Gestalt forum posts in last 60 days

Would be keen to eventually get one too.. great review thx.

Great to see. this is pretty much windsurfing for me. bigger user friendly boards, small fins and wave sails. blasting, bump and jump or small surf. Too much fun to be had.

everyone else switched to winging and bypassed this option. The penny dropped for me being frustrated with having to use heavy slalom gear in lighter winds and noticing the freestyle guys planning in same wind. I set myself a 2 season goal to drop from an 8.5m to a 5.6m

never looked back.

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ptsf1111 said..
The Gorilla, Blue, and Red SeverneRDM masts are identical, except for the 1 layer (Blue) or 2 layers (Gorilla) of glass for strength. Makes you wonder why the Red is more expensive than the Gorilla as it requires less material and labour. Guess it's a higher quality prepreg carbon.

Yup. been told by the severne team they are identical too. Could simply be manufacturing tolerances.

also worth pointing out for the op that the g2 masts are lighter than the original gorillas and the reds are suitable for surf.

Brent I think you also get the gear award.

''would love your thoughts in a review thread on the new stone board.. seems everyone in comps that touches one looks better on the wave. Game changer? Big fins too..

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aeroegnr said..
I wish I had a couple of different % masts sitting around to notice how much I felt the difference with the same sails...

But one thing that I did find out, talking to some local really good IQFoilers was that they would get a few of the 90% 530s and would sort through them by feel to find the best one. They felt the difference in individual masts.

This is very common at the elite end. Especially one design where differences in gear add up. it's more about manufacturing tolerance..

''say I have a sail that is +5% and a mast that's -3% that totals an 8% difference. If I can find a mast that's +5% then it's a better match for the sail..

Maybe one mast has a slightly softer head and that suits the sailor more etc.or another sets the sail slightly fuller. Only way to know is to buy a bunch of gear and start testing.
occasionally you'll see a pro spend their training season matching the perfect gear only to have someone drive over it with a forklift at the airport, or a breakage on day one of comp etc.. Whilst gear is insured that's 6 months of work gone.

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ptsf1111 said..
More time, probably but who's going to fund that... I guess someone's managing budgets and this one might not survive much longer. That is purely a guess fwiw.

this does feel like it has sense of finality.

The gorilla has an extra layer of glass which gives it the feeling of being stiffer and provides the weight and step up in strength. personally I think it also rigs slightly differently because it is a smidge stiffer.

I run full 100% in my simmer sails and won't look back however the next step down is 80% in simmer which is a big step.

back to severne I have a mix of gorilla and blue for wave sails smaller than 5.6m. fwiw jaeger developed the s1 s on gorillas. Not sure if he's using blue or red now though. The smaller the sail the less of an impact and of course he needs stronger masts. in anything over 430mm I'd get blue or red. the higher carbon gets you a lighter sail with better reflex in the head. If weight is your preference the red is a no brainer. if budget then blue.. agree with the others on the water it won't be super noticeable.

as a quiver is built around a mast I think the mast deserves the money.. Sails come and go. After years of using heavier cheaper gear to avoid breakages once I switched to full carbon booms and masts it was a revelation and I can't look back..of course I;m not smashing reef breaks or trying double loops...

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sheddweller said..

Gestalt said..

duzzi said..

Gestalt said..

ptsf1111 said..
I wouldn't be surprised if this is the beginning of the end for this 3Di construction in windsurfing sails, let's see what happens next.

Lots of carbon fiber cloth options for stitched sails now

Not to mention the stichless Q-bond technology point-7.com/zero-26/qbondsails/ ... but let's face it: all this can only save grams, not Kgs like North used to claim.

Severne pioneered this stuff, lightweight carbon cloths, glued seems. They've been doing it for multiple years now.. point 7 missed the boat for me.

They really did not Pioneer it. They were just who you saw doing it.
I had my first spectra laminate sail in 1988, around the same time my friend had a mostly stitchless glued sail. My first carbon laminate slalom sail I can't quite remember the year , I think it was about 2002 era, I had a new sonic 100 at the same time, so that year. My standard 4.6 4 batten sail in 1988 was 2.2kg, made from polyester and kevlar scrim laminates. I had a Twaron scrim laminate 8.2m slalom sail that was under 3kg , around 1997. My 7.0 6 batten cammed slalom sail from 1995 in technora scrim laminates was 2.9kg. not sure what year severne started making sails?
So basically scrim laminate tech is more than 40 years old, highly developed and well understood by those who have been using it a long time.
The north stuff is good too, and the membrane and the film less sailcloths in rolled form. They can all be used to make good sails. But 100percent truth is none are clearly dominant over another, it's all about the design implementation. Hell even monofilm can be good, it's just so damn cheap! 10 euro for a sails worth of cloth instead of 100.....

