How funny does it feel hopping on on a windsurfer after wing foiling for a while. I hopped on a windsurfer today after 10 months wing foiling at first the sail felt heavy and it felt like I was dragging an anchor behind the board then all good have you had a similar experience

Yep, tried finning after a long break, bloody hard work but after a few runs got back into it. Actually was a lot of fun, enough so I bought a new sail to compete with the wing gear. Love the rotations that can be done that I'm not good enough to do winging. Just need to build up the courage to try forwards again, not just rolls.

Lol same.
I was looking for weeds, why isn't this taking off?
Then got REALLY frustrated at the upwind angle.
Then my teeth fell off.

My biggest fear when finally going windsurfing after wing foiling for like an eternity was that I will leave the harness at home : ) But no, windsurfing is like riding a bicycle - you won't forget it.

Sadly, the day turned out to be too small for windsurfing, and would have been a killer winging day though. A good lesson learned. Always take all your gear with you. It's the stuff you leave at home that's best : )

This summer I finally mustered up some patience to go windsurfing after nearly 2 years wingfoil and before that a full year of windfoiling.
I did three fin windsurf sessions this summer.

The first thing was rigging the sail.. I really had to think how this is done again. How to run the ropes through downhaul and outhaul. But it was so much fun figuring out the 'little puzzle'. Actually I realized that rigging windsurfing vs. wingfoil takes almost the same amount of time.

Haha yes the harness! I nearly forgot that and it felt big and clumsy once on.

And then the sensation on the water. Going into full plane, footstrapped and hooked in and so much noise hahah.. the board skittering over the water, constantly hitting chop, drops on your face!

I came out of the water and thought: this IS the best sport ever! What a rush!

Also a strange feeling of not having to be afraid of falling on the foil, or it falling on you or the wing.

Right then and there I decided to sell my windfoil for good, as it will be wingfoil and windsurf for me. Windfoil just felt as a bit too much in the middle ..

I was also super stoked to realize how still incredibly good my current windsurf gear is (Goya)! And I started to think of a better skinnier carbon boom for the bigger sail haha (for 3 sessions a year )

Windsurf on the windy summer days where my gear is close by, and to reconnect with this fantastic sport. It remains very special and unique.

Wingfoil for the rest of the year as I keep the gear in my car.

Same here. I'm only windsurfing nowadays on my windsurf (holiday) trips and when the waves are pushing (and the wind allows for a 5.5 sail or smaller for my 93 kg).
But then it's the best sport in the world. I can't do all these bottom turns and cutbacks on my wing gear.
But i have to admit my wing skills in waves are very, very basic up untill now.
Seeing my friends rip on their wing gear in the waves (sometimes) makes me jeaulos, esepecially on the days when it's just a little too light wing or too small wave to rip.

I find windsurf kit heavy and a bit boring now in waves. It's still fun, but I'd rather be on wing kit in most conditions. My biggest sail is now 4.5.

Windsurfing seems to involve sail changes, waves not quite right, etc, whereas winging is just easier to get around the break and get 10x as many waves.

I'm finding myself missing wavesailing after all the winging I've been doing. Think I need to break out the windsurfing gear a little more before I forget.

DC

Nothing in this world would convince me to start windsurfing again. I sold all the gear and have no intentions of windsurfing again. Wing is awesome, more or less everything that can be done windsurfing can be done on a wing. Jumping in particular is much better with a wing.

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DenisP said..
Nothing in this world would convince me to start windsurfing again. I sold all the gear and have no intentions of windsurfing again. Wing is awesome, more or less everything that can be done windsurfing can be done on a wing. Jumping in particular is much better with a wing.

Sound on : )

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DenisP said..
Nothing in this world would convince me to start windsurfing again. I sold all the gear and have no intentions of windsurfing again. Wing is awesome, more or less everything that can be done windsurfing can be done on a wing. Jumping in particular is much better with a wing.

You can't be serious about the wave riding though....

