So, as a relative newbie to wind foiling, I am noticing that wind foilers have a prolific amount of gear (ok, maybe it's just me). But wing foilers have maybe 2 inflatable wings, a board and a foil with 2 front wings, basically that's it. Now me on the other hand... Slingshot Levitator, Ezzy Cheetah 8.0, Sailworks Flyer 6.0 and 7.0, Duotone Super Session 4.8., Sailworks Revolution 3.8, RDM 370, 430 and 460 masts and Chinook booms 130cm-190cm and 165cm-230cm (?). That's a lot of stuff.
I jumped on wind foiling when my buddies went towards SUP downwind foiling because I couldn't chase the conditions with them due to a job change. I live close to many options for wind foiling and I am the only one doing it currently.
One guy in our group was intrigued by by wind foiling but had zero experience, so he grabbed an Ozone Wasp and went to Florida for a month to practice. He is getting really good at it now and I am AMAZED at the range of wind his 6.0 is good for. A week ago we had a particularly windy Sunday and we both met some kiters for an afternoon of fun. The wind was blowing as I rigged my 4.8 Duotone with my SS i84 front wing. I was IMMEDIATELY overpowered and came in to drop to my 3.8 Sailworks Revolution... got out on the water and was STILL over powered. I am not a small guy at 225lbs and 6'4". I do residential excavating and utility work, so I am no weakling.
My friend was on a 6.0 Ozone, Dave Kalama Custom foil board with a GoFoil GL180 and he was just having a ball! I was STOKED for him, but jealous too. I've spent a LOT of money getting set up for what I figured would cover me in the widest possible range of wind conditions, but now I am second guessing myself.
Yesterday we were out in 10-16mph wind, me on the 8.0 Cheetah/i99 front wing and him on his 6.0 Wasp with the GoFoil Maliko 200. The wind kicked up and I went to swap sails down to the Flyer 6.0 and he just kept going.

It's making second guess whether i should stay with wind foiling or go over to Wing foiling....

Thoughts?

I'm sold on wing foiling but windfoil does have its advantages with better speed and bottom end and you can just swap to Windsurfing if it gets too strong, but like you say you'll need 3 sails and a couple of masts to match the wind range of a wing. My 5m Wasp covers me from 10 - 20 knot average wind speed on my 1700 Starboard wave foil @ 70kg. If you plan on getting into the waves I'd go the wing.

Yep now that I know how good the windrange is on the wings I am thinking of getting one myself to replace the high wind sails in my quiver.

I think most of the crew who gravitate to wind foiling were already windsurfers, so acquiring lots of rigs is not required. That was certainly the case for me, since starting windfoiling I've added a 7.1 to my quiver, but otherwise I already have a full quiver of wave/freeride sails that I can use.

@Excav8ter those are pretty big wings (the 99 & 84). I'm similar size to you and I use the Infinity 76 in 12-20K and the Infinity 65 in 20K+. With the 76 I use either a 7.1 or 6.5, and drop down to a 5.7 with the 65.
I find if I get over-powered it is a lot quicker and easier to change down to the 65 wing, than re-rig a smaller sail. Sailing over-powered also gets easier with more practice. I find if I'm really lit I can still sail upwind by feathering the sail in the gusts, and downwind I just sheet all the way out and ride the foil (back foot out of the strap and more weight on the front foot).

Having said that I totally get the appeal of wing foiling, and if I didn't already have a full quiver of windsurf sails I'd be tempted to go the wing foil option.

For me it's about sail power. Imagine trying to windsurf with a windwing.

So I get frothy trying to fully utilize the power of a windsurf sail with a foil - either through upwind speed/angle, carving hard and fast downwind on windswells or flying down a wave face.
Powerful windsurf sails enable small foil wings - so more speed and harder turns.

I use a range of sails and masts because I'm trying to optimise for the conditions - I could just cruise around in 10-25 knots with a 5m.

I see the attraction of windwings for riding nice long waves de-powered.
And anything that gets crew into windsports and foiling has to be a good thing

There are quite a few variables at play with foiling aren't there? I use my 8.0 foil sail with a (Starboard) 800cm2 front wing in a range of conditions, from 8kts to 20+. Nothing worst than having to change sails and I choose this option as it is the most adaptable (as I am lazy). I can see the attraction of a small wave sail on a big wing but I don't feel they are as adaptable in a broader range of conditions.

