Must be getting on for the bottom of the 5th page by now...not bad for discussion about a board that none of us have paddled yet...
correction...now page 6

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Helmy said..
Must be getting on for the bottom of the 5th page by now...not bad for discussion about a board that none of us have paddled yet...
correction...now page 6

There are two FX threads on the standupzone combining for 13 pages now. Free publicity for SIC and Starboard has snuck in there with multiple hits in head to head comparisons and individual reviews as well. Regardless of the initial uncertainty of SIC dimensions and potential stability issues with the uptick in volume and decrease in width, and Starboards flex claims, both outfits definitely stand to up their sales as a result of the online hype. I like that SIC is getting the publicity considering they don't have the marketing expenditure like companies such as Starboard and Naish. I don't recall this much hype for boards since getting involved in this sport.

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Helmy said..
Must be getting on for the bottom of the 5th page by now...not bad for discussion about a board that none of us have paddled yet...
correction...now page 6

worse than Facebook

Well, SIC kinda have a special place in the SUP world, since they are the most successful outfit that specialises in SUP (yes, I know they make other custom things too, but I'm referring to the production output mainly), if you measure success in terms of international race results.

(The most successful specialist SUP outfit worldwide in terms of sales is presumably Red Paddle.)

It is interesting that there is a certain synergy with the most successful (using the same criteria) paddle-specific brand, Quickblade. Both SIC and Quickblade have figureheads who are active competitors themselves (albeit now of course in the older age categories), and who have pretty decent promotion skills, and put quite a lot of time into brand visibility, knowing that in many ways they ARE the brand, like Richard Branson and Virgin.

It is pretty amazing when SUP-specialist outfits (OK yes, I know that QB made non-SUP paddles too, but you know what I mean) like these manage to prosper in the face of the overwhelming distribution and marketing power of the big windsurf/kitesurf brands (eg. Naish, Starboard, Fanatic etc) and now also the distribution, retail and marketing power of the outdoor lifestyle SUP brands, who sell their wares alongside kayaks etc.

I guess they survive by being quick to innovate, being close to the community they serve, and by providing specialist services that the bigger brands would not find profitable because of scale. For these reasons I think the specialist brands can have a special place in the minds and hearts of SUP gear obsessives. And this is reflected in screeds of discussion on forums like this.

I agree that these forums and related websites (eg. SUP Racer, and the multitude of web SUP "magazines") probably contribute quite substantially to the success of these specialist brands. After all, the paddle-specific brand Ke Nalu emerged pretty much entirely out of one Internet forum, created largely by a guy with a marketing background who was very savvy in building a sense of personal investment in, and loyalty to, the brand by members of an Internet forum, a bit like Kickstarter arrangements but without the money. It's a modern tale of entrepreneurialism in the internet age.

SIC FX14 vs STB Allstar 14x25
that is the series FX with 14x25 and 290ltr

Hanza, is that the 25x14 or the 26x14? The board seems to be sitting quite low in the water for a 14.25 board with 290L.

I agree Area 10. The waterline looks nothing like the board in the video still shot above. Maybe it is the camera angle, but it looks like a 12 6, not a 14 also.

New board review on the Zone. www.standupzone.com/forum/index.php/topic,28555.90.html

Looks like the stability concerns have been addressed. Sounds like it may be even More stable than we expected!! VERY STABLE. Repeated several times. I loved this quote "99% of your focus is on paddling better, rather than wasting resources on maintaining balance." Interesting comments about the platform and bottom shapes.

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Rideordie said..
...it looks like a 12 6...

Time for a new thread? Luv to here about the 12'6"!

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Rideordie said..
I agree Area 10. The waterline looks nothing like the board in the video still shot above. Maybe it is the camera angle, but it looks like a 12 6, not a 14 also.

SOrry don't know I just repost the photo from facebook. Def sits lower and that's what I noticed first, event comparing to the video above so must be the 12'6.

Received my board today. No time to ride yet. Just cleaned it up and installed the fin and beach handle. Will install Rail Saver Pro tape tomorrow and launch it. Pictures and review forth coming. Yes, it is 25 wide and 290 liters. It is a beautiful thing. Hope it rides as good as it looks!!

Earth to Rideordie...

Earth to Rideordie...

