Yee-HAAA!

Go Formula GO!!

Hmmm...actually, it looks kind of...well...****y...are you hoping to win more converts with this video, Gestalt?

This is no Robbie at Hookipa video, that's for sure, but it has to be said that for many of us, planing on a barn door and a 10m+ sail sure beats the hell out of not going windsurfing at all! Those guys were actually planing in NO WIND!

I love my formula board, and it loves me. And after a couple of beers, it doesn't look half bad.

the truth is spoken!

I apologise if this has been mentioned but..
That would've been a WHOLE lot better to watch at the olympics..

It might look ****y, but not as ****y as the air-rowing that went on for those few painful races...

Of course, there might be a problem if it blows more than 20 knots.

What a waste of good fishing weather [}:)]

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555 said...

I apologise if this has been mentioned but..
That would've been a WHOLE lot better to watch at the olympics..

It might look ****y, but not as ****y as the air-rowing that went on for those few painful races...

Of course, there might be a problem if it blows more than 20 knots.

For sure. Olympic windsurfing needs formula. At least its a type of board people actually sail.

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555 said...
Of course, there might be a problem if it blows more than 20 knots.

Really? I thought was Ok up to ... well higher than 20.


You out of a job or something lately Justin? Lots of vids.

Ha ha ha, Our Greek Aussie mate Jason Roditis is in that video

You just have to HTFU to sail Formula.......

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555 said...

I apologise if this has been mentioned but..
That would've been a WHOLE lot better to watch at the olympics..

It might look ****y, but not as ****y as the air-rowing that went on for those few painful races...

Of course, there might be a problem if it blows more than 20 knots.

yes....

could happen.....

at the recent oceanics in qld the guys went out for a freesail session in 30+ knots on their formula kit because racing was put on hold due to the conditions.

the top guys are machines.

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evlPanda said...

555 said...
Of course, there might be a problem if it blows more than 20 knots.

Really? I thought was Ok up to ... well higher than 20.


You out of a job or something lately Justin? Lots of vids.

nope, still got work.

moved the office off to the side of the lounge so now i am completely wired into the stream.

Just to clarify...the deleted word in my post (****y) was a slang word for "gay" (not that there's anything wrong with it), which starts with the letter P, and not the slang word for a certain much-appreciated female bodypart.

It seems that the censorship made it look ruder than it actually was...

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Wet Willy said...


Just to clarify...the deleted word in my post (****y) was a slang word for "gay" (not that there's anything wrong with it), which starts with the letter P, and not the slang word for a certain much-appreciated female bodypart.

It seems that the censorship made it look ruder than it actually was...

well i didn't get it willy,

i thought you had actually seen the light of the one true discipline!

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Gestalt said...



well i didn't get it willy,

i thought you had actually seen the light of the one true discipline!

I sail on Formula gear about 4 days a week, and if I'm lucky I get to plane for an hour or so on most of those days. But in the past month I've only had one chance to go out on my "small" gear - a 130 litre freeride board and 8.5m sail, and it was a whole new world of fun. Nothing beats using the small stuff in good wind.

Long, carefree runs on Formula gear in exactly the right wind ...yep, that's a LOT of fun, but it's a B**** when the wind picks up, and even more of a B**** when you have to slog...and don't even get me started about carrying the gear - I physically cannot carry my board and rig together for more than about 3 metres without serious risk of injury.

But all the while, the guys with the small gear are sitting on the beach re-telling stories about the day it was really windy, back in 1867...

saturday is formula day.

VP high tide, 10-15knots.

will be hitting the strip;

Formula vs Trimaran

Formula is not for everyone, but it is a great format for racing, hence the popularity.

FE+ (Formula Experience Plus) has some real appeal also for people looking to improve their windsurfing skills while traveling around the country with like minded people.
www.windsurfing.org/files/2008/FormulaExperiencePlus2008.pdf

Formula was also the main development tool for allot of the light wind equipment available for recreational sailing today. (Can't be a bad development for the sport huh?)

