Hi,

I need your advice for the FOIL sup + wing thing.I usually ride a longsup 9x26,5" (89 Lts) or a shorter 8'3 27 1/2" (95lts) comfortably. I'm 6'1, 175 lbs, 49y. Suping since 2010.I've been tempted by the foil bug but I have been hesitating because I'm aware I'll need a lot of sessions and the equipment is quite expensive.

I will start with no boat help.
Both the sup and wing dimensions interest me, particularly the later, since it will open up a playground in the windy days.
I surf both point breaks and beach breaks.

Since the used market is very weak around here and I won't have the chance to later sale easily, I have to make good bets on equipment that will let me learn, but won't later be gaining dust.

My bets:

Cabrinha X-Fly 6'2" x 28" x 4.7" x 111.1L
F-ONE phantom 1480 75cm aluminum mast
CABRINHA Crosswing X2 6m (I guess some extra power will be better...)

I'd appreciate your opinions/alternatives.

Thank you!

How much wind? Wing size is mostly determined by wind speed.
Board size seems fine. Foil and mast seem fine for surf conditions.

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LeeD said..
How much wind? Wing size is mostly determined by wind speed.
Board size seems fine. Foil and mast seem fine for surf conditions.

8 to 20 knots...
Later, maybe by a 4m... or do you think 5m does it all?
75cm is too small for winging?

Depth of water is a problem with longer masts.
Depth with 3' waves is around 3-4'.
8-13 knot wind, forget it learning in surf. Flat water, fine.

75cm mast length is fine.

If your wind is primarily 8 to 15 knots ... get the 6m. If your wind is primarily 15 to 20 knots, get the 5m.

I would get a bigger front wing. It will make everything much more easy. Get at least some thing around 1800. The phantom wing is recomended for more advanced riders. At the begining the gravity might be the better choice, as it will get you up on foil faster.

HI Fox its all about time on the water not sitting on the beach .6m should be fine and a front foil round the 1550 to 1850 . My be looks at axis foils or Armstrong .I say this because there is always second hand gear for sale. To sell and up grade later.

Try renting if it's at all an option in your area.

If you decide to get into Wing foiling, accept it will be an expensive sport and you'll have to buy some gear. Boards and wings will be replaced on a regular bases. Foils last longer, so you should spend your money on a good foil system. Look around your area and see what folks are riding, ask their experiences. There are lots of brands of foils, but people tend to end up on just a few brands. Here on Maui, the most popular are Go Foil, Axis and Armstrong.

Save $150 and get the Mantis without windows versus the X2. I agree to start with the 6. You will eventually get a 4 as well and the spacing will work.

I learned on a 6.4 m2 hand wing in lite wind conditions and weigh 90 kgs. You'll want to find days that are at least 12 knots. When blowing less, it can be a lot of work. Bigger front foil wing is easier in the beginning. Some of the newer hand wings are advertised as smaller and have more grunt power as bigger ones. So you may not need to get the largest wing depending on the brand. I just ordered a 4.8 m PPC that supposedly works in lite conditions. Let's see.

Hi,
After deeper research, I've change a bit my bets:

>Board
Armstrong 5'11 (99lts pre 2021)

>Foil
Takuma Kujira 1440 (too dangerous!!??)
or
Takuma Helium
or
Axis 1010
or
Axis 1150

>Wing
Wasp V2 5
or
>Fone strike 5
or
>Mantis 5
or
Takoon 5

1,85 77kg 49yr advanced sup.
Your opinions are very welcome!

Gday 1fox,
Sounds like you have good water skills so the board will be challenging, but not impossible. 20-30L+ body weight seems like a good spot if you've got skills and determination. FWIW, I leaned on a board 40L+ body weight and found it great - dead easy with more vol. Very forgiving, and am still using it. If you're in challenging conditions (chop, current and waves) I'd consider going a bit bigger. Sort of depends on where you want to be longer term? If you think this will be your only board for a few years, then it will probably be a better fit to go the 99ltr. But if you think you'll upgrade soon after, a few more L may assist in the early days given that you'll sell it soon.
As others have suggested, bigger area in the front foil will definitely assist getting going in lighter conditions. And generally more stable. I love the axis foils (1060). Also have a Naish jetfoil 2000 which has bucketloads of low down grunt. 75 cm mast will be fine especially if you're not in shallow waters.
If you want to get up in 8 knots, you'll need TOW, pumping skills and a biggish wing. 5m will be pushing it to get going in 8 knots, esp in the learning days. A 6m may be better? And 15-20 knots, a 5m will be ok, but a 4 will be a lot better. So I'd be inclined to go for a 6m to start with, and then add a 4m into the mix later if you can afford it.

