I surf mushy onshore swell/chop whenever it makes it's way here (seldom). So I don't really have opportunity to test board before buying.
There's lots of lulls in the wind and often uphauling is needed.
People sail here 90+ litre boards, some examples are Simmer quantum, Tabou 3s+, Novenove chameleon, i-99 C5.

My question is, does fanatic stubby plane as early as the ones above (stubby TE, not fw version)? 99l version has width 60, where other brands typically have 61. Also back strap is located close to the stern, wouldn't it cause board to drop from plane during lulls, when compared to boards above?

I love the idea of a compact board for transport, though

No, its designed to make the most of crap waves and turning...... the FW version is obviously much earlier planing though
Think about putting the same rocker (lift at nose and tail) in a shorter length- makes more curve at the front. Eventually you get to the point where its pushing more water when not planing. Yes lots of things correct that but eventually if judged just on early planing a slightly longer board is better. No not saying we go back to 260 cm .... but the difference between 220 and 228 and same volume changes planing threshold.

A 3S will plane heaps earlier - but you're talking FSW vs stubby wave so its not really fair. You need to decide if its B&J or wave turning priority for you....

What's your weight?

The reason why you'd be getting the stubby is for making the most out of the waves unlike a fsw which makes the most out of the wind :) !

However, the stubby does have better planing abilities than others and may work for you still.
What do you like to do on a wave and in your conditions?

Never thought about length & early planing threshold. So would it be wrong to say that 220 x 60 at 90+ range, somewhat corresponds to its "regular" lenght counterpart at 80+ range, what comes to early planing?

I've go huge 3s+ and looking for smaller. I'm dreaming of more wavier board, but in reality 90% of the time I the planing thing.

Understanding planing treshold from board specs seems quite difficult. I wish there was planing index for each board. Like wing size in foiling.

I was talking in very general terms. You can't guess just from the length. But if entry rocker is steep and the board is wide, it will be a bit more of a battle.

Back to what the main question is (?) you are on FSW, and want early planing from a stubby wave board I doubt very much you will be happy.

Don't worry about back strap closer to tail, look at the thickness there.

I think you're really saying you want the most wavey FSW, so Dyno with maybe slightly smaller fin set, Goya One, something like that. Maybe

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Mark _australia said..
I think you're really saying you want the most wavey FSW, so Dyno with maybe slightly smaller fin set, Goya One, something like that. Maybe

2021 Kode is also very wavey if wavey means good in mushy cross onshore conditions (though less so in cross off)

Hi Pondcruiser ... Stubby is definately an earlier planner than say Simmer Quantum , but maybe not against other FSW type crossover boards .... BUT ... the difference is not that great , as the stubby would have more width at back strap plugs than most of them boards , so there's still plenty of width and meat to push off against ... (despite the slight few extra mm of rocker curve)

I love the stubby 99 , reckon its an amazing board .... Cuts really good turns , is pretty forgiving in rail setting / bottom turns bearing in mind how quick and efficient it is ... You could always UP the size of the rear fin for extra early planning ... The parallel rails make a 60cm wide stubby as efficient ads more pumpkin seed 62 wide boards (with same rocker) ... So don't be put off by the 60cm , the rail line extends so far back and forwards to nose that really cancels out any reduced max width ... For me , who sails all types of waveboards - the stubby feels extremely efficient around the park and upwind as well .... and sometimes I think i'm going 'almost ' as early as I would on my freestyle board (providing you are aggressive in getting going / working the board etc ) , but have all the fun on the waves ...

If you prioritise flying through lulls , early planning efficiency - you may want a stubby FSW ....
If you are looking to improve your waveriding - go stubby ...
If you are looking for more topend than yr FSW mates - go stubby ...

I would say there's 5 levels of efficiency .... most to least , each getting going a fraction earlier and gliding through lulls than the next on the list ...

