I do most of my foiling now on the HGO 4 cam 9.0.
However, I know the Olympic guys can do 20+ knot windspeed but it does get hairy and I'd rather downsize to about 7.0 and switch to a 650 front and 105+ fuse but stay on the Iq board.

I could get a 4cam foil sail, but that would require another mast and really another boom to take full advantage.

Could also get a 2 cam 7.0ish that fits my ezzy 460 91% rdm.

Will I notice a huge difference between these and the 6.6 camless goya mark I have? So far I've held off from buying more sails, especially the big bucks for a 4cam and another sdm and boom but the thought does cross my mind still. Not sure if a 2cam will make the ride that much more stable or not.

Next time we're on the same water you should slot my 7.0 Flyer into your board and give it a whirl. It's the older 2-cam 4-batten version but I think you'll notice a huge difference for foiling between that and your Goya.

I can't say enough about the newer 3-cam Flyer FR 8.5 but the older Flyer can be found for less than half the price, which makes sense if it's not going to be your primary sail. I was thinking my 7.0 might actually be redundant because the 8.5 FR is so rangy that I can stretch down to where a 5.7 Revo kinda works, but in that 15kt range the 8.5 feels pretty big and the 5.7 needs a gust or a lot of pumping. The 7.0 is perfect.

I'm completely sold on Foil-specific sails in larger sizes, btw. The 8.5 FW is way more fun to foil than my 8.6 NX, and the 7.0 Flyer much better on a foil than my 7.5 Speedfreak.

I use the Neil Pryde Flight Evo 7metre once it gets over 18 knots wind speed and thats lighter than the 9m HGO and pretty quick as its a race sail. Its a 4 cam.

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Awalkspoiled said..
Next time we're on the same water you should slot my 7.0 Flyer into your board and give it a whirl. It's the older 2-cam 4-batten version but I think you'll notice a huge difference for foiling between that and your Goya.

I can't say enough about the newer 3-cam Flyer FR 8.5 but the older Flyer can be found for less than half the price, which makes sense if it's not going to be your primary sail. I was thinking my 7.0 might actually be redundant because the 8.5 FR is so rangy that I can stretch down to where a 5.7 Revo kinda works, but in that 15kt range the 8.5 feels pretty big and the 5.7 needs a gust or a lot of pumping. The 7.0 is perfect.

I'm completely sold on Foil-specific sails in larger sizes, btw. The 8.5 FW is way more fun to foil than my 8.6 NX, and the 7.0 Flyer much better on a foil than my 7.5 Speedfreak.

Oh yeah I'd appreciate that a lot. The goya feels a bit "different" on that board compared to the hgo so feeling that would be enlightening. Hopefully it'll be windy enough to try that soon.

Also it looks like they may rig on ezzy masts, hmmm

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Maddlad said..
I use the Neil Pryde Flight Evo 7metre once it gets over 18 knots wind speed and thats lighter than the 9m HGO and pretty quick as its a race sail. Its a 4 cam.

How does it feel compared to other similarly sized sails? I really like the feel of the hgo compared to camless when foiling but I just don't know how to describe it yet. Maybe less twitchy and maybe like it doesn't give the mast base as much pressure.

I am not convinced sails with cams are an advantage, Maui Hot Sails has a line of foil sails with no cams! my Aerotech Freespeed 8.0 is perfect IMO for 8-10 knots, cams would only make it heavier, and it is fast relative to the kite foilers.

Hmm... local kitefoilers here top 40 mph and Jonny has hit 44. That seems fast to me.

I think the difference between the 2 cam 7.0 and 9.0 HGO will be marginal. A 2 cam 7.0 can get you up in about 8 knots, and will deform under load faster than the 9.0.tbh I'd expect the 9.0 HGO to be more controlable in the top-end than a 2 cam 7.0. I'd either go 7.0 fr sail or <5m for those 20 knot days. I often made the jump from 9.0 FR sail to 3.0 wavesail with the same foil, that 2m gap is nothing, especially if you're switching sail "disciplines" too!

