They say 1 out of every 5 people have a mental disorder.
So from mild to extreme.
You have to figure some customers are crazy &some are just assholes .
Just like the tradies theres good &bad but the thing is bad tradies tend to get weeded out they can't compete with the good ones &sooner or later they go bust or lose there licenses.
But nothing weeds out bad customers .
I think one of the biggest problems is the percieved attitudes that tradies are second class citizens.
A barista would get more repect from a suit than a chippy yet in reality they are making coffee not putting there life on the line every time they go to work .
Ive had my share of bad customers over the years but the majority by far are great.
The biggest frustration is you seem to get a cluster of the bad ones but if I look on the bright side when that happens I realize the rest of the year should be all great customers .
Its hard to good cheap &fast but I've found that if i make every job perfect I have the good covered the cheap &fast comes from experience and skill .
You dont cut corners because problems compound then you do it right first time every time &you get faster at it .
But I've just seen one of the worst buildings ive ever come across in my life after an independent inspection is done I reckon if there not condemned there will be at least 1mill in defects in a block of town houses .
For example the frame is so far away from bricks no brick ties are attached i could push a 2 storys wall &deflect it by about 6mm .one hand
Everywhere I looked I could see faults
There brand new .
As a note i paid $200 for a fridge mechanic to press rest switch &then tell me if that doesnt work i need to get new fridge as you cant buy the circut board for that fridge .
Took less than 10 seconds .

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djt91184 said..
MODERATOR he hurt my feelings

A 70 year old behaving like a 7 year old dick Get a grip on yourself. As I said, get off those weird stuff, "recreational or not"

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Jupiter said..

djt91184 said..
MODERATOR he hurt my feelings

A 70 year old behaving like a 7 year old dick Get a grip on yourself. As I said, get off those weird stuff, "recreational or not"

He already has

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actiomax said..
They say 1 out of every 5 people have a mental disorder.
So from mild to extreme.
You have to figure some customers are crazy &some are just assholes .
Just like the tradies theres good &bad but the thing is bad tradies tend to get weeded out they can't compete with the good ones &sooner or later they go bust or lose there licenses.
But nothing weeds out bad customers .
I think one of the biggest problems is the percieved attitudes that tradies are second class citizens.

I find your post quite balance. Of course tradies and customers are just people who are made up of a good and bad mix. I did not accuse tradies are rip-off merchants, but I am merely standing my ground as I believe I do have. Then some dude came out and broadcast to the world that customers are to be hated, but are happy enough to take on the job and their money. That is a contradiction in itself.

The propertie in question is also undergoing a complete paint job. I took my chances and used someone purely through recommendation, or word of mouth. I told him that it is for rental, so no need to be flash. That means to concentrate on the obvious areas like walls, ceilings, doors and door frames.

Four days later, it was done. He told me of a few problems I wasn't aware of such as the bathroom in question. That he fixed. Then he told me he also painted the walk-in wardrobes without charge, despite the fact that I told him "if it is out of the way, don't worry about it".

So in effect, he did above and beyond what is asked and expected. I don't know how much more time and cost it will be for me to repaint the wardrobes, but he did it anyway as a professional. Sure, I got a freebee and I am happy about that. But I am also doing my bit to pay him within 3 days after it was done as I am fully aware that he has bills and his staff to pay too.

So it is a two-way street. I am sure that he will be on my book, and I suggested to my real estate agent that he ought to be on their too.

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Jupiter said..

djt91184 said..
MODERATOR he hurt my feelings

A 70 year old behaving like a 7 year old dick Get a grip on yourself. As I said, get off those weird stuff, "recreational or not"

What all this drug talk jupiter? Have you completely lost the plot?
I dont touch it, but I dont want all users to die like you stated in the other thread before you cried to the mods.
Nice configuration of emojis did you spend all night on that post.

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DARTH said..

Jupiter said..

djt91184 said..
MODERATOR he hurt my feelings

A 70 year old behaving like a 7 year old dick Get a grip on yourself. As I said, get off those weird stuff, "recreational or not"

He already has

Sarcasm PLUS a wink, very clever give yourself a pat on the back

Well, folks, here is a good news warranty story for you.

