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I'm not sure what's going on with the air vent setup on a board I've just picked up. It seems the insert part doesn't have a hole in the bottom. Is that how they're made, so they get drilled later? And JP has forgotten to drill this one?

The plug part when screwed in sits about 2mm above the deck because the end of the plug (the threaded part) hits the bottom of the insert. The o-ring stops a mm or 2 short of seating. Because there's no hole, presumably there's no problem as far as letting in water, but the vent can't vent air. Does that all make sense?

sounds like a right royal stuff up, I'd take it back, needs a new vent plug properly installed!
Like you say, vent is drilled after it's glued in otherwise vent fills with glue. As the plug didn't seat, they didn't drill it. Fine until you blow the bottom off!

Yeah seen ones not drilled before but I reckon its very rare.
Even if it was not drilled out, should still seat properly. So seems you have two problems, definitely take it back

Looks like someone used fractions instead of decimals

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More info: it's a 2004 board. The previous owner noted that the plug was a few mm above deck but otherwise assumed it worked as normal. Despite presumably never having been vented, the board is in good condition, no delaminations.

I've learned from you guys that plugs come with a solid bottom that needs to be drilled when the board is made. But I don't get why in this case the bolt part hits the base of the insert - I've checked a few other boards and one has a small hole drilled in the base, which means the whole base didn't need to be removed with a drill for the o-ring to seat. Another board had the whole base gone (you could see an open path through to the foam), which seems to me a bit odd because there'd be a risk of damaging the thread of the insert when drilling.

Anyhow I'm mainly asking out of curiosity, to understand what's going on. For practical purposes it seems I can either:

1. Leave it as is - waterproof but unable to vent air. It seems to have worked for 17 years, though I'm a plug in and (partway) out guy.

2. Drill it, but I'd have to drill the whole base out (so the o-ring can go down far enough to seat), drilling carefully so the thread isn't damaged. (Or find/make a shorter plug ... )

Drill Small hole in the bottom and shorten the screw So it goes in

Take pics and send to JP saying what you want to do, then if they say go ahead then warrenty will still be good

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Ben1973 said..
Take pics and send to JP saying what you want to do, then if they say go ahead then warrenty will still be good

Warranty on a 2004 board?

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sboardcrazy said..

Ben1973 said..
Take pics and send to JP saying what you want to do, then if they say go ahead then warrenty will still be good

Warranty on a 2004 board?

Opps missed the 2004 bit

Friday arvo beer oclock special at Cobra??

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sboardcrazy said..

Ben1973 said..
Take pics and send to JP saying what you want to do, then if they say go ahead then warrenty will still be good

Warranty on a 2004 board?

If it's lived for 17 years without venting , why start now .?

If it is a 2004 board my 'take it back' comments are not so valid lol
I've had vent screws that were not so flat on the bottom and/or the insert had a bit of a taper in the area below the thread, so they didn't quite seat.

YOU CAN'T correct that by drilling as you will touch the thread in the insert.

Drill very carefully thru with a 3-4mm bit, no bigger. Then push a screwdriver thru gently to make sure you hit styro and not the bottom.
Try a different screw to see if it seats. If no shops nearby or its windy today lol:
File the bottom of the screw flat being careful not to stuff up the start of the thread. See if it will then seat the o-ring properly.

If neither works, the insert has a bit of an internal taper below the thread and you may as well fill it, up or replace insert. The screw won't help. If the board that old its not worth the insert replacement job, so I'd fill the top 10mm or so with surf wax. No water can get in, but in theory if there is enough pressure inside the stuff the board up, it would blow the wax first.

I would do all this - as just cos it didn't delam, doesn't mean it won't one hot day....

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Thanks Mark.

Going by our experiences there must be a lot of dodgy vents out there, with people screwing them in and out every session for nothing because the insert is sealed, and exposing them to more harmful temperatures/pressures in the mistaken thought they're venting.

Or others where the insert has been drilled but the o-ring can't seat, so water gets in, whether or not they're screwing it in and out.

Most of the inserts I've seen have been fully drilled - seems like they're risking damaging the insert's thread for no reason, unless the reason is so the o-ring can seat, strange ...

^^ No you have got it all wrong. They are not risking damaging anything.
Read my post well.

The insert is glued in, then they drill a hole - it is only to vent air, so a 0.5mm drill would be fine.

If you drill a 1-4mm hole in the bottom, and the screw will still not seat the o-ring..... you have a very major problem.