Totally agree.

I should have been clearer. I meant scaled up production and implementation.

i hope north get their 3di working. my take is they just need more time.

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duzzi said..

Gestalt said..

ptsf1111 said..
I wouldn't be surprised if this is the beginning of the end for this 3Di construction in windsurfing sails, let's see what happens next.

Lots of carbon fiber cloth options for stitched sails now

Not to mention the stichless Q-bond technology point-7.com/zero-26/qbondsails/ ... but let's face it: all this can only save grams, not Kgs like North used to claim.

Severne pioneered this stuff, lightweight carbon cloths, glued seems. They've been doing it for multiple years now.. point 7 missed the boat for me.

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ptsf1111 said..
I wouldn't be surprised if this is the beginning of the end for this 3Di construction in windsurfing sails, let's see what happens next.

Lots of carbon fiber cloth options for stitched sails now

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Freeflight said..

Gestalt said..

Manawa said..
Another possibility, could be related to the R&D cycle. Developing a new 3Di mold is a massive and time-consuming industrial process. It's possible that North is using these traditional monofilm prototypes as 'live templates.' This would allow designers and athletes to cut, sew, and tweak the geometry like luff curves and draft positions in real-time. Once they've potentially found the winning shape in film, they can then 'freeze' that data into the final 3Di production molds.

Monofilm is back? Well I am going to confort myself with a massive plate of spaghetti or steaming bowl of cappelletti in brodo + 36 month aged muntain of real Parmigiano Reggiano and a good glass of wine.....

This was my take also.. It's easier to proto and cheaper. from what has been publicised they will continue selling the stitched sails and will look to do the 3di in custom amounts.

think it was Monty Spindler that said sails need to be able to be set flat and shaped. that could be the crux of the issue here. the 3di sails don't have that ability

I think if just cloning a mylar sail with the 3di process worked in any way they would have cracked the code a couple of years ago.
The 3di materials seem to respond in a different way and it's not going to be an option to just copy a great working stitched sail.

You may be right about that. I'm not sure. Hard to know where they started with the 3di sails. From scratch or an existing shape. Guess it wasn't a duotone..

bringing onboard the phantom guys brings working shapes and a design philosophy to the table. Pretty much anything can be scanned these days. I guess time will tell.

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Manawa said..
Another possibility, could be related to the R&D cycle. Developing a new 3Di mold is a massive and time-consuming industrial process. It's possible that North is using these traditional monofilm prototypes as 'live templates.' This would allow designers and athletes to cut, sew, and tweak the geometry like luff curves and draft positions in real-time. Once they've potentially found the winning shape in film, they can then 'freeze' that data into the final 3Di production molds.

Monofilm is back? Well I am going to confort myself with a massive plate of spaghetti or steaming bowl of cappelletti in brodo + 36 month aged muntain of real Parmigiano Reggiano and a good glass of wine.....

This was my take also.. It's easier to proto and cheaper. from what has been publicised they will continue selling the stitched sails and will look to do the 3di in custom amounts.

think it was Monty Spindler that said sails need to be able to be set flat and shaped. that could be the crux of the issue here. the 3di sails don't have that ability

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Bouke-Witchcraft said..

Gestalt said..
Just don't take those poorly performing wa boards with limited range to tassie. Lol..

That was 20 years ago. They are not as bad anymore but you still see these traits with a more paralel outline, rounder rails and tailkick in some boards. Not good for less than ideal conditions like you get in the North Sea or other beach breaks with cross on shore condtions and a strong rip down wind directly along the beach. You can stand in knee deep water, 20m from shore and your legs are being pulled from under you. So as soon as you jump on the board, the apparent wind drops and you drift down wind very quickly. You need a fast planing board with good up wind ability to get through this. Once you are through the first 50m, or over the first sand bar, this rip disappears. Then there are also spots with big tides and strong tidal rips, often combined with the beach rip. In the North Sea, where I come from, the tides are around 3m, every 6 hours. In the british channel the tide can be 12m..... In WA the tide is like 50cm max once a day?But there are a whole lot more windsurfers around the North Sea. At spots like Wijk aan Zee in Holland you can see 300 sailors out on a good day. Within a 1 hour drive there are like 10 million people living but people also come from Germany on a good forecast. And there are more spots like that.

