Hello interested Windsurfers,

Neil Scheltema has spent the last 3 years developing some new technology that I believe is going to make a lot of windsurfers very happy.

Mistral saw the potential and have jumped on board.

Neil Scheltema and myself have been collaborating with Mistral on a video to describe why this system has so much potential.

The "free Speed" category boards are done and are popping out of production as we speak. Neil is currently in Europe launching the board range and VRTS system (which has been heavily patented and protected due to how much awesome it can bring to the sport)

From my couple of hours sailing it the Prototype (which has gone into production) 64cm wide / 104 litre Free speed Board gybes better than my current wave board. Its totally ridiculous how loose it is.

The prototype board feels incredibly easy to attack speed in chop on due to the smart entry rocker , board length (slightly more water line) and auto trim / release that the VRTS delivers.

While its not aimed squarely at the racing market -I would love to see what a dedicated racer could pull off with this board as i suspect the accessible speed through bumps could be quite revolutionary. Mistral are more interested in exposing everyday freeriders and "Free racers" to a board that is fast, easy to sail and yet gybes incredibly well.

We are currently working on putting this system into some wave boards - imagine being able to flatten out or progressively add tail rocker to your wave board till it feels just right - I am confident we can get a wave board that simply does the 2 things a good wave board should - sail fast and turn well. While handling a huge range of wave sizes.

For all of us who were around in the Windtech glory days (when windtech ruled the world) Its great to see Neil boosted and blending curves with his master skills.




I dare to speculate that there will be some production demos for people to try in Australia in a month or 2.

Sad to see Mistral have abandoned Chris Lockwood and his excellent designs. They are some of the best slalom boards I have ever ridden and his speedboard holds the record for production boards. The only reason Mistral weren't more successful with them is they had no money to invest in marketing and distribution, it was all run on a shoestring...and a very short one at that. There wasn't even a distributor in North America where Mistral was previously extremely successful. This new board looks like a rehash of the Challenge Flex from the late 80s. It didn't do too well back then. I'm not sure if this new gimmick will do any better. They had great designs by Chris, shame they have given up on them and him.

Neil designed and built fantastic boards in his Windtech days.
Hey every windsurfer in WA must have owned one in the nineties.
So don't brush this off he is probably onto something.

Yeah, Tinkler Tail in 1976.

Looks, reads and sounds really interesting, theory makes sense to me, I guess the proof is always in the pudding, and in this case possibly what the GPS numbers say also!
It's a really bold move especially if the business is pinning all hopes on it, so with that said I have a feeling that perhaps it really does work as well as described!
If it's comfy, fast, planes early, easy to gybe what's not to like, more than happy to be your QLD test pilot.

It does look like the tinker tail. I wonder if the drag from the join and gaps out weigh the benefits of flex. Bring back Chris and get a decent distribution in place.

They straight up acknowledge that it's an old idea. They're not claiming a "revolutionary new concept". And that's a first for a windsurfing company.

"A key area of board design which has been addressed and considered since the 1980s, concerns the notion of an adjustable degree of tail rocker, an adjustable width and even a flexible tail, all with varied end-goals from improving control, flat-line speed, smoothness of ride, speed of rising to the plane, increasing range of rider weight optimums and more besides. "



"History Brings Mistral Full CircleThe first flex-tail concept was invented and patented by Mike Tinkler in the 80s, known simply as the Tinkler Tail, which sparked our imaginations of what could be and why the sport needed such a system. The patent for the Tinkler system, was subsequently acquired by Mistral, who created a production flex-tail with exchangeable tails, named the, Challenge Flex, in the late 1980s. It featured a series of springs to cushion the ride and had a degree of adjustability and was available as an 8’8 and a 9’2. "

http://www.mistral.com/blog/2016/01/freespeed-vrts
mistral.app.box.com/s/1rj7mwzbj97vykrkf4v7dhamiaqr7ors

Looks very interesting I would love to give it a go!
Ps I'm pretty sure Neil is the Stig

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Roo said..
Sad to see Mistral have abandoned Chris Lockwood and his excellent designs. They are some of the best slalom boards I have ever ridden and his speedboard holds the record for production boards. The only reason Mistral weren't more successful with them is they had no money to invest in marketing and distribution, it was all run on a shoestring...and a very short one at that. There wasn't even a distributor in North America where Mistral was previously extremely successful. This new board looks like a rehash of the Challenge Flex from the late 80s. It didn't do too well back then. I'm not sure if this new gimmick will do any better. They had great designs by Chris, shame they have given up on them and him.

I am certain that the designs by Chris will be used again by another innovative brand quite soon. Stand by..........

Neil says the same sorts of things about board length as Chris Lockwood.
Maybe what we have is a blending of the work of two good shapers. Chris used to talk about tail rocker as a trimming device. It does a job similar to cut outs. You'd expect a flexible tail rocker might not only provide less drag but allow more rocker when you need it.
Anyway it looks like its not just a gimmick.

