38 Hans Christian.
www.yachtworld.com/boats-for-sale/make-hans-christian/model-38t/

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BORNFREEE said..

38 Hans Christian.
www.yachtworld.com/boats-for-sale/make-hans-christian/model-38t/

Those boats are made in china is that ok for you dude?

Made in Asia, Hans Christian have been made in Taiwan and Thailand actually, is fine. I worked for a shipping company, Asian yards can make quality although their design capability isn't good.
Hans Christian designers design the boats to go offshore, a lot of production boats are designed to have parties on and be comfortable on a mooring.
Not all are, a very experienced mate, former Navy seaman officer and Director of YA in Queensland, bought a Hanse 40 something to go family cruising. Another friend fitted out a new X-41 for offshore work. Another friend cruises in a Beneteau 47, but he sticks to coastal and short passages where he can pick weather windows.

It's always easy to pick faults with boats, there are as many differing opinions on what makes the perfect boat as what there are different brands or models of boats. No one boat is ever going to be perfect for everyone, the trick is finding the boat that has the least amount of annoyances for you.

Some boats are better at being a gin palace at anchor, whereas other boats are just plain stripped out greyhound type racing machines with no creature comforts whatsoever. I find as I get older I prefer to have more of the comforts and less of the annoyances that deprive me of that comfort. It's when a boat fits you like an old pair of jeans or your favourite sneakers that's when you know that you have found YOUR boat.

Spot on Loosechange.

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southace said..

Well I seek a 4 meter beam in a 40 footer....that's my aim....tell me a pre 90s that has that beam?

My alloy Petersen 42 (IOR 2 tonner) built 1982 had that sort of beam and I could sleep 11 with 3 doubles and 5 single berths. You can't find a stronger yacht than that one in that size and she sails like a witch.

Her first owner/builder had only just completed her 2 weeks before racing her in the Brisbane/Noumea in 1982. He had to wait in Noumea for 5 days for the rest of the fleet to get in because they all thought it was too rough to go out and slipped in behind the wrecks at Moreton Island and got into their duty free grog.

He raced her in 4 of the Noumea races, winning two of them outright. She is a flat topper and I believe is back chartering out of Cairns. Her name is ENVY II and is still on the Aus general register under that name. The bloke that bought her from me called her Lady Katherine after his daughter. Why would anybody rename such a great yacht like that???

There was a sister ship to her for sale in S.A. a year or so ago called Sunburst for $25,000. With the money you have to spend you could buy something like that and put your island beds and white leather upholstery into it and have a cracker of a yacht that out sail and put to shame any of your Beneteaus and Jenneaus.

My personial beef with the modern built production boat is pre fab furniture taped into the hull extremely fast build, the ocean will soon find this weakness

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cisco said..

southace said..

Well I seek a 4 meter beam in a 40 footer....that's my aim....tell me a pre 90s that has that beam?

My alloy Petersen 42 (IOR 2 tonner) built 1982 had that sort of beam and I could sleep 11 with 3 doubles and 5 single berths. You can't find a stronger yacht than that one in that size and she sails like a witch.

Her first owner/builder had only just completed her 2 weeks before racing her in the Brisbane/Noumea in 1982. He had to wait in Noumea for 5 days for the rest of the fleet to get in because they all thought it was too rough to go out and slipped in behind the wrecks at Moreton Island and got into their duty free grog.

He raced her in 4 of the Noumea races, winning two of them outright. She is a flat topper and I believe is back chartering out of Cairns. Her name is ENVY II and is still on the Aus general register under that name. The bloke that bought her from me called her Lady Katherine after his daughter. Why would anybody rename such a great yacht like that???

There was a sister ship to her for sale in S.A. a year or so ago called Sunburst for $25,000. With the money you have to spend you could buy something like that and put your island beds and white leather upholstery into it and have a cracker of a yacht that out sail and put to shame any of your Beneteaus and Jenneaus.

I want to go sailing! I want to go sailing now!

Is it not clear? I have done the repairs , restorations...etc

My mate brought his $25,000 floating yacht 4 years ago and still hasn't got the sails up!

My father always told me aluminium has a life span.........I would be very weary of buying a alloy 30 year old boat especially for $25,000!

I hear you. You have said it before.


I was just answering your question ".tell me a pre 90s that has that beam?"


Do not read into my posts things that I do not actually say. That is what some did when I dared to mention the name Alan Lucas without veneration and worship.


There is nothing wrong with correctly built and maintained aluminium yachts. Weight for weight there is nothing stronger. They are still pulling WW 2 aircraft out of the jungles and the ocean that are still mostly there, ie complete.


Quality aluminium yachts are hard to find as they are quite expensive to build.


