I've got about 30 sessions under my belt and consider myself an advance beginner (can fly straight but still can't nail a jybe).

I recently switched brands from Cabrinha to Axis and got out on the water for the first time last week. I found myself really struggling with the new gear. My main issues seemed to be take off. As soon as I would lift off the foil seemed to always be in a stalled position leading me to eventually crash down. I tried moving my feet forward on the board but then found the nose digging in too much before take-off. This is unlike my previous Cabrinha gear which would generally just take-off with speed aided only slightly with a small kick to back of the board. When I sometimes managed to get flying I struggled to keep flying due to stability issues.

My gear setup was a 960 Sptifire, a Black Short fuse, a 325 Progressive tail, and a 90cm HM carbon mast. Note I've paired all of these things with little knowledge or advice on the brand, hence thinking I've made some wrong choices.

Just wondering where/how I should start trimming the setup to fix the issue. Here are my thought on the potential issues, keen to hear other peoples thoughts:
- Mast too far forward in the tracks leading back foot pressure stalling the board
- Too small a tail for the wing. Would a 350 or larger tail be more suitable for a 960 wing?
- Incorrect length/type of fuse. I thought using a Black Short fuse would be the most stable given it's the longest one I have.
- Too small a front wing for my skill. Given the area of the 960 is just under 1200 I assumed that was large enough and comparable to what I was previously on (Cabrinha 1050 H Mk2 wing or 1300 X wing). I also bought the 720 and 840 Spitfires in anticipation of wanting to eventually step down in size after getting used to the bigger 960.
- Tail shim required? I didn't use shims on my Cabrinha gear so this tweak is new to me.
- Too ambitious a step up in gear for my skill. Is the Spitfire line designed to be unstable and not right for me.

Any advice to help quicken the solutioning highly appreciated. Thanks.

I've got no clue about Axis gear. But from what you describe, I think you just need a little time to adapt. Let it build more speed before you try to get it flying. Maybe you are very close to the stall speed of the foil when you push up, and it will not be stable and/or drop down again.

I am guessing that your previous setup had a much larger front wing.

This should help you get the foil in the right position in the tracks. I always use it when setting up a new board or foil.
Hope it helps.

Use what you have, it should all work together.

The spitfire probably needs a little more take off speed than what you're used to, so wait a few more seconds before you trim up on to foil. Axis foils have a lot of front foot pressure, so see if moving the mast back to see if that helps. You'll get it, switching to new gear sets everyone back a bit.

I think you're gonna struggle with that setup. Unfortunately it sounds like you've invested pretty heavily in those foils which are pretty outdated. The spitfire has no glide which is what you're gonna want learning to gybe. If you want to stick with Axis try to get hold of an Art V2. Knowing what I know now, after struggling for years on a similar setup as yours I would take the loss, dump it & get a Code or F one setup. If I had bought a different setup I'd have shaved a season off my progression curve.

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cleverku said..
I've got about 30 sessions under my belt and consider myself an advance beginner (can fly straight but still can't nail a jybe).

I recently switched brands from Cabrinha to Axis and got out on the water for the first time last week. I found myself really struggling with the new gear. My main issues seemed to be take off. As soon as I would lift off the foil seemed to always be in a stalled position leading me to eventually crash down. I tried moving my feet forward on the board but then found the nose digging in too much before take-off. This is unlike my previous Cabrinha gear which would generally just take-off with speed aided only slightly with a small kick to back of the board. When I sometimes managed to get flying I struggled to keep flying due to stability issues.

My gear setup was a 960 Sptifire, a Black Short fuse, a 325 Progressive tail, and a 90cm HM carbon mast. Note I've paired all of these things with little knowledge or advice on the brand, hence thinking I've made some wrong choices.

Just wondering where/how I should start trimming the setup to fix the issue. Here are my thought on the potential issues, keen to hear other peoples thoughts:
- Mast too far forward in the tracks leading back foot pressure stalling the board
- Too small a tail for the wing. Would a 350 or larger tail be more suitable for a 960 wing?
- Incorrect length/type of fuse. I thought using a Black Short fuse would be the most stable given it's the longest one I have.
- Too small a front wing for my skill. Given the area of the 960 is just under 1200 I assumed that was large enough and comparable to what I was previously on (Cabrinha 1050 H Mk2 wing or 1300 X wing). I also bought the 720 and 840 Spitfires in anticipation of wanting to eventually step down in size after getting used to the bigger 960.
- Tail shim required? I didn't use shims on my Cabrinha gear so this tweak is new to me.
- Too ambitious a step up in gear for my skill. Is the Spitfire line designed to be unstable and not right for me.