Personally i now enjoy the 10-15knot days more than the 20-25knot, and so does my family.
The enjoyment factor of not being totally windblown, and being able to sail up & down wind has special appeal for me.

Regards.

Would love to get a formula rig one day just to maximise my sail time and I enjoy sailing with the Yachts at Mornington, Vic but naturally I lose them when they go heavily up or down wind, so thinking a formula would rock for the 10-20flat water summer days.

Question to you formula sailors: how much to get set up with a decent board and massive sail rig. I have no problem going second hand but I am guessing you have to go a lot of carbon at that size? Just curious for the future, because I am totally broke at the moment anyway.

Thanks.

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Leman said...

Would love to get a formula rig one day just to maximise my sail time and I enjoy sailing with the Yachts at Mornington, Vic but naturally I lose them when they go heavily up or down wind, so thinking a formula would rock for the 10-20flat water summer days.

Question to you formula sailors: how much to get set up with a decent board and massive sail rig. I have no problem going second hand but I am guessing you have to go a lot of carbon at that size? Just curious for the future, because I am totally broke at the moment anyway.

Thanks.

on my formula kit i use an 8.5m sail and that is plenty, so 8.5-9m will serve you well with a 70cm fin.

one the race course the bigger sails 10m+ will leave the smaller sails for dead upwind and allow a deeper run downwind. the average sail used for formula racing would be 10m but as i say an 8.5m is still formula sailing.

the theory though is for sailing in winds over 20 knots you need a big sail, ie. 9.8m+

the reason as it was explained to me is that a bigger sail in high winds helps load the board and keeps the nose down. this is a theory i have yet to try but comes from very highly regarded formula sailors.

or it could be i am gullible.

sean o
brien wrote some interesting stuff a while back saying to go fast on formula. ie. 30 knots plus, you need the following (don't quote me)

70cm fin,
10m+ sail
chop.

I have never sailed a formula board but i'm having great time on my 131 slalom board in 10-15knots, the board now is my favourite.
140lt slalom boards would also be great fun, light wind sailing on the lake = flat water...little ripples and it;s a buzz.

What sail? What sail?

Sail size on a formula board will depend on what you want to do.

In winds of 10-20 knots

1. Cruising about: Reaching with ability to go slightly (correction from Gestalt ) upwind or downwind, but not like a massive formula sail.
For sure 8.5 - 9.0 metre, also not necessary to have 4-5 cam race sail. Can go with Freerace sail (3 cams) eg Maui Sail "Titan" (2009 model) or "MS-2" (2008 model).

2. Upwind - downwind (also want to try FE+ Experience):
80+kg 11.0 metre. 70-60kg 10 metre.
79-70kg depends on height and skill level,
There are formula racers in the NSW series who are hardcore and are exceptions to the above. Respect to Tibor! : )
Also not necessary to go for 4-5 cam race sails.


3. Racing: if you want to get into the arms race, 2 to 3 sails. 4-5 cam race sails


Gestalt, NSW Race Series, the formula workhorse is the 11 metre.


Cheers Nathan

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Squish said...

What sail? What sail?

Sail size on a formula board will depend on what you want to do.

In winds of 10-20 knots

1. Cruising about: Reaching with ability to go slightly upwind or downwind
For sure 8.5 - 9.0 metre, also not necessary to have 4-5 cam race sail. Can go with Freerace sail (3 cams) eg Maui Sail "Titan" (2009 model) or "MS-2" (2008 model).

2. Upwind - downwind (also want to try FE+ Experience):
80+kg 11.0 metre. 70-60kg 10 metre.
79-70kg depends on height and skill level,
There are formula racers in the NSW series who are hardcore and are exceptions to the above. Respect to Tibor! : )
Also not necessary to go for 4-5 cam race sails.


3. Racing: if you want to get into the arms race, 2 to 3 sails. 4-5 cam race sails


Gestalt, NSW Race Series, the formula workhorse is the 11 metre.