Not sure about much more gear (I've been windfoiling for the last 2yrs (freeride/wave) and windfoiling this year).
Current set up and expected wind use and only one 112L 6ft custom Reefwarrior board.Slingshot 99 and 76 ( also have Gofoils but not using as much)Windfoiling
5.8 10-15 knots SS 99
4.3 and 4.9 14-20 knots (depends on SS99 or SS 76)
3.7 16-27 knots and above (tried 3.4 and 2.9 sails but don't find much advantage, too twitchy)

Wingfoiling
14-25 knots 4m Ozone Wasp with SS 99 (likely SS76 soon in the stronger range)
Expected 10-15 knots with a 6m and SS99

There's pro and cons to both
I like both and love winsurfing in good waves (still cant' be beat)
Anything that gets me on the water.

Equipment wise considering the above, likely will be travelling with
5.8 sail, 4m wing, 3.7 sail
one foil board, 2 foil wings
one 80L winsurf wave board.

I do both, but my wind foiling is more analogous to my wing foiling. By that, I mean I use the same sizes across the board. I wind foil strapless and upright, same stance and setup as when I SUP foil. When I'm down winding on chop or small waves, I hold mast with one hand off to the side like the wing. Wind foiling is better upwind due to the physics of the sail, wing foiling is easier setup. All said though, the wing is the way to go for those not coming from a windsurfing or kite background. They are both so damn fun.

I have been wind foiling for a year right now, and past weekend was my first wing session, and I find the traction motion of wing vs sail is a bit different. It felt like the foil was too far back in the track for the wing to lift me up.

Do you use a more forward position in the track for wing foiling vs wind foiling?

some of this probably also comes down to the windsurfing mentality of having lots of stuff... some of the guys who have come to winging from windsurfing already have multiple boards, wings, and foils. Other guys buy one wing with the intention of quivering up. These guys also have lots of surfboards, mountain bikes, snowboards, etc...

one of my friends when he started winging (having windsurfed 20 years prior) said he just wanted it to be simple... one wing, one board, one foil... just wanted to do it locally and not chase conditions... mostly would just be for light wind. Two months later he has another wing and 2 more on the way, another foil on the way, another two boards in the pipe. Us boys like our toys. Plus he's driving all over the place to wing... and he's having a great time, so hell why not? People themselves will make it as complex or as simple as they want IMO

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sunsetsailboards said..
some of this probably also comes down to the windsurfing mentality of having lots of stuff... some of the guys who have come to winging from windsurfing already have multiple boards, wings, and foils. Other guys buy one wing with the intention of quivering up. These guys also have lots of surfboards, mountain bikes, snowboards, etc...

one of my friends when he started winging (having windsurfed 20 years prior) said he just wanted it to be simple... one wing, one board, one foil... just wanted to do it locally and not chase conditions... mostly would just be for light wind. Two months later he has another wing and 2 more on the way, another foil on the way, another two boards in the pipe. Us boys like our toys. Plus he's driving all over the place to wing... and he's having a great time, so hell why not? People themselves will make it as complex or as simple as they want IMO

Good analysis. Same thing happened in the early days of kiting. Yes the wind range on kites was bigger than a sail but people still ended up with 3 kites to cover the wind range of five sails. People like to use kit that is closer to optimal for the conditions.

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Boemix said..
I have been wind foiling for a year right now, and past weekend was my first wing session, and I find the traction motion of wing vs sail is a bit different. It felt like the foil was too far back in the track for the wing to lift me up.

Do you use a more forward position in the track for wing foiling vs wind foiling?

For the wing move it all the way forward, it gives you a more balanced point on the board. I only have my track 2-4 cm's back when I Windfoil as I'm using the same stance as wing foiling. Moving it back let's me carve a little harder of waves and chop without feeling the tail slide out.

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Pointman said..
I think most of the crew who gravitate to wind foiling were already windsurfers, so acquiring lots of rigs is not required. That was certainly the case for me, since starting windfoiling I've added a 7.1 to my quiver, but otherwise I already have a full quiver of wave/freeride sails that I can use.