MProject04 is onto it

I used to be pretty hardcore wavesailor doing close to a 100 sess a year all year round (winters here it can freeze but that didnt stop me on a proper stormy day). Nowadays its for me only fun with 4.1 and 3.7 and the rest of the time I rather go winging or learning to do Sup DW. Last month I didnt bring any wavesail with me on our Trip to Brandon Bay-Ireland and regretted it a bit till a guy I know lent me his (pretty nice) gear while he took a break.2m+ off side off 4.2weather so should be perfect right? Draggy as well, heaps of work to get upwind and sooo heavy to make a proper turn with the full power heavy rig. Yes the late hits to a breaking section are fun, the aerials of the lip as well. Wavecount: 8 where an hour later with the wing it was at least double. I can,t ride as critical with my foil as when wavesailing, but its getting closer and closer, and that couple of meters you stay away of the hollow section are well compensated by the turns I can make earlier on the shoulder. To me own suprise even in those to me pretty much perfect conditions I enjoyed winging at least as much as wavesailing.The only reason I haven,t sold my wavesail gear is sentiment and that couple of big storms we got huge waves sailing between moving mountains that you can,t get out with a foil.

The key sentiment that comes up when discussing winging v windsurfing is "when the conditions are right". For sure I have had some unforgetable days on the water windsurfing and enjoyed it for the nearly 30 years that I was at it. Even learned to Kitesurf but didn't feel the love for that like windsurfing so went back to windsurf. But winging was a revelation here at my local spots in the north of Scotland. Almost every wing session involves some form of wave/swell riding in a way that windsurfing just didn't deliver.
Even on trips to Tiree I now don't take the windsurf kit as I have found that small wings and small foils allow me to wing when the windsurfers are out on 4m kit and I am having a great time. I think for average sailors the area of use considering skill, equipment and environment is much wider for winging than it is for windsurfing.
The beach I live next to was only windsurfed maybe 10 times a year 'when the conditions are right' most of the time I had to drive to get more reliable wind/better swell etc. I now wing here almost every session, flukey wind, short period wind chop or ground swell from up north, its all so much better on the wing kit.
Windsurf kit is all being sold off and no regrets, and respect to the sailors keeping the faith, when the conditions are right its epic.

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MProject04 said..
This summer I finally mustered up some patience to go windsurfing after nearly 2 years wingfoil and before that a full year of windfoiling.
I did three fin windsurf sessions this summer.

The first thing was rigging the sail.. I really had to think how this is done again. How to run the ropes through downhaul and outhaul. But it was so much fun figuring out the 'little puzzle'. Actually I realized that rigging windsurfing vs. wingfoil takes almost the same amount of time.

Haha yes the harness! I nearly forgot that and it felt big and clumsy once on.

And then the sensation on the water. Going into full plane, footstrapped and hooked in and so much noise hahah.. the board skittering over the water, constantly hitting chop, drops on your face!

I came out of the water and thought: this IS the best sport ever! What a rush!

Also a strange feeling of not having to be afraid of falling on the foil, or it falling on you or the wing.

Right then and there I decided to sell my windfoil for good, as it will be wingfoil and windsurf for me. Windfoil just felt as a bit too much in the middle ..

I was also super stoked to realize how still incredibly good my current windsurf gear is (Goya)! And I started to think of a better skinnier carbon boom for the bigger sail haha (for 3 sessions a year )

Windsurf on the windy summer days where my gear is close by, and to reconnect with this fantastic sport. It remains very special and unique.

Wingfoil for the rest of the year as I keep the gear in my car.

I've been foiling over six years. First 3 mostly light wind with windfoil an stong winds with windsurfing gear. The 2020 I began winging and almost two years it's been most of my sailing until late last summer I bought windfoil slalom gear. Oh boy. A speed and sensation of Jibeing from over 50km/h speeds and still over 40k at exit of jibe are just incredibly good. So good that I'm about to order 375cm? front wing to get even more speed a fear into a play.

I have not touched fin for more than 3 years, but I still have couple of bords and sails waiting.