I have a board from 20 years ago, it was designed and built in wa by one of their legend shapers. It doesn't display any of the traits you describe. Outline is not parallel, rails are hard and the double concave through the tail extend beyond the outline. It was also not designed in cad. So what are you on about.
I have boards with and without tail kick. some slalom boards have tail kick as do some speed boards. Tail kick is not a problem fwiw.
some jp fsw boards use flat centre rocker with more rail rocker. seems to work for them.

I have another board here same deal different shaper. not quite as old though.

anyways, here is my final thought.

It would be great if you stopped talking in absolutes, there are no absolutes in design, there is merely a series of choices that lead to an outcome. That outcome being defined by the choices.

your posts continue to push the idea that you have somehow figured out some magic combination that elevates you above everyone.
this is of course simply not true. I'm not suggesting your boards aren't great boards but I'm constantly struck by the thought of how much better your boards could be with a different approach. The problem with absolutes is it prevents exploring all the options both good and bad.

it seems to me other board designers don't suffer from this. Don't feel the need to slag off others and are secure enough in themselves to be able to celebrate others

So less snake oil more....

Just don't take those poorly performing wa boards with limited range to tassie. Lol..

Cool. From what you describe just needed more downhaul for the wind on the day. Am not sure how much a ratchet or 2 adds . Prob best to start at 0 and go up or down 1cm from there.

Either way . Not trying to lecture you. Understand you've been at this for a while and agree with you prob just needed a smaller sail once wind came up. Just helping

Hi sue. how much do you think you put on.. did you rig the sail to spec and then add .5cm more downhaul. That should get you more towards top end settings.

if you feel comfortable going upwind but getting lifted off the wind then you are most likely getting over powered. You can sail deeper to help as well. You may get some extra speed going deeper. Not sure, don't know what angles you are sailing. You may find due to lack of cams you loose drive when going deeper as well.

Agree. Was excellent. Commentary worked so well. Footage was excellent too. Reminded me of Fiji at times.

the organisers got the program and forecasting right too. Finals had the best conditions

Jaeger - 43.14
koster - 21.26
Salmon - 41.5

Infantino - 9.14
Thule - 38.2
Kenyon - 23.02

Seman - 21.3
Andres - 23.43

Kenyon - 26.36

Winner!!!! ptsf1111 - 204.79 well done mate
Gestalt - 182.42

interesting to try. I need to think it through so if you have any suggestion let me know..i excluded the redemption as it skews points toward those not making it through the main round and as we're trying to pick winners that seems counter intuitive.

such a great comp. Professional coverage and performances. Jaeger showed his class with the wave in the final where he hit big lips and gouged a Jon Jon Florence esk top turn, was next level.

Sarah and Jake gave it everything and deserved the wins. Exciting for them. Sarah was always on the best waves..Jake's airs could be mistaken for Jaegers. How good is that stone board.
So many other good moments and like last year, some unlucky sailors. Koster and Salmon were unlucky

why the hell is no-one talking about the event. If it's a 5 star next year everyone there this year has an edge.

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Manawa said..

ptsf1111 said..
Same, I like my Blades but if there was a considerably better sail without a premium price that lasts, I'd consider it. Let's see where North are heading, hopefully everyone can just share honest reviews rather than promos though.

To be totally honest, last August I had both the North 3Di[/b] and the Severne S-1 Pro carbon fusion[/b] in my van, and choosing which one to rig was a real 'luxury problem.' They are absolutely on the same elite level. The S-1 Pro is an incredible piece of engineering, super light, big range of use, is made for competition. I was using the 4.4 S1 pro carbon fusion.
I've been in love with the S-1 Pro for years, but the North Wave has captured my heart recently. It's really a matter of personal preference when you're surfing or just planing. My partner made a clearer choice toward Severne; she finds the center of effort more central and easier to manage. Personally, I'm loving the North right now I really like that feeling of a light but effective forward drive. It's just a matter of taste in how you feel the power. On both sets of sails, we use the original Severne (blu and red) and North masts, extensions, and booms to keep the specs right. As for boards, my girlfriend is literally in love with the Pyro 78 [/b]it's her absolute favorite. So as you can see, we aren't brand-biased; we just use what we love. I'm just curious to see if Gen 3 takes that 'forward drive' feeling I like to the next level.

I also wanted to apologize to everyone for my tone earlier. Please put it down to my huge passion and the fact that my English isn't perfect....;
In the end, all these carbon sail brands have pushed the bar so high that we are all winners.

