Apologies there are a lot of beginner posts but the gear is moving so fast that none are really answering what im asking!
I am in need of some direction for upgrading my axis kit. For starters I am about 75-80kg, surf and kite background, based in adelaide. I've taken up foiling, my main focus is metro wing foiling on the 15-20 knot days (ie generally just windswell but occaisionally backed by some groundswell). Would rather kite when its cranking. What i have loved watching is the effortless gliding, i am not too worried about performance or carving hard at this point, i just want to be able to catch small waves and flag out the wing and pump around. A 2ft day at middleton with cross-off would be ideal for those who are familiar. I would like to have a crack at prone foiling too, catching multiple waves looks fun but thought some more time on foil would probably help first.

I started out on a BSC1120 (2100cm2) with a 500 rear on a standard red fuse, paired with a 5m mantis. picked it up reasonably quickly, have only had maybe 10-15 sessions, can jybe, stay upwind, have semi ridden a few unbroken waves etc. As its such a mega front wing i could get up on foil on pretty minimal wind even with my poor pumping technique. i have just moved on that setup and bought a black short fuse + a 400 progressive rear. but im struggling with the choice on front wing. with the old setup it just felt slow and draggy and i couldnt stay on waves without input from the wing too. my candidates are probably a SF 1030, HPS 1050 or ART 1099/999. I have read the SF 1030 kinda matches adelaide conditions well (peaky short period windswell) and reportedly has a really big range and gets up easy, but a few reports say not ideal for beginners. The 1099 seems to meet most criteria but if im not worried about going super fast is the spitfire better all round, also some say you need a bit of speed to get up and going. I thought the 999 might be too big of a jump - is about half the area of my old setup.
Every new video i watch seems to steer me in another direction, and whenever i think ive found a decent few comments its for 100kg plus riders so im not sure how much to scale down from that.

Any helps appreciated!

If you're going in 15 to 20, and 75kgs, the 999 would work. I'm 90kg and use the 999 in that range and love it. If you can get one used, grab it.
I've heard great things about spitfire as well but haven't used one.

DC

I use the spitfire 900 in those conditions at the same weight. I've been foiling for 3 years though. Get the spitfire 960. The 1030 spitfire is too big at your weight unless the waves are really really really small.

I love the 999, but I'm 60 kg.., so I'd go with the 1099. If u want the glide (but also surf...) the best series are art and art pro. Sf are OK but they're more surf oriented. U can now find art at a very good price...

thanks guys, i have borrowed a HPS 1050 to test. Might try get hold of a 1099 too to compare.

Cheers

I second the vote for the 960 Spitfire, perfect foil at your weight and 15 to 20. second hand HPS 880 or bigger also great, 1050 might be too big in that much wind

Cmrls23, I am 70kg and have been foiling for 5 years. Have acquired a lot of different Axis gear. I have lots of experience but not a lot of talent. Can gybe dead easy, wave ride a bit and tack inconsistently.
I started on the BSC 1060 with a 500 rear and windsurf fuse. Super stable platform. Great to learn with. Put it on waves and it struggled to keep up - too slow and draggy. Also found it a real chore when you did try and ride a wave. Heaps of lift, and then as you run down the face the lift lessens and you and up having to quickly change your weighting to not plummet the nose into the trough. You are right to move to a black fuse compatible foil.
Your choice of a short black fuse and 400 p tail I think is a good one. It will be a lot less pitch stable than the red fuse setup you've been using but it'll be much better on a wave. You'll keep up easier and will find the lift control much better to deal with.
I've messed around heaps with the png 910 and love it for all round. It's got a great bottom end, is predictable and manouverable and copes pretty well with waves. If you were conservative about where you go next, this would be a dead set winner. HOWEVER, you may find you hit your limit with it sooner than the spitfires or arts.
I've used an HPS 1050 and found it to be OK. I've used an HPS 930 and it was good. Not the bottom end of the png910, but much better on waves and for speed.
I also have a spitfire 840 and 960. These things are slightly more difficult to use than the HPS but feel a bit faster and manouverable too. The 960 stall speed was impressively low as well.
I have an art 999 and i've found this to have a bit more glide than the SF 960 or 840, but it's harder to use.
Going forwards for you:
What's your budget like? Theres been lots of HPS come up second hand for pretty cheap. These are a good deal as you get a good foil for a good price. HPS 980 would be a good one. I found the 930 would get up and running in 13-14 knots, so I reckon in 15 knots, the 930 would still be a goer. And they have a great top end.
If you decide to go brand spanking new, then I'd recommend the Spitfire. As for size of SF, well, I've found the 960 gets going in a little less than the HPS 930, perhaps 11-12 knots? It has a great top end and just glides down waves and is really predictable. While I haven't ridden a SF900, I've think they may be a touch harder to get going, with a little better top end and manouverability. The SF 840 needs close to 15 knots for me to get it to fly. It's an absolute scream on a wave though.
If you're worried that the whole setup that you might get may be a handful, then get a 450p. I find these to be a little slower than the 400p's, but definitely give you a more stable platform.
If you stick with the 400p, and get a black front foil and struggle, bung the 500 rear on for a session or 3. It'll anchor it and make it easier to play around on, but the foil won't glide like it's designed to. It'll provide a stepping stone to the more advanced setup. This is a way of progressing to your more advanced setup.
Good luck with it. Am sure you'll do well.