Thanks for the wake up call Helmy!! Here is a quick review. A few photos will follow. Just to be clear, my board is 14 x 25 290 liters. Check. The rails, as measured at the handle are 6.25 inches thick. To put that into perspective, I measured my X 14 SCC (not the PRO) rails at the handle and got 5 and 1/2 inches. So the rails are full. It is 7.75 at the thickest point of the board foward of the standing area. Construction, fit and finish are excellent. Did have some sort of minor compression damage on the bottom. No paint damage. Not that bad, but enough for me to mention. Not sure if it was a quality control thing or shipping damage. Waiting for a response from the dealer. Have not weighed it but assume 24 lbs is about right. I added Rail Saver Pro XL, which added a bit of weight. I installed the beach start handle to provide an anchor point for my Speed Coach, but the suction cup mount would not adhere to the flat paint. Guess we will have to go the adhesive route later. Slight V in the rockered nose, rides with about only 3- 4 linear inches out of the water when flat. The shape quickly goes to flat throughout the board and all the way out to the very sharp rails, which begin around midpoint and continue through the tail. The back third of the board has a very slight Vee forming slowing and increasing slightly toward the tail. Very interesting. Stepping onto the board, my first impression was that this feels a little tall and tippy, as I have been recently mounting a lower 28.5 in X-14 (barn door). However, this feeling quickly diminished and I immediately became confident in the stability. The wind was a steady 12 mph, but we were on the upwind side of the lake, so the waves did not have time to mount. Notice that more narrow width allowed me to have a more natural and upright stroke. The tall rails, kept the board very dry even when sideways to the wind/waves. The soft nose and soft from rails make it very easy to change directions or spin around. However, the tracking of this board is perhaps the best I have encountered. It does not get blown around in the wind. It is easy to make course corrections in the wind. I did get to point it downwind a bit and it seemed fast and comfortable, as verified by GPS. I was paddling with my friend on his 17 6 unlimited and was actually leading him most of the time. The board floats me very well at 205 lbs and it seemed like it could have handled an even larger rider easily. The board accelerates very quickly from a stop and glide is excellent. It seems to be easy to maintain a high speed and requires less effort in rough water. Due to conditions and time constraints, I did not get a chance to paddle on flat water or any significant downwind. Looking forward to that and want to get in a "typical" 6 mile training run and compare to what I used to do on my X 14 Pro. Oh, I really like the flat deck and feel like I have more room on it than I did on the X 14 or x 14 Pro. There are very slightly raised edges on the rails and pad, so you can feel yourself getting to the edge of the board. Stock fin seems fine to me. I have always liked the 8.3 weedless. Others might like a different shape. Overall impression so far: Well made, a little tall, handles great in the rough and wind, excellent tracking, acceleration and glide. Going to be great over long runs. Seems like it will be wonderful on downwind and good on flats too, but not verified yet. Any questions?

Rideordie,

Good to hear you are liking the stability and volume of the board so far. I also like flatter decks, which not only helps if you want to add tie downs and strap on some gear, but also if need to get well forward on your board if you are exploring in shallow waterways, or just end up in shallow water and need to get your fin up. It's a dicey proposition standing beyond the deck pad on domed/peaked decks, and strapping down gear isn't optimal either.

Looking forward to a more detailed review for rough water paddling in the future.

Btw, spaces man, spaces. Reading large blocks of text without spaces or formed paragraphs is a bit awkward.

Got it.

Spaces .

Rough water report planned.

Loving it so far.

Think it may be as fast as the X14 Pro or faster.

Got it up to 6 mph on flats for a quick sprint after paddling for 4 miles. It's fast! It is sweet on a light down breeze and it fast upwind too. Can't wait for some righteous wind!!

Its great to hear your enthusiasm for the FX, but it's unlikely that it will be as fast as the X14 Pro in pure flat water - at least if you put a bunch of Pro riders on them, anyway. You can't beat a displacement nose in flat water. So that might be setting the bar a bit high. But it would be interesting to know how the speeds would compare over a mixed course that included upwind, downwind, crosswind, flat water and bumps, and in and out of surf. I think that would be a fairer test. It's great to know that Mark Raaphorst has come up with another killer design.

Area 10, I agree with everything that you said. I have not tested it enough yet, but I have put about 11-12 miles on it and I am starting to get a sense of what I have here. Call it what ever you want, but with a much larger fin (Futures Runner) and an effectively shorter paddle (have not adjusted it yet) I am paddling this board as about as fast or faster than my X-14 PRO on mostly flat water in 4-14 mph winds. I have been thinking about this and how the board "feels".

