Anyone out there sub 166cm? Which sail brands/models have you found work best for you?

I have a 5.2 camless freerace that has been my comfiest sail ever, but I've still always had to run the boom at the bottom of the cutout. Same brand same size race sail and I just can't get the boom low enough to be near comfortable. I've tried running with the pulleys touching. The shortest base I can find. Longer lines. Always with the boom jammed as far as I can into the bottom of the cutout. I've thought about cutting the zip out to get a few more cm but I suspect it will still be much too high. Are there any other tricks shorter sailors use?

Maybe a hollowed out deck board might help a bit

How about using a Z Boom

Have you tried a Koncept? I'm far from tall, and I run the boom about a third of the way up, other sails I'm right at the bottom

I'm barely 6 foot and run Overdrives right in the middle, so I reckon there must be 6 inches left. That doesn't translate to 6 inch drop in the boom, but the lower hole could help at the expense of some drive. The power is quite low compared with current race sails, which might be a good thing.

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needsalt said..
Anyone out there sub 166cm? Which sail brands/models have you found work best for you?

I have a 5.2 camless freerace that has been my comfiest sail ever, but I've still always had to run the boom at the bottom of the cutout. Same brand same size race sail and I just can't get the boom low enough to be near comfortable. I've tried running with the pulleys touching. The shortest base I can find. Longer lines. Always with the boom jammed as far as I can into the bottom of the cutout. I've thought about cutting the zip out to get a few more cm but I suspect it will still be much too high. Are there any other tricks shorter sailors use?

Make friends with a sailmaker?

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cald said..

needsalt said..
Anyone out there sub 166cm? Which sail brands/models have you found work best for you?

I have a 5.2 camless freerace that has been my comfiest sail ever, but I've still always had to run the boom at the bottom of the cutout. Same brand same size race sail and I just can't get the boom low enough to be near comfortable. I've tried running with the pulleys touching. The shortest base I can find. Longer lines. Always with the boom jammed as far as I can into the bottom of the cutout. I've thought about cutting the zip out to get a few more cm but I suspect it will still be much too high. Are there any other tricks shorter sailors use?

Make friends with a sailmaker?

I am 167 cm and I use Koncepts - boom always half way up the cutout at least.
What length harness lines are you using? Are they too short? Mine are 30 inch.

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anthony perkins said..
Maybe a hollowed out deck board might help a bit

Well she is considering a custom speed board build this winter, maybe just go nuts on the hollowed bit.

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Mark _australia said..

anthony perkins said..
Maybe a hollowed out deck board might help a bit

Well she is considering a custom speed board build this winter, maybe just go nuts on the hollowed bit.

The hollow makes a difference. Severnes are ok then. I think the Koncepts are lower. I only have older sails ( 2017 - 2019 ) but I feel the Severnes ( Machs and OD's ) are really set up for control in overpowering conditions whereas the Koncepts might have better low end.

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Mark _australia said..

anthony perkins said..
Maybe a hollowed out deck board might help a bit

Well she is considering a custom speed board build this winter, maybe just go nuts on the hollowed bit.

She is??? Is that a sponsorship offer??

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Windxtasy said..
I am 167 cm and I use Koncepts - boom always half way up the cutout at least.
What length harness lines are you using? Are they too short? Mine are 30 inch.

I'm 165cm. Usually 28s but started running adjustables that start at 28 to try to help. Found myself running them at everything up to their max at 34 and still way too high

Koncepts definitely seem to be the most popular option for shorties so far.

Check different sail brands. Severne slalom sails have a very high cutout. KAs tend have a much lower cutout. Lofts are also lower, but not as low as KAs. Lofts still work well for Nina @ 1.60, but with the boom at the bottom of the cutout.

Depending on the brand, there may also be differences between sail sizes and years. Lofts are the only ones where where have sails from 3 or more different years, and the boom cutout is pretty consistent. The 3 Severne Mach 2 sails we had all were a bit different.

You may also see improvements by adding more downhaul. Shorter sailors can benefit from a bit more downhaul than larger and heavier sailors, who have more leverage over the sail. It you trim your sails with more than 2 cm of rope between the pulleys, changing the extension settings to remove the extra rope (e.g. 16 instead of 18 cm) can also help.