Yeah you only need a tiny hole for air, and the smaller the better to keep any stray water out, though I suppose a pinhole could get blocked by something.
My point was why do they drill it bigger than just a few mm - most of the ones I've seen have no trace of the base of the insert remaining. I originally imagined that was because the insert would be moulded without a base (i.e. open, so it didn't need drilling), but as you and Decrepit said, they have a base so the glue doesn't block the insert.

just wack a 4mm drill bit through the bottom of the insert, its what you do when you build a board, you can even go 5mm past the end of the insert so you get to fresh styro foam.

Or just leave it, been heaps of boards without vent plugs survive just fine.

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Mark _australia said..
^^ No you have got it all wrong. They are not risking damaging anything.
Read my post well.

The insert is glued in, then they drill a hole - it is only to vent air, so a 0.5mm drill would be fine.

If you drill a 1-4mm hole in the bottom, and the screw will still not seat the o-ring..... you have a very major problem.

It would be easy enough to grind some of the length off the screw.

Gotta get to the bottom of this ...
I checked 3 more boards and the bottoms of the insert are totally not there (I've only ever seen one board where there was an obvious (small) drill hole in the bottom). It doesn't make sense if it's true as stated above, that they come with bottoms that need drilling after gluing the insert in the board, because I can't imagine how it could be done without damaging the thread of the insert. I suspect some inserts come with bottoms (that require (small) drilling, preferably once the insert is in the board), and some are made open. But that doesn't help much ...

To confuse things further ... if the thread was made after the insert is in the board i.e. cut by the screw, as for example you do with footstraps screws, that could explain things somewhat, but I doubt that happens.

Btw, one of the boards had been drilled about 2 inches into the styro, the others only a few mm.

The vent plug is usually built in to the deck box, sometime they are two separate inserts, yes they all have no hole drilled into it or resin would squeeze into the bottom of the plug hole and into the thread, yes the thread is molded into the plastic before they go into the board, how far into the board they drill the hole is up to the little Taiwanese guy drilling the hole.

Yes you can just drill a hole in yourself if you want it in there.

If you want to freak people out, don't drill it out and don't put the vent plug in when you go sailing so when people on the beach see the plug missing they will freak out thinking you forgot it and filled the board with water.. have seen this before on a custom board, its quite funny.

^^
Unless there is a tiny hole.

slightly off topic but can the gore vent plugs be unscrewed and a normal one put in.

Goretex is a larger diam, easy to seal the gortex and insert a standard holder

Thanks P.C., good reply, but the mystery of the large/full diameter hole remains - we've established that the hole is made after the insert is glued in (and the thread is already there), so how do they make the hole without damaging the thread?

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decrepit said..
Goretex is a larger diam, easy to seal the gortex and insert a standard holder

so it can be unscrewed?

im actually thinking about fitting a gore valve to a starboard, if its bigger then I might just be able to tap the old insert to the bigger size. and use the plug from a old board or maybe just buy a new one

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wendell said..
Thanks P.C., good reply, but the mystery of the large/full diameter hole remains - we've established that the hole is made after the insert is glued in (and the thread is already there), so how do they make the hole without damaging the thread?

Prob with a smooth sided bit that only has say 1-2mm of cutter on the end? They have all sorts of special tooling to make it easy for unskilled labourers

Good work, that's the type of creative answer we need. But it leaves the question of why not just drill a small hole. The only thing I can think of is to safeguard against bolts that are too long for the insert, as in the example of my board where you could think you have tightened it, but the o-ring isn't seated i.e. good way to ruin a board. But that doesn't feel like the real reason they drill big ...

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Ben1973 said.. >>>so it can be unscrewed?

Yep, but you have to be careful, the visible hex head of the plug is only joined to the body by very thin posts, and they snap off very easy. This leaves the gortex unprotected. you need to try and work on the deep base of the plug rather than the top. But that's difficult as it's the same size hex head and there's only a very narrow gap to fit a tube spanner in.
I have a vague memory of thinking of doing a similar thing, but the standard plug I had was too small to drill out far enough.
I don't recommend there use anyway. If you get moisture in the board it can block the plug from breathing in both directions. I've had a couple of boards in for repair, with bottoms blown off for no apparent reason, that had gortex vents. And there's also reports of water getting in boards with gortex vents. Saying that I put them in two of my boards without a problem.