Bedouin looks good and a great name too.


http://www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/phil-curran-43/151697


Out of your budget but what a great yacht.


www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/cigale-16/148423


Not your style but affordable.


www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/radford-14m-cruiser-racer-haphazard/148284


This one has a leather lounge.


www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/jon-sayer-performance-cruising-yacht/147424


This one was built in 1968 so don't tell me aluminium yachts don't last.


www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/camper-and-nicholson/145234


Newer design and worth a look.


www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/van-de-stadt-45-marfab-eng-aus/138348


Tan leather in this one. Reduced by $50,000 to $199,000.


www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/ocean-racer-cruiser-60/136235


This is a great yacht in alloy but like the broker says "Sorry, no island beds here."


www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/adams-44/124030


Is this your yacht??


www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/holman-and-pye-cutter-ketch/96310



We gotta find you a yacht southace before not having one sends you mental.

Hi Southace,
This boat as referenced by Cisco as a good example of aluminium lasting, is NOT a good example.
"This one was built in 1968 so don't tell me aluminium yachts don't last."
http://www.boatsonline.com.au/boats-for-sale/used/sailing-boats/camper-and-nicholson/145234

Pacha is a beautiful boat, but nearly sank at the C.Y.C. due to aluminium corrosion, was pumped out, then lifted and stripped out and a new hull from at least the waterline down was built, and the keel moved. She is a delight to sail,beautifully balanced, I have sailed on her in 40+ kn, during a delivery from Coffs to Sydney, and also delivered her to N.Z. Great boat, but probably not what you are really after...

Here is a Jeanneau 43 well within your budget, also a couple more yachts in the 40' - 46' range on this site, if you want to really go sailing, then why not start overseas??
www.yachtauctions.com/inventory/9660/

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morningsun said..

Hi Southace,
This boat as referenced by Cisco as a good example of aluminium lasting, is NOT a good example.
"This one was built in 1968 so don't tell me aluminium yachts don't last."

Pacha is a beautiful boat, but nearly sank at the C.Y.C. due to aluminium corrosion, was pumped out, then lifted and stripped out and a new hull from at least the waterline down was built, and the keel moved. She is a delight to sail,beautifully balanced, I have sailed on her in 40+ kn, during a delivery from Coffs to Sydney, and also delivered her to N.Z. Great boat, but probably not what you are really after...

So what are you saying here morningsun??

Pacha nearly sank, somebody recognized the problem and kept her pumped out and whoever had the cheque book paid for her to be hauled and have the LACK of correct maintenance rectified. Then you went sailing on her.

You say that my reference is NOT a good example of aluminium yachts lasting. I assume by that you mean you can quote OTHER examples of aluminium yachts that HAVE lasted.

You are having a go at me and trying to discredit me over this LMYC thing aren't you???

Any time you like brother, your boat or mine, we go sailing, just you and me and we will find out if either of us has got it.

I once owned a aluminum center consul fishing boat, I called her pimples she was previously owned by a professional fisho either a savage or a Stacer cant remember which . Bought it cheap because it was full of pimples welded lots of small holes all over it not sure if it because of wiring or what but she was pretty bad when I bought her but I guess shed done power of work before I owned her.

A beautiful yacht. Would you say the annual maintenance cost would be 10% of capital value??

I'm not real good with math but I would say a polish and wax with slipping and antifoul every 24 months @$2,000. A couple of cans of spray lube and silicon spray @$50. Oil and lube change every 200 hours@$100. All my labour will be donated free of charge! That's a total of $1075 per annual. What percent is that from $200k?

I think total running costs over the year would be close to 10%
Marina fees 7~8K
Insurance 1~2K
Routine maintenance as you say 2K

If you include Safety gear, rigging and Sails 10% of replacement cost per Year
Then I believe this to be the true cost. Oh and that does not include any unforeseen breakages.

Yes but the question was percent for anual maintance.....
Marina fees will be over 10k annual and insurance about 2 k....but my marina fees will be half of that as I plan to spend 6 months cruising.....still cheaper than a apartment paying body corporates,electricity....etc and I certainly can't afford to own both!
My last set of sails lasted me 7 years cruising and are still in newish condition apart from some mould on main sail. Had a few stitches put into the headsail in Tassie cost me $75.
Unforeseen breakages will occur far more frequently on a older vessel than a new one......I spent $100k on a old vessel to make it new.....therefore had just about nill breakages over 5,000 nm.....new stuff does fail but that's mostly electronics (Navman)! In my opinon.

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southace said..

I do like this but I would have to buy a bucket of ice to keep my 6pack and tuna salad sandwiches cold as it has NO fridge!

http://yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/mcconaghy-custom-built-fractional-sloop/151012

South Ace "Get Real" in no time flat you fit one Id say you could screw him down a touch

Yeah minus the 17k for the new main....and the installation of a fridge!

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BORNFREEE said..

There is a Hunter yacht on the hard stand at Tin Can Bay it was sailed over from the USA it has no back stays never had how it managed to sail down wind and not loose the rig beats me , but i am no rigger, the interesting thing is the spade rudder(shudder) it has been torn off no stainless rod to be seen just a bit of pathetic foam, but hey they are like a huge power boat come caravan with a stick on them and the women just love the inside exactly how they where desighned for the lady.

