Whats a fast sail & how fast do they go?

We pretty much know that the race sails are the fastest but what about those other ones that we also use?

2, 1 and no cam sails? What can they do? What have they done?

How fast have you gone on what sail and what size?

Feel free to add board & wind strength.

Me, 29knts NP Ryde 6.5 JP SS124 145x73 JP SS40 fin (yep too big)

This can assist when we are looking for new gear that is fast but not as full on as the race kit.

31knts, Severne Gator 6.5, JP Super X 95, Tabou 34 FSW. (84kg).

I think you can go quite fast on non-racing gear but they will usually lack the stability (of racing sails) and may not be quite as good deep off the wind.

4.7 Gator 2013, JP Supercross 96L 2009, JP weed wave 21. 35.15 knots at 90beers.

I don't wear a GPS but I can fairly closely match some of the speeds our local GPS crew are sailing with the Sailworks Huckers I use, often with a metre less sail size as well. If power can be converted to speed then these no cam sails a super quick.

I have been talked into getting a Canmore unit to see exactly how fast I'm going. It will be interesting to see.

I have to admit though it can get pretty interesting very quickly in variable conditions with the draft moving around a lot. Prefer consistent powered up conditions.

Severne Overdrive is my pick. Not your full on race sail, has 3 cams, cheaper than the race sails, lighter, easy to manoeuvre, easy to rig and full of grunt.
My new 5.2 R7 just feels so nice and controllable in the big Tassie winds.
34.31 kts in bumpy choppy gusty conditions. Can't wait to try it in the flat water on a speed run. Looking forward to going for the big 40 kts on it this year.....I hope....soon.....

Just adding - 30 kts on 3.5 wave sail and 65 lt wave board in 30 - 40+ kts on flatwater.

To consistently achieve speeds in excess of 30kts you need to
1. bear off the wind to angles approaching 140 degrees and
2. sail in overpowered conditions

No-cam (RAF) sails loose too much power in these sailing angles and are too much of a handful when overpowered going to windward back to the top of the speed run. 4 and 3 cam race and freerace sails with adjustable outhauls are the go. EG KA Race (4 cam) and KA Concept (3 cam), Severne Reflex (4 cam) and Severne Overdrive (3 cam).

For a non cammed sail 32.99kts 4.2m Sailworks Hucker and beat up 78ltre Tabou Pocket wave on flatwater.
With the winds you're getting down there Kazza 40kts is on the cards!

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John340 said..
To consistently achieve speeds in excess of 30kts you need to
1. bear off the wind to angles approaching 140 degrees and
2. sail in overpowered conditions

No-cam (RAF) sails loose too much power in these sailing angles and are too much of a handful when overpowered going to windward back to the top of the speed run. 4 and 3 cam race and freerace sails with adjustable outhauls are the go. EG KA Race (4 cam) and KA Concept (3 cam), Severne Reflex (4 cam) and Severne Overdrive (3 cam).

+1 - Now I've got Severne overdrives I hate Raf sails- the draft moves around too much in our gusty conditions and gutless off the wind.. Mine are wavesails though rather than freeride..
Mind you they are easier to waterstart..

A fast sail is the one you're hanging onto on a windy day in good conditions, all the rest are slower sitting in the car, trailer or at home

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elmo said..
A fast sail is the one you're hanging onto on a windy day in good conditions, all the rest are slower sitting in the car, trailer or at home

Ok another one for severne overdrives. I find them easy to rig, reasonable in price and not as rigid as a reflex. I'm actually finding them a little faster than the reflex's as they are easier to pump after starting or gybing and I had troubles flipping the cams in the reflex if water starting and the cams where around the wrong way. I like the roller cams instead of the more full on cams in the Reflex. I think it is important as well to get a carbon boom as well as this stops the draught moving around in the sail. I haven't had a catapult since changing to the overdrives and a carbon boom so I'm pretty happy about that. The difference between say a Blade (wave sail) and an overdrive is a lot. Recently I was really struggling with my 5.7m blade in 28knots and had to come in, and pretty much the same happened with my 7.8 overdrive, thought getting close to getting hurt time to come in, just to get you an idea in the differences between the two sails. I'm 90kg and it was in similar water conditions, but with a 92 lt wave board and 115 slalom board.

Loft Switchblades work for me but supply is a little limited in Oz now. Check out Windsurfing Religion.

I did 34 knts on a 4.2 wave sail a few years ago, but that was at George lake when fast guys on proper equipment were doing 40s. I use 3 cam Koncepts because they are fast and light, but in light wind and bigger sizes they lack bottom end.

Now you're talking. Non speed specific gear doing the business.

What about some Severne NCX, Unit speeds? Ezzy Lion & Cheetas NP Hellcats & Hornets.