That being said, have you tried more downhaul and especially more outhaul? You can crank the HGO like a slalomsail, but the real key to windrange is the outhaul, cranking that will stabilise the preassurepoint in big gusts & therefore limits losing control / foilouts due to gusts to a minimum. Losing / keeping control with a racing sail in high wind is all about the distribution of pressure between your hands and very little to do with foil control or weight etc. If the balance is not exactly equal between your hands both outside and inside gusts you'll feel on edge because that disbalance translates to a disbalance between your legs and therefore pressure on the foil!

The Severne foil glide 7m will rig well on your ezzy 460. I had both and it worked perfectly. A great sail for light to medium wind but started to get out of shape in stronger wind. I did solve this a bit by adding a couple of cam spacers in each cam and increasing downhaul and outhaul by 2cm more than recomended, also increasing the batten tension a bit. Even though it is a freeride sail it has a good turn of speed and I regularly got over 24 on it. Even with 3 cams it only has 5 battens and on an rdm it is never going to be a rigid sail that will handle well in 20kn +. I have since gone to foil race sails and have a 6,7& 8m. Yes they are heavier than the twin Cam free ride alternatives but if you want to get the most from your slalom fuse and wing you would be better off with race sails. I struggled for quite a while in stronger wind with unsuitable sails but cost and availability of foil race sails is a big problem. I was fortunate enough to get second hand sails and matching masts, so didn't cost the earth.
I now have a great set up of quality board, foil and sails and I'm enjoying my foiling more as I'm not fighting anything anymore when the wind kicks in. I am now the weakest link

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WhiteofHeart said..
I think the difference between the 2 cam 7.0 and 9.0 HGO will be marginal. A 2 cam 7.0 can get you up in about 8 knots, and will deform under load faster than the 9.0.tbh I'd expect the 9.0 HGO to be more controlable in the top-end than a 2 cam 7.0. I'd either go 7.0 fr sail or
That being said, have you tried more downhaul and especially more outhaul? You can crank the HGO like a slalomsail, but the real key to windrange is the outhaul, cranking that will stabilise the preassurepoint in big gusts & therefore limits losing control / foilouts due to gusts to a minimum. Losing / keeping control with a racing sail in high wind is all about the distribution of pressure between your hands and very little to do with foil control or weight etc. If the balance is not exactly equal between your hands both outside and inside gusts you'll feel on edge because that disbalance translates to a disbalance between your legs and therefore pressure on the foil!

Interesting. Yes I have cranked the outhaul when it's really strong, but I can't remember how far. I think I took the adjustable as tight as I could pull it. Wind was strong enough that the upper leech was chattering and I was pretty overwhelmed. Water state was such that dropping the sail was a huge event.

Good point about lines. I've been getting them more balanced than they were before. Some gusts have ripped me out of the water but a lot went wrong and it's been a while so presumably I've improved some. Guess I'll have to try more when it's howling and not step down (and make sure others are around).

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WhiteofHeart said..
You can crank the HGO like a slalomsail, but the real key to windrange is the outhaul, cranking that will stabilise the preassurepoint in big gusts & therefore limits losing control / foilouts due to gusts to a minimum. Losing / keeping control with a racing sail in high wind is all about the distribution of pressure between your hands and very little to do with foil control or weight etc. If the balance is not exactly equal between your hands both outside and inside gusts you'll feel on edge because that disbalance translates to a disbalance between your legs and therefore pressure on the foil!

Interesting suggestion. With slalom sails, a lot of the stability comes from the batten touching the boom. Some slalom sails definitely get less stable if you add so much downhaul that the sail cannot touch the boom anymore, and more stable with negative outhaul so the batten is on the boom all the time (although handling the resulting power can be a different issue). With intermediate outhaul settings where the sail touches the boom only in gusts, the pressure point moves forward in gusts, which can help keeping control through more mast foot pressure on slalom gear. But for foiling, I can see that this could cause problems.
Do the battens touch the boom in foil race sails in "normal" trim, and when using lots of outhaul?

