new Futura 71. Besides being on the smaller side of what I thought it was going to be (but nothing I can do about that), the footstrap position leaves much to be desired. The front needs to be more toward the rail, and the back can use another 2 cm backward. I can live with the back footstrap, but simply sliding the front foot outward adds half a gear to the board ... not sure what Starboard was thinking and why they did not use the same Isonic positions plus a more inward row ..

Anyway, question is: other than drilling in new footstrap positions, what can I do to move at least the front straps outward?

bummer, not sure why manufacturers skimp on insert options, when we pay 2k+ for boards. Although a dealer told me that the only thing the buyer can compare in the store is the color and the weight.

You could get another cm by using only the outside holes for the front strap. You probably thought of that.

If you make the front strap really small eg just toes through does the heel extend to the rail?

Yes, I thought to use the outside holes, but I am afraid the footstrap will just bend more and the 1 cm will be really 0.5. But I never used the outside holes that way. I could tighten the strap and see where it takes me. To be on the rail it feels like I need to basically take out my foot, little contact with the strap, but it is hard to judge while navigating.

Gwarn and Segler: I thought of the stick-ons but I am not so sure about reliability? I will be going 28-30 knots with this thingy. There are a bit of conflicting opinions on the Web. And for plates, like Mark mentions, I am a bit afraid of the stress that they put on the inserts, although there are two rows to anchor them on on the Futura.

Putting in an extra row start to feel like the best solution ... I have done it a few times before.

Select to expand quote

Gwarn said..
They work used a set for a test on one of my foil boards

boardsportscalifornia.com/product/2-hole-surface-mount-insert-plates/

i wouldn't use these in your situation. they'll likely pop out with the front foot lifting you'd likely be doing (riding at 25+kts and cranking into powered up gybes).

Select to expand quote

thedoor said..

bummer, not sure why manufacturers skimp on insert options, when we pay 2k+ for boards.

two rows of inserts should be more than enough on a Futura - provided they are in the right place.

seems like that isn't the case on the 71 also (as it was on the other sizes i tested myself).

Select to expand quote

duzzi said..

Yes, I thought to use the outside holes, but I am afraid the footstrap will just bend more and the 1 cm will be really 0.5. But I never used the outside holes that way. I could tighten the strap and see where it takes me. To be on the rail it feels like I need to basically take out my foot, little contact with the strap, but it is hard to judge while navigating.

[snip]

Putting in an extra row start to feel like the best solution ... I have done it a few times before.

on the smaller Futuras i tested last year, with the front straps on the outside row, i needed to practically be out of the front strap and on the rail to be where i thought i needed to be. not surprised it's the same on the 71. didn't measure but 1-1.5cm wouldn't surprise me.

i'd agree that installing another row of proper inserts is the better solution.

For a freeride board there should be multiple options for footstraps

Select to expand quote

choco said..
For a freeride board there should be multiple options for footstraps

on the boards i tested there were.

two rows for the front, two for the back (slightly offset front to back, as i recall). three holes in each row (going from memory).

and it's actually a 'freerace' board

Select to expand quote

choco said..
For a freeride board there should be multiple options for footstraps

Yes, it is a Freerace board, quite different from older Futuras, according to Starboard the slalomish shape for long distance. It has two rows of inserts, but the outside row is still not out enough. I am not sure what is the use of the inside row, probably dictated by marketing. Lovely board with a lot of potential. Fast, but need to be powered up properly. Very easy, really eats up chop. And yes Windflyer I pretty much need to be out of the straps, then it feels right.

We have used this method to move the position of footstaps, mainly on speed boards to move them back further, but I don't see any reason why the same technique could work for your case.

Stainless steel plates. Drilled with holes to screw into the existing mounting holes and tapped for a very short screw for the footstrap. The only trick is to use thick enough plates so they don't bend up under unusual loads.

You can remove them but they leave a compressed mark on the pads.

In this pic the plate is covered with a piece of glued on cloth, purely for aesthetics.

Hey, I remember that image, must be about 15 years ago on the very first speed board from starboard...?
I did the same on mine after seeing that image, worked great! :)

That's what I'd recommend too.