@Excav8ter those are pretty big wings (the 99 & 84). I'm similar size to you and I use the Infinity 76 in 12-20K and the Infinity 65 in 20K+. With the 76 I use either a 7.1 or 6.5, and drop down to a 5.7 with the 65.
I find if I get over-powered it is a lot quicker and easier to change down to the 65 wing, than re-rig a smaller sail. Sailing over-powered also gets easier with more practice. I find if I'm really lit I can still sail upwind by feathering the sail in the gusts, and downwind I just sheet all the way out and ride the foil (back foot out of the strap and more weight on the front foot).

Having said that I totally get the appeal of wing foiling, and if I didn't already have a full quiver of windsurf sails I'd be tempted to go the wing foil option.

I must be doing something wrong. I read about guys who are using (or maybe just claim to be) such small sails in conditions that I'd be on something 1.5 to 2 meters bigger. Maybe they're all in salt water and the added buoyancy is helping a bit. Or maybe I'm in lighter wind than I think.
Currently, this is the range I feel I get for my sails.
Cheetah 8.0 - 8 to 14mph
Flyer 7.0 12-18mph
Flyer 6.0 16-22mph
Super session 4.8 20-28mph
These are all rough estimates based on anemometer readings before and during a session. The Sailworks Revolution 3.8 i have only came out once and it was blowing 28-40mph, and i just flat out was out of my league.

Generally I'm on my i84 wing with the 6.0 and smaller size sails. The 8.0 is pretty much only used with the i99... but i will use the i99 with ALL of the sails depending on how I'm feeling that day.

From what I saw of my friend with his 6.0 Ozone and his GoFoil GL180 and Maliko 200, he has a range from 10 mph to 30mph with one wing and two front foils.

As mentioned, I could switch to windsurfing when it gets blowing too hard for me to handle the foil.

I think i need to add an i76 to my quiver.

When you drop down in front foil wing size, I assume that speed picks up dramatically too, correct?

I am getting more comfortable with the idea of going faster, but frankly had figured that i would rather just try and ride swells and do some mild carving. Go upwind, then ride swells downwind and so on. No interest in doing ins and outs in waves and shore break.

Maybe with more practice and trying to move my sail mast forward when i start getting overpowered will help? Should I also move my foil mast backwards?

Sorry to ramble on... just trying to make sense of this wind foiling thing.

Local wingdingers can get foiling about when I can with a 4.7-5.2~ so around a steady 12-14kts.
I can run that 4.7 up to a comfortable 25kts then it gets uncomfortable. They seem happy enough on the same wing up to 30kts.

They can't match the upwind angles although we are on similar foils. Getting up on their boards in steep chop doesn't look fun. Waterstarting my sail is significantly faster.

Their transitions (especially tacks) look graceful and far easier.

Yep a smaller wing will typically be faster, there are other factors like aspect ratios, but all things being equal you'll go faster. There are lots of outrageous claims on forums about tiny sails in light wind, you mileage may vary. They deserve to be taken with a grain of salt. Back in the old days of fin sailing people would always brag about how windy their session was, now people brag and BS about how windless it was, and it is subjective. My idea of 8mph may be different from someone else's, then there's that actual truth. Nevermind the fact that the local weather station always reads low on certain wind directions. If I was foiling when it read 4mph it doesn't mean I can foil in 4mph. Where I sail we sometimes get a cheese grater chop that makes popping on foil way harder than in smooth conditions. I try not to worry about being on a 7.0 if someone else is on a 5.5 my fun is not contingent on other people schlogging or their rigging choices. As long as I am flying I don't worry about it. Anyways, now I am just rambling...

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excav8ter said..
I must be doing something wrong. I read about guys who are using (or maybe just claim to be) such small sails in conditions that I'd be on something 1.5 to 2 meters bigger. Maybe they're all in salt water and the added buoyancy is helping a bit. Or maybe I'm in lighter wind than I think.
Currently, this is the range I feel I get for my sails.
Cheetah 8.0 - 8 to 14mph
Flyer 7.0 12-18mph
Flyer 6.0 16-22mph
Super session 4.8 20-28mph
These are all rough estimates based on anemometer readings before and during a session.

Readings during a session - does that mean you are referring to iWindsurf meter readings (or similar)?

I usually use iWindsurf meter readings when I talk about wind strength. Australians typically talk about hand-held meters and readings the get at the beach. That can be a huge difference, especially in lighter winds, since the iWindsurf betters are typically 30+ ft up in the air. Last time I was out foiling at my home spot, I got readings on the beach of 12 mph gusting to 14, while the closest iWindsurf meter showed 18 mph averages. At another local spot, the difference tends to be even larger (12 vs. 20) because the wind does not reach the shore well, even in side-on conditions.

