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Created by

GreenPat > 9 months ago, 4 Oct 2008

GreenPat

QLD

4096 posts

4 Oct 2008 9:08am

SEBASTIEN CATTLELAN has done it:

50.26

In a blistering first run of the day Catman charged down the speed strip in Luderitz... the wind was a whopping 45knots at times, and during breakfast you could see the anticipation of something great happening...

the clock read 50.3, but after verification it came back at 50.26... the mystical barrier has been broken...

Seb's GPS read 58 - could 60 be on the cards, tomorrows forecast is predicted to be even stronger than today... but as of now Seb is the new Outright Speed Record Holder...

Haircut

QLD

6491 posts

4 Oct 2008 9:20am

slick

elmo

8879 posts

4 Oct 2008 7:53am

Still to be ratified but awesome work none the less, Seb's been pushing it for a while now so hopefully it will be approved.

The scarey part is the reading the last 2 Para's

Heres the full article

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50 knots to the Catman!!!
Friday, October 03, 2008, Friday 9:59 PM

It was a massive Friday at the Lüderitz Speed Challenge, with a new world record, and the magic 50 knot barrier broken by Sebastien Cattelan of France with a blistering run of 50.26 knots (93kph). The new record is still subject to ratification by a sitting of the World Speed Sailing Records Council.

In the 35 to 40 knot winds that blew today, gusting to more than 45 knots (83kph), the speed sailors braved very rough water conditions to achieve these records speeds, with numerous runs by top sailors of over 49 knots. Several new outright records were set:

• Sebastien Cattelan 50.26 knots – new world outright speed sailing record, and the first person to break the magic “50 knot” barrier (sponsored by Genetrix kites, xelerator boards, Prolimit, Ocean eyewear, Dabens)

• Rolf van der Vlugt 44.9 knots – new Dutch outright speed sailing record (Airush, Mystic, Protest, TUDelft, X-tremeboards)
• David Williams 44.82 knots – new UK outright speed sailing record (Best Kiteboarding, Dead Man clothing)
• Charlotte Consorti 42.19 knots – new French women’s outright speed sailing record (F-One, Nike, Maui Magic, Baracuda, Weleda)
• Katja Roose 36.83 – new Dutch women’s outright speed sailing record (Protest, Maui Magic, Airush)

Other top times today were from Jerome Bila 49.26 knots and Alexander Caizergues at 49.21 knots. Note that these times are verified by the official time keeper, but are still subject to final ratification by the WSSRC.

Cattelan's new record ups the ante in this 2008 edition of the month-long Lüderitz Speed Challenge, where American Rob Douglas’ 49.84 knots on the 19th September smashed the 49.09 knot world record set by windsurfer Antoine Albeau in the ‘trench’ at St Marie de la Mer in France earlier this year.

Coming into today’s event, he was struggling with an unrelated small injury, requiring him to reduce his activity. “I’ve been in bed the last three days, concentrating on what I would do today. Then I just did it,” he says. According to Cattelan, his record breaking run of today saw a maximum speed of 58 knots – 107kph – on the GPS, with an average of 54.5 knots over 200m.

Saturday promises even stronger winds, with a new milestone ahead of the competitors – the psychological barriers of 60mph and then 100kph.

Both the competitors and ESF Events, the organisers of the Lüderitz Speed Challenge are expecting even more world-beating performances tomorrow.

The Waterboy

VIC

109 posts

4 Oct 2008 11:47am

Nah - cheer up Elmo: 50 knots is the hydraulic equivalent of Mach 1.

That's why it's such a b*gger to get through, but once you're through, the drag/speed slope flattens off, and it's comparatively easy to go to 60, 70 and onwards.

That's why the kiters are showing 58's on the dial with such ease - it's not because they've just got so much more potential than windsurfers (although I also reckon there's more potential there that hasn't been exploited yet), it's just that that extra bit of grunt they've got has managed to tug them through Mach 1, and (if you'll pardon the pun), it's plain sailing out the other side.

So once the windsurfers have figured out a way to crack 50 themselves and keep almost nothing but the fin in the water, I actually wouldn't be surprised if they managed to overtake the kiters -> do ya reckon the Tonster (Tony W) will have the b*lls to do 70kn?

Do you have the b*lls for it?

Dunno about the Tonster - starting to show his age a bit...

Mind you, if he does show he's got the Cremaster for it... just think, in a few years time he could be the founding member of the "Senior Citizens @ 70 knots Club".

......

elmo

8879 posts

4 Oct 2008 10:56am

I think it's great, once it's ratified I think it will also end up like the 4 minute mile, the 30knot, 40knot barriers.

Once the floodgates are opened more will follow.

Now wheres that 40knot barrier

yoyo

1646 posts

4 Oct 2008 11:39am

According to Cattelan, his record breaking run of today saw a maximum speed of 58 knots – 107kph – on the GPS, with an average of 54.5 knots over 200m.

interesting... if his peak was 58, and ave 54 over 200m then you can assume his min speed was ~ 50.