The easiest would be to lend your board to someone else and see if they have the same issue though ;)

Could come from (or alleviate with) sailing position, fin size, sail trim, etc.

Once out of warranty period I would just put in some inserts. Sometimes I think the guys who develop these boards have big feet and don't consider the possibility of people having smaller footsies

Once out of warranty period I would just put in some inserts. Sometimes I think the guys who develop these boards have big feet and don't consider the possibility of people having smaller footsies

Select to expand quote

sailquik said..
We have used this method to move the position of footstaps, mainly on speed boards to move them back further, but I don't see any reason why the same technique could work for your case.

Stainless steel plates. Drilled with holes to screw into the existing mounting holes and tapped for a very short screw for the footstrap. The only trick is to use thick enough plates so they don't bend up under unusual loads.

You can remove them but they leave a compressed mark on the pads.

In this pic the plate is covered with a piece of glued on cloth, purely for aesthetics.

hum ... not sure about working with stainless steel. but maybe I can use a carbon plate and some sort of T-nuts, even bike shoe cleat nuts should work to secure the strap to the carbon plate ...

Select to expand quote

sailquik said..
We have used this method to move the position of footstaps, mainly on speed boards to move them back further, but I don't see any reason why the same technique could work for your case.

Stainless steel plates. Drilled with holes to screw into the existing mounting holes and tapped for a very short screw for the footstrap. The only trick is to use thick enough plates so they don't bend up under unusual loads.

the issue in duzzi's case is that going outward the extensions would need to go over a curved area of the board (as opposed to the flat surface just going backwards). so the extensions would need to follow that curved area hugging the deck precisely to work. i can't imagine it'd be easy to bend the plates like that (and not have them bend back with all the front foot lifting action).

Select to expand quote

col5555 said..
Sometimes I think the guys who develop these boards have big feet and don't consider the possibility of people having smaller footsies

maybe just insufficient testing during the pandemic.

Select to expand quote

Manuel7 said..
The easiest would be to lend your board to someone else and see if they have the same issue though ;)

Could come from (or alleviate with) sailing position, fin size, sail trim, etc.

apparently, it is a known issue to Starboard. and they're fixing it for the the 2023/24 version of the board.

and yeah, that's cold comfort for duzzi and all other 2021/22 Futura owners

Select to expand quote

WindFlyer said..

col5555 said..
Sometimes I think the guys who develop these boards have big feet and don't consider the possibility of people having smaller footsies

maybe just insufficient testing during the pandemic.

Manuel7 said..
The easiest would be to lend your board to someone else and see if they have the same issue though ;)

Could come from (or alleviate with) sailing position, fin size, sail trim, etc.

apparently, it is a known issue to Starboard. and they're fixing it for the the 2023/24 version of the board.

and yeah, that's cold comfort for duzzi and all other 2021/22 Futura owners

Well, the board works ... it just misses a really easy to obtain extra five-and-a-half-gear!

And yes, the plates might not work for the front straps, they need to go out not back. I could actually make the curved plate, but it is a lot of work. There is this www-windsurfing33-com.translate.goog/forum/viewtopic.php?f=42&t=125425&sid=970410bc0e4c1ff4455fce8cb8454223&_x_tr_sl=fr&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en, but installing in a chinook two positions insert is not that much harder ...

Select to expand quote

duzzi said..

installing in a chinook two positions insert is not that much harder ...

yes, and it gives you a tuning/anti-twist option.
just be sure to also switch your screws to 6mm ones on those inserts and sail happily ever after.

From a structural point of view , I would be worried about putting extendo plates on a wide board where you lever in the straps . A couple cm , OK , but no more . The levering pressure will surely weaken the plugs . Then they will leak . It would be fine on a thin speed board but not a wide board with a big fin that your hanging off the side.
Id get plugs put in , it's not an expensive job .

Select to expand quote

Imax1 said..
From a structural point of view , I would be worried about putting extendo plates on a wide board where you lever in the straps . A couple cm , OK , but no more . The levering pressure will surely weaken the plugs . Then they will leak . It would be fine on a thin speed board but not a wide board with a big fin that your hanging off the side.
Id get plugs put in , it's not an expensive job .