I'm 90Kilo and 6' 2", been Winging for 2 months. My set up is a 105ltr Quatro Wing Drifter, and an Axis BSC 1060 (around 1800 square). With a 6.4 Slingwing v2.

I'm very happy with the setup, the board being 15+ my weight seems perfect. I would definitely NOT be getting any wing less than 1800square given your wind conditions. Also I would not get anything less than a 6 meter wing.

I'm no expert and have only been doing this for 2 months but I'm loving it and am hooked, my windsurfing and windfoiling experience have very much helped.

Have fun!

DC.

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1fox said..
Hi,
After deeper research, I've change a bit my bets:

>Board
Armstrong 5'11 (99lts pre 2021)

>Foil
Takuma Kujira 1440 (too dangerous!!??)
or
Takuma Helium
or
Axis 1010
or
Axis 1150

>Wing
Wasp V2 5
or
>Fone strike 5
or
>Mantis 5
or
Takoon 5

1,85 77kg 49yr advanced sup.
Your opinions are very welcome!

Hi, I'm the same weight as you.

Foil: don't get Kujira that's too hard to learn on and very dangerous with the sharpness. Best bet is to get a second hand Axis setup. There's a ton of used Axis gear going around. 1150 is too high aspect to learn too. You need something medium aspect with a more gradual lift. Like many others, I learnt on the original carve 920 which is excellent for that. Otherwise the BSC series is the one that supersedes the original carve e.g. 970

Wing: personally I did not like the Wasp v2. The Strike is an excellent wing but it's more for advanced riders (it's my current wing). Takoon is a safe bet, very similar to the easy to use and well rated Smik.

Board: any which is +20/30L and 5"10 max would be ideal

I'm on the Axis Broad Spectrum Carve 1120 and it is an absolute light wind winging weapon, however I pair it with a smaller (910 pump n glide) wing for anything over 13knots. The 1060 BSC could be a really good allrounder. I would also recommend the standard length fuselage for ease of use learning. There is a big difference using the shorter fuselages and the ride is much less stable / predictable even if turning is better.

(btw I am using these foils on a 5'8" Quatro Wing Drifter (115L - I'm 86kg). They work well on the board. My experience of boards is that once you get down to +10L or smaller (over your body weight) starting gets much harder.

However a 99L with you at 77kg could work fine, particularly if you can learn on flat water.

Before the holidays arrive, I finally closed my options:
Armstrong 5'11 (2020)
Kujira 1440 75
Fone strike cwc 6

Maybe too much power/ lift for the conditions here... surely equipment well beyond my zero skills that I won't outgrow.

Commitment driven by the stoke you all share and by the huge capex .

thanks for your hints

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1fox said..
Before the holidays arrive, I finally closed my options:
Armstrong 5'11 (2020)
Kujira 1440 75
Fone strike cwc 6

Maybe too much power/ lift for the conditions here... surely equipment well beyond my zero skills that I won't outgrow.

Commitment driven by the stoke you all share and by the huge capex .

thanks for your hints

Keep on the lookout for a 1600 ProFoil LOL wing set.... may give you a bit easier time for your first dozen or so sessions...

Select to expand quote

1fox said..
Before the holidays arrive, I finally closed my options:
Armstrong 5'11 (2020)
Kujira 1440 75
Fone strike cwc 6

Maybe too much power/ lift for the conditions here... surely equipment well beyond my zero skills that I won't outgrow.

Commitment driven by the stoke you all share and by the huge capex .

thanks for your hints

The Kujira 1440 is an excellent foil but maybe a bit harder with which to learn. Make sure you round off those winglets by sanding the sharp edges down some. Since they are pointed down (unlike the 1210 and 980) they should be more out of the way but be careful. You'll probably want to get the 85 cm. mast at some point.

Use the bladder of your wind wing for support when figuring out where to kneel on the board -- make sure you practice with the wing first on land before taking it to the water. There are lots of good videos on Youtube to help you get started. My first experience wing foiling was discouraging and humiliating so I went back to the drawing board and carefully listened to the advice given in some of the videos.

Check out this thread:

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Wing-Foiling/Wind-Wings/Learn-to-Wing-Foil-Resources?page=1

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dejavu said..