I use Tushingham T-birds (no cam) and freeride boards, RRD or Exocet.
Consistently get between 28 & 32 knts sailing across the wind.
They don't go off the wind as well as cammed sails.

Then again remember it's more about the Indian, not the arrow

Severne Ncx is a nice sail for rough water conditions as easy to water start. It is nearly as fast as overdrive on beam reach however it is limited as per John 340 comments. As mentioned before carbon boom will make it better behaved in overpowered conditions but no perfect. I think also you should think about masts and probably keep as close as possible to constant curve so that you are not totally locked into one brand.

2015 Ezzy Cheetah 6.5m + Tabou 3S 96l combo. Only used a few times with a GPS, 2sec 28kts, 5x10sec 26.85kts & 22.76nm. I'm a pretty slow Indian.

If anyone has any feedback on the Ezzy Lion would be interested to read, cheers.

I consistently get 30/31 on a Naish Koncept with a 5.8m KA Kult in overpowered conditions on a speed track.
Put a 5.5 HSM GPS on it, same board, same fin. Did 34.6 on it.

Dave I did 34 on a Windrush Fun 11 / 5.5m RAF Pryde in 1986 along the spoil bank

Didn't have a GPS so I can really determine what units of measurement I was using though...

Was Lindsay driving next to you, 34kmh

Centre board up or down?

Why down of course. I was going upwind after all!!!

I like my Tushingham X15s. 4 cam, but more of a freerace sail, they feel lighter handling. Good for over 40kts with the right wind/water/board

30-32 knots on 6.5 and 5.5 Ezzy Cheetahs with FSW boards and slalom fins.

33.5kts with a north soul wave 5.2 and atomiq 100. Admittedly I was the slowest on the water that day

In a similar vein, what is the wind range of each sail? A bit harder because few of us use an anemometer and even fewer of us have weather station on the course we sail. All i can really say is i can easily hang onto my reflex 9.7 in the same wind that i am fully powered up on my rrd firewing 7.8. If i was going i could hang onto the firewing 7.8 in really strong wind (guys out with4.5 wave sails, everyone over powered at times) but if i felll off i had to wait for a lull to be able to waterstart. No idea what speed. Felt like light speed in the lulls and just hanging on in the gusts. Sorry if it ot but wind range really interests me. I would trade a few knots of top end speed for a sail that had low end grunt to get my 100+kg going in no wind but i could still hang onto and water start in a cyclone.

34.2 (2 sec) on a 7.5 Gaastra Matrix no cam RAF. Fanatic Falcon 104l and Black Project Weedspeed 31.

www.gpsteamchallenge.com.au/sailor_session/show?date=2016-03-20&team=98

Fastest on the water that day against a couple of 4 cam 7.0m rigs (but not by much). Yes, the extra half meter of size may have helped.

I reckon the slight aerodynamic disadvantage of the RAF sail is negligible in these relatively 'friendly' conditions, more than outweighed by the inherent luck of jagging the right gust on the right patch of water. They are certainly not slow or a guarantee of being at the back of the pack. I find the slight elastic flex as the RAF sail takes shape in a gust very confidence inspiring - almost like a mini slingshot. You get the feedback that the gust is hitting and then have a second or two to adjust your weight and stance to make the most of it.

36.8 Loft 5.9 O2 no cam & CA SL58 www.gpsteamchallenge.com.au/sailor_session/show?date=2011-06-25&team=20

I'm with Eckas, nothing really wrong with a no cam in the right spot at the right time, my speed is my 3rd fastest ever. I find lately I'm slowing up cambers or not, nothing to do with gear just the way it is sometimes

There is no doubt that under the right conditions you can do mid 30s with a no cam sail. The point is that in the same conditions you can potentially achieve high 30s or 40kt on a 3 or 4 cam sail. In the end it really doesn't matter what you use, as Elmo says its more important to get out there with whatever you've got.

Guy Cribb came 6th in the Lancelin Ocean Classic using a free ride sail and free ride board. Angles are very deep off the wind. Most people in top 20 using race sails and slalom gear.

I'm no gun but... I have used Reflex (race), Overdrive (3 cam), Turbo (2 cam), NCX (no cam), freeride no cam 6 batten. I don't think there is a huge difference in top speed when you are in the middle of the wind range for the sail in good conditions. In the top end there is a difference as you move to the race end, I think the acceleration is also noticeably better with race, slightly better upwind angles etc. But I ended up preferring the no cam for light handing, ease of rigging, easier gybing and de-powering. On a good day I can still pull top speeds that are maybe 1 knot slower than if was on race gear.

Like all gear decisions it's about trade-offs.

Fast is in the hands of the holder.

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sailquik said..
Fast is in the hands of the holder.

Yep. AA could get on a blown out 1991 World Cup Racing sail and do 45 knots.