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Reflex Films said..
Hello interested Windsurfers,

Neil Scheltema has spent the last 3 years developing some new technology that I believe is going to make a lot of windsurfers very happy.

Mistral saw the potential and have jumped on board.

Neil Scheltema and myself have been collaborating with Mistral on a video to describe why this system has so much potential.

The "free Speed" category boards are done and are popping out of production as we speak. Neil is currently in Europe launching the board range and VRTS system (which has been heavily patented and protected due to how much awesome it can bring to the sport)

From my couple of hours sailing it the Prototype (which has gone into production) 64cm wide / 104 litre Free speed Board gybes better than my current wave board. Its totally ridiculous how loose it is.

The prototype board feels incredibly easy to attack speed in chop on due to the smart entry rocker , board length (slightly more water line) and auto trim / release that the VRTS delivers.

While its not aimed squarely at the racing market -I would love to see what a dedicated racer could pull off with this board as i suspect the accessible speed through bumps could be quite revolutionary. Mistral are more interested in exposing everyday freeriders and "Free racers" to a board that is fast, easy to sail and yet gybes incredibly well.

We are currently working on putting this system into some wave boards - imagine being able to flatten out or progressively add tail rocker to your wave board till it feels just right - I am confident we can get a wave board that simply does the 2 things a good wave board should - sail fast and turn well. While handling a huge range of wave sizes.

For all of us who were around in the Windtech glory days (when windtech ruled the world) Its great to see Neil boosted and blending curves with his master skills.




I dare to speculate that there will be some production demos for people to try in Australia in a month or 2.

Very bouncy ride just just like the Mistral " Challenge Flex" was.

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Roo said..
Sad to see Mistral have abandoned Chris Lockwood and his excellent designs. They are some of the best slalom boards I have ever ridden and his speedboard holds the record for production boards. The only reason Mistral weren't more successful with them is they had no money to invest in marketing and distribution, it was all run on a shoestring...and a very short one at that. There wasn't even a distributor in North America where Mistral was previously extremely successful. This new board looks like a rehash of the Challenge Flex from the late 80s. It didn't do too well back then. I'm not sure if this new gimmick will do any better. They had great designs by Chris, shame they have given up on them and him.

Exactly my thoughts!

Here's a thread from 2013 referencing the flex tail.

www.seabreeze.com.au/forums/Windsurfing/General/Interesting-tail-concept-trim-tabs/

So is mistral doing away with Chris's slalom range altogether?

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JonesySail said..
...theory makes sense to me....

Unless I am mistaken, I dont think I heard any description of what it is actively doing - which means it isn't a theory. [ I only heard "makes everything better", but not how it does that. ]

I would be interested to know what it is actively trying to do... as far as I can tell, it appears to be a flap of carbon - which means that it is likely to have negative-rocker from the connection point, to the bolt (unless it is quite thick - thus heavy).

It does remind me of the "scoop" thing that was meant to make the board plane earlier...

I am surprised to see that.
I am used to believe (please correct me if I am wrong!!!) that each one of the different design features of a board (such as rockerline, outline, rail shape, cutouts, ...) have to blend harmoniously with the others. So now instead we have a board in which just the rockerline can be changed, while all of the others stay the same?!?
Funnily, to get that chance you have to deal with a carbon plate, a row of screws to keep it in place and then an adjusting screw. Do we have to assume all those extra parts will never give any troubles on the beach? Expecially considering the plate is moving all of the time, continuously tensioning and releasing the screws?
Plus, the video shows what looks like an extremely bouncy ride even in what looks like not such bad chop. Which is exactly what you would expect when you have a flexy tail, thus releasing waterflow when the nose of the boards point up; instead of a stiff one, which would make pressure rise in the tail when the nose points up thus leveling the ride. Ah, but the board will jibe like a waveboard ... who cares ...
More, previous designs from CL (which I own and do not intend to change) seem to me are really a breakthrough as have an incredibly smooth ride in chop AND extremely high speed potential (CL passed 40 knots on all of them, including the 82 cms wide one!!!) with no need to change or adjust parts. The only one think they left wishing, in my view, is some lighter weight; but on the other hand the boards are incredibly tough, and I also think one could shave several 100 grams off by just finishing them in a simpler way (instead of fully coloured deck and bottom and high gloss finish).

Bah. In my personal view, the m° guys are killing the brand. A real pity. I hope I am wrong and I will change idea one day. For now, I am glad to read what AJEaster writes.

I guess this is a proto, but Mistral better come up with an idea to prevent the adjusting screw going through the carbon plate.
And if it's hand adjustable (as seen on vid) won't the vibrations make it move ? To the risk of loosing your setting, or even loose the screw ??

I'll get the Mistral/Chris Lockwood issue out of the way first, Chris is a great designer and will succeed because what he designs works as intended.

Now this Variable rocker bizzness? Leaving hydrodynamic theory aside, a shock absorber system on a windsurfer is a great idea for us riders who are getting older and bodies don't work as well anymore. So, if it softens the ride without degrading performance its a bloody good idea. Neil Sch is a wise man of windsurfing and deserves some respect.