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boardsurfr said..

WhiteofHeart said..
You can crank the HGO like a slalomsail, but the real key to windrange is the outhaul, cranking that will stabilise the preassurepoint in big gusts & therefore limits losing control / foilouts due to gusts to a minimum. Losing / keeping control with a racing sail in high wind is all about the distribution of pressure between your hands and very little to do with foil control or weight etc. If the balance is not exactly equal between your hands both outside and inside gusts you'll feel on edge because that disbalance translates to a disbalance between your legs and therefore pressure on the foil!

Interesting suggestion. With slalom sails, a lot of the stability comes from the batten touching the boom. Some slalom sails definitely get less stable if you add so much downhaul that the sail cannot touch the boom anymore, and more stable with negative outhaul so the batten is on the boom all the time (although handling the resulting power can be a different issue). With intermediate outhaul settings where the sail touches the boom only in gusts, the pressure point moves forward in gusts, which can help keeping control through more mast foot pressure on slalom gear. But for foiling, I can see that this could cause problems.
Do the battens touch the boom in foil race sails in "normal" trim, and when using lots of outhaul?

Even with a freeride 2 cam, I put the boom 2 cm past the suggested setting and when overpowered, pull it to the max. Transitioning to full on race sail in that size and even in super light air, it runs well pretty flat. Maybe the airflow has an easier time staying attached to the foil sail because we aren't bouncing around? Along with longer harness lines, I've rigged flatter as I've had more TOW. I also rig my HGO 2cm past the sail bag number. Doesn't touch the boom at that setting and barely touches with the outhaul off. (I could be doing it wrong, of course) I think part of it, too, is that we develop a lot of power in lower winds and as the wind rises, it's more a matter of managing excess power and drag. I'm reminded of the AC boats that would bag out in transitions to power through and then flatten out whether going up or downwind.

Good comment by WoH and goes to what we often say to beginners who've moved up their lines; and then, in gusts, they pull in the back hand and launch themselves skyward.

Foiling is strange. When you first start out, settings are just approximations . As you do it more, it becomes a science of centimeters. I've become an absolute princess about mast base settings, harness lines, outhaul, downhaul, etc. and will tweak something ten times on shore before even going out.

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LeeD said..
Hmm... local kitefoilers here top 40 mph and Jonny has hit 44. That seems fast to me.

Hey, I am not on SanFran bay!, different level of kite foiling and windsurfing here, and I am glad!

Worse!
There is some old dude, maybe 75, doing 20' airs and landing maybe 80' past takeoff, thinking of jumping a spit of land that is rocky and over 25' wide......

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Sandman1221 said..
I am not convinced sails with cams are an advantage, Maui Hot Sails has a line of foil sails with no cams! my Aerotech Freespeed 8.0 is perfect IMO for 8-10 knots, cams would only make it heavier, and it is fast relative to the kite foilers.

Never used a cam sail on a foil, but I suspect that one of the advantages of the cams when foiling is the steadiness of the power you get out the sail. My ACX (no cam) when very powered up is not slower, across the wind, than my old cam sails. But if just powered, or under powered, is less stable with a less stable delivery. And that might not be too good for a foil? But if it works for you and it let you keep up with kite foilers! AAll foils right now, and in the hands of #1-#5 in the world, seem to top out at around 36-38 knots max 2" speed ...

What Swindy and Maddlad said rings true

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duzzi said..

Sandman1221 said..
I am not convinced sails with cams are an advantage, Maui Hot Sails has a line of foil sails with no cams! my Aerotech Freespeed 8.0 is perfect IMO for 8-10 knots, cams would only make it heavier, and it is fast relative to the kite foilers.