It's not just foiling. I had always wondered how Ozzie speedsurfers can go so fast in relatively light wind on sails that would not get me planing at all. When I sailed with them last year, though, I was on the same sail size as guys of similar weight, and got speeds that were comparable to average speedsurfers. It was just the measuring on the beach. Of course, the really fast guys were a lot faster than I was, but I can get that at home, too .

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boardsurfr said..

excav8ter said..
I must be doing something wrong. I read about guys who are using (or maybe just claim to be) such small sails in conditions that I'd be on something 1.5 to 2 meters bigger. Maybe they're all in salt water and the added buoyancy is helping a bit. Or maybe I'm in lighter wind than I think.
Currently, this is the range I feel I get for my sails.
Cheetah 8.0 - 8 to 14mph
Flyer 7.0 12-18mph
Flyer 6.0 16-22mph
Super session 4.8 20-28mph
These are all rough estimates based on anemometer readings before and during a session.

Readings during a session - does that mean you are referring to iWindsurf meter readings (or similar)?

I usually use iWindsurf meter readings when I talk about wind strength. Australians typically talk about hand-held meters and readings the get at the beach. That can be a huge difference, especially in lighter winds, since the iWindsurf betters are typically 30+ ft up in the air. Last time I was out foiling at my home spot, I got readings on the beach of 12 mph gusting to 14, while the closest iWindsurf meter showed 18 mph averages. At another local spot, the difference tends to be even larger (12 vs. 20) because the wind does not reach the shore well, even in side-on conditions.

It's not just foiling. I had always wondered how Ozzie speedsurfers can go so fast in relatively light wind on sails that would not get me planing at all. When I sailed with them last year, though, I was on the same sail size as guys of similar weight, and got speeds that were comparable to average speedsurfers. It was just the measuring on the beach. Of course, the really fast guys were a lot faster than I was, but I can get that at home, too .

I check the wind with a handheld anemometer. I use weather stations as a guide for what to expect, but pretty much always use my Skywatch anemometer when I get to the site I plan to sail from.

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Windbot said..
Yep a smaller wing will typically be faster, there are other factors like aspect ratios, but all things being equal you'll go faster. There are lots of outrageous claims on forums about tiny sails in light wind, you mileage may vary. They deserve to be taken with a grain of salt. Back in the old days of fin sailing people would always brag about how windy their session was, now people brag and BS about how windless it was, and it is subjective. My idea of 8mph may be different from someone else's, then there's that actual truth. Nevermind the fact that the local weather station always reads low on certain wind directions. If I was foiling when it read 4mph it doesn't mean I can foil in 4mph. Where I sail we sometimes get a cheese grater chop that makes popping on foil way harder than in smooth conditions. I try not to worry about being on a 7.0 if someone else is on a 5.5 my fun is not contingent on other people schlogging or their rigging choices. As long as I am flying I don't worry about it. Anyways, now I am just rambling...

I'm ok with going faster, as long as I'm not going to experience the same perceived feeling of lift, or over-foiling, just at a higher speed. I am not in this for speed, just to have fun and learn to ride small swells and carve easy, flowing turns. I will pick up an i76 to try out from Mackite. Wind in the forecast for Friday afternoon and evening.

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excav8ter said..

boardsurfr said..

excav8ter said..
I must be doing something wrong. I read about guys who are using (or maybe just claim to be) such small sails in conditions that I'd be on something 1.5 to 2 meters bigger. Maybe they're all in salt water and the added buoyancy is helping a bit. Or maybe I'm in lighter wind than I think.
Currently, this is the range I feel I get for my sails.
Cheetah 8.0 - 8 to 14mph
Flyer 7.0 12-18mph
Flyer 6.0 16-22mph
Super session 4.8 20-28mph
These are all rough estimates based on anemometer readings before and during a session.

Readings during a session - does that mean you are referring to iWindsurf meter readings (or similar)?

I usually use iWindsurf meter readings when I talk about wind strength. Australians typically talk about hand-held meters and readings the get at the beach. That can be a huge difference, especially in lighter winds, since the iWindsurf betters are typically 30+ ft up in the air. Last time I was out foiling at my home spot, I got readings on the beach of 12 mph gusting to 14, while the closest iWindsurf meter showed 18 mph averages. At another local spot, the difference tends to be even larger (12 vs. 20) because the wind does not reach the shore well, even in side-on conditions.