Any advice to help quicken the solutioning highly appreciated. Thanks.

What was the size of Cabrinha kit you came from, and your body weight, board size.
Noththing wrong with the kit, just different technique required. I remember switching to Axis and using the HPS series, I just kept breaching then slapping down. Once I got used to them they were great foils. Ppl use the spitfire to downwind with so have plenty of glide, not as much as the higher AR foils obviously but still good foils.

First, I'd do a bigger tail. Way more bigger friendly jibing with a 375 or 400 tail. The bigger tail adds a ton of stability "and" automatically helps keep you on foil, coming out of the jibe when you are learning to jibe. Leave the little 325 tail for when you become a hot shot. No shims.

You didn't say if you had original short fuse, advance short fuse or advance plus short fuse. Huge differences in placement in the tracks. Advanced plus, is likely a lot more forward than your Cabrinha.

It really is critical to get the kit balanced. Lift the entire kit, board, and foil, precisely from the chord line of the front wing and makes sure the board is hanging level upside down. It really does matter.

Join the Axis Face book group. Ask advice there.

Spitfire 960 is a great learning foil and light wind foil once you get going. ( kept one as a learning kit.)

Fast enough, lots of lift, not too wide.

Short fuse is fine, ultra short is most common.

325 progressive stab is perfect but may benefit from a 350 while learning.

Adjust mast position so front foot never needs to move after takeoff.

Reduce stab size if front foot pressure increases with speed too much.

Buy a smaller Surge once up and going, they are amazing but not needed for learning..

What board are u using?

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Microsurfer said..
I think you're gonna struggle with that setup. Unfortunately it sounds like you've invested pretty heavily in those foils which are pretty outdated. The spitfire has no glide which is what you're gonna want learning to gybe. If you want to stick with Axis try to get hold of an Art V2. Knowing what I know now, after struggling for years on a similar setup as yours I would take the loss, dump it & get a Code or F one setup. If I had bought a different setup I'd have shaved a season off my progression curve.

Spitfire is outdated but by no means obsolete. Excellent learning to expert, at low second hand price. Spitfires allow you to breach the tips without crash, are easy to use and turn great. Foils that dont allow tip breaching are obsolete as they discourage flying high.
Rear stab size is critical in foiling, the right size is the size up from the one thats too small. needs trial and error.
Surge is next level the 780 is amazing for winging.
The High modulus axis mast is very stiff, market leader. Axis is a great platform.

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Steven F said..

Microsurfer said..
I think you're gonna struggle with that setup. Unfortunately it sounds like you've invested pretty heavily in those foils which are pretty outdated. The spitfire has no glide which is what you're gonna want learning to gybe. If you want to stick with Axis try to get hold of an Art V2. Knowing what I know now, after struggling for years on a similar setup as yours I would take the loss, dump it & get a Code or F one setup. If I had bought a different setup I'd have shaved a season off my progression curve.

Spitfire is outdated but by no means obsolete. Excellent learning to expert, at low second hand price. Spitfires allow you to breach the tips without crash, are easy to use and turn great. Foils that dont allow tip breaching are obsolete as they discourage flying high.
Rear stab size is critical in foiling, the right size is the size up from the one thats too small. needs trial and error.
Surge is next level the 780 is amazing for winging.
The High modulus axis mast is very stiff, market leader. Axis is a great platform.

Hi Steven, please could you give me some more insides about thre surge 780. I am interested in getting some. 73 kg advanced + rider. Currently on thrfe fireballs 880, 1000, 1070, 1160 , 1350 and sf 900, 960, 1030. Both for wing and fd dw. i am a bit concerned the surges are not fast enough for winging. What are your thourghts. Many thanks.

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foilfox said..

Steven F said..

Microsurfer said..
I think you're gonna struggle with that setup. Unfortunately it sounds like you've invested pretty heavily in those foils which are pretty outdated. The spitfire has no glide which is what you're gonna want learning to gybe. If you want to stick with Axis try to get hold of an Art V2. Knowing what I know now, after struggling for years on a similar setup as yours I would take the loss, dump it & get a Code or F one setup. If I had bought a different setup I'd have shaved a season off my progression curve.

