I am coming from a windsurfing background, but the one thing that drives me nuts in this sport are pinhole leaks in my leading edge bladders. I find they happen too soon, and are PIA to find once the bladder is out of the wing. I feel snake bit, as I have had these issues with two separate wings (same brand, different model). On both I chose to replace the whole bladder with a new one (one was covered by warranty). Now, after a few patches, I am replacing it again. I am going with an aftermarket one to see if I will finally rid my life of this. It is a killjoy to hear that hiss and see those bubbles. I wing in a lot of marginal light wind, and you really lose pumpablity to get on foil if the pressure drops. I have tried everything I know to baby these wings, and I just don't know what I could be doing to get them.

Any tips/tricks?

Is your setup/packup area free of any burrs or prickles? These will easily cause pinholes in the leading edge.

Good question. I always roll it up/put it away on grassy area, but it has lots of weeds and some are prickly. I guess I should have taken better care of my lawn.

Sand getting inside Leading Edge can do this, and sone have loose stitching to allow it.

Bindies on the grass 100%. Check the patch of grass you're rigging on carefully for bindies.
I've had two leading edge bladder replaced due to pushing down on them while deflating them on the grass.
I've learnt to rig up in really clean area now !!

Everyone at my local spots has the same issues, little sticks, thorns, even sometimes sharp little stones, we have oyster shells too, which eat wings alive, if you mark the wing with chalk after its dry while its pumped up, its much easier to locate the pin hole in the bladder, make sure to use the string method when you remove reinstall the bladder (saves some time) and yes you have to pump up the bladder and sometimes it doesn't hiss so you need to put it in a large long tank of water, your bath tub, the neighbours pool etc.. can't tell you how many bladders I have fixed now - and finally pumping them back up, you only need one twist and you have to spend more time straightening it out, keeps the bladder manufacturers in business - but to really answer your question you could try putting down a large cheap plastic picnic sheet when you pump up
(and I so agree with you, it's super annoying after an hour's winging and your wing won't pump anymore because theres so much flex as the pressure is lost)

Yup, total PITA. Spinafex grass will do it too, worse thing is they are often too small to make bubbles when you dunk the bladder. I've learnt to just pump up the wing to max pressure and just spray the whole thing with soapy water. Fastest way to find leaks. Under pressure the leaks will show up easier and you'll get a better idea of where to focus your search on the bladder. I've had slow leaks that only show this way, you can use soapy water spray instead of dunking the bladder too. I find it shows tiny pricks better than dunking in water.

Stay away from grassy areas unless you are sure there are no burrs and thorny things. If on grass, never kneel on the bladder, or use too much down force to get the air out. We've done hundreds of sessions without any pinholes. Most of the time, we've got a carpet on a parking lot, but there have been a few dozen sessions rolling up on sand or grass, too. A friend winging the same spots has been less lucky, with 2 separate bladder leaks over a couple of years. The first time, the issue seemed to be sand that got inside; the second time, she did not carry the bladder high enough to clear some rose bushes. No more issues since she switched to using a carpet.

Slightly OT: I have a 2 cm tear in my bladder. The bladder repair patches are 1 cm squares. Could I seal/ repair the bladder with gorilla tape? Or 4 patches in a row covering eachother and then gorilla tape?

Thanks for any tips, advice!

All my pin holes have come from grass rigging areas, the points of the grass will create them if you're wing is left lying/ bouncing on the grass.

Mike

@MProject, you probably could but it would be much better to just order some more tear tape, ideally if you are nimble with your fingers is to get a perfect patch on the 'inside' (no wrinkles etc), it's not easy to do, and then another patch on the outside, you can also heat seal larger areas but you need a bit of practice and some glues will work too but you need to do some test patches first, also some tapes are way better than others, so again doing tests is the way to go

Select to expand quote

RAF142134 said..
@MProject, you probably could but it would be much better to just order some more tear tape, ideally if you are nimble with your fingers is to get a perfect patch on the 'inside' (no wrinkles etc), it's not easy to do, and then another patch on the outside, you can also heat seal larger areas but you need a bit of practice and some glues will work too but you need to do some test patches first, also some tapes are way better than others, so again doing tests is the way to go

Thanks RAF. Just to be clear the specific gorilla tape is the crystal clear .. wide heat resistance range, and can flex. Slightly hard to work with because once it sticks it's hard to peel off

Select to expand quote

MProject04 said..
Slightly OT: I have a 2 cm tear in my bladder. The bladder repair patches are 1 cm squares. Could I seal/ repair the bladder with gorilla tape? Or 4 patches in a row covering eachother and then gorilla tape?

Thanks for any tips, advice!

Don't do that - only use tear aid type a or an equivalent bladder repair tape.

Tear aid is available in 3" or 6" widths meaning you can cover the entire rip no worries. Overlapping layers often leads to tiny leaks at the point where the patches overlap even if they appear well sealed.

Your local shop of repairer should have the tape you need.