It's not just foiling. I had always wondered how Ozzie speedsurfers can go so fast in relatively light wind on sails that would not get me planing at all. When I sailed with them last year, though, I was on the same sail size as guys of similar weight, and got speeds that were comparable to average speedsurfers. It was just the measuring on the beach. Of course, the really fast guys were a lot faster than I was, but I can get that at home, too .

I check the wind with a handheld anemometer. I use weather stations as a guide for what to expect, but pretty much always use my Skywatch anemometer when I get to the site I plan to sail from.

And your wind estimates may be very accurate indeed, but those claiming outrageously low speeds may just guessing poorly.

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excav8ter said..I'm ok with going faster, as long as I'm not going to experience the same perceived feeling of lift, or over-foiling, just at a higher speed. I am not in this for speed, just to have fun and learn to ride small swells and carve easy, flowing turns. I will pick up an i76 to try out from Mackite. Wind in the forecast for Friday afternoon and evening.

Changing down to the Infinity 76 from the 99 or 84 will definitely be helpful for control (and fun) in stronger winds (at your size).

I'd use B fuse position. Position the foil mast under the back footstaps (rear settings).

If you're out on the water and getting overpowered moving the mast base forward will give additional control.


The 76 tops out at about 21 knots (so not scary fast), doesn't really breach and super fun in the turns

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excav8ter said..

Pointman said..
I think most of the crew who gravitate to wind foiling were already windsurfers, so acquiring lots of rigs is not required. That was certainly the case for me, since starting windfoiling I've added a 7.1 to my quiver, but otherwise I already have a full quiver of wave/freeride sails that I can use.

@Excav8ter those are pretty big wings (the 99 & 84). I'm similar size to you and I use the Infinity 76 in 12-20K and the Infinity 65 in 20K+. With the 76 I use either a 7.1 or 6.5, and drop down to a 5.7 with the 65.
I find if I get over-powered it is a lot quicker and easier to change down to the 65 wing, than re-rig a smaller sail. Sailing over-powered also gets easier with more practice. I find if I'm really lit I can still sail upwind by feathering the sail in the gusts, and downwind I just sheet all the way out and ride the foil (back foot out of the strap and more weight on the front foot).

Having said that I totally get the appeal of wing foiling, and if I didn't already have a full quiver of windsurf sails I'd be tempted to go the wing foil option.

I must be doing something wrong. I read about guys who are using (or maybe just claim to be) such small sails in conditions that I'd be on something 1.5 to 2 meters bigger. Maybe they're all in salt water and the added buoyancy is helping a bit. Or maybe I'm in lighter wind than I think.
Currently, this is the range I feel I get for my sails.
Cheetah 8.0 - 8 to 14mph
Flyer 7.0 12-18mph
Flyer 6.0 16-22mph
Super session 4.8 20-28mph
These are all rough estimates based on anemometer readings before and during a session. The Sailworks Revolution 3.8 i have only came out once and it was blowing 28-40mph, and i just flat out was out of my league.

Generally I'm on my i84 wing with the 6.0 and smaller size sails. The 8.0 is pretty much only used with the i99... but i will use the i99 with ALL of the sails depending on how I'm feeling that day.

From what I saw of my friend with his 6.0 Ozone and his GoFoil GL180 and Maliko 200, he has a range from 10 mph to 30mph with one wing and two front foils.

As mentioned, I could switch to windsurfing when it gets blowing too hard for me to handle the foil.

I think i need to add an i76 to my quiver.

When you drop down in front foil wing size, I assume that speed picks up dramatically too, correct?

I am getting more comfortable with the idea of going faster, but frankly had figured that i would rather just try and ride swells and do some mild carving. Go upwind, then ride swells downwind and so on. No interest in doing ins and outs in waves and shore break.

Maybe with more practice and trying to move my sail mast forward when i start getting overpowered will help? Should I also move my foil mast backwards?

Sorry to ramble on... just trying to make sense of this wind foiling thing.

Excav8ter,

VCRWoody and Cyber have developed this benchmarking to help answer the weight, foil, wind, sail question.