An 8 knot difference over 200m or 7 seconds! This is quite a different kettle of fish to the fast windsurfing (and other sail powered craft) runs where they seem to get pegged out against a drag wall. This, I suspect illustrates the ground effect drag reduction skim. Of course it could have been a wicked gust and demontrates that there really is no top end limit for kites.

I guess the next race is to be first to 100 km/h.

Congratulations to the Catman.

Bonominator

VIC

5477 posts

4 Oct 2008 1:54pm

That's awesome!

I think this and recent results from kitesurfers puts more pressure on windsurfers to look at alternative higher power/lower drag design systems - something I'm passionate about. But I feel there's still fear of change from the windsurfing community, which is ironic considering we were once at the forefront of watercraft innovation. Clearly a peak speed of 58knots is way out of reach of current windsurfer design (and I'd love to see anyone contradict me) and that it appears some threshold has been surpassed by the kites. I see no such threshold being surpassed by windsurfers at the moment - just a steady but slowing increase in top speeds over a 25 year period.

For the time being, we remain very good at refining design, not innovating. This approach is good for getting more people on the water and having fun, but every now and then we must innovate too. We can innovate and have fun at the same time!

slowboat

560 posts

4 Oct 2008 12:36pm

I reckon its great that the kites are pushing forward. Seb is also a good windsurfer I might add...

Windsurfing has not reached a limit yet. I'm sure of that. But there is a fundamental limitation we do face. We can only generate a limited amount of lift from the sail due to the moment being balanced with our body weight, and needing the centre of effort to be a minimum height above the water (to maintain a reasonable aspect ratio). The kite has a significant advantage in that the centre of effort can be placed very low, thus reducing the need to use weight and leverage to get power. The trick we use to be fast is efficiency. Our hydrodynamic lift is several times more efficient than a kite board. But that comes with a penalty at very high speeds- cavitation. The faster we go, the lower the pressure on the low pressure side which is giving us our efficiency advantage. But at some point the dissolved gas and small bubbles in the water will expand and cause a reduction in lift, whilst increasing drag. There goes the efficiency advantage!

With a kite there are several fundamental advantages. They can generate multiple times the power of a windsurfing rig with the same sized rider, which corresponds directly to accelleration. So they can really whip up to speed very quickly. This means they can go really fast on shorter courses like luderitz, AND take advantage of short gusts. And of course the advantage of the kite board is its only working with a high pressure side, so no cavitation mechanism is kicking in. The limit for kites will be wind speed, board stability (attachment to the water), and rider strength!

The kite speeds will continue to rise.

jp747

1553 posts

4 Oct 2008 11:05pm

fantastic to see someone break the 50kt. barrier on a kite..but i'd really like to see a windsurfer do it

..nevertheless kudos to Sebastian for doing so now he has raised the bar and everyone will be rethinking every bit of gear just to break this one..i really had a feeling about this since last year but it's good for all the windsports

jp747

1553 posts

4 Oct 2008 11:06pm

fantastic to see someone break the 50kt. barrier on a kite..but i'd really like to see a windsurfer do it

elmo

8879 posts

5 Oct 2008 2:28pm

Bloody Hell, Alex C did 50.57 yesterday.

Still to be ratified but that's smoking

~~http://www.luderitz-speed.com/ContentPages/News/News.aspx?pageid=1~~

Bonominator

VIC

5477 posts

6 Oct 2008 8:47am

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slowboat said...

The kite speeds will continue to rise.

And so will L'Hydroptere's by the look of it!

windjunky

VIC

401 posts

6 Oct 2008 12:57pm

Was talking to someone who pointed out that if "sailing" involves a non-solid attachment to the rig, then its only a matter of time before they put a waterskier on the back of one of those huge a 30+ knots catamarans, and get him to slice across the wake (like they do before a water ski jump) a few times. Easily get 60 knots, and he would be powered by sail...

This could get silly!

club309

QLD

66 posts

6 Oct 2008 12:14pm

windjunky i don't think you would get a very high average speed over 500m whipping on a water ski behind a big trimaran. the fact that it is an average speed over a distance means that you are measuring velocity made good. as such your vmg when being towed by a trimaran will be equal to the speed of the trimaran. unless of course you were on a ludiccrously long rope which created an arc with a chord length of 500m. but that is pretty much impossible.

Bonominator

VIC

5477 posts

6 Oct 2008 3:07pm

Windjunky. Hey I see you've opened up ye olde chestnut again. How about we move on from the question of what is a sailing craft and concentrate on bettering speeds mate?

The WSSRC has.

windjunky

VIC

401 posts

6 Oct 2008 9:23pm

Select to expand quote

Bonominator said...