I still windsurf quite a bit but definitely less this year now that I have a kid and my sessions are sometimes limited to 30min. the wing and foil just are more of a sure thing to score as the range is massive and I don't have to worry about the tides/currents at my local spot as much. windsurfing, I have to be rigged much more correctly and have the conditions be good for everything to line up.

funny thing is I wing totally different than I windsurf. I was into freestyle windsurfing.... now I just like to blast back and forth and do shove its and forwards... crank some good jibes. If it's flat water and windy I'd much rather do freestyle windsurfing than wing. if the swell is good and it's windy, it's a toss up. Light wind, wing no question.

The best days windsurfing and kitesurfing in waves or blasting beat winging with feeling the power of waves/water and wind. Winging turns mediocre wind/kite days into fun days, so I wing far more.

I do quite a bit of Winging in Auckland, New Zealand as the conditions are...ideal. BUT - when it's 25knots I still get twitchy to windsurf and have 40 years experience and a garage of windsurfing gear. I still love the speed/power/physicality of windsurfing - it feels like a sport compared to standing on a pogo stick holding a blow-up lilo and going slow! I recently got into GPS speed sailing as the antidote to Winging and that is something new for me to pursue. Wavesailing is my first love and still love that. Also, it's good to go from an intermediate Winger to an expert Windsurfer and switch modes.
Saying that - I sometimes feel like a dinosaur when I talk about windsurfing with my WInging mates - who are mostly ex-Kiters - which is another story as a lot of Kiters are Winging now and they have sold all their kite gear.

As a multi-watersport kind of guy, I've always been fascinated by the water tribes. I never understood the "It's one or the other" ideology.

All the water sports bring their own blessings. Trust me, I've got the wing foil sickness bad, but if I see a side to side-off wave breaking across a shallow sandbar, windsurfing is hands down the best sport to reap the most benefits that day. It's different, in that it's visceral. The speed down the wave, the smacking a closeout section and floating over it, it's heaven. I also still windsurf the bays when it's nuking, I love going out pushing the pedal down, bumping and jumping like a kid in a skate park.

And then there's the days to SUP LB style, SUP SB style, shortboard surf, LB surf. My only dilemma is which and when. Such a first world problem. ??

Let us not forget SUP foiling and Prone Foiling.
Not to leave out the stringers out, it's the only sport I wasn't drawn towards, but I totally get it. No one will ever get the air the stringers get.

Just show some love to everyone out there, after all.we're just big kids playing on plastic toys.

My local area is just more amenable to winging. And on the rare days, when planets and the stars l align, what am I going to learn windsurfing? With winging I feel improvement every session, no matter how small. I learned all my windsurfing on holidays, and even then at a much slower rate than winging in my choppy bay. Chop is the mind killer. Foiling (almost) negates it. Without the distracting clatter of the board hitting chop , I now have much better awareness of what the wind and the water are doing.

@Shlogger,
I absolutely agree with you on the tribe thing. I never get that either, imo almost everything is a way of surfing with just different crafts, but regarding windsurfing I loved it for 35years and love the entausiasm of the guys who still do but think I very much grew out of it and only like it in conditions I can,t wing (wich become less and less).
Besides Wingfoil I sup on a several diff boards from a 14ft racer to longboard, Fishes an pro style boards, prone once in a while and started the DW/supfoil journey (now with a break/delay after breaking my ankle 4weeks ago).

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Jeroensurf said..
@Shlogger,
I absolutely agree with you on the tribe thing. I never get that either, imo almost everything is a way of surfing with just different crafts, but regarding windsurfing I loved it for 35years and love the entausiasm of the guys who still do but think I very much grew out of it and only like it in conditions I can,t wing (wich become less and less).
Besides Wingfoil I sup on a several diff boards from a 14ft racer to longboard, Fishes an pro style boards, prone once in a while and started the DW/supfoil journey (now with a break/delay after breaking my ankle 4weeks ago).

It's crazy how many options we have now, w foiling busting open the doors of light wind and micro swells, when does one have time to get anything else done???

