Anyone had the chance to compare the 90L wizard and 90L wingcraft boards for winging?

I've been wondering the same thing. The Wizard 90 looks like it might be the ticket for high wind wind foiling (water starting) and all things winging. The bottom shape should work really well with the newer HA winging foils and it has enough volume, at least for me (68 kg.), to knee start with a wing together with a short length (4' 10"), so little swing weight. It has enough foot strap positions to work with either sport. The wing craft has a bottom shape, which appears to favour lower aspect foils. I find he Wizard 90 a more tempting proposition, especially if you're into both sports.

i have a friend who wings on the Wizard 90 and likes it. He is probably in the 75-80kg range and is an experienced windsurfer, windfoiler, and winger. He often wings on a 35l sinker.

He suspects the Wizard 90 is closer to 80-85l. He wings w/ this board in lighter, gustier wind on the lake, and he uses footstraps and likes to jump.

A couple downsides to the Wizard 90 as a wing board:
-no leash plug
-no carry handle
-shorter deck pad and non-skid on the front of the board
-extra weight (around 20lbs)
-flat deck w/ dome (instead of concave)

The Wizard 90 would be a great board for a windfoiler who wants a small, maneuverable board. It can also be used for winging, and it's a great one-board solution, but I don't think it's ideal for winging only.

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sunsetsailboards said..
i have a friend who wings on the Wizard 90 and likes it. He is probably in the 75-80kg range and is an experienced windsurfer, windfoiler, and winger. He often wings on a 35l sinker.

He suspects the Wizard 90 is closer to 80-85l. He wings w/ this board in lighter, gustier wind on the lake, and he uses footstraps and likes to jump.

A couple downsides to the Wizard 90 as a wing board:
-no leash plug
-no carry handle
-shorter deck pad and non-skid on the front of the board
-extra weight (around 20lbs)
-flat deck w/ dome (instead of concave)

The Wizard 90 would be a great board for a windfoiler who wants a small, maneuverable board. It can also be used for winging, and it's a great one-board solution, but I don't think it's ideal for winging only.

There are some simple solutions to some of the problems you raised -- 1) you can put the rear foot strap on or just use the screws to attach a heavy line and use it to attach your leash; 2) carry the board on your upwind shoulder and the wing in the other hand; and 3) cut out some wetsuit material (if you have an old wetsuit or steamer) just below the knees a couple of inches wide and locate it just below your knees if you're not wearing a wetsuit to protect your upper shins (it works for me). We can't do anything about the weight or the domed deck.

Like the Door I wind foil and wing and that's why this board looks so interesting as a one board solution. The new shred sled -- 110 litres) also looks like a one board solution that's more geared towards winging.

Thanks. Do you think the foil tracks are too rear on the wizard for winging? or is this more on issue with bigger slower front wings that generally need to be more forward.

Also wondering if the wizard 90 would be small enough to no under my arms like a surfboard. I imagine that is how people carry their sinkers.

I have the Fanatic Sky Wing 95 litre and the tracks are quite far back on it. I'm using the Kijura foils, which have aspect ratios of about 6.5:1, 7.1:1 and 8.1:1 and they work fine -- set up about 2 centimetres from the front of the track. The Armstrong foils might be an issue. The Phantasm should work.

BTW, have you looked at the new Shred Sled as an allrounder?

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dejavu said..
I have the Fanatic Sky Wing 95 litre and the tracks are quite far back on it. I'm using the Kijura foils, which have aspect ratios of about 6.5:1, 7.1:1 and 8.1:1 and they work fine -- set up about 2 centimetres from the front of the track. The Armstrong foils might be an issue. The Phantasm should work.

BTW, have you looked at the new Shred Sled as an allrounder?

Thanks. The new shred sleds looks very good, especially the long tracks. Hard to find one though

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dejavu said..
The bottom shape should work really well with the newer HA winging foils and it has enough volume, at least for me (68 kg.), to knee start with a wing together with a short length (4' 10"), so little swing weight. The wing craft has a bottom shape, which appears to favour lower aspect foils.

I wonder how you can tell what bottom shape favors what wings? I remember the discussion where people said that plain square shaped tails with sharp 90 degree rails work best and supposedly all these complex and compound concaves and cutouts make things/takeoff harder.

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leto said..

dejavu said..
The bottom shape should work really well with the newer HA winging foils and it has enough volume, at least for me (68 kg.), to knee start with a wing together with a short length (4' 10"), so little swing weight. The wing craft has a bottom shape, which appears to favour lower aspect foils.

I wonder how you can tell what bottom shape favors what wings? I remember the discussion where people said that plain square shaped tails with sharp 90 degree rails work best and supposedly all these complex and compound concaves and cutouts make things/takeoff harder.