My sense is that this board may not hit as high a peak speed during the stroke, but it stays on glide longer/better. This is verified (granted not much data yet) through my GPS. What I saw was that at speeds averaging 5 mph or more, the X -14 PRO graph was consistently "spiky". What I mean is that the board speed spikes up then drops off quickly, during each side shift, I think. As I look at the graph of the FX with similar speeds, I see much more smooth and consistent speed. The X-14 Pro splits the water, where the FX nose seems to skim on top and encounters less resistance. To put that another way, it seems that the FX stays on trim for me, where as the X Pro would "fall" back down, even though it was wider. It seems to me that would indicate that I was somewhat overweight for the board design/volume of the X PRO, which I think was 253 liters. Either the 290 liters of the FX seems to suit me better, or perhaps this is just a slicker design. I am saying that it is much faster on flats than I expected. Once I getting into a little better racing shape and I have it dialed in on paddle length, foot placement and fin selection, I may pick up some more speed.

It is also going to be interesting to get onto some rougher water, but it is hard to really get a GPS comparison on rough water, as there are so many variables at work. Will be more of a seat of the pants observation. Have not had a chance to get a buddy out with me and switch boards yet. I noticed that I rarely need to move my feet on this board. X Pro was much more sensitive to proper trim and you had to move up and back a bit. Stability is very good and I now would say better than the X-14. Even with the very flat front rocker, the nose of this board is rarely fully engaged in oncoming small waves and when it does there is zero "boof". It is effortless and smooth with no apparently loss of speed. The Carolina Cup race is in a month, so I am getting serious about training. Many miles to go. The more time I spend on the is board, the better I like it. It is simply amazing. If you are reading this note and on the fence about getting one, I say place your order now before they are all sold. It IS THAT good!!

Sounds great. I think this extra glide between strokes might be a feature of these more fat-nose concept boards. I notice this about my Bark Vapor too, and it's actually allowing me to change the way I paddle (for the better). Joe Bark talks about it in one of his videos when he's explaining the Vapor. It also seems to be a feature of the Ace, allowing it to maintain decent forward progress even in chop. I think it may be as much about the relative lack of pitching that this sort of design manages, as about what water does when it hits the nose. I suspect that fat noses don't compress as much into the water during the stroke as displacement noses do. This keeps a flatter trajectory of the board (less bouncing) through the stroke which I suspect leads to great glide during the recovery phase. It may be one reason why Mark R added so much volume to the FX.

Try really pushing the board forward with your feet at the power phase of each stroke. This seems to work well with the Vapor, much better than on my displacement boards. I think it might be one way to build on the design advantages of fat nose boards. But I'm still experimenting.

Area10, it is good to hear that you are validating what I think that I am experiencing. I agree that is probably a characteristic of these new all water boards. Just took mine out in 15 mph winds and again noticed how it carries speed even upwind. I like it much better than the displacement board ride. I think these all water shapes are here to stay!!

Yeah, I think that's right. I'm not sure that they are faster than displacement shapes in most conditions that people race in, but as far as my experience with the Vapor goes, there is something about them that is so much more pleasurable to paddle that unless you are a race fanatic looking for that extra 0.5% of performance, you'd much rather paddle one of these new breeds of boards - at least in the ocean, anyway. I've found myself choosing to paddle the Vapor in flat water recently in preference to my flat water boards, which are faster (of course) in those conditions. I think that the amount of stability for a narrow width, good tracking, and the lack of pitching, makes the paddling experience much nicer, and allows you to concentrate on your technique.

Sooo, I have paddled my board about 40 miles now in mixed conditions. I have to say that I am liking it better with each paddle. I finally got a chance to paddle on a fairly flat day and I took it for an 8.25 mile paddle. Very light winds and no chop with occasional boat wakes. A day like this and my GPS give me a chance to get a really good comparison to my previous X-14 Pro in similar conditions. My typical training run is about six miles, so this was a bit longer than I usually go, but not to the extreme. I averaged 4.9 miles per hour and max speeds were well over 6 mph. The course that I took was curvy going in and out of lake coves. I was not intending to try to set a personal best, but I did paddle at a good strong pace.

Typically, my six mile training speeds on my X-14 Pro would be 4.9-5.0 mph. Personal best in perfect conditions (and physical paddling shape) over that 8+ distance on a straight course would be about 5.0 mph average. I would guess that my typical training run over that distance and course would also be about 4.9 mph on most days. This estimate is based on hundreds of miles of experience over the same water with GPS results. Here's my point. This is a RACE board that is more capable of downwinding and handling rougher water. It is NOT a downwind board that you might be able to race. This sucker is FAST on flat water!! Period, end of discussion.

