Kitepower Australia said..

Kamikuza said..

Customer service - especially being nice to potential customers - can pretty much be done away with once you've got your hooks in.

Utter nonsense!
Where do you and Plummet get this drivel? Treat customers badly = business failure, and very quickly too, nothing is worse for business than an unhappy customer (who always tells lots of other people).

You can see from your posts that you don't care much about public perception -- I guess you assume this forum has limited reach... I think you'd be surprised.

There are always plenty of more suckers walking in the door; and lessons are where the money is, isn't it? It's a big planet, full of a lot of people -- especially when you've got your internet shop ticking along, supplying your local fan base... so a few pissed off would-be or ex-customers doesn't bother dealers too much.

Loftywinds said..

Kamikuza said..

It's not capitalism -- there are plenty of businesses, even in our limited arena of interest, that don't treat people like crap, even when they could get away with it. Basically, some people are just jerks.

If anything capitalism should weed out the knobs and leave the best service providers standing. I think what we have I our market is a kind of monopoly, with some capitalizing on that do just enjoy the ride and behave badly...

Yes. You mean shops that have the entire beach to themselves and no other competition? Well that's what I meant about capitalism. It's a free market and if there is only one player - too bad, too sad.

No, I meant the economic market place. The number of people needed to keep a store operating limits how many stores will actually make it in a given area... All of the stores I can think of here have been in the game since the beginning. They cover a pretty large area, although they do kind of have a "home" beach.

They seem to do business a bit different here anyway...

Sooo..
We still have no answer on the topic of this thread of 'how much it costs to open a kite shop' but what we do know from reading this is that if you do open one there will be no shortage of people full of advice on how to run it!

mattkennedy said..

Sooo..
We still have no answer on the topic of this thread of 'how much it costs to open a kite shop' but what we do know from reading this is that if you do open one there will be no shortage of people full of advice on how to run it!

Perhaps you should read the first page again...?

Open a kite shop? Might be a waste of time and money. When looking at some posts I feel kiting might be 99% talking/writing about it and only 1% actually being on the water. So better sell running shows or something...

mattkennedy said..

Kamikuza said...

mattkennedy said..

Sooo..
We still have no answer on the topic of this thread of 'how much it costs to open a kite shop' but what we do know from reading this is that if you do open one there will be no shortage of people full of advice on how to run it!

Perhaps you should read the first page again...?

Thanks kamikaze just read the first page again. Was a great read, my favorite part was there was no posts from you on there

LOL! True, and your observation is still correct, there is no definitive answer.

Does it matter how I spell your username when your just some troll hiding behind it?

JOYRIDER said...

With attitudes like this you will be the death of bricks and mortar retail in Australia.

Can i put something to you?

If that wheel set or snowboard setup you bought online, crapped out for some reason, i bet you'd be the first to head to your local store to get after sales service and a warranty.

Very few people understand the structure of distributing gear in Australia. Regardless of the sport.

By shopping overseas online your only under cutting your store and making it harder for them to make a buck and in turn support the industry.

If you take care of your stuff and it wasnt faulty when you first recived it it shoudlnt break. If it does typicaly you wouldnt go through a shop just contact the company directly. If you do take the item to a local shop to be fixed they will probaly over charge you and you just as well buy another off the internet.

I'm not the bad guy here, The bad guys are the ones ripping their customers off. If you can buy something for half price elsewhere than your local shop then thats what you do.

If everyone swapped to internet shopping I'd love to see how quickly australian shop prices fall to actualy be somewhat realistic and competative with the rest of the world.

pezzy said..

I'm not the bad guy here, The bad guys are the ones ripping their customers off. If you can buy something for half price elsewhere than your local shop then thats what you do.

Im intrigued. Where is it you can buy kites for which are half the price that the shops would sell them to you for in Australia? Please be specific not just say the internet.

Kamikuza said..

JOYRIDER said..

With attitudes like this you will be the death of bricks and mortar retail in Australia.

Can i put something to you?

If that wheel set or snowboard setup you bought online, crapped out for some reason, i bet you'd be the first to head to your local store to get after sales service and a warranty.

Very few people understand the structure of distributing gear in Australia. Regardless of the sport.

By shopping overseas online your only under cutting your store and making it harder for them to make a buck and in turn support the industry.

If they're dealers for the company, why wouldn't they support the product? It'd be like buying a Toyota in one town, and the dealer in the next town refusing to service it... after all, when they order parts where do you think they come from?!