My understanding is that any bottom shape that gets the board up to speed quickly works well with the higher aspect foils and for lower aspect foils the boards with the tail that allows the rear end of the board to be easily sunk and pumped work well. There seem to be a lot of variables -- any board that would plane quickly should get up on foil pretty fast. Do cut outs hurt this -- why? They're used in race windsurf boards that need start up speed as well as very good average top speed. More wing boards are going the simple shape route (fairly wide thick flat tail) as the HA foils gain popularity.

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dejavu said..

leto said..

dejavu said..
The bottom shape should work really well with the newer HA winging foils and it has enough volume, at least for me (68 kg.), to knee start with a wing together with a short length (4' 10"), so little swing weight. The wing craft has a bottom shape, which appears to favour lower aspect foils.

I wonder how you can tell what bottom shape favors what wings? I remember the discussion where people said that plain square shaped tails with sharp 90 degree rails work best and supposedly all these complex and compound concaves and cutouts make things/takeoff harder.

My understanding is that any bottom shape that gets the board up to speed quickly works well with the higher aspect foils and for lower aspect foils the boards with the tail that allows the rear end of the board to be easily sunk and pumped work well. There seem to be a lot of variables -- any board that would plane quickly should get up on foil pretty fast. Do cut outs hurt this -- why? They're used in race windsurf boards that need start up speed as well as very good average top speed. More wing boards are going the simple shape route (fairly wide thick flat tail) as the HA foils gain popularity.

I think a lot of the boards initially used for winging were built for SUP foiling. I think Board Designers initially stuck with SUP foiling shapes and simply shrunk the physical sizes.

What was interesting with the Fanatic gear was all the maroon coloured boards were essentially the same design except the 95L. The 95L is my opinion was a really great board for winging because of the very square tail and the mostly flat area through the board. It released from the water well.

Fanatic seem to be now moving more towards the 95L design as they learn what works best for winging (rather than SUP foiling).

For super low wind, the best two boards I have seen are the Naish 150 and Naish 130 hybrid. Sharp rear and very flat through the middle and long, so they plane well. Really easy to get on-water planing speed before you pop up onto the foil.

Most people will end up with a few boards, a few foils and a lot of wings to cover the full spectrum of conditions.

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bigtone667 said..

dejavu said..

leto said..

dejavu said..
The bottom shape should work really well with the newer HA winging foils and it has enough volume, at least for me (68 kg.), to knee start with a wing together with a short length (4' 10"), so little swing weight. The wing craft has a bottom shape, which appears to favour lower aspect foils.

I wonder how you can tell what bottom shape favors what wings? I remember the discussion where people said that plain square shaped tails with sharp 90 degree rails work best and supposedly all these complex and compound concaves and cutouts make things/takeoff harder.

My understanding is that any bottom shape that gets the board up to speed quickly works well with the higher aspect foils and for lower aspect foils the boards with the tail that allows the rear end of the board to be easily sunk and pumped work well. There seem to be a lot of variables -- any board that would plane quickly should get up on foil pretty fast. Do cut outs hurt this -- why? They're used in race windsurf boards that need start up speed as well as very good average top speed. More wing boards are going the simple shape route (fairly wide thick flat tail) as the HA foils gain popularity.

I think a lot of the boards initially used for winging were built for SUP foiling. I think Board Designers initially stuck with SUP foiling shapes and simply shrunk the physical sizes.

What was interesting with the Fanatic gear was all the maroon coloured boards were essentially the same design except the 95L. The 95L is my opinion was a really great board for winging because of the very square tail and the mostly flat area through the board. It released from the water well.

Fanatic seem to be now moving more towards the 95L design as they learn what works best for winging (rather than SUP foiling).

For super low wind, the best two boards I have seen are the Naish 150 and Naish 130 hybrid. Sharp rear and very flat through the middle and long, so they plane well. Really easy to get on-water planing speed before you pop up onto the foil.

Most people will end up with a few boards, a few foils and a lot of wings to cover the full spectrum of conditions.

Agreed. There was a bit of a mad rush to get gear out and I don't think they really had the time to do lots of R&D. Gonna be interesting to see which features stick. Eventually, there will be different wing board designs that are optimized for different conditions once they figure out which board features do what

Hey guys,
I've been winging the 2019 Wizard 103L with the Tuttle connection, and have just picked up the 90L wingcraft.
The width of the wizard makes it feel like a boat,
and only having the Tuttle limits foil adjustment.
In saying that I had the Slingshot infinity 84 and the switch fuse(2 positions) it was a great step on my wing journey. (The wizard is currently for sale)
The 90L wing craft is very stable and the tracks make dialling in the foil / foot position.
Much better with a full deck grip, as the clear sand paper finish plays havoc with your elbows.

Grant