Comparing the existing wings and XLW.

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bigtone667 said..


Comparing the existing wings and XLW.

Interesting -- that's less sized up than I had imagined, at least for back wing. Same width, maybe 30% more surface area?

Though front wing looks quite a big bigger, both wider and length....at least double surface area, maybe more.

Seems to me the challenge with canard design is to get the balance right, as both wings are lifting. I bet it took some iterations to get the sizes optimal.

... sorry if this question has been answered before but,,,,, can either the Spitfire standard or XLW be a good first time buyers hydrofoil/board (ie zero foiling experience)? Can you point me in the right direction for the info?

Cheers,

Robbie

I think you can learn just as easily (or difficult) as any freestyle type of foil. More rear foot with this canard design, but as a beginner there is no frame of reference so you should be fine

The Spitfire is more pitch sensitive than a normal foil so requires some extra finesse. Plus a little more speed and power. This makes it maybe not so good to learn to foil on, but there is an argument that if you don't know what a normal foil is like then learning may not be much different.
the XLW wings do lower takeoff speed and power required but the pitch control level of finesse remains.
the Spitfire is wave focused and does feel more comfortable to use in waves as opposed to flat water.
hope that helps.

... exactly what I wanted to know, cheers!!

Hi Robbie, I'll show you a good foil to learn on when we catch up. $30 per hour to rent
If you spend a bit of time on this type of foil to start with then you will be in a good position to advance to the next level.
Learning kerv alot quicker.
See you soon.

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RAL INN said..
The Spitfire is more pitch sensitive than a normal foil so requires some extra finesse. Plus a little more speed and power. This makes it maybe not so good to learn to foil on, but there is an argument that if you don't know what a normal foil is like then learning may not be much different.
the XLW wings do lower takeoff speed and power required but the pitch control level of finesse remains.
the Spitfire is wave focused and does feel more comfortable to use in waves as opposed to flat water.
hope that helps.

When you say "pitch sensitive", does that mean a tendency to drop off foiling if not enough speed or balance is off?

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juandesooka said..

RAL INN said..
The Spitfire is more pitch sensitive than a normal foil so requires some extra finesse. Plus a little more speed and power. This makes it maybe not so good to learn to foil on, but there is an argument that if you don't know what a normal foil is like then learning may not be much different.
the XLW wings do lower takeoff speed and power required but the pitch control level of finesse remains.
the Spitfire is wave focused and does feel more comfortable to use in waves as opposed to flat water.
hope that helps.

When you say "pitch sensitive", does that mean a tendency to drop off foiling if not enough speed or balance is off?

On an old school foil lets say you have a range of about 300mm that you move your centre of gravity forwards and backwards to control the attitude of the foil, and hence its pitch.
spitfires only let you have say 150mm to move to get same results.
plus they turn snappier and with more back foot bias.

For me, pitch control was the most difficult thing to learn. I'm on a Moses Fluente and 548/330 wing combo. Perhaps this set up is pitch sensitive. But now I've got it pretty much figured out, and doing some heel to toeside carves, about 50% success rate on strong side after 2 practice sessions.
So id be careful choosing a pitch sensitive foil to learn on.

Got to wonder when or if Zeeko will release the Spitfire for surf/sup. Watching the videos of the big slow carves on the wave face looks a bit boring. From what I have seen of the Spitfire it looks to be perfectly suited for wave use.
I did swap my wings around (home build) to try the canard configuration, yep it flew ok but needs some fine tuning. Immediately noticed the pitch sensitivity and was noticibly more twitchy, currently beyond my skills at the moment so I changed it back.

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Puetz said..
... sorry if this question has been answered before but,,,,, can either the Spitfire standard or XLW be a good first time buyers hydrofoil/board (ie zero foiling experience)? Can you point me in the right direction for the info?

Cheers,

Robbie

I think the Spitfire with the XLW wings would be fine to learn on (but not with the original wings).

I tested the XLW wings over the weekend on the choppy flat crap at Kurnell and Tuggerah Lake (about 50 k's worth).

All the pitch issues I had with the smaller wings are essentially gone.
Your front does not need to be too far forward and the back foot can sit nicely behind the mast mount.

The little beast turns really really nicely (it feels like I have a sturdier platform under foot in comparison to the Carver).

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bigtone667 said..