Never used a cam sail on a foil, but I suspect that one of the advantages of the cams when foiling is the steadiness of the power you get out the sail. My ACX (no cam) when very powered up is not slower, across the wind, than my old cam sails. But if just powered, or under powered, is less stable with a less stable delivery. And that might not be too good for a foil? But if it works for you and it let you keep up with kite foilers! AAll foils right now, and in the hands of #1-#5 in the world, seem to top out at around 36-38 knots max 2" speed ...

duzzi, I do not keep up with kite foilers, I gain on them! And you should try an Aerotech Freespeed sail, it feels very consistent up to just before getting over powered. The AFS S650 wing is good for around 29-34 knots VMG according to the website, that means you can go faster than 29-34 knots when you do not take into account velocity made good.

That's pretty fast!
I know one SLab kitefoiler using a 750 wing, hitting 43 mph locally. He got launched big time when foil ventilated at full speed. Wind 10-18, him 185 lbs., 15 meter foil kite. Broad reach, very flat water.

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boardsurfr said..

WhiteofHeart said..
You can crank the HGO like a slalomsail, but the real key to windrange is the outhaul, cranking that will stabilise the preassurepoint in big gusts & therefore limits losing control / foilouts due to gusts to a minimum. Losing / keeping control with a racing sail in high wind is all about the distribution of pressure between your hands and very little to do with foil control or weight etc. If the balance is not exactly equal between your hands both outside and inside gusts you'll feel on edge because that disbalance translates to a disbalance between your legs and therefore pressure on the foil!

Interesting suggestion. With slalom sails, a lot of the stability comes from the batten touching the boom. Some slalom sails definitely get less stable if you add so much downhaul that the sail cannot touch the boom anymore, and more stable with negative outhaul so the batten is on the boom all the time (although handling the resulting power can be a different issue). With intermediate outhaul settings where the sail touches the boom only in gusts, the pressure point moves forward in gusts, which can help keeping control through more mast foot pressure on slalom gear. But for foiling, I can see that this could cause problems.
Do the battens touch the boom in foil race sails in "normal" trim, and when using lots of outhaul?

Pretty much all racers here (me included) use ultra wide booms for racing (the formula wide ones, like these: point-7.com/product/carbon-pro-boom/?q=%2Fproduct%2Fcarbon-pro-boom%2F&v=796834e7a283), so the sail is pretty much never touching the boom. That said, my range for my sail (Phantom FR) was anywhere between 1cm negative to 5cm positive, so relatively thight. Thighter ouhtaul also makes a massive difference in upwind performance, as any backhand pressure kills your angle.

In my experience the power moves back when a gust hits, not forward? Thats what causes foilouts for me anyway. A cranked outhaul and shifting my back hand back in gusts counters this.

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Swindy said..
The Severne foil glide 7m will rig well on your ezzy 460. I had both and it worked perfectly. A great sail for light to medium wind but started to get out of shape in stronger wind. I did solve this a bit by adding a couple of cam spacers in each cam and increasing downhaul and outhaul by 2cm more than recomended, also increasing the batten tension a bit. Even though it is a freeride sail it has a good turn of speed and I regularly got over 24 on it. Even with 3 cams it only has 5 battens and on an rdm it is never going to be a rigid sail that will handle well in 20kn +. I have since gone to foil race sails and have a 6,7& 8m. Yes they are heavier than the twin Cam free ride alternatives but if you want to get the most from your slalom fuse and wing you would be better off with race sails. I struggled for quite a while in stronger wind with unsuitable sails but cost and availability of foil race sails is a big problem. I was fortunate enough to get second hand sails and matching masts, so didn't cost the earth.
I now have a great set up of quality board, foil and sails and I'm enjoying my foiling more as I'm not fighting anything anymore when the wind kicks in. I am now the weakest link

You were 100% correct.

Got a used, great condition 3 cam foil glide 2 7.0 and took it out on the ezzy hookipa 460. Was only on the slingshot 76, not a race sail, as I wanted to feel exactly what was different.

I felt a little bit more mast base pressure than the Freeks/Blade I've been using. It glided a lot better in the lulls than the freeks (because they lose shape), and in the gusts felt much more solid and stable. I think on the foilx it would benefit from 1/2-1cm aft of center to remedy the mast base pressure.