1fox said..
Before the holidays arrive, I finally closed my options:
Armstrong 5'11 (2020)
Kujira 1440 75
Fone strike cwc 6

Maybe too much power/ lift for the conditions here... surely equipment well beyond my zero skills that I won't outgrow.

Commitment driven by the stoke you all share and by the huge capex .

thanks for your hints

The Kujira 1440 is an excellent foil but maybe a bit harder with which to learn. Make sure you round off those winglets by sanding the sharp edges down some. Since they are pointed down (unlike the 1210 and 980) they should be more out of the way but be careful. You'll probably want to get the 85 cm. mast at some point.

Use the bladder of your wind wing for support when figuring out where to kneel on the board -- make sure you practice with the wing first on land before taking it to the water. There are lots of good videos on Youtube to help you get started. My first experience wing foiling was discouraging and humiliating so I went back to the drawing board and carefully listened to the advice given in some of the videos.

Check out this thread:

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Wing-Foiling/Wind-Wings/Learn-to-Wing-Foil-Resources?page=1

Than you!

The helium 1500 was the one I was thinking about but I could not get it before holiday day zero, coming August.
I'm intending to try to play with wing on land and later on my regular sup with the biggest fins.
I'll also go with the foil on sup mode and try to get familiar with volume and so on. later, I'll mix the two components.
If I can, I'll go for some session behind the boat... not sure I'll have the chance.

I'll sand the wing tips as you advised. I'll wear a Gath and a wake impact vest I've ordered.

Humbleness, focus and small steps might lead to joy :)

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gorgesailor said..

1fox said..
Before the holidays arrive, I finally closed my options:
Armstrong 5'11 (2020)
Kujira 1440 75
Fone strike cwc 6

Maybe too much power/ lift for the conditions here... surely equipment well beyond my zero skills that I won't outgrow.

Commitment driven by the stoke you all share and by the huge capex .

thanks for your hints

Keep on the lookout for a 1600 ProFoil LOL wing set.... may give you a bit easier time for your first dozen or so sessions...

Decathlon just has the 1300 and 1900. The 1600 is out of stock.
Do you think the 1900 it's worthy?

I think you would be better off with the Takuma Kujira Helium 1500 if you can find one (I see you have already tried) -- the 1900 will probably be O.K. for learning but you might want to "upgrade" fairly quickly and at the end of the day buy the 1500 (that could be expensive). Maybe you could go on line and find a used Moses 1100 or something like that.

Perspective of a Snowboarder/skater/kiter coming into the sport:-

107kg
Experienced kite foiler, (means nothing at this stage as not foiling yet).

The Melbourne lockdowns have been very drawn out, luckily half my 5km radius is in the Bay, I've packed up the snowboard gear and bought some Wing Ding equipment.

It all started with a skateboard session on princes pier, I have used wings and kites on land before, so I found this relatively easy, and decided now would be a good time to pull the trigger on some gear.

Friends guided me into what I would need to get started..
Big wing, Big board, Big foil is the general advice.

I started with 6m Smik wing, which I had been told was an excellent choice, and was also priced competitively..

Chris @ KIte Republic sent me off with a 95L board and What I though was a huge looking foil..

I was confident that that should be able to get going, but could not even get onto my Knees.
Clearly the board was way to small, and I got a quick reality check that this was maybe not going to be soo easy.

I returned the board/foil to KR, and at the same time pulled the trigger on a 4m ozone WaspV2. Unfortunately no larger boards. I think other larger blokes also borrowing the easy learning gear.

I then rang Ben @ foilsports to see what he had, a well timed call, he had just finished unloading new stock.

Although the advice is to get a large board, like your weight + 20% to learn I also wanted to get something that would fit into the back of Ute and that I would not outgrow too quickly.

Ended up with:-
Ensis Rock 'N' Roll 117L & Ensis 2000 foil.

Feels great to now have everything I need to get started.

First go:- 11knots = definitely not enough wind, could get to knees only and started to realise I have made my life difficult. but more stable than first attempt.

Last night I went out again for my first proper attempt, with enough wind that other wing dingers were foiling, (15knots) and I had a fighting chance..

Let me say, technique makes a huge difference, luckily I had a couple mates to give advice as required to get me up. (On my undersized board for my weight and skill).
I managed to get up and moving in both directions. next stage, more wind and hopefully less time in water & knees.

Feet are sore, I think from kicking foil a couple times, and the weird/new kneeling positions.
Knees got a workout too.

I'm frothing for next session, hopefully with more wind and first glides.

Good times.