1 .... Pure fast FSW .... most efficient ( say rrd FSW , tabou 3s )
2.... Wave orientated FSW (like goya one , quatro freewave , dyno severne )
3 .... Parallel rail STUBBY
4 ..... Normal outline boards 'fast' waveboards like Simmer Quantum ...
5 ... Normal outline waveriding boards ( like goya quad / quatro pyramid / tabou dacurve / Mako etc)

Studdy TE is definitely a super early planing board.

The max width is not super-wide when you check the specs, however the board is wide over a longer distance compared to a more typical outline design.

My Stubby TE 82 planned about similar to my Grip TE 89 .. perhaps even a bit earlier.

The Stubby should have been refined not dumped and replaced by the Mamba - despite the marketing, the Mamba doesn't have the same benefits as the Stubby .. early planing and stable.

And yes, I am referring to the Stubby TE not the Freewave STB TE or Freewave STB TXTR.

And as you said .. the Stubby TE is a bit nicer for transport too :)

It does require a different sailing style however .. ie back foot for turning.

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pondcruiser said..
Never thought about length & early planing threshold. So would it be wrong to say that 220 x 60 at 90+ range, somewhat corresponds to its "regular" lenght counterpart at 80+ range, what comes to early planing?

Can't answer this question without details as to whether it is a Stubby outline or regular outline shape .. and rocker is another variable.

For planing, these are all very close:
Stubby TE 82 = Freewave TE 86 = Grip TE 89

Heaps of great info on the fanatic forum btw .. and responses from the pros and shapers.

sorry i should have noticed it wasent about the freewave but ill leave this up if thats ok i have the 2018 fanatic freewave stubby 95and i sailed it loads on south coast uk i thought id upgrade to the new severne dyno 95 (red one)did a lot of back to back i sold my stubby twice and bought it back twice as the dyno was slower to plane and did not like staying on the plane in lulls, i got so fed up with dyno i sold it at a big loss but dont regret it, my kit is now on its way to Perth oz where we are looking to come and live(along with my tatty old stubby)where we hope to get in maybe april 2022,the dyno did lots of things well but it wasent really for me, i have put on another forum some thoughts before, we are looking to maybe looking safety bay and secret harbour area to rent, any suggestions as to sailing there or north maybe Yanchep area not sure yet, and please feel free to ask about my feelings on differences on boards but sorry ive no info of other boards above (for whats worth i thought the 2020 fanatic freewave 95 i sailed in el medano was like the dyno 95 odd hu so i wouldnt swop the feel of my old stubby for the feel of the newer fanatic freewave

I recently had a conversation with Francisco regarding the upcoming '22 Goya Nitro stubby model.
He told me the board will plane sooner than the C3/C4 but later than the One Freewave, due to outline and volume distribution despite the board having a reasonable amount of rocker.
So do you find that on the boards of the other brands too, that the stubby shapes have rocker curves like classic waveshapes?
I always thought the early planing of the stubbies comes from a faster/flater rocker compared to classic shapes.

That was certainly the case with the Quatro Mini. Very flat, quick to plane and lively.

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Jens said..
That was certainly the case with the Quatro Mini. Very flat, quick to plane and lively.

Interesting.
I just reread the Test of 2019 Waveboard test of the german Surf magazine and they found the SM 84 the worst planing stubby compared to Fanatic, JP Slate, Naish Assault and Simmer Cortex. (Gleiteigenschaften = planing )

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AlexF said..

Jens said..
That was certainly the case with the Quatro Mini. Very flat, quick to plane and lively.

Interesting.
I just reread the Test of 2019 Waveboard test of the german Surf magazine and they found the SM 84 the worst planing stubby compared to Fanatic, JP Slate, Naish Assault and Simmer Cortex. (Gleiteigenschaften = planing )

Could well be. Still the SM was faster to plane than the Pyramid and Goya Custom Quad that I was comparing them with. Even so I ended up getting rid of it and returned to those boards because of the compromised performance in the waves of the SM when conditions got good. I felt I'd rather have slower planing and reduced pop for the freedom of bottom turning when and where I wanted regardless of size. With the SM I could only do that below half mast or so...