No issue with the mast curve. The cams rotated easily and even better than my 9.0 HGO with severne mast , but maybe that says more about me and my beat up sail and my batten tuning ability than anything else.

It does feel less playful and turny than the freeks and blade, but it kept me flying a lot more in the lulls so it seems like a great lightwind weapon. Should balance nicely with the 105+ and 725 front wing but I have yet to try that combo.

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duzzi said..

Sandman1221 said..
I am not convinced sails with cams are an advantage, Maui Hot Sails has a line of foil sails with no cams! my Aerotech Freespeed 8.0 is perfect IMO for 8-10 knots, cams would only make it heavier, and it is fast relative to the kite foilers.

Never used a cam sail on a foil, but I suspect that one of the advantages of the cams when foiling is the steadiness of the power you get out the sail. My ACX (no cam) when very powered up is not slower, across the wind, than my old cam sails. But if just powered, or under powered, is less stable with a less stable delivery. And that might not be too good for a foil? But if it works for you and it let you keep up with kite foilers! AAll foils right now, and in the hands of #1-#5 in the world, seem to top out at around 36-38 knots max 2" speed ...

Well the Aerotech Phantom 4.5 is a remarkably On/Off sail when used for foiling in 15+ knots, just a little sheeting out will depower the sail, versus my Freespeeds which depower more gradually and that makes it more likely that a gust will cause a foil out.

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Sandman1221 said..

duzzi said..

Sandman1221 said..
I am not convinced sails with cams are an advantage, Maui Hot Sails has a line of foil sails with no cams! my Aerotech Freespeed 8.0 is perfect IMO for 8-10 knots, cams would only make it heavier, and it is fast relative to the kite foilers.

Never used a cam sail on a foil, but I suspect that one of the advantages of the cams when foiling is the steadiness of the power you get out the sail. My ACX (no cam) when very powered up is not slower, across the wind, than my old cam sails. But if just powered, or under powered, is less stable with a less stable delivery. And that might not be too good for a foil? But if it works for you and it let you keep up with kite foilers! AAll foils right now, and in the hands of #1-#5 in the world, seem to top out at around 36-38 knots max 2" speed ...

Well the Aerotech Phantom 4.5 is a remarkably On/Off sail when used for foiling in 15+ knots, just a little sheeting out will depower the sail, versus my Freespeeds which depower more gradually and that makes it more likely that a gust will cause a foil out.

I was thinking 8.0m in 10knts to a 4.5m in 15+ knots was a huge jump in sizes but upon rereading it makes sense now I see you have a 2knt windrange for sails.

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aeroegnr said..

Swindy said..
The Severne foil glide 7m will rig well on your ezzy 460. I had both and it worked perfectly. A great sail for light to medium wind but started to get out of shape in stronger wind. I did solve this a bit by adding a couple of cam spacers in each cam and increasing downhaul and outhaul by 2cm more than recomended, also increasing the batten tension a bit. Even though it is a freeride sail it has a good turn of speed and I regularly got over 24 on it. Even with 3 cams it only has 5 battens and on an rdm it is never going to be a rigid sail that will handle well in 20kn +. I have since gone to foil race sails and have a 6,7& 8m. Yes they are heavier than the twin Cam free ride alternatives but if you want to get the most from your slalom fuse and wing you would be better off with race sails. I struggled for quite a while in stronger wind with unsuitable sails but cost and availability of foil race sails is a big problem. I was fortunate enough to get second hand sails and matching masts, so didn't cost the earth.
I now have a great set up of quality board, foil and sails and I'm enjoying my foiling more as I'm not fighting anything anymore when the wind kicks in. I am now the weakest link

You were 100% correct.

Got a used, great condition 3 cam foil glide 2 7.0 and took it out on the ezzy hookipa 460. Was only on the slingshot 76, not a race sail, as I wanted to feel exactly what was different.

I felt a little bit more mast base pressure than the Freeks/Blade I've been using. It glided a lot better in the lulls than the freeks (because they lose shape), and in the gusts felt much more solid and stable. I think on the foilx it would benefit from 1/2-1cm aft of center to remedy the mast base pressure.

