i wanted to put this out to the SB brains trust.

i've had a question about the NM bonus prize of $1000 cash if the record is broken at burrum.

in the category outline i stipulated doppler tracks. the question has been asked of me if trackpoints are accepted. certainly for the NM champ at the burrum comp both TP and D will be accepted.

for the Australian NM record however i stipulated doppler as it is more accurate BUT i am easy either way.

question is? what is the record currently substaniated with, trackpoints or doppler?

are there any other question i should ask>

doppler

why change ?? DOPPLER !

Soooooo

Is the record 38.04 held by Hamma??

as shown on GPSTC individ rankings

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Wineman said...

Soooooo

Is the record 38.04 held by Hamma??

as shown on GPSTC individ rankings

Thats right, it was done at the now defunked Clayton Speed Channel it was probably one of the best places in the world to do NM runs approx 5km long, looks like Burrum will be the only place now in Oz that is capable of producing high NM runs.

Well obviously you blokes have never been to Lake Dangerous!!!!!!!
Got the friggin' lot!!

cheers for the feedback guys,

i'm not looking at changing anyhting just trying to get a feel for what constitutes the australian record.

ie. are trackpoints accepted generally?

my gut feel is that doppler is the future and is more accurate so doppler should be the yard stick.

not being tech savy, does the trackpoint advantage reduce over distance?

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ka43 said...

Well obviously you blokes have never been to Lake Dangerous!!!!!!!
Got the friggin' lot!!

Where's that? Google Earth doesn't seem to know it.

is this it?

wiresmash.com/amazing/the-most-dangerous-and-toxic-lake-in-the-world/

Don't think it makes a huge difference if the trackpoints are all valid.
I've just done a quick check on my last NM, and it goes from 31.74 to 31.90.
Trackpoints make more difference at short times.

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Gestalt said...

cheers for the feedback guys,

i'm not looking at changing anyhting just trying to get a feel for what constitutes the australian record.

ie. are trackpoints accepted generally?

my gut feel is that doppler is the future and is more accurate so doppler should be the yard stick.

not being tech savy, does the trackpoint advantage reduce over distance?

All current postings on GPS-SS must be in Doppler to be shown in top rankings.
Doppler is not the future, it is the present!
Trackpoint postings have much lower credibility and so could not really be considered 'Records', even if they are unofficial.
Trackpoint error is usually the same or more over longer distances. For shorter, straight line distances it can be less error if the 'direct line' path is calculated (using just the start point and end point) rather than the sailed path (using every single trackpoint). Not sure if the current versions of the softwares give this option anymore.

thanks andrew and decrepit.

hardie or nebs, what is the GTC thoughts about this?

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Gestalt said...

is this it?

wiresmash.com/amazing/the-most-dangerous-and-toxic-lake-in-the-world/

Ironic that its in Beaut Bute Montanna.

Gestalt it's your Gig you make the rules for prizes etc, as for GTC I think the consensus is that if you are in the top eschelon of sailors Doppler is what you post. Most top sailors will have GT-11 or 31. However, The GTC concept is to be inclusive, & not to exclude sailors who have Garmins so Trackpoint posting is valid for GTC. Dont think we've made a specific ruling tho? Maybe we need to? Exclusivity & Elitism is what kills mass participation in some sports so lets not go down that pathway, windsurfing cant afford it!!

totally agree hardie, and that's why the burrum windfest uses both sets of data.

i set a doppler only condition for the NM record as it is an australian record that's being chased.

without throwing you a potato, GTC has the database so you guys have by default become the gate keepers.

unfoirtunately there is no national body to make the call, i guess it falls to "US"

that said, if everyone agrees to dissagree then i'll accept both.

after re-reading my post i wanted to clarify i'm not asking the GTC to set the standard in australia for judging records that you guys have no control over. i'm just looking to the "experts" for their opinions.

it would be shame to see someone take the record with track points and then have people not recognise it.

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Gestalt said...



without throwing you a potato, GTC has the database so you guys have by default become the gate keepers.

unfoirtunately there is no national body to make the call, i guess it falls to "US"

that said, if everyone agrees to dissagree then i'll accept both.

Not Sure is it a yatching thing? Australian Windsurfing Association? Or do GPS-SS hold these things? Given our Data Base we certainly hold data, but no-one has officially sanctioned us in any way to be official record holders?

One issue I was thinking about and I'll make it public here is that the GTC affiliates itself with all the State Windsurfing associations......... Once I've got my head around that I'll post something here.

wanderers whom are running the burrum event are affiliated with windsurfing qld. edit* but only as far as gaining access to the AWA scheme. how you become national is beyond me

ok, after a lot of thought i have a potential solution.

1. did hammer set the record with doppler? if so then doppler is required to better it.

2. can a trackpoints figure be produced from hamma's data? if so then we would have a trackpoint speed required to better it.

3. this would mean that both sets of data for records could be used.

I doubt you'l need to worry about it Justin, there's only a handful of guys in that league that will be serious challengers and I'm sure they all use doppler, maybe a garmin backup I suppose but I'd reackon its a realistic expectation for people going for the record to be using doppler as a primary source of data.

Anyone got a Garmin gps I can borrow for Burrum

Seriously though stick with Doppler

As Choco said earlier Hammer used Doppler

sounds like a plan.

ok, the decision is that the advertised requirement for the NM record to be recorded in Doppler for the burrum record attempt is the path we will follow.

i hope this suits all.

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Gestalt said...

ok, the decision is that the advertised requirement for the NM record to be recorded in Doppler for the burrum record attempt is the path we will follow.

i hope this suits all.

Yeah, It suits TOM CHALKO.

So how is your Foretrex Rick?

guys the event will except both doppler and trackpoint.

it is only the australian NM record that will require doppler for the cash prize as the current record just happens to be held with doppler data we are using doppler. if the record was held with track points then we would use that.

i should also point out that we are only talking about the record being beaten at burrum and specifically in relation to the cash prize.

any other attempts anywhere else in oz or at burrum on track points will be for others to decide.

also, i don't know tom chalko, have never met the man and have never had a conversation with him.