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FlySurfer said..

actiomax said..
I've been out working outside for 20 years and it's the last couple of years it's getting impossible to work through the middle months of the summer .
Its heat wave or torrential rains & this is in Sydney.
So I'm already feeling the effects it's now reducing by a month or two my working year .
Should I budget for three next year it's really noticeable.
And it's not just me it's right across the board nobody can work outside building

Most of Australia is uninhabitable & with climate change more will become so at an ever increasing rate & that is happening right now & the drought & bushfires are proof .

I don't doubt you, and on the other side of the world they're complaining about polar vortexes, snow in Texas, snowed in for days... and one group is blaming this ALL on one molecule, CO2 which is 0.04% and they have a solution for you... the green new deal. Which may prevent you from working at all.

Sydney suffers really badly from urban heat island... they need more greenery, but then people complain about urban sprawl.

CO2 were it to act like they claim would have an homogenizing effect... cooler summers, warmer winters.

I've expressed my opinion that geomagnetism plays an important role, but people seem reluctant to even entertain this, so prepare yourself for the green new deal, which is going global ec.europa.eu/info/strategy/priorities-2019-2024/european-green-deal_en it may sound like an awesome idea, but they're selling you a fantasy in exchange for total and complete control of your life and industry.

Just a quick question - I see that you have avoided dealing with the fact that you threw absolute bull**** about "climate warriors" getting stuck in the ice around this forum. Since you threw complete and utter denialist BS around earlier, and you don't have the honesty to address the fact that it was BS, why should anyone trust you now?

Are you going to accept that you posted BS earlier? It's hard to deny. So are you posting more of it now?

Secondly, allegedly this Stossel you rely on said in 2013 that soon we'd be buying donuts with a wheelbarrow full of cash. If so, why rely on him? In fact, isn't it strange how the denialists screech about the fact that Al Gore and Attenborough are not scientists, but then accept what other people who aren't scientists tell them about science?

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Chris 249 said..So are you posting more of it now?

If you're going to be litigious, please bullet point what I wrote and where it deviates from the truth, and I will be happy to address them.

But until then, maybe watch this which correlates somewhat to my view (Freeman's).

I've already pointed out your BS. You said (as can be seen here www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/General-Discussion/Chat/Hockey-stick-Mann-loses-climate-denier-court-case?page=3 ) that there were "Climate alarmists stuck in ice trying to prove there's no ice... evacuated by global warming helicopter.
www.climatedepot.com/2019/09/09/climate-warriors-filming-documentary-stuck-in-arctic-ice-all-16-climate-activists-evacuated-from-ship-by-helicopter/

A previous alarmist attempt to prove melting ice had to turn back in JULY bcos: 'We had expected more melting': Thick Arctic ice forces Norwegian climate research icebreaker to turn back."

I've shown, with links, that what you said was utter bull****. They were not "climate alarmists...trying to prove there's no ice" - they were a bunch of Scandinavian guys following an old exploration. And there was no "alarmist attempt to prove melting ice" - there was a mechanical issue with a propeller. I have shown that with links that prove that the Scandi guys have been running such trips for years; with pics of the propeller gland being fixed; even with an interview with the leader of the Scandi trip.

No reasonable person could need bullet points to show how such completely wrong claims are completely wrong. You fell for the denialist crap.

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FlySurfer said..

Chris 249 said..So are you posting more of it now?

If you're going to be litigious, please bullet point what I wrote and where it deviates from the truth, and I will be happy to address them.

But until then, maybe watch this which correlates somewhat to my view (Freeman's).

I'll check it later. But what I find odd is that you'll present someone like Dyson, who is brilliant but not a climate scientist and not in touch with the field, and say "look, here's an expert view, you must listen to it". But on the other hand, if the other side presents the views of a top climate scientist or a brilliant scientist like Schmidt, "deniers" say "he's full of ****, don't listen to him". It seems that if a scientist says that fits with your view you accept it, but if a scientist who is better qualified in this field says something that doesn't fit with your view, you'll abuse them. You've posted cartoons that insult scientists who don't agree with you, and yet now you want people to agree with scientists.

The fact is, I don't want AGW to be happening. It worries me; not personally because I'm one of the lucky ones in various ways, but on behalf of other people. But to sling **** at people who are qualified experts in the field just because they do not say what we want them to say is dishonest.

Those ship of fools were a classic

It will never get old

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TonyAbbott said..
Those ship of fools were a classic

It will never get old

Still confusing weather with climate I see. What matters is the trend over decades.

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holy guacamole said..
I note that idiot Michael McCormack has used his re-election to again state that these bushfires are NOT unprecedented, despite contrary statements from the fire authorities, the fire experts, the Prime Minister and Treasurer.