I'm with you, for my small board I also don't want a stubby, my current board is a Goya C3 98, me having 92 kg.
For my big board I'd consider a stubby though.
Instead of the Goya One Freewave 105, which is also a good turning board and kind of a "stubby in disguise", but a real stubby could be even better.

Most of my wave riding is in right side cross-off wind with relatively soft Pacific waves at a remote point break. I have the 2018 Fanatic Stubby TE in 99 and find it great fun when well powered up. It does not plane very early at all but is VERY soft in chop and off the lip so I can let it rip with a bigger sail. Because it was so bad in light wind, I rarely used it, but it shines later in the day when the wind picks up. The 90 liter RRD FSW wave from 2004 is my favorite board as it is faster and more early planing than the later models and at speed I can go vertical just as the waves close and survive. It also has this magical mode with a 5.2 sail in light wind where it planes at speeds lower than any of the other boards I have tried, and rarely does any other finned device point better. It keeps momentum in jibes very well and the extra length makes tacks easier, so much fun to jibe without losing speed tearing out clue first on the outside swell. I has a subtle Vee and relatively narrow and thin tail, that makes it function well when powered in chop. Cutbacks are not as easy as on the Stubby, that's for sure. The 2004 has an exaggerated high nose that is great for whitewater and late drops and seems to be quite durable. It catches more waves than any other. After trying later models it amazes me how a company can be consistently worse for so many years in designing boards.

The 2018 Stubby cost: ~$1500 USD. The RRD 2004 cost: $0

I finally got some tests withTE. Conditions were realistic, huge lulls the wind and 3-4ft chop. Board kept dropping from planing and felt uncontrollable when overpowered. There were brief moments when the power (and waves) were ok and it shined. When overpowered, turning downwind with open sail gave too much power and catapultish ride. With little power any maneuver (jump, turning) caused dropping off plane. So it felt the comfort range was too narrow for these conditions.

5 levels of efficiency was really very informative list. It seems I have to get at least one step up. One candidate would be F2 Rave, which I'd expect to be a planer (62cm). Might have to check surf-magazine, it appears to have some critical thinking worth reading.

But again, conditions were (hyper)realistic. I do see point of this board in longer wave length / stable wind.

I know this is an old topic, but came across it when looking for differences between the Goya Nitro 3 and Fanatic Stubby TE. Our beaches face SE and our typical summer conditions are S to SW wind-driven surf (knee to a little overhead at most with a storm swell). In the winter months, we typically have NE winds that produce bigger swell but a lot of wind with current and a lot of holes. So, summer has fun thermal 15 to 20kt side on breezes, but usually smaller and mushier surf. Winter has bigger, but still mushier surf and the wind is typically a mess.

I'm 50yo and have been surfing since I was a teenager. Started windsurfing in my early 20s. I mostly have sailed Freeride and FSW boards, but haven't had a dedicated waveboard since the early 2000s, until recently. I like bump and jump, blasting, and carving waves. Haven't nailed a loop of any sort. Don't have any clue how modern freestyle moves even work. So...I'm a pretty average windsurfer, at best.

I bought a 99L Fanatic Stubby TE late summer last year, but have only been able to get it out a few times so far, and have yet to really get in conditions with solid wind and decent waves. We've had waves with lots of holes or solid wind with no waves. The center fin that came with it (18cm) was ridiculously small and couldn't hold me and a 5.2 (I'm 165lbs) in all the local currents. I switched it out for a K4 fins 22cm (forgot which one, but is a wave fin that isn't so swept it hangs out past the tail of the board) and that seems to have done the trick. A 20 or 21cm G10 fin would likely have been fine as the K4 has more flex. Have been able to comfortably ride with a 6.0 Goya Banzai, but still waiting to get it out on a day with decent (for here) waves and consistent wind. I think 5.2-5.7 is likely the magic sail range for me on that board. From what I can tell so far, it is the best board I've ever used in the waves in my hometown.

