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Plummet said..

toppleover said..
Hey Plums,

Why you go and share your vast knowledge on some Ozone thread somewhere......no offence intended, just trying to get back on topic.

Fair enough. To be fair I wasn't pushing ozone. Its just the brand I know so I can list the wave and non wave kites.

Bit rough, topple. Plums only mentioned the Reo once, in passing.

Wait, if thats the only wave kite you've played with, I'm not surprised you think they're one trick ponies and do nothing well

Ha - ha, thought Plums was having his way with you Kami, so was sticking up for you ( i see now that your the receiver & enjoying it) but in my defence he did also post an Ozone clip on a switch thread.

Don't worry, I'm sure he will be back.

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toppleover said..
Ha - ha, thought Plums was having his way with you Kami, so was sticking up for you ( i see now that your the receiver & enjoying it) but in my defence he did also post an Ozone clip on a switch thread.

Don't worry, I'm sure he will be back.

He might even make the switch

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lotofwind said...

toppleover said..
Ha - ha, thought Plums was having his way with you Kami, so was sticking up for you ( i see now that your the receiver & enjoying it) but in my defence he did also post an Ozone clip on a switch thread.

Don't worry, I'm sure he will be back.

He might even make the switch

Forget it man, that dude is Ozowned for life again no offence Plums

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toppleover said..
Ha - ha, thought Plums was having his way with you Kami, so was sticking up for you ( i see now that your the receiver & enjoying it) but in my defence he did also post an Ozone clip on a switch thread.

Don't worry, I'm sure he will be back.

*you're

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toppleover said..
Ha - ha, thought Plums was having his way with you Kami, so was sticking up for you ( i see now that your the receiver & enjoying it) but in my defence he did also post an Ozone clip on a switch thread.

Don't worry, I'm sure he will be back.

Oh right LOL yeah I'd seen that before and remembered the surfing and neato paragliding, but had completely forgotten the knuckle-shuffling intro...

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toppleover said..

lotofwind said...

toppleover said..
Ha - ha, thought Plums was having his way with you Kami, so was sticking up for you ( i see now that your the receiver & enjoying it) but in my defence he did also post an Ozone clip on a switch thread.

Don't worry, I'm sure he will be back.

He might even make the switch

Forget it man, that dude is Ozowned for life again no offence Plums

Well. That maybe true. There's several reasons i role with ozone.
1) They have the range of kites i like and suit my style
2) My good buddy sells ozone. I like to support him.
3) There's a good second hand market for buying and selling ozone in nz.
4) I like to roll with no pullies on leis
5) I like to have the same safety system across all kites.

But never say never! Switch currently don't have any kites in their range that interest me. But if that changes I may look at them. To be fair at the moment i am pretty much a s/h hand buyer. Even the switch price is too high for me. I haven't bought a new kite since 2012. I doubt that will change any time soon.

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But never say never! Switch currently don't have any kites in their range that interest me. But if that changes I may look at them. To be fair at the moment i am pretty much a s/h hand buyer. Even the switch price is too high for me. I haven't bought a new kite since 2012. I doubt that will change any time soon.

I'm sure you know your stuff about pre 2012 kites. But using that knowledge to comment on new 2016 kites is a bit of a stretch.

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Plummet said..

1) They have the range of kites i like and suit my style
2) My good buddy sells ozone. I like to support him.
3) There's a good second hand market for buying and selling ozone in nz.
4) I like to roll with no pullies on leis
5) I like to have the same safety system across all kites.

But never say never! Switch currently don't have any kites in their range that interest me. But if that changes I may look at them. To be fair at the moment i am pretty much a s/h hand buyer. Even the switch price is too high for me. I haven't bought a new kite since 2012. I doubt that will change any time soon.

So what do you pay in NZ for a used Ozone kite with no warranty and dodgy quality when new?

Switch will never have any kites you're interested in because they'll never be Ozone Perhaps you should actually get your hands on them and other brands before condemning. . . .

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Kaha said..