Windjunky. Hey I see you've opened up ye olde chestnut again. How about we move on from the question of what is a sailing craft and concentrate on bettering speeds mate?

The WSSRC has.

Fair enough - i didn't come her for an argument (as Monty Python would exclaim)!

GreenPat

QLD

4096 posts

9 Oct 2008 1:24am

Just got this via ~~stalkernet~~ facebook:

Sebastien Cattlelan was leading the day with a run of 50.6 knots, only to be bettered by Rob Douglas with 50.7...

and South Africa's Taro Niehaus has broken the outright African sailing record...

all this will be verified this evening and I'll send you the exact results...

elmo

8879 posts

9 Oct 2008 6:44am

No, records today but 3 riders doing 50.5's (once you open the floodgates)

Tomorow they think all the planets may align with stronger winds and better tides

Roo

878 posts

9 Oct 2008 8:08am

Select to expand quote

elmo said...

Tomorow they think all the planets may align with stronger winds and better tides

And the heavens will open and rain down fire upon these infidels who dare to touch the holy grail and make themselves gods! (Monty Pythonesqe tongue firmly in cheek)

sausage

QLD

4873 posts

9 Oct 2008 10:40am

Select to expand quote

Roo said...

And the heavens will open and rain down fire upon these infidels who dare to touch the holy grail and make themselves gods! (Monty Pythonesqe tongue firmly in cheek)

Hey Roo,
Won't this burn their kites?

Roo

878 posts

9 Oct 2008 9:07am

If we are lucky![}:)]

GreenPat

QLD

4096 posts

9 Oct 2008 11:28am

A bit green are we? Elmo's on the money, I got this this morning:

Alexander Caizergues(FRA) record of 50.57 knots still stands as both Rob Douglas(USA) and Sebastien Cattelan(FRA) came extremely close with runs of 50.54 and 50.52 knots respectively...

From wondering if someone would break the “50 knot barrier” at the Lüderitz Speed Challenge 2008, we now how three sailors well clear of it, and all separated by a mere 0.05 knots...

South Africa's Taro Niehaus set a new South Africa and Africa outright record of 48.47 knots...CONGRATULATIONS...

Roo

878 posts

9 Oct 2008 10:31am

I've got some Irish in me Pat so I'm more than a bit green. Bring me a shrubbery (Monty referance again). Actually I admire the kiters for the speeds they are achieving, it's great to see speed back in the public conscience again. With kiters, windsurfers and boats all after the holy grail of the outright record the sport couldn't be healthier. My money is on the boats to have the record by the end of the year and I hate to say it but I don't see windsurfers getting 50 knots over 500m anytime soon. The torch has been passed and the new knights of speed ride steeds of steel and plastic with crossbow kites their weapons of power!

sausage

QLD

4873 posts

9 Oct 2008 12:42pm

Select to expand quote

Roo said...

I've got some Irish in me Pat so I'm more than a bit green. Bring me a shrubbery (Monty referance again). Actually I admire the kiters for the speeds they are achieving, it's great to see speed back in the public conscience again. With kiters, windsurfers and boats all after the holy grail of the outright record the sport couldn't be healthier. My money is on the boats to have the record by the end of the year and I hate to say it but I don't see windsurfers getting 50 knots over 500m anytime soon. The torch has been passed and the new knights of speed ride steeds of steel and plastic with crossbow kites their weapons of power!

Roo,
Are these the Knights of Nee these new Knights of speed?

Roo

878 posts

9 Oct 2008 10:48am

They are one in the same you silly sausage!

sausage

QLD

4873 posts

9 Oct 2008 12:52pm

Select to expand quote

Roo said...

They are one in the same you silly sausage!

Ah the The Knights Who 'Til Recently Said Ni

latedropeddy

VIC

417 posts

9 Oct 2008 1:54pm

a bit more competition with Hydroptere going over 50kts max!

yoyo: note the stepped hulls/outriggers. A pretty common feature on fast watercraft like offshore powerboats, seaplanes, Dan Engdahls board (did he use it recently?) and other craft.

www.hydroptere.com/_en/

and pics

www.bymnews.com/photos/displayimage.php?album=422&pid=70618

Roo

878 posts

9 Oct 2008 12:03pm

They are now the knights who murmour "ground effect" under their breath!

GreenPat

QLD

4096 posts

9 Oct 2008 2:19pm

Select to expand quote

Roo said...

I've got some Irish in me Pat so I'm more than a bit green.

Funny that, me too. To the point where my parents christened me 'Patrick', would you believe? I also had a green kite once, hence the username.

elmo

8879 posts

9 Oct 2008 4:43pm

50.57 run

AUS1111

3621 posts

9 Oct 2008 5:18pm

You can see in there why they have such high peaks compared with their 500 metre speeds; he's really not going very straight at all is he? It looks like a series of little bursts and then - whoops! let's just bring that back under control.

It suggests to me they have a long way to go yet.

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