I have not heard of any problems with the B and R rig as used on the Hunters.
They are probably not unlike the Diamond rig as used on modern day 'Cats' with their large roach mainsails.
The main disadvantage is that you have no backstay to crank on when going to windwind in a fresh breeze.
This will flatten out the main and to a lesser extent, tension up the headstay, helping depowering the yacht.

My wife and I owned a Noelex 25 once, all of which do not have a backstay either.
Generally all our sailing is offshore.
I remember in late December of 1998, we are trying to pick up a mooring inside Moruya Heads for shelter with the increasing winds.
At the time it was up to 45 knots and as soon as we got beam onto the wind, we ended up spearing into the breakwall.
We ended up surviving ok and my wife commented 'you take me out on the best dates Hon!

We spent the rest of that week bunkered down listening to ABC radio on the horrors unfolding in Basstrait.

I didn't realise the nolex 25 didn't have a backstay that is interesting was it a B&R rig? I guess u pre tension the rig and have inline mast furling so it works ok....my only thought is where to put a HF anterior for Aus reg but I'm thinking a whip Ariel will cover this! I can see the whip on this babe...if only another 300k I would do the globe in comfort!

http://yachthub.com/list/yachts-for-sale/used/sail-monohulls/50ft-hunter/152079

Not having a backstay doesn't automatically make it a B&R rig. In order for it to be B&R rig it has to look as though there is no way that a seagull can fly through the rigging

Lookee here .. www.boats.com/reviews/boats/the-bampr-rig/

I'm really starting to like the idea thanks loosechange for that read! I guess sheet on hard on the main to windward and all should be sweet just like a cat and then ease it out to power her up.

So it looks as though you are back to looking at Hunters, to fit a B&R rig to something with a normal rig the costs would be horrendous, assuming anyone here in Aus knew anything about how to build and then rig them.

Na I wouldn't change a rig on a boat. There is a Hunter 41 ,2 cabin , 3.99 beam real leather upholstery that I have been watching since march but since everyone freaks that it don't have a backstay I'm assuming they are hard to re-sale.

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southace said..

Na I wouldn't change a rig on a boat. There is a Hunter 41 ,2 cabin , 3.99 beam real leather upholstery that I have been watching since march but since everyone freaks that it don't have a backstay I'm assuming they are hard to re-sale.

Kimohno?
Nice looking boat with nice layout, the fitout and standard of finish looks to be not quite the same standard as you see on European boats.
I have to admit that I am not a fan of the in mast furling on that boat.

That's the

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LooseChange said..

southace said..

Na I wouldn't change a rig on a boat. There is a Hunter 41 ,2 cabin , 3.99 beam real leather upholstery that I have been watching since march but since everyone freaks that it don't have a backstay I'm assuming they are hard to re-sale.

Kimohno?
Nice looking boat with nice layout, the fitout and standard of finish looks to be not quite the same standard as you see on European boats.
I have to admit that I am not a fan of the in mast furling on that boat.

That's the one ! I'm going stealth from now on.....! I will let you guys know when I purchase a yacht!

hurry up will you, the suspense is killing me

The Freedom 40 yacht from many years ago had a completely unstayed rig. I believe they were one of the first uses of carbon fibre in yachts.

They never became very popular even though they were very innovative. Maybe they don't point very well.

www.google.com.au/search?q=freedom+40+cat+ketch&rlz=1C1NOOH_enAU504AU510&espv=2&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=Z8WNU4nkGsn2kAWYvYHIBg&ved=0CCEQsAQ&biw=1366&bih=639

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LooseChange said..

It's when a boat fits you like an old pair of jeans or your favourite sneakers that's when you know that you have found YOUR boat.

That is about where I am at with my Lotus 9.2.

Big enough but small enough. Acceptable comfort and acceptable performance with a stove and a fridge that would be the envy of many a larger yacht.

www.google.com.au/search?q=freedom+40+cat+ketch&rlz=1C1NOOH_enAU504AU510&espv=2&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=Z8WNU4nkGsn2kAWYvYHIBg&ved=0CCEQsAQ&biw=1366&bih=639#q=lotus+9.2+yacht&tbm=isch

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cisco said..

The Freedom 40 yacht from many years ago had a completely unstayed rig. I believe they were one of the first uses of carbon fibre in yachts.

They never became very popular even though they were very innovative. Maybe they don't point very well.

www.google.com.au/search?q=freedom+40+cat+ketch&rlz=1C1NOOH_enAU504AU510&espv=2&tbm=isch&tbo=u&source=univ&sa=X&ei=Z8WNU4nkGsn2kAWYvYHIBg&ved=0CCEQsAQ&biw=1366&bih=639

I think it's all Gary Hoyt knew, him being a Finn sailor after all. It's probably the reason he never designed anything else.