McCormack's breathtaking, deliberate, and continuous ignorance is usually reserved for the likes of 911 conspiracy theorists, gun nuts, anti-vaxxers, and flat earthers.

Our Prime Minister speaks in tongues.

They belong in the "loony" column.

People actually see demons hiding behind an "agenda" to reduce pollution and protect our own environment.

I can't believe we are still holding a candle in the dark in the 21st century.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Demon-Haunted_World

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TonyAbbott said..
Those ship of fools were a classic

It will never get old

So, you still haven't actually shown that it happened. We know the denialist right has LIED about it happening - so when has it actually happened?

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holy guacamole said..

TonyAbbott said..
Those ship of fools were a classic

It will never get old

Still confusing weather with climate I see. What matters is the trend over decades.

But apparently not the trends over millennium

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harry potter said..

holy guacamole said..

TonyAbbott said..
Those ship of fools were a classic

It will never get old

Still confusing weather with climate I see. What matters is the trend over decades.

But apparently not the trends over millennium

They're inconvenient.

That's the inconvenient truth.

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evlPanda said..

holy guacamole said..
I note that idiot Michael McCormack has used his re-election to again state that these bushfires are NOT unprecedented, despite contrary statements from the fire authorities, the fire experts, the Prime Minister and Treasurer.

McCormack's breathtaking, deliberate, and continuous ignorance is usually reserved for the likes of 911 conspiracy theorists, gun nuts, anti-vaxxers, and flat earthers.

Our Prime Minister speaks in tongues.

They belong in the "loony" column.

People actually see demons hiding behind an "agenda" to reduce pollution and protect our own environment.

I can't believe we are still holding a candle in the dark in the 21st century.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Demon-Haunted_World

Yeah and whilst they were happening David Attenborough said we had reached "the moment of crisis" which means the world was at a critical point that signalled the beginning of the a global catastrophe . Really? the moment of crisis, yet somehow a month on the bush has begun to recover. FFS guys get a grip, the world is not ending. It will be here billions of years after we are all gone.

As to continuous ignornace and political agenda's just read what Climate Extinction has as goals, if you think there is no political agenda you have your head in the sand.

Finally religious beliefs are not an indication of intelligence and any one who portrays them as such is just demostrating their own prejudice.

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evlPanda said..McCormack's breathtaking, deliberate, and continuous ignorance is usually reserved for the likes of 911 conspiracy theorists, gun nuts, anti-vaxxers, and flat earthers. Our Prime Minister speaks in tongues. They belong in the "loony" column.

People actually see demons hiding behind an "agenda" to reduce pollution and protect our own environment.

I can't believe we are still holding a candle in the dark in the 21st century.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Demon-Haunted_World

Firmly in the happy clappy loony column.

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Chris 249 said..

I'll check it later. But what I find odd is that you'll present someone like Dyson, who is brilliant but not a climate scientist

Should of checked it first. Modest Dyson doesn't claim to be a "climate scientist" but who really can? Climate science spans so many disciplines I don't think anybody could claim to be fully across it. You've got geologists, meteorologists, sedimentologists, chemists, astrophysicists, botanists, biologists, oceanographers, mathematicians specialising in complex systems, mathematicians specialising in computational methods. And to cap it all off computer programmers!, Dyson has just as much, most likely way more, claim to be a "climate scientist" as any of them. ( apologies if I've left anybody here out)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeman_Dyson

Should have, should've. Not should of.

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cammd said..
Finally religious beliefs are not an indication of intelligence and any one who portrays them as such is just demostrating their own prejudice.

No, religious beliefs are an indication of intellectual laziness. Excepting, of course, the people who carefully study the accumulation of texts and go on to manage and manipulate the hordes of believers

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TonyAbbott said..
Those ship of fools were a classic

It will never get old

Well, a quick search over breakfast indicates that the cartoon was about the Akademik Shokalskiy. The problem is that it's lying bull****. One of the aims of the expedition was to explore the growth of fast ice - yes GROWTH - and they were well aware of "the more extensive sea ice cover in Commonwealth Bay" which seems to have been caused by the grounding of the giant iceberg B09B nearby.

It's a lie to say that the expedition were "studying disappearing ice". Like many things related to the climate, the extent of ice is complicated. Sadly, many deniers don't know seem to know the difference between truth and lies, and they are so gullible they keep on falling for lies and thinking that political cartoons are a source of truth.

You'd also have to be ignorant to not know that ships get stuck in ice pretty routinely; in 1983 the Russians had 26 ships stuck in ice at sea at the same time, for example. It's not something that's all that unusual and to make a song and dance about it is pretty dishonest.

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Ian K said..

Chris 249 said..