This board is significantly faster downwind, but I don't really have a way of quantifying it, due to the variables. That is just my seat of the pants impression. I have not yet begun to push the limits on this board, but I believe that I may find a new personal best on it. At minimum, I will tell you that I did not lose any flat water speed switching to this board and it is much more enjoyable and less tiring to to paddle. I will be racing it at the Carolina Cup in less than a month and I am stoked. Just wanted to share my board buzz!! Woohoo!!

It's great that the FX is so good in flat water. I was thinking that I couldn't justify owning both a Bark Vapor and a SIC FX, but your review plus this video has made me wonder if I can. They look very different:



I'm looking forward to hearing more about the FX downwind. I love this new breed of stable-but-narrow boards.

Area 10, I can only speak to down breeze on inland lake. Short period waves don't give you much opportunity but I have been able link up a few runners and it goes well. Not reall a swell though. Hopefully someone else can provide you a better downwind review. I think that Big Winds was going to do a downwind review an comparison between FX and Allstar. I will be watching for it and post link if I see it. Life is short. If you want it get it and enjoy!!

The 14' FX has finally hit the floor here at Surf Fx. Just had time to snap a few pics of the finished board. It looks quite a bit different from the prototypes we have seen.

Thanks for the pics. Have you got any of the FX resting on the ground without the fin fitted? I'd like to see the amount of nose/tail rocker.

In these pics the FX looks more like a flat water board than the 14x26 prototype did.

The rails are so think I think maybe I'd have to buy myself a special length paddle to use just with this board. I associate these thick slab-sided rails with a flat deck with the Naish Glide Mk1 and 2 (14 and 17) and those boards were surprisingly fast, but tended to be discombobulated by messy, churned-up conditions, so I'll be interested to find out if the FX can cope with very rippy, messy stuff, or if it's composure goes out the window.

Oh, and how heavy is it?

Thanks.

Area 10, it weighs 24 lbs. yes, I agree surprisingly little front rocker. Nearly flat. I think your intuitions are right. It IS more of a race board than a downwinder. However it is a better downwinder than most race boards. It does lose some composure in confused conditions, but it is better than X 14 Pro and most race boards in those conditions. Side chop is the worst of it, but even that is not bad for a 25 wide board. It suits me well for nearly every condition that I will encounter. Have not fallen in the water yet and I have been out in 15 to 20 mph sustained winds. That says a lot. I don't go out in anything bigger than that unless the water is warm enough for swimming. I don't own a wetsuit. Any other questions I can answer?

You mention the nose rocker on your FX is nearly flat, but in this video when there is a prolonged side by side comparison the FX is clearly well above the water line at the tip of the nose in the side profile. While there is more nose rocker on the Vapor, there isn't much more from what I can see in these videos which is evident from the side profile, and the FX definitely has more tail rocker. When paddling, there seems to be very little difference in how much the nose is above water between boards in this video as well. Could be a difference where the paddler is standing, but long story short, the FX in this video has a decent amount of overall rocker for sure. Lots of tail rocker. Do you have the same board as what's pictured here?

www.paddleboardspecialists.com/info_blogr2.asp

Yes, I have the exact same board. I guess this is a matter of perspective and expectation. (I own a Glide V 2.) The tip of the nose is cut up and elevates it a little, but not much. This gives it a lightly engaged nose and fairly dry ride. If you get forward, you can drop and engage the the nose more fully. That being said, the profile of the front of the bottom board is very flat, except the last 10 inches. If you look at the still shot of the underside of the board in the video link, you can see where the forward tip of the red stripe starts on the bottom of the board, that is where the flat rocker begins. Yes, the tail rocker is significant. The front rocker is not as big as I expected, but I am pleased by that. Others might not be. The board is flatter and faster on flat water than I expected. I think that the X 14 Pro may have a faster top speed, but the FX has better glide, which seems to make up for it. The FX is smoother and better balanced for me. FX is much better downwind. I believe that it is more of an all water race board than a downwinder. Just my opinion. I live on an inland lake, so my experience and perspective are very limited. It will be interesting to hear a review from someone with a real downwind perspective.

Thanks for the clarification and it makes more sense now. Looks like a great board and I would love to give one a try one day. Once u get the handling characteristics dialed I'm sure u will be able to take it out in some good sized swell.