Puetz said..
... sorry if this question has been answered before but,,,,, can either the Spitfire standard or XLW be a good first time buyers hydrofoil/board (ie zero foiling experience)? Can you point me in the right direction for the info?

Cheers,

Robbie

I think the Spitfire with the XLW wings would be fine to learn on (but not with the original wings).

I tested the XLW wings over the weekend on the choppy flat crap at Kurnell and Tuggerah Lake (about 50 k's worth).

All the pitch issues I had with the smaller wings are essentially gone.
Your front does not need to be too far forward and the back foot can sit nicely behind the mast mount.

The little beast turns really really nicely (it feels like I have a sturdier platform under foot in comparison to the Carver).

BT are you saying its better than all your past foils?

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warwickl said..

bigtone667 said..

Puetz said..
... sorry if this question has been answered before but,,,,, can either the Spitfire standard or XLW be a good first time buyers hydrofoil/board (ie zero foiling experience)? Can you point me in the right direction for the info?

Cheers,

Robbie

I think the Spitfire with the XLW wings would be fine to learn on (but not with the original wings).

I tested the XLW wings over the weekend on the choppy flat crap at Kurnell and Tuggerah Lake (about 50 k's worth).

All the pitch issues I had with the smaller wings are essentially gone.
Your front does not need to be too far forward and the back foot can sit nicely behind the mast mount.

The little beast turns really really nicely (it feels like I have a sturdier platform under foot in comparison to the Carver).

BT are you saying its better than all your past foils?

The Spitfire with the XLW wings will now get equal time with the Carver Wing (and an Aussie Brand I am demoing).

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bigtone667 said..

warwickl said..

bigtone667 said..

Puetz said..
... sorry if this question has been answered before but,,,,, can either the Spitfire standard or XLW be a good first time buyers hydrofoil/board (ie zero foiling experience)? Can you point me in the right direction for the info?

Cheers,

Robbie

I think the Spitfire with the XLW wings would be fine to learn on (but not with the original wings).

I tested the XLW wings over the weekend on the choppy flat crap at Kurnell and Tuggerah Lake (about 50 k's worth).

All the pitch issues I had with the smaller wings are essentially gone.
Your front does not need to be too far forward and the back foot can sit nicely behind the mast mount.

The little beast turns really really nicely (it feels like I have a sturdier platform under foot in comparison to the Carver).

BT are you saying its better than all your past foils?

The Spitfire with the XLW wings will now get equal time with the Carver Wing (and an Aussie Brand I am demoing).

How are you finding the transition between riding the two types of foils? I am pretty keen on the SF for waves but really enjoy my setup now for the bay in front of my house. I also have to clear some cap space to buy one as I wouldn't mind finding a board that I could ride waves with without the foil when it gets good. (Mainly for traveling lighter) Some of the Zeeko boards look tempting.

Whether or not you use the std. Spitfire wings or the XLW set, the Spitfire likes you to commit to it in order to get the full benefit of it.
its when you decide that the Spitfire is the way forward for you, and you use nothing else that you break through to a new normal.
then the difference between Std. & XLW is down to waves under or over 1.5m
its sort of like starting to foil when the best results and greatest rate of improvement happen when you totally commit to foiling and not keep switching back and forth.
the Spitfire is other such step in another direction.

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RAL INN said..
Whether or not you use the std. Spitfire wings or the XLW set, the Spitfire likes you to commit to it in order to get the full benefit of it.
its when you decide that the Spitfire is the way forward for you, and you use nothing else that you break through to a new normal.
then the difference between Std. & XLW is down to waves under or over 1.5m
its sort of like starting to foil when the best results and greatest rate of improvement happen when you totally commit to foiling and not keep switching back and forth.
the Spitfire is other such step in another direction.

This might be true for you, but ....

I switch back and forwards between the Zeeko Carver and Spitfire all the time. Takes me about 5 minutes to adjust my foot position and weight. I continue to learn every time I use either foil device, or TT, or surfboard.

A lot of people will pick up the Spitfire because of it's "backfoot" orientation and happily ride it on flat water and carve around like mad people. It's a foil that turns well. Doing great turns in waves will be a bonus for some.

I suspect with both agree that Zeeko have made a pretty cool product.

Very
they are working on a windfoil board shorter than my first kiteboarding, and the board I first used for foiling.