But never say never! Switch currently don't have any kites in their range that interest me. But if that changes I may look at them. To be fair at the moment i am pretty much a s/h hand buyer. Even the switch price is too high for me. I haven't bought a new kite since 2012. I doubt that will change any time soon.

I'm sure you know your stuff about pre 2012 kites. But using that knowledge to comment on new 2016 kites is a bit of a stretch.

I didn't say i didn't have or haven't flown newer kites..... I said that was the last new kite i purchased. My newest kite is 2014/5.

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Kamikuza said..
So what do you pay in NZ for a used Ozone. ?

Switch will never have any kites you're interested in because they'll never be Ozone Perhaps you should actually get your hands on them and other brands before condemning. . . .

Last edge I purchased was $400. Had a small le repair was 2 years old with very little use.

Show me in this thread where i have condemned switch? I haven't at any stage. Buy one if you want.

That the small one, yeah? And the model that's infamous for falling apart. As you say, you get what you pay for...

So only a couple hundred cheaper than a new kite with lifetime warranty. Can't fault that logic

Stay on topic gents

Who got the new element then?! Much difference to the V4/3?

They go alright, but no need to claim

"the World's leading cutting edge, high performance kitesurfing kites, freestyle boards and accessories"

Like they do work, and at a price they are ok but in no way shape or form are they cutting ledge or the worlds leading brand. Cheap gear if you want to get out there.

If you want cutting edge or world leading I would like towards the top brands. If you're poor, well yeah, you can't afford the best but a switch will get you out there.

Dont claim it though.

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carbine said..

If you want cutting edge or world leading I would like towards the top brands.

Oh yeah? How do you figure out that "top" brands are cutting edge? And what defines "world leading"?

They innovate and they sell more gear.

They have higher margins, and use these margins to develop better gear year on year rather then relying on pumping up subjective traits of their kites, spin and fan boys.

"They" are the faceless men of kiteboarding..... They are reportedly a guild of Kite designers who command exorbitant fees, but have a reputation for success that is unparalleled by any comparable organization.

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carbine said..
They innovate and they sell more gear.

They have higher margins, and use these margins to develop better gear year on year rather then relying on pumping up subjective traits of their kites, spin and fan boys.

Well that is a good point.

Lets see . . . we know Switch innovates. Ever seen fabric or construction tests etc from the "world leaders"? No me neither.

Can't speak to sales figures, but the Honda Super Cub and the Model T Ford are the most sold vehicles in the world. Popular or high sales doesn't equal best.

But the margins comment . . . it's like you don't know what that word means perhaps if they spent less giving free gear to the pro riders and sending them to exotic locations with expensive film crews, they might have lower margins and more spare cash to . . . you know, actually innovate, rather than change the canopy covers and claim it's all new.

When you say "pumping up subjective traits of their kites, spin and fan boys" it sounds like you actually mean Ozone

Looks like you've just popped here in to have a dig. What's the agenda?

switch kites are poorly made pieces of **** that fall apart in a season

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Kozzie said..
switch kites are poorly made pieces of **** that fall apart in a season

Very scientific. So any Switch kite that doesn't fall apart in a season pretty much makes you look like an ass, eh.

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Kozzie said..
switch kites are poorly made pieces of **** that fall apart in a season

Kozzie go troll elsewhere, we are over your constant unfounded bashing.

My kites are still going very strong after 2 years... Wouldn't say the same for some top brand kites such as Ozone

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carbine said...
They innovate and they sell more gear.

They have higher margins, and use these margins to develop better gear year on year rather then relying on pumping up subjective traits of their kites, spin and fan boys.

Naive to say they have higher margins. Do you think the kite shops don't make anything and the sell price goes to the manufacturer??

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Kamikuza said..

Kozzie said..
switch kites are poorly made pieces of **** that fall apart in a season

Very scientific. So any Switch kite that doesn't fall apart in a season pretty much makes you look like an ass, eh.

or the owner a kook who cant kite

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Kozzie said..

Kamikuza said..

Kozzie said..
switch kites are poorly made pieces of **** that fall apart in a season

Very scientific. So any Switch kite that doesn't fall apart in a season pretty much makes you look like an ass, eh.

or the owner a kook who cant kite

You'll have to define "can kite", but I assume that you'll just keep moving the goal posts to prop up the dead horse so you can keep beating it.