Great post. I was reading it thinking .. mate you gotta try the simmer team carbon.. lol

Maria Andres has gone to hot sails

Alessio Stillrich is on Patrik. Surprised by that. He looked good on bruche.

Thx, just tuned in.

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onshoreroy said..
I used to get through sales every year or two and they it would upset me how much they cost and how quickly they look rough. Now I use as ezzy sails and difference is incredible. Although I do have some simmer legacy sails that are going strong.

Have seen ezzy sails having issues with mono in the past ..warranty claims etc ..

Agree tho that they are better than some brands for longevity but that's more about material choice from the brands .. any sails that use thicker mono or longer lasting materials will last longer ..

As you point out, Simmers a great example of sails that go the distance but there is also Goya, hot sails and others.

Ezzy have somehow managed to convince people their sails last longer when in reality they don't have access to materials that others can't access. So anyone using similar materials gets the same lifespan. Materials have known lifespan and sail designer get to make the choice when piecing together the sail.

As users we just need to understand how the materials last when making choices about what we are buying..

Me personally I ditched bigger slalom gear and switched to wave based gear because I wanted more longevity from my gear... Less mono.

Same with hardware. I ditched any brand that broke.. I ended up with heavy gear, indestructible but not really as much fun to use.

So swings and roundabouts.. am I ever going to buy a monofilm sail again .. I have some still so yes but my preference is for more hybrid longer lasting, lighter materials in most cases.

The problem with xply, it stretches..... Overtime sails loose their crispness. I've got simmer sails that are 7 years old, heavily used, have mono windows and xply elsewhere but they have lost their shape in places and are slower to react .

Swings and roundabouts.....

I watched on Surfline in realtime. His rides really stood out compared to everyone else on the day. Possibly looked better than the closeups posted on socials even though the quality on Surfline is not as good.

tomorrows forecast looks good.

Fair to say Jake Ghiretti was on fire in his pro junior heat. Stomped huge airs, was drifting his tail in critical sections and came in a minute early after destroying the lineup with wave scores over 8

Live scorer has 12 minutes on the countdown. Lineup looks cleared...

Good one. Just a bit of fun. to be honest I didn't dig into it too deep. I guess if you know the competitors you have to base choices on who's getting through earlier rounds. yeah agree re maria. She commits! I struggled not to pick her.

it's all for fun tho.

as it's only 2 of us I'll keep the scores in an excel doc. see where it all lands. will be watching via Surfline when I can.

Men's group A
Philip Koster
Jaeger Stone

Men's group B
Federico Infantino
Simon Thule
Peter Kenyon

Women's group A
Jane Seman

Women's group B
Sarah Kenyon

Ok who's keen. Only really threw this idea together now. Could be flawed but let's see how it goes..

Competitors below.. Total their individual scores throughout the event as per WSL system.
entry list is here however I've grouped competitors below. www.liveheats.com/events/437495
just reply to this thread. If no interest it dies a gracious death.

Men's group A - pick 2

Philip Koster
Alessio Lucca Stillrich
Takuma Sugi
Jaeger Stone
Julian Salmonn

Men's group B - pick 3

Federico Infantino
Chris Powell
Simon Thule
Simon Peters
Oliver Desforges
Jake Ghiretti
jonah desforges
Peter Kenyon
Nick Bentley


Women's group A - pick 1

Jane Seman
Karin Jaggi
Maria Andres

Women's group B - pick 1

Sarah Kenyon
Sybille Bode
Helena Derya Lale

Agree.. been a huge fan of what north are trying to do but it became obvious that something was not working at the elite level once the sails started to under perform in competition..

not saying that means they are no good.. most people I know who use them rave about them so there is something to these sails. Maybe it's gonna take some time for north to tweak each stage of the process to fully deliver the game changing part of the story. 'tech wise it is game changing. I'm sure they'll figure it out..

I was there 2 weeks ago giving my son his first drive on sand and flicking a few lure around the northern side river mouth..

there was a breakthrough on the northern side a couple of weeks back which has increased the size of the area a lot so it's looking great. lots of banks there and some of it pretty soft. At low the tide was ripping out.

the runs are longer now. I'd caution about sailing there on a fast outgoing tide which is the case for all rivermouths and bar crossings and agree with tomp it's prob too shallow on lower tides.

Something I've always wanted to do is hire a bbq boat, anchor it over the sand banks opposite Russell street at high tide and go blasting straight off the back of the boat.