Cheers Nathan

i think you are not giving enough credit to small sails on formula boards. they certainly go more then slightly upwind and downwind. agree that the big gear can outpoint the small gear but we are not talking sheep stations and the question was about a formula rig to maximise TOW.

the "BIG" problem with formula gear is the massive cost with the gear. you don't need to outlay a massive cost to enjoy formula. on my 8.5m i can plane in 8 knots.

the same boom i use on my 8.5 fits my 6.4m sail also.

yeah i got a 10.8m sail but affording a $1000-1500 mast and $1000-1500 boom for the use with one rig is pointless.

mates of mine (lightweights) use 7m raf sails on formula boards and cruise all day on the ocean.

when we actually had a formula series in qld the 10-10.5 was a very popular size. it's still comfortable and the mast and boom is a whole lot cheaper than that needed for a 11m and up.

There are a few people in Sydney who use formula boards, especially older ones, with sails around the 7 to 8.5 meter range. They seem to go alright. Not sure if I could own one myself. I would need to buy a bigger van.

Well I mostly use a 131 carve atm with my biggest sail being a 8.5 NP V8 but I am 95Kgs so realistically my minimum planing wind is 14-15knots. You talked about using a 8.5 on a formula, would it lower my planing wind with the same sail and by how much do you think? I guess the other advantage of just changing the board would be pointing up and down right?

If I could increase my sailing time by a lot by just changing the board, thus saving a ton of cash it would be worth it.

G'day Gestalt, I was answering the question as below......

Leman : "Question to you formula sailors: how much to get set up with a decent board and massive sail rig."




G'day Leman

Yes formula eqiupment is expensive, but it is not necessary to buy 100% Carbon.


Retail Maui Sail Aluminium Boom 230-280: $349 (suit MS-2 11 metre 273cm)
11 metre sails. 3 years old: start about +$500
Masts: $###. (buying a race sail, get a new mast)
Carbon boom 3-4years: $600+
Formula Boards 3 years old: +$900
Also get a adjustable outhaul: approx $125.
Assumptions: the second hand gear is in good-fair condition.

Cheers Nathan

As a comparison:

I have an older Starboard Formula 186. I think this was the first of the 100cm wide ones and was quickly superseded in the same year by the 186X so it was still in fast development. It is not even wood construction but is plenty light enough. The first time I sailed one the same I was sailing my light wind slalom board of about 130 litres with a powerful 6.5m sail but the wind dropped to less than 12 knots and I could not keep planing. I pulled into the beach and a friend offered me a go on his Formula with 8.5m sail. I accepted but decided to try my 6.5 instead (such a 'huge' 8.5m sail freaked me out back then ). I was astounded that as soon as I stepped on the board I was planing easily after 1 pump. Not only that, I was able to sail upwind and downwind at will. Remember, this was with the exact same sail that wouldn't even get me planing on my large slalom board!
Conclusion (since backed up by numerous other similar experiences:
When conditions get marginal, switching to a much bigger formula type board is much more of and advantage than switching to a bigger sail.
A couple of years ago a picked up the same model board second hand for $500 in great condition. I have had endless hours of fun ever since on days less than 10-11 knots when no slalom boards could sail at all. First with a 8.4m KA Koyote camless sail and later with a 9m KA Koncept. With these sails I can easily cruise up and downwind in 8-9 knots+ (perhaps slightly less)

But,

When my friend Mat comes down with his modern Formula board and state of the art 10.8m rig with carbon mast, boom and adjustable everything (picked up for a bargain price BTW, after an international race in Melb. from a broke top French racer ) he does out run me upwind and downwind. Not by a huge amount though, and if he fluffs a tack occasionally it can be enough for me to stay with him for a while. Clearly for racing performance/competitiveness you need the mega rig, but for light wind fun where you don't have to get the last few degrees up and down wind there is very little in it and you would probably hardly notice the difference.