I bought a complete solar system from an online auction 5 years ago. On Thursday 2 weeks ago the inverter showed an "relay failure". Clearly it needed fixing since the switch off switch on method didn't get it working again.
Luckily I still have the business card of the guy who installed it so I rang him up. Turns out he no longer does solar installations but he knows the problem occurs with that sort of inverter. Also, he knows that the company that sold it to me has gone broke and vanished. The only people I can chase is the inverter manufacturer.
So I ring them up at the call centre in the Philippines and they say that I have to provide proof of purchase. This is a real problem. I have supermarket dockets floating around from months ago and plenty of dockets from small purchases that might come under warranty is at some date in the future but I can't find the one that I need for a $5000 purchase. I get in touch with the online auction company and they can't find any record of the transaction, or even of me. Not only that, the email address that I was using at the time was a Hotmail account and for some reason I got locked out of it years ago.
A bit of back and forth ensues with the call centre, but I still have the apparently insurmountable obstacle of the lack of proof of purchase. Time to employ some personal charm by visiting the Sydney office of the Chinese company that built the inverter. And the lady there was very useful. She tells me that solar installers go broke all the time and that the serial number of the inverter is good enough for her to send me a new one. That arrived today. All I have to do is arrange installation and send the old one back. That's organised for Thursday morning
So I'm in a pretty good mood about that. 4 years and 10 months into a five-year warranty and they have honoured it. Hopefully the new one will last just as long or longer

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djt91184 said..

What all this drug talk jupiter? Have you completely lost the plot?
I dont touch it, but I dont want all users to die like you stated in the other thread before you cried to the mods.
Nice configuration of emojis did you spend all night on that post.

The trouble with you is that you are becoming creepy. Yes, CREEPY. You followed me to have a shot at me because you have now developed a grudge on me. That is fine as I am now on an open forum. I opened my mouth because I have an opinion. Some people said I am very opinionated. That is fine too as without opinions is just like zombies which follow other's directions.

Interestingly, you are not too far from it. You responded my posts, but you brought nothing to the table. All you are capable of doing is "LOL", or "I agree", or "I oppose". Yes, you can do all of these, still you need to offer an "alternative" view if you do not agree with me. You disagreed just for disagreement's sake, and that is why I don't rate you very highly in the intelligence stake. Sorry. My opinion knows no bound !

Then you dug up a thread a long while ago about the cutlery drawers where I asked about what is the fair price for it. You claimed that I was "shot down from the sky" That is your own observation which differ from mine. But do I care about what you think ? Certainly not.

By the way, you are fast becoming like Oliver. So quit before unwanted hair grows on your palms !

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Mr Milk said..
Well, folks, here is a good news warranty story for you.

So I'm in a pretty good mood about that. 4 years and 10 months into a five-year warranty and they have honoured it. Hopefully the new one will last just as long or longer

That is a very good news. I bet you will not be reluctant to buy from them again You probably will tell your mates about them too. That is what I meant by word of mouth, and being prepared to back your your product.

Sorry, Mr.Milk, what was the problem to find 5 y.o. transaction in your bank statements ?
My bank says I can do it up to 7 years back... haven't tried that yet though..
The oldest I had to track for the warranty claim was 1 y.o.

I sacked the bank in the meantime. They refused to honour their warranty on a "cash" account. If they aren't willing to provide the cash at call, they should pay interest in line with their term deposit rate. When I looked in my old statements, that page was missing.

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Mr Milk said..
Well, folks, here is a good news warranty story for you.

I've had two of note.

One was Fisher & Paykel with a washing machine, it exploded (drum weld split at 1000rpm) one day, probably >5 years out of warranty. I rang them as a courtesy just to inform them that it had happened in case they knew about it happening. They took note of the serial number and delivered a new one 2 days later with a letter of apology. They installed the new one and took the old one away. When we came back from the UK and needed to outfit the whole house, guess which white goods company got my money?

I bought a Tag Heuer watch when I was 19 (back in the old old mining boom), the pins in the bracelet started coming loose within the first year. A Tag dealer in Perth used a pin & hammer to enlarge the ends (pretty crappy job) that lasted about 11 years when it finally broke. I took it into a dealer in the UK and had it sent off to Tag for a band replacement - I was expecting a bill of around US$400 (quoted price) - instead I got a full refurb service, new bracelet and an apology letter for the poor quality of the original bracelet. I'd like to say I've spent more money with them but I still wear daily the same watch 26 years after I bought it.

In neither instance did I ask for, nor expect a warranty to apply and I didn't need to provide proof of purchase etc. You could argue that in both cases they were a known fault that the companies figured it was better to cough up for a new one rather than have it dragged out etc but I'll take that as some good old fashioned great customer service.


I just googled the Tag warranty - 2 years and doesn't cover the bracelet so. YMMV.

Hey Jupiter.

Sorry if I hurt your feelings in assuming you would be a pain in the ass customer. Went back through your posts to show you a few quotes on why I would come up with that assessment. Decided that you are not worth the effort of quoting. When I meet a client that acts like you I don't quote for them. Straight up tell them i'm too busy.