Can you explain the structure of distributing gear in Australia, please?

Its not as simple as Joe from kite brand "X" waltzing down to the airport, grabbing a van full of kites and dropping them at the local shop.

From the top, there is a lot of money that goes into designing 1 size of 1 model of kite.
Everything from every plastic piece on the bar, to each panel on the kite. And don't forget the international team riders, R&D, advertising and keeping the development of the sport happening.
It all costs time and money. Once the product is refined its then made. and that's manufacturing price and it all starts.

The national distributor then has to buy the kite at his/her cost price. In order to work out the wholesale price, that the shop buys the product at, they need to cover freight into Australia + GST + import taxes +local marketing + business overheads + profit heaven forbid.

The state level shop then buys the kite at the wholesale price. And again has to make enough margin to keep the lights on in the shop, pay staff, buy stock at the start of the season. and if he is nice, which i guarantee all are (that's why their still open) they donate money or product to local events or riders. and yeah they also have to make some profit so they can eat and have a roof over their head at night.

This is all done on an international level in every country that people kitesurf.
The pricing also needs to be as even as possible across all regions to make sure it reflects the local income and economics and also doesn't under cut other regions.

So next time you think a kite should be $1000 brand new, current model, meaning with simple person logic, that a manufacturer needs to cover all costs for less then $100 a kite, have a think about your saying.

Yeah, that's what I thought -- pretty standard business model. Switch is changing that and look at the difference in prices -- what we, the end of the chain, are paying to keep those middle links active.... Makes you wonder eh.

They seem to do it a little different here, but it's essentially the same. Maybe the distributor gets dropped for some brands and the gear is ordered dieect from HQ... Price is the same though -- RRP less a discount for "club members" which is about 20% over $2000.

If you are going to open a shop, can it be in the Northern suburbs of Perth. We don't really have anything north of Scarborough and there are loads of kiters and potential kiters up here. I'd love a local shop less than 30mins away

Kamikuza said..

Yeah, that's what I thought -- pretty standard business model. Switch is changing that and look at the difference in prices -- what we, the end of the chain, are paying to keep those middle links active.... Makes you wonder eh.

They seem to do it a little different here, but it's essentially the same. Maybe the distributor gets dropped for some brands and the gear is ordered dieect from HQ... Price is the same though -- RRP less a discount for "club members" which is about 20% over $2000.

Switch do it yes and i honestly believe they wont last.
Going direct to customers is all well and good, from the customer end, but it means a lot of what the national distributor does and pays for now needs to be warn by the manufacturer.

It must work tho, i see tonnes of "direct to customer" kites on the water.

BTW: alot of major brands are implementing new business strategies and alot of it is to help the struggling retailer.

I love how this place can go from discussing the facts to "personal attacks" for absolutely no good reason at all.

Switch has been around what, 2 years now? Might be a bit early to call it, either way.

If local shops aren't ripping you off AND are actually providing support eg. NOT "oh that's not a warranty, that's misuse", it might be a different story. And let's not forget that sometimes, you just can't get want you want in-country: no Peter Lynn, no Axis, there was no Ozone for a while (I waited 9 months for a SB harness before giving up), no repair for foils at a sensible price etc etc.

I wouldn't take my crappy car to a mechanic with no parts or knowledge about the brand... And I'd go out of town for proper support -- so why do we cling to these out-moded ways of doing business?

Good to hear it's being shaken up...

Kamikuza said..

I love how this place can go from discussing the facts to "personal attacks" for absolutely no good reason at all.

Switch has been around what, 2 years now? Might be a bit early to call it, either way.










I'm intrigued to see how switch go when their volume of sales worldwide reach a certain threshold, without on the ground support mechanisms in place.

Product is decent though, no questioning that, but will their distribution and support model hold up.

Interesting space to watch. 3 Years I think isn't it overall, given they have the V3?

iandvnt said..

How much does it cost? Hard work, intelligence, cash and thick skin.

It's great to see more youth getting into kiting and that is a direct result of being able to afford kit buying direct online. It's also great that more affluent kiters enjoy their relationship with their local shop.

No thats not how the kids get into it, they do not buy online predominantly, they buy from their local market, mostly hand me downs from my observations and experience travelling around Oz and beyond. Young people don't have the credit cards and disposable income, or the patience to buy online and wait for delivery.
The people buying online are an older age group, generally more established and experienced in life, plenty of room on the credit card and happy to use the old kite waiting for the new on to arrive.