I'll check it later. But what I find odd is that you'll present someone like Dyson, who is brilliant but not a climate scientist

Should of checked it first. Modest Dyson doesn't claim to be a "climate scientist" but who really can? Climate science spans so many disciplines I don't think anybody could claim to be fully across it. You've got geologists, meteorologists, sedimentologists, chemists, astrophysicists, botanists, biologists, oceanographers, mathematicians specialising in complex systems, mathematicians specialising in computational methods. And to cap it all off computer programmers!, Dyson has just as much, most likely way more, claim to be a "climate scientist" as any of them. ( apologies if I've left anybody here out)

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freeman_Dyson

I didn't say Dyson was a climate scientist, nor did I imply it. I know he's not a climate scientist and doesn't pretend to be.

The point, which I thought was pretty clear, was that deniers have discounted the views of many scientists who are not working in climate science, by saying that because they don't work in that area they should not be listened to. And yet here Dyson, who admits that he is not a climate scientist, is being pointed to as someone to listen to.

It's inconsistent and illogical. We either discount the views of those who are not specialists, or we don't. Deniers can't say "Dr Smith is not a specialist but you have to listen to him" while also saying "Dr Jones is not a specialist so we will not listen to him".

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cammd said..

evlPanda said..

holy guacamole said..
I note that idiot Michael McCormack has used his re-election to again state that these bushfires are NOT unprecedented, despite contrary statements from the fire authorities, the fire experts, the Prime Minister and Treasurer.

McCormack's breathtaking, deliberate, and continuous ignorance is usually reserved for the likes of 911 conspiracy theorists, gun nuts, anti-vaxxers, and flat earthers.

Our Prime Minister speaks in tongues.

They belong in the "loony" column.

People actually see demons hiding behind an "agenda" to reduce pollution and protect our own environment.

I can't believe we are still holding a candle in the dark in the 21st century.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Demon-Haunted_World

Yeah and whilst they were happening David Attenborough said we had reached "the moment of crisis" which means the world was at a critical point that signalled the beginning of the a global catastrophe . Really? the moment of crisis, yet somehow a month on the bush has begun to recover. FFS guys get a grip, the world is not ending. It will be here billions of years after we are all gone.

As to continuous ignornace and political agenda's just read what Climate Extinction has as goals, if you think there is no political agenda you have your head in the sand.

Finally religious beliefs are not an indication of intelligence and any one who portrays them as such is just demostrating their own prejudice.

Climate Extinction does not speak for all people who believe in AGW, just as the Nazi party does not speak for all right wingers.

How much of the bush have you walked through? How many of the animals have you counted, and how do you know they will recover?

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Mr Milk said..

cammd said..
Finally religious beliefs are not an indication of intelligence and any one who portrays them as such is just demostrating their own prejudice.

No, religious beliefs are an indication of intellectual laziness. Excepting, of course, the people who carefully study the accumulation of texts and go on to manage and manipulate the hordes of believers

Na, there are some damn smart theologians around, and some damn smart religious people. Sure, you and I think they are wrong, but they are neither wrong or lazy.

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Chris 249 said..

cammd said..

evlPanda said..

holy guacamole said..
I note that idiot Michael McCormack has used his re-election to again state that these bushfires are NOT unprecedented, despite contrary statements from the fire authorities, the fire experts, the Prime Minister and Treasurer.

McCormack's breathtaking, deliberate, and continuous ignorance is usually reserved for the likes of 911 conspiracy theorists, gun nuts, anti-vaxxers, and flat earthers.

Our Prime Minister speaks in tongues.

They belong in the "loony" column.

People actually see demons hiding behind an "agenda" to reduce pollution and protect our own environment.

I can't believe we are still holding a candle in the dark in the 21st century.

en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Demon-Haunted_World

Yeah and whilst they were happening David Attenborough said we had reached "the moment of crisis" which means the world was at a critical point that signalled the beginning of the a global catastrophe . Really? the moment of crisis, yet somehow a month on the bush has begun to recover. FFS guys get a grip, the world is not ending. It will be here billions of years after we are all gone.

As to continuous ignornace and political agenda's just read what Climate Extinction has as goals, if you think there is no political agenda you have your head in the sand.

Finally religious beliefs are not an indication of intelligence and any one who portrays them as such is just demostrating their own prejudice.

Climate Extinction does not speak for all people who believe in AGW, just as the Nazi party does not speak for all right wingers.

How much of the bush have you walked through? How many of the animals have you counted, and how do you know they will recover?

No XR don't speak for all people but I was responding to an assertion that there is NO political agenda associated with climate activists when clearly there is within a section of the movement, XR was provided as an example to back up my reply.

Its actually a shame that groups like XR with a political agenda are using climate alarmism as a means to promote their political goals because whilst I and people like me can get on board with looking after the planet and making it a better place for all living things I absolutely cannot get on board with leftard socialist ideals that don't work and by mixing them together it creates suspicion and resistance to the climate message.