You have insulted public servants & tradies. I am not some arrogant dude. I was trying to stand up for the new innocent business owner. He bought a name. Not a company. He has no obligation to help you or honour someone else's warranty. You have boasted about taking his work away from him. You should drop past and see his kids so you can tell them face to face that you have taken the food off their plate so that you can feel better about yourself. You are the poster boy for **** client.

My hatred of clients is a problem. One that I am actively addressing by shifting my business focus. If I could afford to I would just build for myself, but unfortunately some of the older generations have made access to finance quite hard for younger people.

At the end of the day a bad client can be defined as one who would actively try to rubbish a business owner they have never worked with, over a $500 ten year old warranty by someone else. Just out of interest, of the $495 you initially spent, how much of that did you pay? Was it a tax write off? Did you not up the rent a little a few months later? I'd guess you probably didn't spend much, we the non investment property owning public probably paid for it you arrogant p.o.s.

Don't forget that us scummy tradies are probably stronger, tougher and depending on the trade a damn sight smarter than you.

My feel-good warranty bit,

Years ago, I purchased a brass polishing tumbler, from a mate who had purchased it a few years previously from a second hand shop.

After I had it running it almost continuously for around 5 1/2 years, the motor fell to bits.

Tried a few local shops for parts - none able to help.
Rang the Aussie distributor to see if I could buy a replacement motor, and was treated like dirt.
Called the manufacturer in the USA and explained that I wanted to purchase a replacement 220 volt motor for my very much used, abused and overworked hand-me-down relic of a tumbler.
Advised that my tumbler [the companies biggest model] was no longer in production, and that particular motor was unobtainium.

Oh well, must go and get a new one......

A few minutes later I received a phone call asking for a postal address.
I figured I might be getting some promo stuff or if I was really lucky - maybe a voucher to be redeemed through the Aussie distributor.

A few days later there is a box on my doorstep with a brand new tumbler, sent priority from the USA, with a note apologising for not being able to supply an Aussie plug, and hoping this model would be OK as it was a little smaller than my dead one!
They also crammed the carton and tumbler full of bags of fresh tumbling media and promo stuff.

HORNADY RULES WHEN IT COMES TO CUSTOMER RELATIONS!!

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mclovin said..
Hey Jupiter.

Sorry if I hurt your feelings in assuming you would be a pain in the ass customer. Went back through your posts to show you a few quotes on why I would come up with that assessment. Decided that you are not worth the effort of quoting. When I meet a client that acts like you I don't quote for them. Straight up tell them i'm too busy.

You have insulted public servants & tradies. I am not some arrogant dude. I was trying to stand up for the new innocent business owner. He bought a name. Not a company. He has no obligation to help you or honour someone else's warranty. You have boasted about taking his work away from him. You should drop past and see his kids so you can tell them face to face that you have taken the food off their plate so that you can feel better about yourself. You are the poster boy for **** client.

My hatred of clients is a problem. One that I am actively addressing by shifting my business focus. If I could afford to I would just build for myself, but unfortunately some of the older generations have made access to finance quite hard for younger people.

At the end of the day a bad client can be defined as one who would actively try to rubbish a business owner they have never worked with, over a $500 ten year old warranty by someone else. Just out of interest, of the $495 you initially spent, how much of that did you pay? Was it a tax write off? Did you not up the rent a little a few months later? I'd guess you probably didn't spend much, we the non investment property owning public probably paid for it you arrogant p.o.s.

Don't forget that us scummy tradies are probably stronger, tougher and depending on the trade a damn sight smarter than you.

Before I answer your silly self-grandeur post, I want to declare I don't view ALL tradies like I do with this character.

No, sorry, McLovin, you didn't succeed in hurting my feeling. Instead, you have succeeded in making a damn fool of yourself, and create a bad reputation for all tradies.

In case you are not aware, tradies are not a "protected species", although you think you are. I thought consumers are allowed to get a "competitive" quote from anyone ? Isn't that how a capitalist system works ? Take the submarine contract for example, would you like the government simply give the multi-billions contract to anyone, let alone to you, "client hating tradie" ?

I am not as stupid as you think I am, that is why I went to get a couple of quotes. Of course, price is not everything. It is quality too. If I knew you are not prepared to provide a "reasonable" warranty, it means you are not as good as you believed you are. Mind you, there are dodgy tradies out there, just like dodgy clients who do not pay.

Talking about social service now are we ? Me taking away food from the dodgy tradie's kids ? That is deep, innit ?