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Windsurfing/Foiling/SS-Infinity-Wings-Knots-Sail?page=2#9

Sounds like your problem is having too much wind!!!! That's NOT a problem its a BLESSING!!! My thoughts are you could just go to windsurfing if the wind picks up. Or just go to a smaller front wing. Either way, I wish I had your problems ;)

DC

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Dcharlton said..
Sounds like your problem is having too much wind!!!! That's NOT a problem its a BLESSING!!! My thoughts are you could just go to windsurfing if the wind picks up. Or just go to a smaller front wing. Either way, I wish I had your problems ;)

DC

I don't think we get wind like that more than 10 times a year. I was just stunned that a 3.8 was too much sail, and my friend on his 6.0 Ozone was having a blast.

I will probably try windsurfing on my old Bruce Jones 9'2" at some point, but it's been 18 years since it's been wet.

Ah...Bruce Jones. What a guy, RIP. I have a Bruce Jones 10' epoxy surfboard. It's a wave catching machine. I rode it a lot on Lake Michigan where you need a board like that.

Here's a back to back comparison. He doesn't say it in as many words, but I think Kai gives the wingding a win on points. ( Of course he doesn't look a day over 17 )

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Windsurfing/Wave-sailing/Kai-doing-what-he-s-good-at?page=1

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excav8ter said..

Pointman said..
I think most of the crew who gravitate to wind foiling were already windsurfers, so acquiring lots of rigs is not required. That was certainly the case for me, since starting windfoiling I've added a 7.1 to my quiver, but otherwise I already have a full quiver of wave/freeride sails that I can use.

@Excav8ter those are pretty big wings (the 99 & 84). I'm similar size to you and I use the Infinity 76 in 12-20K and the Infinity 65 in 20K+. With the 76 I use either a 7.1 or 6.5, and drop down to a 5.7 with the 65.
I find if I get over-powered it is a lot quicker and easier to change down to the 65 wing, than re-rig a smaller sail. Sailing over-powered also gets easier with more practice. I find if I'm really lit I can still sail upwind by feathering the sail in the gusts, and downwind I just sheet all the way out and ride the foil (back foot out of the strap and more weight on the front foot).

Having said that I totally get the appeal of wing foiling, and if I didn't already have a full quiver of windsurf sails I'd be tempted to go the wing foil option.

I must be doing something wrong. I read about guys who are using (or maybe just claim to be) such small sails in conditions that I'd be on something 1.5 to 2 meters bigger. Maybe they're all in salt water and the added buoyancy is helping a bit. Or maybe I'm in lighter wind than I think.
Currently, this is the range I feel I get for my sails.
Cheetah 8.0 - 8 to 14mph
Flyer 7.0 12-18mph
Flyer 6.0 16-22mph
Super session 4.8 20-28mph
These are all rough estimates based on anemometer readings before and during a session. The Sailworks Revolution 3.8 i have only came out once and it was blowing 28-40mph, and i just flat out was out of my league.

Generally I'm on my i84 wing with the 6.0 and smaller size sails. The 8.0 is pretty much only used with the i99... but i will use the i99 with ALL of the sails depending on how I'm feeling that day.

From what I saw of my friend with his 6.0 Ozone and his GoFoil GL180 and Maliko 200, he has a range from 10 mph to 30mph with one wing and two front foils.

As mentioned, I could switch to windsurfing when it gets blowing too hard for me to handle the foil.

I think i need to add an i76 to my quiver.

When you drop down in front foil wing size, I assume that speed picks up dramatically too, correct?

I am getting more comfortable with the idea of going faster, but frankly had figured that i would rather just try and ride swells and do some mild carving. Go upwind, then ride swells downwind and so on. No interest in doing ins and outs in waves and shore break.

Maybe with more practice and trying to move my sail mast forward when i start getting overpowered will help? Should I also move my foil mast backwards?

Sorry to ramble on... just trying to make sense of this wind foiling thing.

Get a 76 and try to ride it sooner than you thought you could .
I begun last summer windfoiling and all I had was an 84 , this year I decided to move to Moses and got a 790 and 1100 which is more or less similar to the Infinity 76 and 84 . Then I decided to use the 790 to see the difference with my previous 84 with the same board and wind strenth , Wow what a difference , I understand I was way over foil most of the time prior to this 790 . I still need a big wing but all I want to ride now is the smaller one . Way more comfortable and stable . At least for my level .

reefwarriors.wordpress.com/2019/12/10/wingy-dingy-thingy-vs-wwf-comparison/

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kiter49 said..

excav8ter said..