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Shlogger said..
As a multi-watersport kind of guy, I've always been fascinated by the water tribes. I never understood the "It's one or the other" ideology.

Just show some love to everyone out there, after all.we're just big kids playing on plastic toys.

This point on multi-watersport I find interesting. Over 20 years of surf to kite to foil (and watching interplay with windsurfers and lately learning to windsurf, dabble with SUP etc, though I'm younger so never windsurfed like you all did)
Over the 20 years, I've noticed two archetypes, the first being the tribal one:

1. the "die hards" for whatever sport. Won't touch anything else, and you only ever see them when the conditions for that sport are perfect, super competent at their thing but cannot do anything else to even basic level

2. the multi-watersport "kids with toys". Cannot help themselves but try the latest thing, and are out whenever the conditions for their variety of toys, pretty rapid progression to very competent intermediate but likely only go beyond that occasionally.

I'm in the latter group

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cornwallis said..

Shlogger said..
As a multi-watersport kind of guy, I've always been fascinated by the water tribes. I never understood the "It's one or the other" ideology.

Just show some love to everyone out there, after all.we're just big kids playing on plastic toys.

This point on multi-watersport I find interesting. Over 20 years of surf to kite to foil (and watching interplay with windsurfers and lately learning to windsurf, dabble with SUP etc, though I'm younger so never windsurfed like you all did)
Over the 20 years, I've noticed two archetypes, the first being the tribal one:

1. the "die hards" for whatever sport. Won't touch anything else, and you only ever see them when the conditions for that sport are perfect, super competent at their thing but cannot do anything else to even basic level

2. the multi-watersport "kids with toys". Cannot help themselves but try the latest thing, and are out whenever the conditions for their variety of toys, pretty rapid progression to very competent intermediate but likely only go beyond that occasionally.

I'm in the latter group

And then there's phenoms like one of my buddy.
-RSX Olympic team
-Back flip on the first season learning to snowboard
-High level freestyle windsurfer
-team rider for big brands wingfoil
-1 min dock start in 2 days.
-paddle up on foil within 15 min of learning how to, without almost no prior paddling experience.

Some people just want to make up give to trying.

yes I have a friend like that, can do anything and will be top at it almost immediately.

I imagine excellence in one field makes the others easier (eg Olympian) even just from a mindset perspective.

fwiw can you share a link to their socials?

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cornwallis said..
yes I have a friend like that, can do anything and will be top at it almost immediately.

I imagine excellence in one field makes the others easier (eg Olympian) even just from a mindset perspective.

fwiw can you share a link to their socials?

instagram.com/maxjrobinson?igshid=OGQ5ZDc2ODk2ZA==

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drlazone said..

cornwallis said..
yes I have a friend like that, can do anything and will be top at it almost immediately.

I imagine excellence in one field makes the others easier (eg Olympian) even just from a mindset perspective.

fwiw can you share a link to their socials?

instagram.com/maxjrobinson?igshid=OGQ5ZDc2ODk2ZA==

I remember seeing Max on a windsurfer in Hatteras a few years ago. He was working on Flakas, and it did indeed look like work. More recently, I saw him in wing freestyle competitions, and it seemed he can do way more tricks with the wing that with a fin. Still, he does not really have a chance against many of the under-18 year olds who seem to dominate. In windsurfing, he stood out as a young guy; in winging (at least in competition), he's now an "old" guy. But then, even Balz Mueller does not stand a chance in wing freestyle competition anymore, so he's in good company .

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cornwallis said..
Over the 20 years, I've noticed two archetypes, the first being the tribal one:

1. the "die hards" for whatever sport. Won't touch anything else, and you only ever see them when the conditions for that sport are perfect, super competent at their thing but cannot do anything else to even basic level

2. the multi-watersport "kids with toys". Cannot help themselves but try the latest thing, and are out whenever the conditions for their variety of toys, pretty rapid progression to very competent intermediate but likely only go beyond that occasionally.