A couple of weeks ago we had some unexpected warm, Southerly "gift wind". No waves, but some chop. Was a good day for speed runs and jibe, tack practice. Started the day on a 6.0m Goya Banzai and the 99 liter Stubby TE. Wind was still coming up, and I had a problem getting through lulls, but no problem staying upwind. Switched to a 97 liter 2014 Fanatic Hawk and was able to deal with the lulls better (though the wind was starting to fill in better, too). In flat water, was able to hit 30mph on the Hawk while fully powered up in the smoothest section, and was able to get a few floaty jumps in the chop. I switched out the Hawk for the Stubby TE again shortly after it was obvious the wind was solid (20+, no holes). Was surprised to see that I hit 26.7mph on the Stubby TE in the smooth section. A friend on his 101 liter JP FSW and 6.3 hit 31mph around the same time.

So, the lessons I've learned so far is that the Freeride and FSW (used to have a JP FSW) boards will plane earlier, go faster, and get through lulls better and their width likely makes them more fun for bump and jump. However, the same volume boards can't touch the Stubby TE in the waves and the Stubby TE does just fine in slop if tuned properly (fins, footstrap placement, mast position). Also, for what it's worth, the Stubby is also way more forgiving to jibe than the Hawk. I'm not selling the Hawk, but I look forward to using the Stubby TE more.

Interesting point re fin size. I have come to the conclusion that for the vast majority of brands larger size waves boards are more of an after thought. I'd even go so far as to say the majority of brands don't even test the larger sizes properly before they go into production.

Why? Simply look their roster of team riders in the wave segment. They are all around 65 - 75 kgs in weight. How would they know what a 85kg plus rider is looking for in a wave board?

Given the boards are CNC shaped these days they mostly likely simply upscale the 80 litre version their team riders/ board developers tested. As for fin size they probably just size up the fin in 2 cm increments without much thought.

With all that in mind the way brands look at 99 to 115 liter wave boards is probably more like... it's a float and ride wave board the team rider takes out when there isn't enough wind to get planing.

Happy to proven wrong. But my experience with large volume wave boards suggests for this to be the case.

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stehsegler said..
Simply look their roster of team riders in the wave segment. They are all around 65 - 75 kgs in weight. How would they know what a 85kg plus rider is looking for in a wave board?

Just no.

second.wiki/wiki/philip_kc3b6ster

Koester is literally the only exception to this. He uses 112 liters down to 80ish depending on wind from memory.

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stehsegler said..
Interesting point re fin size. I have come to the conclusion that for the vast majority of brands larger size waves boards are more of an after thought. I'd even go so far as to say the majority of brands don't even test the larger sizes properly before they go into production.

Why? Simply look their roster of team riders in the wave segment. They are all around 65 - 75 kgs in weight. How would they know what a 85kg plus rider is looking for in a wave board?

Given the boards are CNC shaped these days they mostly likely simply upscale the 80 litre version their team riders/ board developers tested. As for fin size they probably just size up the fin in 2 cm increments without much thought.

With all that in mind the way brands look at 99 to 115 liter wave boards is probably more like... it's a float and ride wave board the team rider takes out when there isn't enough wind to get planing.

Happy to proven wrong. But my experience with large volume wave boards suggests for this to be the case.

I don't agree with this. I can't speak for other brands but with Severne a lot of the custom boards I was building were big boards or small boards. You get a lot of good feedback from the big guys on what they want.

That's why I said "majority of brands" not "all brands".

Would definitely like to participate in this game. Seems interesting

For Goya:
Brawzinho is 84 kg AFAIK
Tom Hartmann 100+ kg, who's in the big board development team.

And Goya has a long time big waveboard heritage.

For my 93 kg I find the Goya 20/21 C3 98 (which remains unchanged for the 22 C3 99) a really good big boys waveboard.