No issue with the mast curve. The cams rotated easily and even better than my 9.0 HGO with severne mast , but maybe that says more about me and my beat up sail and my batten tuning ability than anything else.

It does feel less playful and turny than the freeks and blade, but it kept me flying a lot more in the lulls so it seems like a great lightwind weapon. Should balance nicely with the 105+ and 725 front wing but I have yet to try that combo.

I don't know that you need to go all the way down to the 725 to enjoy the new 7.0. Give it a go with the 900 and I imagine you'll be impressed with it being a lot more slippery and stable than what you've used in the past and you'll get a lot of wind range out of it. Of course, if you are well-powered, the 725 will be fun, too.

The i76 has many virtues but you may enjoy trying the 7.0 on foils that accelerate a bit more.

Sounds like a sail you will enjoy. Congratulations.

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Paducah said..

aeroegnr said..

Swindy said..
The Severne foil glide 7m will rig well on your ezzy 460. I had both and it worked perfectly. A great sail for light to medium wind but started to get out of shape in stronger wind. I did solve this a bit by adding a couple of cam spacers in each cam and increasing downhaul and outhaul by 2cm more than recomended, also increasing the batten tension a bit. Even though it is a freeride sail it has a good turn of speed and I regularly got over 24 on it. Even with 3 cams it only has 5 battens and on an rdm it is never going to be a rigid sail that will handle well in 20kn +. I have since gone to foil race sails and have a 6,7& 8m. Yes they are heavier than the twin Cam free ride alternatives but if you want to get the most from your slalom fuse and wing you would be better off with race sails. I struggled for quite a while in stronger wind with unsuitable sails but cost and availability of foil race sails is a big problem. I was fortunate enough to get second hand sails and matching masts, so didn't cost the earth.
I now have a great set up of quality board, foil and sails and I'm enjoying my foiling more as I'm not fighting anything anymore when the wind kicks in. I am now the weakest link

You were 100% correct.

Got a used, great condition 3 cam foil glide 2 7.0 and took it out on the ezzy hookipa 460. Was only on the slingshot 76, not a race sail, as I wanted to feel exactly what was different.

I felt a little bit more mast base pressure than the Freeks/Blade I've been using. It glided a lot better in the lulls than the freeks (because they lose shape), and in the gusts felt much more solid and stable. I think on the foilx it would benefit from 1/2-1cm aft of center to remedy the mast base pressure.

No issue with the mast curve. The cams rotated easily and even better than my 9.0 HGO with severne mast , but maybe that says more about me and my beat up sail and my batten tuning ability than anything else.

It does feel less playful and turny than the freeks and blade, but it kept me flying a lot more in the lulls so it seems like a great lightwind weapon. Should balance nicely with the 105+ and 725 front wing but I have yet to try that combo.

I don't know that you need to go all the way down to the 725 to enjoy the new 7.0. Give it a go with the 900 and I imagine you'll be impressed with it being a lot more slippery and stable than what you've used in the past and you'll get a lot of wind range out of it. Of course, if you are well-powered, the 725 will be fun, too.

The i76 has many virtues but you may enjoy trying the 7.0 on foils that accelerate a bit more.

Sounds like a sail you will enjoy. Congratulations.

I would guess that yes, the 900 would be better in lighter winds with the 105+. I'm wondering how low I could push it with light wind with that vs. just going full IQFoil. It seems I need something like 8kts minimum with the i76 and 7.0, maybe a little bit more, to get it going on the FoilX. I think I've gotten the IQFoil going in about 7 but I really am not sure. One of these days I'll shim it up with +1 and find out.

I think a lot of it is understanding when to switch foils over, all things being the same. I don't like being in swells so far with race foils because everything happens so fast and I don't feel like I get them fast enough to be good and stable without risking smacking into the swell top. The i76 is benign in comparison, but I don't think I'd want to be in the swells with the cammed sail and i76, but the freeks instead. The 7.0 cammed with either the 900 or 725 and 105+ would be interesting for speed and endurance just due to how well they cut through chop/swells but they aren't really wave riding material from what I have experienced.