Spitfire is outdated but by no means obsolete. Excellent learning to expert, at low second hand price. Spitfires allow you to breach the tips without crash, are easy to use and turn great. Foils that dont allow tip breaching are obsolete as they discourage flying high.
Rear stab size is critical in foiling, the right size is the size up from the one thats too small. needs trial and error.
Surge is next level the 780 is amazing for winging.
The High modulus axis mast is very stiff, market leader. Axis is a great platform.

Hi Steven, please could you give me some more insides about thre surge 780. I am interested in getting some. 73 kg advanced + rider. Currently on thrfe fireballs 880, 1000, 1070, 1160 , 1350 and sf 900, 960, 1030. Both for wing and fd dw. i am a bit concerned the surges are not fast enough for winging. What are your thourghts. Many thanks.

Im 75kg. Got the 830 and 950 surges. Loved them but the 830 felt slow compared to the ART v2's i was riding. After a few sessions i was using the 830 with much smaller sails, had the 3.5m in as low as 15knots in one session when the wind dropped. They turn and surf so well lots of fun so easy to get on foil.Surges are high lift for area foils, at low speed they are great but suspect drag increases rapidly at speed, opposed to the Art v2 which was a lower lift section with lower drag at high speed. 830 was too big..

Got the 780 and its right size and feels fast. Turns next level and really easy to use. Go to foil. Back to using bigger sails dont mind being over powered as can go faster.

The 950 is great for light wind session saving, can pump it around and have a lot of fun. Still turns well.

Suspect ill be wanting a 740 at some stage. Love the narrow span and low area the surges allow you to use. Suspect downwinders will move to surges for fun turning runs.

Awesome foils.

960 Spitfire has loads of lift and is a very cruisy foil that handles disturbed water brilliantly. Consider a bigger stab - 375P and don't try to come up on foil too quickly as it will drop you, build more speed first before trying to get up on foil. Nothing wrong with the spitfires they are a great foil and easy to gybe. If board is rising too quickly and stalling the foil move mast back a bit.

Just move the mast back until it doesn't stall, don't overthink about gears, you are on an ok setup, just play around and get use to it. But for your actual problem, just move your mast back. Later on, most probably, you'll move it back forward again.

I've demoed both the Cabrinha MK2 and the Spitfire (albeit smaller sizes). If anything, I thought the Spitfire was more mellow.

Get an advanced rider to try your setup.

I agree with what others have said.
Move your mast back so you have a bit more board speed before lift off.
That sounds like the main issue to me.

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Microsurfer said..
I think you're gonna struggle with that setup. Unfortunately it sounds like you've invested pretty heavily in those foils which are pretty outdated. The spitfire has no glide which is what you're gonna want learning to gybe. If you want to stick with Axis try to get hold of an Art V2. Knowing what I know now, after struggling for years on a similar setup as yours I would take the loss, dump it & get a Code or F one setup. If I had bought a different setup I'd have shaved a season off my progression curve.

+1

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Faff said..
I've demoed both the Cabrinha MK2 and the Spitfire (albeit smaller sizes). If anything, I thought the Spitfire was more mellow.

Get an advanced rider to try your setup.

This is #1 advice. An experienced rider will offer setup advice or tell you if you are just flogging a dead horse.

I have also just changed over to the 960 Spitfire, from a few beginner K series foils, which were so easy to ride. Got.about 20 hours in total.
The 960 is definitely not a beginner foil, I have had 3 sessions on it now and the same thing happens, it basically just jerks around before it gets enough speed, I figured out it' gets too much power at start , I sheet out a bit and it settles down.
Essentially it's our lack of technique at this point of time.

The spitfire 960 was my 2nd foil after my beginner bsc1060, it was a great transition foil, easy, mellow and nailed my jibes with it because it was much faster than the bsc.I still have it and its my light wind go to with a crazy short adv+ and skinny tail, still loads of fun.
the spitfires are awesome in choppy water, they handle turbulence so well imoWhen i first got the 960 I was running an ultrashort adv plus fuse with a 375 prog tail, I think moving the mast in relation to where you normall stand (or move yourself forward or back when you take off, might be the answer.
The short fuse will also stabilize everything, with regards to pitch (short is quite long in axis fuse speak)and yes any advanced foiler can ride your setup and tell you where to put the mast or whats the issue. you can overthink everything as a beginner because there are so many variables.