Ry
The Sail Doctor
Kite and wing Repairs

experimentation can be fun, but like I said, you're better off doing it on a test piece, you can cut scraps from the bladder ends where there is usually a fold over if you have to, but I have to agree with the Cornish man that tear aid is the way to go, in the end trial and error will help us all find what works best

Select to expand quote

wsurfn said..
I am coming from a windsurfing background, but the one thing that drives me nuts in this sport are pinhole leaks in my leading edge bladders. I find they happen too soon, and are PIA to find once the bladder is out of the wing. I feel snake bit, as I have had these issues with two separate wings (same brand, different model). On both I chose to replace the whole bladder with a new one (one was covered by warranty). Now, after a few patches, I am replacing it again. I am going with an aftermarket one to see if I will finally rid my life of this. It is a killjoy to hear that hiss and see those bubbles. I wing in a lot of marginal light wind, and you really lose pumpablity to get on foil if the pressure drops. I have tried everything I know to baby these wings, and I just don't know what I could be doing to get them.

Any tips/tricks?

Try completley wetting the wing with a hose then spraying with soapy water, works well especially if a micro pinhole. I used shower gel but anything that is bubbly works.

I had 2-2022 wings where sharp internal loose ends of stitching made micro holes in the bladder. I couldn't find the leak when I removed the bladder and pumped it up, not enough pressure to open up the holes in the bladder.

The wings were only a few months old and replacing the bladder wasn't a solution.

Jaime

Edit: 5.5 had 3 holes in the leading strut, the 4.5 had 5 holes in both

Select to expand quote

Cornishryan said..

MProject04 said..
Slightly OT: I have a 2 cm tear in my bladder. The bladder repair patches are 1 cm squares. Could I seal/ repair the bladder with gorilla tape? Or 4 patches in a row covering eachother and then gorilla tape?

Thanks for any tips, advice!

Don't do that - only use tear aid type a or an equivalent bladder repair tape.

Tear aid is available in 3" or 6" widths meaning you can cover the entire rip no worries. Overlapping layers often leads to tiny leaks at the point where the patches overlap even if they appear well sealed.

Your local shop of repairer should have the tape you need.

Ry
The Sail Doctor
Kite and wing Repairs

Thanks! Yes got the tear aid in larger size.

Select to expand quote

Jaime said..

wsurfn said..
I am coming from a windsurfing background, but the one thing that drives me nuts in this sport are pinhole leaks in my leading edge bladders. I find they happen too soon, and are PIA to find once the bladder is out of the wing. I feel snake bit, as I have had these issues with two separate wings (same brand, different model). On both I chose to replace the whole bladder with a new one (one was covered by warranty). Now, after a few patches, I am replacing it again. I am going with an aftermarket one to see if I will finally rid my life of this. It is a killjoy to hear that hiss and see those bubbles. I wing in a lot of marginal light wind, and you really lose pumpablity to get on foil if the pressure drops. I have tried everything I know to baby these wings, and I just don't know what I could be doing to get them.

Any tips/tricks?

Try completley wetting the wing with a hose then spraying with soapy water, works well especially if a micro pinhole. I used shower gel but anything that is bubbly works.

I had 2-2022 wings where sharp internal loose ends of stitching made micro holes in the bladder. I couldn't find the leak when I removed the bladder and pumped it up, not enough pressure to open up the holes in the bladder.

The wings were only a few months old and replacing the bladder wasn't a solution.

Jaime

Edit: 5.5 had 3 holes in the leading strut, the 4.5 had 5 holes in both

Same here. My daughter used to work at Real Watersports doing the official kite/wing repairs. She would always try and find the leak using soapy water with the bladder still in the wing and blown up to full pressure. This is the only pinhole leak I've gotten in all my winging time. Luckily she was with us on this trip to Jarvis Bay since I'm terrible at finding them my self. Based on where this pinhole occurred on the leading edge I'm guessing it was a burr in the grass

?feature=share

How do you mark the hole for repairing it then, when you put out the bladder? Or does this just narrow the area for detection when the bladder is out?

If you find the pin hole with soapy water, clean and dry the area and make a circle with chalk, when you take out your bladder you may well be able to visually find the hole because it will be close to where you marked the wing material, I then mark the bladder with a sharpie so it's easy to keep an eye on the hole, but yes this technique is not going to physically locate the pin hole in the actual bladder

Select to expand quote

RAF142134 said..
If you find the pin hole with soapy water, clean and dry the area and make a circle with chalk, when you take out your bladder you may well be able to visually find the hole because it will be close to where you marked the wing material, I then mark the bladder with a sharpie so it's easy to keep an eye on the hole, but yes this technique is not going to physically locate the pin hole in the actual bladder

What he said! This particular leak was right near the zipper opening so we only had to pull the bladder partially out. As soon she found the approximate location it was easy for her to poinpoint the exact location with the bladder exposed, but then again she's done it many times. I'd probab;y struggle even with that on my own

Don't use soapy water on grass, or get a dead grass in a bow-shape

The soapy water spray works really well, but I had one leak where the pinhole was over 50cms away from where I marked the outer wing material. You can pump up the bladder and dip it in a long bucket of water (like a cement mixing plastic box) or you can use your nose, pass the tip of your nose around where you think the pinhole is (in the bladder) and you should be able to feel the tiny jet of air on the tip of your nose, you can then locate the pinhole with a sharpie / felt pen / marker pen.f Hope that helps