Pointman said..
I think most of the crew who gravitate to wind foiling were already windsurfers, so acquiring lots of rigs is not required. That was certainly the case for me, since starting windfoiling I've added a 7.1 to my quiver, but otherwise I already have a full quiver of wave/freeride sails that I can use.

@Excav8ter those are pretty big wings (the 99 & 84). I'm similar size to you and I use the Infinity 76 in 12-20K and the Infinity 65 in 20K+. With the 76 I use either a 7.1 or 6.5, and drop down to a 5.7 with the 65.
I find if I get over-powered it is a lot quicker and easier to change down to the 65 wing, than re-rig a smaller sail. Sailing over-powered also gets easier with more practice. I find if I'm really lit I can still sail upwind by feathering the sail in the gusts, and downwind I just sheet all the way out and ride the foil (back foot out of the strap and more weight on the front foot).

Having said that I totally get the appeal of wing foiling, and if I didn't already have a full quiver of windsurf sails I'd be tempted to go the wing foil option.

I must be doing something wrong. I read about guys who are using (or maybe just claim to be) such small sails in conditions that I'd be on something 1.5 to 2 meters bigger. Maybe they're all in salt water and the added buoyancy is helping a bit. Or maybe I'm in lighter wind than I think.
Currently, this is the range I feel I get for my sails.
Cheetah 8.0 - 8 to 14mph
Flyer 7.0 12-18mph
Flyer 6.0 16-22mph
Super session 4.8 20-28mph
These are all rough estimates based on anemometer readings before and during a session. The Sailworks Revolution 3.8 i have only came out once and it was blowing 28-40mph, and i just flat out was out of my league.

Generally I'm on my i84 wing with the 6.0 and smaller size sails. The 8.0 is pretty much only used with the i99... but i will use the i99 with ALL of the sails depending on how I'm feeling that day.

From what I saw of my friend with his 6.0 Ozone and his GoFoil GL180 and Maliko 200, he has a range from 10 mph to 30mph with one wing and two front foils.

As mentioned, I could switch to windsurfing when it gets blowing too hard for me to handle the foil.

I think i need to add an i76 to my quiver.

When you drop down in front foil wing size, I assume that speed picks up dramatically too, correct?

I am getting more comfortable with the idea of going faster, but frankly had figured that i would rather just try and ride swells and do some mild carving. Go upwind, then ride swells downwind and so on. No interest in doing ins and outs in waves and shore break.

Maybe with more practice and trying to move my sail mast forward when i start getting overpowered will help? Should I also move my foil mast backwards?

Sorry to ramble on... just trying to make sense of this wind foiling thing.

Get a 76 and try to ride it sooner than you thought you could .
I begun last summer windfoiling and all I had was an 84 , this year I decided to move to Moses and got a 790 and 1100 which is more or less similar to the Infinity 76 and 84 . Then I decided to use the 790 to see the difference with my previous 84 with the same board and wind strenth , Wow what a difference , I understand I was way over foil most of the time prior to this 790 . I still need a big wing but all I want to ride now is the smaller one . Way more comfortable and stable . At least for my level .

The Moses 1100 shares the same area as an i84 but It's a higher aspect wing introduced, iirc, this year. The i84 analog is the 873. Both the 873 and 1100 are 2100cm2 but obviously different widths. i84 on the bottom. The 1100 seems like a nice wing. A couple of locals find it easy to fly.

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Lecum said..
reefwarriors.wordpress.com/2019/12/10/wingy-dingy-thingy-vs-wwf-comparison/

Agreed for the most part. I found the downwind aspect much the same. I also give wind foiling a big edge upwind as the sail is just more aerodynamic w a small leading edge compared to my wing. As you mentioned, you can also leverage against your sail when carving whereas the wing is more flowing.

If you're someone going strapped in high winds, that gets a little different. But both the freestyle wind and wingers are moving forward at a lightening pace. Going to be a fun ride watching all this develop.

Which one (side by side) -- windfoil or wingfoil? Same place same conditions.

.be

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dejavu said..
Which one (side by side) -- windfoil or wingfoil? Same place same conditions.

.be

Sick video and riders. Max used to be JP right?

PS: Canada is definitely civilized but we couldn't call it paradise with that much rubber