You want to indulge in financial aspect as well now ? My tax deductions ? Remember what Kerry Packer said about this matter? I don't want to waste time to educate you. Goggle it yourself. By the way, is it true that tradies and claim tax deductions on their tools and stuff ? And travel expenses ? And cars and trucks ? You had better check it up if you haven't yet done so. You could me missing out, hombre.

The last line made me laugh. Now we are talking about being tough, dependable ? You mean physically tough? Are we getting into comparing muscles ? Dependable ? Well, it depends. Most tradies probably are. Not sure about you though. As for being smarter? Hello. I have no need to brag.

I think you are getting desperate.

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Jupiter said..


Before I answer your silly self-grandeur post, I want to declare I don't view ALL tradies like I do with this character.


Talking about social service now are we ? Me taking away food from the dodgy tradie's kids ? That is deep, innit ?

You want to indulge in financial aspect as well now ? My tax deductions ? Remember what Kerry Packer said about this matter?

Jesus I wish you would stop your bloody whinging Jupiter.
And taking Kerry Packer as an example of a good citizen is feeble. His attitude to tax is appalling, claiming that everybody should pay as little as possible, by implication meaning evertbody else should pay more.

Remember the definition of a gentleman...someone who can play the bagpipes, but doesn't out of respect for the world at large. A decent citizen doesn't grab all he can for himself, even if he can use the law to do it.

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mclovin said..
Hey Jupiter.

Sorry if I hurt your feelings in assuming you would be a pain in the ass customer. Went back through your posts to show you a few quotes on why I would come up with that assessment. Decided that you are not worth the effort of quoting. When I meet a client that acts like you I don't quote for them. Straight up tell them i'm too busy.

You have insulted public servants & tradies. I am not some arrogant dude. I was trying to stand up for the new innocent business owner. He bought a name. Not a company. He has no obligation to help you or honour someone else's warranty. You have boasted about taking his work away from him. You should drop past and see his kids so you can tell them face to face that you have taken the food off their plate so that you can feel better about yourself. You are the poster boy for **** client.

My hatred of clients is a problem. One that I am actively addressing by shifting my business focus. If I could afford to I would just build for myself, but unfortunately some of the older generations have made access to finance quite hard for younger people.

At the end of the day a bad client can be defined as one who would actively try to rubbish a business owner they have never worked with, over a $500 ten year old warranty by someone else. Just out of interest, of the $495 you initially spent, how much of that did you pay? Was it a tax write off? Did you not up the rent a little a few months later? I'd guess you probably didn't spend much, we the non investment property owning public probably paid for it you arrogant p.o.s.

Don't forget that us scummy tradies are probably stronger, tougher and depending on the trade a damn sight smarter than you.

Faaaarkin nasty man. Tradies generally building tradies have the worst rep over here. Dont know about SA but over here unreliable rude etc. There are some good ones.

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Mr Milk said..

Jupiter said..

Jesus I wish you would stop your bloody whinging Jupiter.
And taking Kerry Packer as an example of a good citizen is feeble. His attitude to tax is appalling, claiming that everybody should pay as little as possible, by implication meaning evertbody else should pay more.

Remember the definition of a gentleman...someone who can play the bagpipes, but doesn't out of respect for the world at large. A decent citizen doesn't grab all he can for himself, even if he can use the law to do it.

No. not whinging. it is called standing your ground if you do have a point to make. Don't like what you read, how about skipping it and there will be no skin off your back.

Kerry Packer probably not your role model, neither is mine. However, it is about "legit" tax deduction. I bet you don't do it yourself because you care so much about others will pay ore ? Well, good on you if that is the case. If not, then you are just a hypocrite.

McLovin kicked goals, but he kicked it into his own. Now please do tell me which tradie doesn't make maximum tax claims ? Are you a tradie ? Do you do that, or you are a socially conscious individual who likes to take the burden off someone else? I suspect there may be some cash deals with some of the tradies too. And what is your argument about being a gentleman and all that ?

My tax claims on my investment properties are totally legit and my tax accountant make sure of that. No more and no less. Now do you have a problem with that ? Or may be you want to change the tax laws ?

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DARTH said..

Faaaarkin nasty man. Tradies generally building tradies have the worst rep over here. Dont know about SA but over here unreliable rude etc. There are some good ones.

As I declared earlier, I do not, I repeat, do not regard all tradies are like such. There are bad apples among them. The trouble is that those bad one actually believed they are of such importance that they can take the customers' money but hate them at the same time. Point in contradiction, innit ?