As for the bush I haven't walked through it and and I don't know for sure it will recover, I am just assuming that will happen based on the bush recovering from past bushfires in this country for the last I dont know 1 million years or so. What do think you think, do you think those areas that were burned will never recover ever again.

Was David Attenborough right, was it the "moment of crisis" for our planet or was he just being a tad alarmist

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Chris 249 said..

Mr Milk said..

cammd said..
Finally religious beliefs are not an indication of intelligence and any one who portrays them as such is just demostrating their own prejudice.

No, religious beliefs are an indication of intellectual laziness. Excepting, of course, the people who carefully study the accumulation of texts and go on to manage and manipulate the hordes of believers

Na, there are some damn smart theologians around, and some damn smart religious people. Sure, you and I think they are wrong, but they are neither wrong or lazy.

Thank you Chris , there have been some damn smart ones though out history as well and your correct you do not need to share a persons beliefs in order to show them respect, to think otherwise is either ignorance or bigotry or maybe a little of both.

Interesting wrap up of the misinformation trotted out by right wing politicians, climate change deniers and shock jocks.

www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02-18/fact-check-peter-dutton-arson-250-charged/11971454

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holy guacamole said..
Interesting wrap up of the misinformation trotted out by right wing politicians, climate change deniers and shock jocks.

www.abc.net.au/news/2020-02-18/fact-check-peter-dutton-arson-250-charged/11971454

Interestingly we don't have any hard evidences either way. Simply guessing ( educated one may add) .
The fact the arsonist wasn't always catch up and then sentenced doesn't mean anything.
We must agree the smart arsonist may rather win alway over prosecutor.
We don't have also hard evidenced of bushfires ignited by lighting.
This is rather more based circumstances - there was lighting, then bushfire, then lighting was at fault- but nothing like video security camera or taken from drones , space video of single lighting strike spreading into massive bushfire.

not very convincing evidence. tree is not instantly erupting into torch, but one may say that our trees are different and lighting strikes also 1000x stronger.
But I would like to see a single photo / video evidence from our recent bushfire of such event. One video surveillance demonstrating cause of one of many recent bushfire here.

Why did the CSIRO hide this?

Because climate activist have conducted a long march through institutions like the CSIRO. They masquerade as scientist then pretent they are unbiased.


www.skynews.com.au/details/_6138277802001?fbclid=IwAR3qUEDU2ioq5Yz7QNlBozRBT0mSvZbIj4V1potYXO7c33lqirmm0s3u8Jk

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TonyAbbott said..
Why did the CSIRO hide this?

Because climate activist have conducted a long march through institutions like the CSIRO. The masquerade as scientist then pretent they are unbiased.


www.skynews.com.au/details/_6138277802001?fbclid=IwAR3qUEDU2ioq5Yz7QNlBozRBT0mSvZbIj4V1potYXO7c33lqirmm0s3u8Jk

No CSIRO has not dropped its game. It's just that in something as complex and fuzzy as climate change and its implications for the frequency and severity of fire weather, there's a lot of room to include spin or lack of spin without being unscientific.

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TonyAbbott said..
Why did the CSIRO hide this?

Because climate activist have conducted a long march through institutions like the CSIRO. They masquerade as scientist then pretent they are unbiased.


www.skynews.com.au/details/_6138277802001?fbclid=IwAR3qUEDU2ioq5Yz7QNlBozRBT0mSvZbIj4V1potYXO7c33lqirmm0s3u8Jk

More like climate deniers have conducted a long march through propaganda companies like Sky News. They masquerade as news then pretend they are unbiased.

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holy guacamole said..
More like climate deniers have conducted a long march through propaganda companies like Sky News. They masquerade as news then pretend they are unbiased.

As an aide ... why do you assume one group does this bias thing but nobody else does...?

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Kamikuza said..

holy guacamole said..
More like climate deniers have conducted a long march through propaganda companies like Sky News. They masquerade as news then pretend they are unbiased.

As an aide ... why do you assume one group does this bias thing but nobody else does...?

As an aside.... why are you addressing that question to HC but not TA?

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TonyAbbott said..
Why did the CSIRO hide this?

Because climate activist have conducted a long march through institutions like the CSIRO. They masquerade as scientist then pretent they are unbiased.


www.skynews.com.au/details/_6138277802001?fbclid=IwAR3qUEDU2ioq5Yz7QNlBozRBT0mSvZbIj4V1potYXO7c33lqirmm0s3u8Jk

The strange thing is that it appears that you really do think that a Sky report about a Coalition claim is proof of anything.

There's no proof, of course, in your abuse of the CSIRO.