I can run the 8.4 on a 490 80% mast and alu boom. Not that expensive. The 9m Koncept does require a 520 mast but I still use a $250 alu boom and it is fine. Actually, it doesn't make much difference for cruising to even use my 7.5m Koncept which rigs on a standard 460 mast!

Once you get the the 8-9 knot mark or thereabouts, you need another couple of thousand $ worth of gear to lower the wind minimum by each 1 knot step. Not much different from how it's always been but back in the early '90's the big $ threshold was more like 15 knots. Thats big progress I recon!

My 2c:

I took out a 111l carve and a 7.2 KA Koyote last weekend (and a shiny new MFC 42cm Liquid Pro) and got planing in what couldn't have been more than a 13 knot gust or two. Once I was planing it was all go.

- I think the issue is getting planing more than anything else. Someone needs to invent some sort of boost system. Maybe a discardable kite?
edit: maybe a jet-ski?

Also I pump & jump the board onto the plane. Actually if I'm feeling really lazy and it's slightly marginal I just wiggle the board onto the plane with my feet, a bit like the side to side when getting an overladen powerboat onto the plane.

- Anyone else do this? Can you do that with a formula board?

God those formula rigs are huge.

You don't need a 520 mast; I run my 9.8m V8 on a 490 with 50cm carbon extender. I think the whole rig cost me...hmmm...old sail 150, old carbon boom 150, old mast 50, new carbon extender 150. That's $500, plus 300 for an old Starboard Free Formula 159. This is in Singapore dollars, which are suddenly worth more than Aussie dollars, (WTF?) but it's still cheap.

This is a desperation early planing rig, not a racing engine, so it's ok to go el cheapo. I reckon the higher the wind you're looking at, the better quality gear you need. Luckily smaller gear tends to cost less so it evens out somewhat.

Thanks Sailquick, Evlpanda and Wet Willy you pretty much told me what I want to hear. Formula board will extend my low wind planing considerably! Be a while before I even think about another rig. Funnily enough I use a 520 NP x6 mast for my 8.5 sail. The guy at SHQ cut off about 5 cms. Unfortunately my extention has been stuck in it for a year, close to zero chance of getting it out now so I cannot extend it.

Wet Willy it seems you got an amazing deal, lucky to get standard size rig for that price.

Anyway once I finish saving for my trip to Thailand I looking into saving for a second hand formula.

Also Panda, I've sometimes done a little foot push and pull while hooked in which gets me planing. Unsure whether it works because of my feet or the slight sail pumping effect from the harness.

Thanks again guys.

Hi Leman,

i'm 95Kg+ and plane in 8 knots on my formula board and 8.5m sail. 2-3 pumps needed in 8 knts. just hook in in 10 knots.

by 10 knots i am fully powered.

my sail is an 8.5m KA race. my favourite of all my sails.

the NP V8 is a very gutsy sail so i reckon it is great for whay you want.

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Gestalt said...

Hi Leman,

i'm 95Kg+ and plane in 8 knots on my formula board and 8.5m sail. 2-3 pumps needed in 8 knts. just hook in in 10 knots.

by 10 knots i am fully powered.

my sail is an 8.5m KA race. my favourite of all my sails.

the NP V8 is a very gutsy sail so i reckon it is great for whay you want.

hmmm 8 knots hey Gesty

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vando said...

Gestalt said...

Hi Leman,

i'm 95Kg+ and plane in 8 knots on my formula board and 8.5m sail. 2-3 pumps needed in 8 knts. just hook in in 10 knots.

by 10 knots i am fully powered.

my sail is an 8.5m KA race. my favourite of all my sails.

the NP V8 is a very gutsy sail so i reckon it is great for whay you want.

hmmm 8 knots hey Gesty

of course my wind gauge could be mistaken....

forgot to say leman, if you do get a formula board make sure you get a decent 70cm deboichet fin. 2ndhand they are around $200