One more time then: LIFETIME WARRANTY. Thats's how much faith Switch has in the materials and construction. Not 6 months, not a year, not even 2 years. Lifetime.

Just let that sink in for a bit, Kozzie.

The concept of Lifetime Warranty is meaningless. "Lifetime" doesn't mean forever. It means for the normal life of the kite.

Notionally all products have a "lifetime" warranty under Australian consumer law.

If the product fails due to a material or manufacturing defect then you get a new one, or a refund, or a repair if it's minor.

But if the product lasts well through the first year or so of use then it is clearly not defective. Any problems that arise are likely to be normal wear and tear, user error, or accident.

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Gorgo said..
The concept of Lifetime Warranty is meaningless. "Lifetime" doesn't mean forever. It means for the normal life of the kite.

Notionally all products have a "lifetime" warranty under Australian consumer law.

If the product fails due to a material or manufacturing defect then you get a new one, or a refund, or a repair if it's minor.

But if the product lasts well through the first year or so of use then it is clearly not defective. Any problems that arise are likely to be normal wear and tear, user error, or accident.

bolded: Then why enforce 2 year warranties?

You're right. Any "material/manufacturing" warranty is pretty much useless, when it can be dismissed with such glib responses as "our stitching is world class" or "you must be dragging it across the beach"

Normal life of a kite is more than 6 months or even two years, no? My 2011 kites still look good and they get used . . . often in error

And--it's not the age, it's the mileage. My 13 and 16 got way more use than my 10m did, and the 7 only comes out of the bag a couple of times a year.

Austalian consumer law talks about "reasonable" lifespan and use. Just off the top of my head it seems "reasonable" to expect a kite to hang in for a couple of years of normal use.

I think you would be hard pressed to make a reasonable argument that a kite had been sitting idle in a nice dry cupboard for 5 years.

My kite are coming up for 7 years old and 140-240 hours each. The main driver of degradation for them is accident. Just about everything is mint except for where one kite got scrunched against a sea wall. You can hold the fabric up to the light and see the damage even though the kite looks and flies just fine.

BTW. My 7 is by far my most used kite. The 10 comes a close second with the 13 a long way behind. You need to move to somewhere else, or go hydrofoiling.

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Gorgo said..
Austalian consumer law talks about "reasonable" lifespan and use. Just off the top of my head it seems "reasonable" to expect a kite to hang in for a couple of years of normal use.

I think you would be hard pressed to make a reasonable argument that a kite had been sitting idle in a nice dry cupboard for 5 years.

My kite are coming up for 7 years old and 140-240 hours each. The main driver of degradation for them is accident. Just about everything is mint except for where one kite got scrunched against a sea wall. You can hold the fabric up to the light and see the damage even though the kite looks and flies just fine.

BTW. My 7 is by far my most used kite. The 10 comes a close second with the 13 a long way behind. You need to move to somewhere else, or go hydrofoiling.

You gotta convince them of what "normal use" is. Seems from some of the claims that are refused that normal use is indeed limited to "in the bag, in the cupboard".

None of my tubes have repairs, and of the ones I bought new only the 13 has a patch -- where the main valve poked a hole when packed. Almost 100 sessions on that kite . . . compared with under a dozen on my 7

Certainly got my money's worth out of them!

Yeah, we need more wind! The foil has helped a lot for getting out and making the most of things. Only had to swim in once so far

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Kamikuza said..
That the small one, yeah? And the model that's infamous for falling apart. As you say, you get what you pay for...

So only a couple hundred cheaper than a new kite with lifetime warranty. Can't fault that logic

It was a 2012 13m edge. I think i bought it late 2013. Its still going strong 2016. In fact its showing no sign of wear at 4 years old other than the accident damage repair. I'll get another 2 years easy out of it. .

Your right I paid for what I got. Getting 4 years out of a second hand kite for $400. That is awesome.

Hey Plummet, you wouldn't use a 13 meter much in taranaki, that's why its lasting well.