I'm in the latter group

I know some examples of these two categories, but I'd add a few more, based on people I see on the beach most often:

3. The pragmatist who wants more playtime on the water, without dishing out lots of money for new gear. That prohibited a switch to kiting, but allowed for using a foil with a sail. He's often seen switching back and forth between fin and foil, depending on the wind.

4. The curious fast-learner who switches completely from one toy to the next - if the next toy offers clear advantages in all conditions. One member of this group switched back and forth between fin and windfoil until winging came along, and now only wings, with the exception of truly outstanding conditions for speedsurfing (think Lake George or Albany).

5. The "this is so cool, I must do this" super-slow learner who makes very, very little progress over months, but nevertheless cancels his old sport and sticks to the new sport. It may take him or her 20 times more sessions that the members of group 4 to reach early goals like steady flight and foiled jibes, but he sticks with it, anyway. I've seen multiple members of this category at different places. The end result is similar to group 4 (albeit at a much lower level): one sport completely dominates and replaces older options.

6. The hesitant slow learner: tries to get into a new sport multiple times, and gives up multiple times, only to go back to it. Still likes other sports, and will do them sometimes, but is focussed on learning the new sport, even if it takes almost as long as it takes group 5, so other sports drift into the background a bit.

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boardsurfr said..

drlazone said..

cornwallis said..
yes I have a friend like that, can do anything and will be top at it almost immediately.

I imagine excellence in one field makes the others easier (eg Olympian) even just from a mindset perspective.

fwiw can you share a link to their socials?

instagram.com/maxjrobinson?igshid=OGQ5ZDc2ODk2ZA==

I remember seeing Max on a windsurfer in Hatteras a few years ago. He was working on Flakas, and it did indeed look like work. More recently, I saw him in wing freestyle competitions, and it seemed he can do way more tricks with the wing that with a fin. Still, he does not really have a chance against many of the under-18 year olds who seem to dominate. In windsurfing, he stood out as a young guy; in winging (at least in competition), he's now an "old" guy. But then, even Balz Mueller does not stand a chance in wing freestyle competition anymore, so he's in good company .

cornwallis said..
Over the 20 years, I've noticed two archetypes, the first being the tribal one:

1. the "die hards" for whatever sport. Won't touch anything else, and you only ever see them when the conditions for that sport are perfect, super competent at their thing but cannot do anything else to even basic level

2. the multi-watersport "kids with toys". Cannot help themselves but try the latest thing, and are out whenever the conditions for their variety of toys, pretty rapid progression to very competent intermediate but likely only go beyond that occasionally.

I'm in the latter group

I know some examples of these two categories, but I'd add a few more, based on people I see on the beach most often:

3. The pragmatist who wants more playtime on the water, without dishing out lots of money for new gear. That prohibited a switch to kiting, but allowed for using a foil with a sail. He's often seen switching back and forth between fin and foil, depending on the wind.

4. The curious fast-learner who switches completely from one toy to the next - if the next toy offers clear advantages in all conditions. One member of this group switched back and forth between fin and windfoil until winging came along, and now only wings, with the exception of truly outstanding conditions for speedsurfing (think Lake George or Albany).

5. The "this is so cool, I must do this" super-slow learner who makes very, very little progress over months, but nevertheless cancels his old sport and sticks to the new sport. It may take him or her 20 times more sessions that the members of group 4 to reach early goals like steady flight and foiled jibes, but he sticks with it, anyway. I've seen multiple members of this category at different places. The end result is similar to group 4 (albeit at a much lower level): one sport completely dominates and replaces older options.

6. The hesitant slow learner: tries to get into a new sport multiple times, and gives up multiple times, only to go back to it. Still likes other sports, and will do them sometimes, but is focussed on learning the new sport, even if it takes almost as long as it takes group 5, so other sports drift into the background a bit.

Ha these are great!

Reminds me:

7. The hell-raiser. Forever going out in sketchy conditions, getting rescued as they almost disappear over the horizon on howling offshore hanging onto a bundle of gear. Unreliable downwind partner as they will forget the plan and disappear. Their partner often asks if you've seen them.