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needsalt said..

Windxtasy said..
I am 167 cm and I use Koncepts - boom always half way up the cutout at least.
What length harness lines are you using? Are they too short? Mine are 30 inch.

I'm 165cm. Usually 28s but started running adjustables that start at 28 to try to help. Found myself running them at everything up to their max at 34 and still way too high

Koncepts definitely seem to be the most popular option for shorties so far.

Try Duotone Warps. I'm 173cm, use 28 inch harness lines and run my boom in the middle of the Duotone cutout, so there should be enough adjustment for your 165 height and same harness line length. Also there is no neoprene zipped cover on the Duotones.

This is all very interesting info. Thanks so much!

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John340 said..

needsalt said..

Windxtasy said..
I am 167 cm and I use Koncepts - boom always half way up the cutout at least.
What length harness lines are you using? Are they too short? Mine are 30 inch.

I'm 165cm. Usually 28s but started running adjustables that start at 28 to try to help. Found myself running them at everything up to their max at 34 and still way too high

Koncepts definitely seem to be the most popular option for shorties so far.

Try Duotone Warps. I'm 173cm, use 28 inch harness lines and run my boom in the middle of the Duotone cutout, so there should be enough adjustment for your 165 height and same harness line length. Also there is no neoprene zipped cover on the Duotones.

Interesting, I'm 191cm, sailing only warps, and have my boom firmly in the lower 1/4 of the cutout. I'm a bit weird though, currently using 26" lines and a waist harness.
This is a question as much about sailing posture as it is cutout height, Locally I see people significantly shorter than myself using higher booms and longer lines. Personally, I like to be more upright, less under the rig if you like sailing this way then you will need to find lower cutouts at 166cm.
I suspect in Fast/Racing sails you may not find what you are looking for. You may need to have some sails modified (there are possibly a few brands around that might be able to customise the cutout also if you have the $$ for new sails...)

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needsalt said..

Windxtasy said..
I am 167 cm and I use Koncepts - boom always half way up the cutout at least.
What length harness lines are you using? Are they too short? Mine are 30 inch.

I'm 165cm. Usually 28s but started running adjustables that start at 28 to try to help. Found myself running them at everything up to their max at 34 and still way too high

Koncepts definitely seem to be the most popular option for shorties so far.

needsalt, if you prefer the feel and handling of camless sails then the KA Kross-S freeride sails (formerly the Koyote) have an even lower boom cutout than the cammed Koncepts

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cald said..

John340 said..

needsalt said..

Windxtasy said..
I am 167 cm and I use Koncepts - boom always half way up the cutout at least.
What length harness lines are you using? Are they too short? Mine are 30 inch.

I'm 165cm. Usually 28s but started running adjustables that start at 28 to try to help. Found myself running them at everything up to their max at 34 and still way too high

Koncepts definitely seem to be the most popular option for shorties so far.

Try Duotone Warps. I'm 173cm, use 28 inch harness lines and run my boom in the middle of the Duotone cutout, so there should be enough adjustment for your 165 height and same harness line length. Also there is no neoprene zipped cover on the Duotones.

Interesting, I'm 191cm, sailing only warps, and have my boom firmly in the lower 1/4 of the cutout. I'm a bit weird though, currently using 26" lines and a waist harness.
This is a question as much about sailing posture as it is cutout height, Locally I see people significantly shorter than myself using higher booms and longer lines. Personally, I like to be more upright, less under the rig if you like sailing this way then you will need to find lower cutouts at 166cm.
I suspect in Fast/Racing sails you may not find what you are looking for. You may need to have some sails modified (there are possibly a few brands around that might be able to customise the cutout also if you have the $$ for new sails...)

I'm 18cm shorter than you, use a low hook seat harness and sail with my boom between chin and shoulder height when standing upright. You must sail with yours around your stomach height. I can't imagine how this works with your waist harness.

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John340 said..

cald said..

John340 said..

needsalt said..

Windxtasy said..
I am 167 cm and I use Koncepts - boom always half way up the cutout at least.
What length harness lines are you using? Are they too short? Mine are 30 inch.

