Yes, I know, chalk and cheese, but I need to decide between these (or a similar option).

After my first board, a Bombora something-or-other (160l, centerboard), I moved to short boards and haven't sailed anything since (25years).

I'm looking to move to something a little slower, more versatile, but still provides a fun and challenging sail. Biggest sail is 8.6. I'm heavy 100+kg, but I not interested in winning races.

I've never sailed a raceboard, but I thought I'd give the Phantom 295 a try, but it appears to get one of these I have order it and either pay a fortune for shipping, or wait 6 months for it to be batched up and ship in a large order. They are not cheap either.

The Rio (and I think the JP Explorer) are readily available in Melbourne, but they look too much like a beginners board (there's an interview on the 'net with the Rio board shaper, saying it was designed for windsurfing schools).

Having a board with lots of volume will also mean I can teach my nieces and nephews - can I do that on the phantom 295 with a small sail?

Hi ftkalcevic,

They are quite different boards, the phantom is a no compromise raceboard and the Rio is beginner/ intermediate board designed to be sailed with a centre board to get you up and planing as soon as possible. It also works great as a teaching board. The phantom is not great for teaching people as the construction is more delicate and the mast track and other items on the deck make it hard for foot placement.

I probably wouldn't recommend the Phantom unless you are interested in racing. The performance of the rio will be much better than the bombora anyway. (the Explorer will be similar) If you want more performance with the ability to teach, check out the Go range with centre fin.

Hope this helps !

I have rio longtail large
also ridden phantom 295 and have the bigger 377 phantom plus old school longboards f2 lightening

heres my take ... keen beginner/intermediate - many strong feelings on the subject

2 criteria listed...
>fun versatility ??on a race board...
the more specialised race boards for experienced sailer are much more fun. Either larger phantoms or old school ie F2 lightning
my friends who have owned the phantom 295 have generally been disappointed
doesn't really meet raceboard or short board criteria .. the compromise especially at your weight will be significant. I'm similar weight. They quickly progressed to old school longboards or the 377 so they could sail with their mates in similar conditions and not be left behind

>possibility of teaching
the longtail is wider - significant- and has a little more volume - significant

my wife who fits the large size category has learnt on a *board start and now is very comfortable doing her thing on the large longtail - it's the best board in the business for large learners once they get the first few steps out of the way. We are talking about somebody who thought windsurfing was never going to be possible

lots of large longtail love on Morgan's blog
Windsurflearningcurve
or his learning curve thread in qld seabreeze


My suggestion
longtail m if that's all that is available or if exploring in low winds relaxing the BIC large windsup is awesome and a good price plus a versitile teaching platform

my sailing mate paddles - JOHN did a review in the gear section

the Kona is also good option as longboard alternative - got one but prefer the longer boards now

happy to help

mssge me
cheers Jeff
ps the modern GO is based on carve platform and not in the same league as the longer boards you are looking at. I had the Go 151 and have ridden the 161 both are disappointingly hard work for a heavy weight sailer - many other boards get onto plane easier.

my mate Pat (fellow heavyweight) has the 161Go and the phantom 295 .. he doesn't get out enough!! What board does he use the most?? His old school longboards F2lightening and F2 comet

Hi Alphabet, I learned to sail on an Express (older 180L GO with a centre fin) so rate them pretty highly exactly as The Zu suggests, but they are still a short board. However, one day, I borrowed/pinched Jeff's ^^^^ wife's Rio L longtail when nobody else could/would sail and raved about it. Because it was difficult to source a Rio up here at the time, I actually ended up buying a 11'6 BIC WindSUP and I'm so glad I did, it is superb. It's a versatile (you can SUP and teach your friends) and virtually indestructible fun board. Be aware that it doesn't have footstraps though if that's an issue for you.

Select to expand quote

Paddles B'mere said..
Hi Alphabet, I learned to sail on an Express (older 180L GO with a centre fin) so rate them pretty highly exactly as The Zu suggests, but they are still a short board. However, one day, I borrowed/pinched Jeff's ^^^^ wife's Rio L longtail when nobody else could/would sail and raved about it. Because it was difficult to source a Rio up here at the time, I actually ended up buying a 11'6 BIC WindSUP and I'm so glad I did, it is superb. It's a versatile (you can SUP and teach your friends) and virtually indestructible fun board. Be aware that it doesn't have footstraps though if that's an issue for you.

Thanks Paddles good perspective - love the BIC windsup- they use them at RQ to teach with.

just want to clarify the Go/start you used is a very different beast to the modern GO. Starboard changed from the futura base to carve base around 2015 and ruined (my perspective) a great product

cheers Jeff

Select to expand quote

Paddles B'mere said..
Hi Alphabet, I learned to sail on an Express (older 180L GO with a centre fin) so rate them pretty highly exactly as The Zu suggests, but they are still a short board. However, one day, I borrowed/pinched Jeff's ^^^^ wife's Rio L longtail when nobody else could/would sail and raved about it. Because it was difficult to source a Rio up here at the time, I actually ended up buying a 11'6 BIC WindSUP and I'm so glad I did, it is superb. It's a versatile (you can SUP and teach your friends) and virtually indestructible fun board. Be aware that it doesn't have footstraps though if that's an issue for you.

Thanks Paddles good perspective - love the BIC windsup- they use them at RQ to teach with.

just want to clarify the Go/start you used is a very different beast to the modern GO. Starboard changed from the futura base to carve base around 2015 and ruined (my perspective) a great product

cheers Jeff

If you have sailed short boards in the past your not really a beginner. I would opt for a full size raceboard, best option is a modern one but if you get an older one in good condition they are still a load of fun to sail.

You mentioned you want something versatile, fun and challenging. Raceboard ticks the boxes

Select to expand quote

cammd said..
If you have sailed short boards in the past your not really a beginner. I would opt for a full size raceboard, best option is a modern one but if you get an older one in good condition they are still a load of fun to sail.

You mentioned you want something versatile, fun and challenging. Raceboard ticks the boxes

Given that you already own and sail a 140lit Carve, I'm not sure why you would want either the Rio or 290 Phantom. If you want a board you use on all points of sail, you are better off with a full size raceboard.

Thanks for all the advice.

A second hand Phantom 377L from the classifieds is heading my way.