If you haven't ridden the ART range before then I can tell you the 1099 in gybes will throw you off given half a chance - not an easy foil to get round a gybe, not locked in and really quite wayward. The HPS 1050 is super easy to foil in comparison. The 999 is a lot better behaved than the 1099 and much more user friendly.

That said I think you will be way better off on the Spitfire's. They ride well, they don't get up as easy as similar sized HPS wings but they turn better. I find the 900 and up are slower than the size equivalents in the HPS range. The 840 downwards are a lot of fun and offer good glide on reasonable swell and they don't tend to swoop and over foil when dropping in on waves / swell (which the HPS can tend to do).
The HPS / Spitfires are great in close swell, chop and more diffciult conditions. The ART's not so much in the 999 and bigger, they tend to pick up too much lift in choppy conditions - the 899 and smaller are still pretty ok in choppy conditions and have good glide and speed for their size.

Select to expand quote

martyj4 said..
Cmrls23, I am 70kg and have been foiling for 5 years. Have acquired a lot of different Axis gear. I have lots of experience but not a lot of talent. Can gybe dead easy, wave ride a bit and tack inconsistently.
I started on the BSC 1060 with a 500 rear and windsurf fuse. Super stable platform. Great to learn with. Put it on waves and it struggled to keep up - too slow and draggy. Also found it a real chore when you did try and ride a wave. Heaps of lift, and then as you run down the face the lift lessens and you and up having to quickly change your weighting to not plummet the nose into the trough. You are right to move to a black fuse compatible foil.
Your choice of a short black fuse and 400 p tail I think is a good one. It will be a lot less pitch stable than the red fuse setup you've been using but it'll be much better on a wave. You'll keep up easier and will find the lift control much better to deal with.
I've messed around heaps with the png 910 and love it for all round. It's got a great bottom end, is predictable and manouverable and copes pretty well with waves. If you were conservative about where you go next, this would be a dead set winner. HOWEVER, you may find you hit your limit with it sooner than the spitfires or arts.
I've used an HPS 1050 and found it to be OK. I've used an HPS 930 and it was good. Not the bottom end of the png910, but much better on waves and for speed.
I also have a spitfire 840 and 960. These things are slightly more difficult to use than the HPS but feel a bit faster and manouverable too. The 960 stall speed was impressively low as well.
I have an art 999 and i've found this to have a bit more glide than the SF 960 or 840, but it's harder to use.
Going forwards for you:
What's your budget like? Theres been lots of HPS come up second hand for pretty cheap. These are a good deal as you get a good foil for a good price. HPS 980 would be a good one. I found the 930 would get up and running in 13-14 knots, so I reckon in 15 knots, the 930 would still be a goer. And they have a great top end.
If you decide to go brand spanking new, then I'd recommend the Spitfire. As for size of SF, well, I've found the 960 gets going in a little less than the HPS 930, perhaps 11-12 knots? It has a great top end and just glides down waves and is really predictable. While I haven't ridden a SF900, I've think they may be a touch harder to get going, with a little better top end and manouverability. The SF 840 needs close to 15 knots for me to get it to fly. It's an absolute scream on a wave though.
If you're worried that the whole setup that you might get may be a handful, then get a 450p. I find these to be a little slower than the 400p's, but definitely give you a more stable platform.
If you stick with the 400p, and get a black front foil and struggle, bung the 500 rear on for a session or 3. It'll anchor it and make it easier to play around on, but the foil won't glide like it's designed to. It'll provide a stepping stone to the more advanced setup. This is a way of progressing to your more advanced setup.
Good luck with it. Am sure you'll do well.

Thanks mate, that is exactly how i felt on my big BSC. I had a crack on the 1050 with 400p the other day and found it ok. Definitely way twitchier than my first setup but that was expected. unfortunately i sold my first setup before my new tail arrived so never got a chance to just change on thing at time by downsizing the tail but oh well.
I have pretty well landed on the same conclusion as you've said. spitfire 960 if i want to splash the cash, but at the same time there are so many cheap HPS, ARTs on the market i think ill try start with them. Maybe a 980 and 999 would be a decent second hand combo. Ive also been offered a pretty cheap PNG910 so like you said could be a good stepping stone too.
While i said i wanted this setup for light wind i havent really had many sessions where it hasnt been cranking. Which is good because i get up super easy but bad because im not learning how to pump up, and when im up i feel like im hanging on a fair bit. im hoping to get a bit smaller wing too for the windier days.
Cheers for your help

PNG910 is still my favourite axis front for the red fuse. Perfect for guys that have learnt to wing foil on flat water and now want to get into riding waves and swell. They are slow compared to the latest stuff, but lift early, turn great and pump decently. Lots of fun in waves with a wingIf you have a black fuse i see lots of HPS going cheap now. Im 85kg and still ride my 880 all the time. Probably wouldn't recommend the ART999 based on your previous posts. In messy swell and waves they can be very unforgiving. If the 1050 felt twitchy a 999 would be much much more so.

Cmrls23 just be aware that the png 910 comes as red fuse compatible and black fuse compatible as well. Make sure you get a black compatible one for your black fuse. It's the only axis foil that has a model for each fuse type. And if you're going light wind orientation the png 910 I've found gets up earlier than the art999 or the spitfire 960 but not by a lot. 11 knots vs 12 to 13.