I'm 165cm. Usually 28s but started running adjustables that start at 28 to try to help. Found myself running them at everything up to their max at 34 and still way too high

Koncepts definitely seem to be the most popular option for shorties so far.

Try Duotone Warps. I'm 173cm, use 28 inch harness lines and run my boom in the middle of the Duotone cutout, so there should be enough adjustment for your 165 height and same harness line length. Also there is no neoprene zipped cover on the Duotones.

Interesting, I'm 191cm, sailing only warps, and have my boom firmly in the lower 1/4 of the cutout. I'm a bit weird though, currently using 26" lines and a waist harness.
This is a question as much about sailing posture as it is cutout height, Locally I see people significantly shorter than myself using higher booms and longer lines. Personally, I like to be more upright, less under the rig if you like sailing this way then you will need to find lower cutouts at 166cm.
I suspect in Fast/Racing sails you may not find what you are looking for. You may need to have some sails modified (there are possibly a few brands around that might be able to customise the cutout also if you have the $$ for new sails...)

I'm 18cm shorter than you, use a low hook seat harness and sail with my boom between chin and shoulder height when standing upright. You must sail with yours around your stomach height. I can't imagine how this works with your waist harness.

Like Cald posture has a lot to how high or low, I sail with 32 lines and I'm 6'1", seat harness and boom lower half KA race sails. Have a older Warp never could get the boom low enough to feel right. My boom is set just below shoulder height, only time I increase the height is when I change to the bottom clew hole I raise the boom 50mm to account for the different angle.

Best way rather than speculate on heights is measure from the bottom of the base plate to your preferred boom height, easy then to see if the cutout of a particular brand meets your requirements.

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Aus501 Boz said..

Best way rather than speculate on heights is measure from the bottom of the base plate to your preferred boom height, easy then to see if the cutout of a particular brand meets your requirements.

Totally agree that measurement is best, but I've actually found it really difficult to get info on boom cutout heights from both manufacturers and shops. It just doesn't seem to be info that is commonly available with specs. Even with direct enquiries it hasn't been easy to come by. Living in a regional area with no local speed sailors, unfortunately I don't get to inspect/measure other options myself very often. So it's particularly interesting and helpful to hear about the experiences of other shorter sailors here.

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John340 said..

cald said..

John340 said..

needsalt said..

Windxtasy said..
I am 167 cm and I use Koncepts - boom always half way up the cutout at least.
What length harness lines are you using? Are they too short? Mine are 30 inch.

I'm 165cm. Usually 28s but started running adjustables that start at 28 to try to help. Found myself running them at everything up to their max at 34 and still way too high

Koncepts definitely seem to be the most popular option for shorties so far.

Try Duotone Warps. I'm 173cm, use 28 inch harness lines and run my boom in the middle of the Duotone cutout, so there should be enough adjustment for your 165 height and same harness line length. Also there is no neoprene zipped cover on the Duotones.

Interesting, I'm 191cm, sailing only warps, and have my boom firmly in the lower 1/4 of the cutout. I'm a bit weird though, currently using 26" lines and a waist harness.
This is a question as much about sailing posture as it is cutout height, Locally I see people significantly shorter than myself using higher booms and longer lines. Personally, I like to be more upright, less under the rig if you like sailing this way then you will need to find lower cutouts at 166cm.
I suspect in Fast/Racing sails you may not find what you are looking for. You may need to have some sails modified (there are possibly a few brands around that might be able to customise the cutout also if you have the $$ for new sails...)

I'm 18cm shorter than you, use a low hook seat harness and sail with my boom between chin and shoulder height when standing upright. You must sail with yours around your stomach height. I can't imagine how this works with your waist harness.

Yeh thats my point everyone is different at least a little bit and in some cases a big bit.
My boom is around nipple to lower chest height, my waist harness is pulled down low, and when I sail my rig is upright not angled over me, harness lines end up more horizontal. I like the forward pull feeling more than the lifting feeling. I'm more upright, shoulders well outboard of hips. No poo stance like I see a lot of now days... quite a few of the euro speed guys sail like this.