Here's some recent clips. Hitting a stingray (I think?) at the beginning, with a long and continuous clip of some flight time and slow jibes (not foiling through) with the foil glide 2 today, and then some flights over stingrays and trying to carve swell with the freek at the end. Lots to work on overall, but still having lots of fun.

The wind today with the foil glide was, if I could guess, 8-12kts. The wind meter read 10-14 or even 15 but it's at least 2 knots high based on my handheld anemometer and it's direction sensitive so it's hard to say exactly.

If you want to stretch the bottom end of the I76 but keep it playful in swell etc then consider the 6.3 Fringe. It's my go-to sail for light wind with a surfy foil.

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Grantmac said..
If you want to stretch the bottom end of the I76 but keep it playful in swell etc then consider the 6.3 Fringe. It's my go-to sail for light wind with a surfy foil.

Yes!

Although for me it's 6.3 freek->5.6 freek -> 5.0 blade -> 4.4 freek

I like the freeks a lot. I'm able to duck the 6.3 easily and have pulled off some successful helitacks and upwind 360s (slogging) on the foilx, now need to get it dialed and try them on a foil.

I don't think there's a huge bottom end minimum flight/takeoff difference between the 6.3 freek and 7.0 foil glide, but the 7.0 will stay flying a lot longer in a lull than the freek will.

That Foilglide 2 7.0 is a nice sail, and surprisingly powerful except when you compare it to other sails with similar measurements - by Duotone/Ezzy/Sailworks standards 488/204 would be around a 7.3-7.5 in most designs, even certain other Severne, and even those with moderate roach and no inset clew. This doesn't appear to be the case with either the 6.0 or 8.0 FG2 though.

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Awalkspoiled said..
That Foilglide 2 7.0 is a nice sail, and surprisingly powerful except when you compare it to other sails with similar measurements - by Duotone/Ezzy/Sailworks standards 488/204 would be around a 7.3-7.5 in most designs, even certain other Severne, and even those with moderate roach and no inset clew. This doesn't appear to be the case with either the 6.0 or 8.0 FG2 though.

You've raised my curiosity.

Definitely looks like the flyer is lower aspect, but it's unclear how close the size is vs. actual size? And the Flyer gets away with the 430 in the 7.0 vs. a 460 for the FoilGlide

Looks like the Duotone's F Pace Cam is even higher aspect with a shorter boom and a 490 luff. But maybe I should've chosen the sleeve induced version vs. sleeve + 2 cams? I dunno

Phantom's Iris Z 6.8 looks closer to the Flyer.

I'm realizing I have no idea what the 7.0 actually means.

Is it area of the cloth of the sail without the mast in it?

Is it projected area from a 3d model when rigged at nominal settings?

Or is it something else? Is it even consistent between companies? How much of it is marketing.

Do you even measure the area of a freestyle sail like the freek which is flat without wind in it vs. a deep bellied camber sail in the same way?

I have the 7.0 Flyers, both the older 4-batten and the newer 5-batten. Both are 2 cam.

The older 7.0 takes a 430 rdm and nothing else.

The newer 7.0 has a longer mast sleeve which takes either 430 rdm with a really long extension, or a 460 rdm.

At my weight of 200 lb with the newer 7.0, the 460 rdm mast is much much better.

Both sails respond very well to adjustable outhaul. This greatly extends their wind range and widens the angle window for upwind/downwind foiling.

The Flyer FR sails were designed more for racing and have a higher aspect ratio than the non-FR Flyers. With a one mile distance between loft and lab (Columbia River), developing and testing sails is a really good process at Sailworks. The Sailworks team slalom races the FR Flyers and really rip.

There are two Flyers. The Flyer and the Flyer FR (freerace). The FR is more high aspect than the regular. You can still get both models. This is the chart for the FR:

Interesting part is that most are going to SDM mast. How many still have under 430 an SDM mast sitting around. I sold all my small ones some time ago (370-400).