Yes, I always wondered about that, and anyway a trip downstairs to my garage discovered that I have already the left overs I need to do the proper job. So be it! Before I set out to destroy the Futura, a couple of questions for the professionals on this forum:

(1) In the past, with urethane sandwiched plugs, I always put a couple of layers of 4oz/yard2 (120g/m2?) fiberglass on top. I plan to use the un-sandwiched plugs. Should I bother covering with fiberglass? Is the binding fiberglass/plastic enough to make a difference?

(2) Routing is the weak spot, simply because I never use my router. It scares the hell of me when it turns on, and then I wobble ... Any tricks to go straight and smooth? I do have a dremel that can probably use a router attachment ...

Thanks to everybody by the way!

Sell the board and get something else

If your not confident on doing the mod , I'd get a professional to do it . Your board Is so shiny and new , an extra $200 or so , to get a perfect result is worth it . Remember, any mod may void your warranty and heavily reduce the selling price .
If you have to do it , and want a good job there are a LOT of steps that you need to get right . I'd definitely go at least 4 layers of 4 oz glass over the plugs . Also , if your moving the plugs a long way , you may need heel patches .
If it's an old board , I'd say , definitely give it a go , but being so new .....................?

Select to expand quote

Imax1 said..
If your not confident on doing the mod , I'd get a professional to do it . Your board Is so shiny and new , an extra $200 or so , to get a perfect result is worth it . Remember, any mod may void your warranty and heavily reduce the selling price .
If you have to do it , and want a good job there are a LOT of steps that you need to get right . I'd definitely go at least 4 layers of 4 oz glass over the plugs . Also , if your moving the plugs a long way , you may need heel patches .
If it's an old board , I'd say , definitely give it a go , but being so new .....................?

Done a bunch of mods in the past, including a foil mod (see below), and built two boards ages ago. I am fine with it.
Four layers of 4oz seems an overkill, especially if, as I suspect, there is no significant binding between the plugs top and the fiber. Without the hard foam, the surface of the plug is a few cm^2, and the fiberglass might just have the function to help sealing the area. I'll go for two.

Router question was a (half) joke, I just don't like the tool! but I can always use a drill. Resale value is already non existent. Nobody seems to buy (or sell) a windsurf in the San Francisco Bay Area. Especially a mid size slalom board.

Why ask ? Just go for it.

Select to expand quote

col5555 said..
Once out of warranty period I would just put in some inserts. Sometimes I think the guys who develop these boards have big feet and don't consider the possibility of people having smaller footsies

yeah, the front strap position looks fine to me, my heel would be on the rail, size 13 D width.

Select to expand quote

WindFlyer said..

col5555 said..
Sometimes I think the guys who develop these boards have big feet and don't consider the possibility of people having smaller footsies

maybe just insufficient testing during the pandemic.

Manuel7 said..
The easiest would be to lend your board to someone else and see if they have the same issue though ;)

Could come from (or alleviate with) sailing position, fin size, sail trim, etc.

apparently, it is a known issue to Starboard. and they're fixing it for the the 2023/24 version of the board.

and yeah, that's cold comfort for duzzi and all other 2021/22 Futura owners

Who informed you of the fix for 2023

Select to expand quote

col5555 said..

WindFlyer said..

col5555 said..
Sometimes I think the guys who develop these boards have big feet and don't consider the possibility of people having smaller footsies

maybe just insufficient testing during the pandemic.

Manuel7 said..
The easiest would be to lend your board to someone else and see if they have the same issue though ;)

Could come from (or alleviate with) sailing position, fin size, sail trim, etc.

apparently, it is a known issue to Starboard. and they're fixing it for the the 2023/24 version of the board.

and yeah, that's cold comfort for duzzi and all other 2021/22 Futura owners

Who informed you of the fix for 2023

I heard this too, can't find the video I watched, but Remi V was talking about test the 2023 Futura proto's, he said the shape would remain the same, but the footstraps would be further outboard, because his team all said they we're to inboard.