As I said earlier that a painter whom I have never met, but I took the chance and used him. He turned out to be a bloody good tradie and conscientious as well. Something to cheer about. I hope I am not whinging too much ?

Man you are some special kind of person aren't you. I am no longer going to respond to you as you are continually going round in circles. Please start reading other posts, not with blinkers on. You are either not reading or not understanding. I have tried to offer you another perspective. Honestly, I can have a better argument with my four year-old, his logic outshines yours every day of the week.

At no point in my life have I been told I must like my clients. I am my own boss, I can work for whoever I want. If I don't like you then you WILL pay a surcharge. If you don't like the price go somewhere else. If you continually get over market quotes then other people have the same attitude. I'd rather work with a nice client than a tight whinger. We don't have to work for you. I have enough repeat business to be picky.

Sure I claim my tools and rightfully so. They cost a bundle, wear out and break or get nicked by clients ( yes, have caught two people). They are direct expenses to run a business. Tried using a hammer and hand saw to build a house? At your $100 an hour it may cost you a little. I am not negatively gearing my business though, getting other people to pay for my repairs to rental properties, I'm still paying tax. In fact the govt makes more off me than I do.

You seem to be stuck on the fact that I have grown to hate clients. Big deal. They don't know I hate them, I'm a professional. Do you think teachers like their students at the end of their career? Plenty of jobs out there with people that don't like doing them. I like my job, just not the clients. So I'm moving away from dealing with them, just like I'm moving away from dealing with you.

May the property market crash and give you something real to bitch about.

Over and out.

Hey jupiter

Can you please scan and attach your "warranty" including the terms and conditions section?

!5 years for a shower sealer?

Ya kidding' right?

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mclovin said..
Man you are some special kind of person aren't you.

You seem to be stuck on the fact that I have grown to hate clients. Big deal. They don't know I hate them,

May the property market crash and give you something real to bitch about.

Over and out.

Hello hello, spate the dummy, or you dug yourself a hole so deep you couldn't get out ?

You ought to think carefully what you write before crashing in before you are "stronger, tough, and a damn sight smarter" than me. Then you accused me of a tax dodge by claiming tax concessions against my properties. Unfortunately, you forgot about your own claims on all manners of things with your trades. I have no issue with that as long as it is legit. But one shouldn't throw rocks in a glasshouse, should we ?

By the way, I do know of one kind of people/profession who take clients' money, but hate them anyway. I believe all their clients are called "John"

This is by no means referring to ALL tradies. If you are offended, my apologies.

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shoodbegood said..

Hey jupiter

Can you please scan and attach your "warranty" including the terms and conditions section?

!5 years for a shower sealer?

Ya kidding' right?

Hello shoodbegood, Sorry, I don't have a scanner. The warranty provided is just a straight forward invoice with a list of things done to the showers. It did itemize the areas "sealed and checked" then "pressure tested". It does look impressive as it seemed to have cover all areas in and around the showers. At the end of the invoice, an impressive looking seal with "15 Year Warranty written on it.

By the way, are you saying that (1). expecting 15 years out of a shower seal is too long, or (2). the fact that it didn't last longer than 15 years ? Please explain

Hey Jupiter

Yeah, I reckon 15 years from a shower sealer is way long.

Typically, 2 to 4 showers a day, lets call it 3 for an average.

That's 3 x 365 x 15 years = 16,425 showers !!!!!

Thats a lot a water splashed on something made of tile, silicone, glass, aluminium and porous grout.

And it has weak points, like the tap and shower outlet, maybe a shelf, a waste in the floor that probably never ever gets fully dry and holes where the shower screen has been fixed/secured.

Then throw in all the chemicals that are in shampoos and soaps. Have a look at the bottom corner of the glass shower screen. it will be cloudy as even though you clean it every week (I'm sure you do that right?)

Yep, 15 years is a big ask, in fact nigh on an impossible ask.

Sorry

Hey Jupiter

Yeah, I reckon 15 years from a shower sealer is way long.

Typically, 2 to 4 showers a day, lets call it 3 for an average.

That's 3 x 365 x 15 years = 16,425 showers !!!!!

Thats a lot a water splashed on something made of tile, silicone, glass, aluminium and porous grout.

And it has weak points, like the tap and shower outlet, maybe a shelf, a waste in the floor that probably never ever gets fully dry and holes where the shower screen has been fixed/secured.

Then throw in all the chemicals that are in shampoos and soaps. Have a look at the bottom corner of the glass shower screen. it will be cloudy as even though you clean it every week (I'm sure you do that right?)

Yep, 15 years is a big ask, in fact nigh on an impossible ask.

Sorry