My son is about to resume his windsurfing. He hasn't used a harness before but is ready.

When learning to use the harness, would you recommend he get used to the harness first, then try footstraps, or learn both together?

Start with long lines and go shorter, or use lines the right length from the start?

I'd say harness before footstraps (you need to learn how to control a catapult without breaking an ankle)

Correct length from the start.

Good luck with it

[Edit: Looks like you beat me to it Gestalt! ]

I'd go foot straps first. Catapults in the harness are not fun.

take the fin out of board plug the sail in and let him use foot straps and harness together ... move the board around ...( upwind,downwind) let him get a feel for it all

Catapults unfortunately are part of the learning process. Time to buy that nose protector I think.

Unsure if it is best way but I originally got used to the harness in non-planing speeds (without footstraps). At these speeds catapults are pretty soft. Biggest risk is harness hook into sail. If he is planing, out of footstraps could get nasty.

Don't forget to make him aware he will be trapped under the sail at least once, hooked in. That's always fun. Best do some controlled, panic-free demos in shallow water first.

evlPanda said...

Don't forget to make him aware he will be trapped under the sail at least once, hooked in. That's always fun. Best do some controlled, panic-free demos in shallow water first.

Great way to put him off ever hooking in there mate.

That's like saying to a learner driver on the first day behind the wheel: "one day you're going to have an accident, let's have a small one today so you can used to it."

For the record, I've NEVER been stuck in my harness under the sail, and I've been sailing for nearly 20 years. Maybe I'm just lucky.

EDIT: In order to add something useful:

Waist harness, long harness lines, lighter wind conditions, out of the footstraps, getting used to hooking in and unhooking.

Progress towards planing conditions, hooking in, not in the footstraps.

Then work on the footstraps. The reason the footstraps come last is that by hooking in you are taking the weight off your feet, bringing the board out of the water and on to the plane, and making it easier to get in to the footstraps when you do get going. That's the way of the RYA Fast Forward programme, and it makes sense to me.

evlPanda said...

Don't forget to make him aware he will be trapped under the sail at least once, hooked in. That's always fun. Best do some controlled, panic-free demos in shallow water first.

That is good advice, speaking as someone who in recent years went through that stage of learning and had moments of panic and flapping under the sail. I laughed about it...but only much later

FlickySpinny said...

evlPanda said...

Don't forget to make him aware he will be trapped under the sail at least once, hooked in. That's always fun. Best do some controlled, panic-free demos in shallow water first.

For the record, I've NEVER been stuck in my harness under the sail, and I've been sailing for nearly 20 years. Maybe I'm just lucky.

I had a nasty experience with that just a couple of weeks ago.
As close to drowning as I would ever want to be. Frightening. I couldn't get unhooked, couldn't get my head either side of the sail, no air underneath, deep water, the sail being driven into the water by a stiff breeze. Eventually decided I was just going to have to use my hands to get the harness line untangled. Didn't even think about the quick release on the harness itself until later.
I didn't tell my family about that. Wouldn't want to frighten them.

A controlled panic-free demo may be a good idea...

just do it topless and you'll be surprised how many will assist you

evlPanda said...

FlickySpinny said...
For the record, I've NEVER been stuck in my harness under the sail, and I've been sailing for nearly 20 years. Maybe I'm just lucky.

Never?

Never.

I am a RYA qualified instructor as well, and I've just spent the winter at Club Vass in Greece. The trick I'm working on at the moment is a clew-first puneta (clew-fist switch-stance spock), which I think qualifies me as having windsurfed long enough to talk about this.

I agree that showing people how to be calm when they are under the sail (NOT hooked in) to find their way to the edge is a good idea.

I maintain that teaching students that they're going to get stuck in their harness underwater when there is a natural major reluctance to hook in is not a great teaching method and can put people off moving to the next level. The RYA do not include this as part of their teaching method, and I agree completely with it.

And just how does that qualify for a red thumb?

An expert windsurfer and professional instructor expressing his personal opinion (which happens to be in line with the line taken by the largest windsurf training organisation in the world) in a reasoned argument is not suitable for a red thumb.

If you don't agree, then that's fine, but don't red thumb something like that.

[Edit: thanks to whoever gave me a green thumb to cancel out that red. Point still stands though.]

I green thumbed your comment, but red-thumbed your reaction to the red thumb : )

So there is honestly no mention of how to react when trapped under a sail during training? It does seem odd as it is probably about the only dangerous aspect of the sport, alongside collisions with others and obtstacles.

And experts and professionals aside most of us recall being trapped or still ocassionally do get trapped under the sail. It's only for a moment but usually happens when you are overpowered, exhausted and you've just been catapulted, sometimes with some slight winding thrown in for fun.

I reckon getting trapped under the sail is very important to mention.

It is the worst in knee deep water and you get pinned down knee deep water is where you learn all these things to.

I still think of that day and its like over 15 years since it happened to me.

I think that what is good to make him understand is that using the harness is not just for resting the arms, but for making the sailing much more efficient (control) and fast (less weight).
I just can't sail without it now !

FlickySpinny said...

evlPanda said...

FlickySpinny said...
For the record, I've NEVER been stuck in my harness under the sail, and I've been sailing for nearly 20 years. Maybe I'm just lucky.

Never?

Never.

I am a RYA qualified instructor as well, and I've just spent the winter at Club Vass in Greece. The trick I'm working on at the moment is a clew-first puneta (clew-fist switch-stance spock), which I think qualifies me as having windsurfed long enough to talk about this. No more qualified than anyone else. Defiantly not more than someone who HAS been stuck under a sail.

I agree that showing people how to be calm when they are under the sail (NOT hooked in) to find their way to the edge is a good idea.

I maintain that teaching students that they're going to get stuck in their harness underwater when there is a natural major reluctance to hook in is not a great teaching method and can put people off moving to the next level. The RYA do not include this as part of their teaching method, and I agree completely with it.

That's like saying you shouldn't teach defensive driving because it might put people off. The fact that it isn't included in the RYA syllabus is neither here nor there. Presenting the proposal as "teaching students that they're going to get stuck in their harness underwater" is argumentative and silly. No one is going to be put off by being taught a safety drill.