I the end the market will decide, I think the consumer will have to feel a noticeable difference to invest in the product though.

A lot of us older riders are looking for flatter and flatter water to sail on, one reason being its easier on the body, you can sail longer and enjoy more.

Formula 1 cars (early nineties) had 'active suspension'. Suspension adjusted on the fly, by computer, driver or pit crew, matching conditions fuel load etc...

It all became too complex and expensive to fathom a cars running gear. Active suspension was outlawed. Honda adapted, sourcing suspension from 'Ohlins', who made their name motor cycle racing. Lap times in testing dropped by 2 seconds, with Ohlins analogue suspension.

Rocket science can't compensate for flawed design. Gps just got interesting for me.

I find the level of pessimism here a bit much. Yeah, so far it is all advertising hype but if Neil is involved, 3yrs testing, and good enough for Mistral to pick it up it must have something in it. It must do something well. Yes we have all seen the tinkler tail before and Mistral even brought it into production. Therefore it has a LOT of development behind it because they have done it before. So having seen it all before is not necessarily a bad thing?

Then Matt who has no monetary interest or anything and was just making the video reckons it rides great - he's already made the video he doesn't have to try and sell the product too....so I'd believe him over a sponsored rider.
I'd love to try one.

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Mark _australia said..
I find the level of pessimism here a bit much. Yeah, so far it is all advertising hype but if Neil is involved, 3yrs testing, and good enough for Mistral to pick it up it must have something in it. It must do something well. Yes we have all seen the tinkler tail before and Mistral even brought it into production. Therefore it has a LOT of development behind it because they have done it before. So having seen it all before is not necessarily a bad thing?

Then Matt who has no monetary interest or anything and was just making the video reckons it rides great - he's already made the video he doesn't have to try and sell the product too....so I'd believe him over a sponsored rider.
I'd love to try one.

Its not really "pessimism"... just that nobody likes being on the butt-end of a gimmick. Which is why I'd really like to hear some technically-sound explanation of what it brings to the table ...err water.

Note that in the video, there was one thing said which did have some merit... depending on whom you talk to, the size of the wake is a measure of energy being lost into the water. It could be said that if that wake was small/smooth (say not rooster-tailed), there would be more energy delivered into forward motion. However, the clip didn't really indicate whether it was better/worse, as there wasn't a side-by-side comparison.

Just my two cents worth.l have watched the vid about this adjustable tail rocker.looks like it could work in a variety of water conditions.Neil sounds like a pro who eats sleeps & drinks this sport.lve been waiting for a new innovation on boards for years.so far all we get is product designers changing the tail then another manufacturer copies it or changes it.personally l think Neils idea might work or not either way it will be a hard sell .

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mathew said...
...
Note that in the video, there was one thing said which did have some merit... depending on whom you talk to, the size of the wake is a measure of energy being lost into the water. It could be said that if that wake was small/smooth (say not rooster-tailed), there would be more energy delivered into forward motion. ...

I think you can't avoid some "rooster tail" if water and hull are exchanging forces (resulting in hull being lifted up, and water being pushed down, therefore forming a "hole" in the wake which gets filled again at some distance from the tail). This happens ideally; then one may apply some "brake" by pushing the tail down, which forms a larger "rooster tail", but this is something related to control in my view rather than to efficiency.
More, when sailing overpowered, efficiency is not a problem by definition (you have available more power than you can handle to the point you have to shed some).

I believe Neil is a pro dedicated to our sport, nevertheless I see there are a huge lot of other dedicated pros around that don't hit the center 100% every time they do something new (to say the least). So, I am waiting for a sound technical explanation; in the meantime, I will stay skeptical.

Ok first up I haven't watched the video, I've run out of data for this month. I met Neil in the 90's, a bloody nice bloke who was/is at the very top of his game, I sincerely hope this venture works for him. But and sorry if I sound like a pessimist, I have enough trouble with fin size, mast base position, out and down haul, boom hight and harness lines, now I'd have to work out the right tail rocker, I think Lookwood probably had it right straight up.

Lockwood's such a nice guy and a very good designer every thing windsurfing, I certainly hope Mistral hasn't given him the flick and the adjustable tail rocker is just another Mistral line.

But hey I thought kitsurfing and paddle boarding wouldn't take off so what do I know, just my thoughts guys, be kind with the red thumbs

Baaahahaaaa, I think you have all been sucked into the manufacturers business hype hook line and sinker.

Good point Mathew (that there is no tech info) but I must say that sometimes when something just works, the 'why' is so damn technical there is no point including it.

EG if you draw pictures with vectors about sail twist half the people still don't get why you need a different angle up there to down here. This would be 10x more complex.

Proof will be in the sailing I think...

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lotofwind said..
Baaahahaaaa, I think you have all been sucked into the manufacturers business hype hook line and sinker.

Thanks for your deep analytical insight loto. I'm sure we'll all take careful note of it.

Still one big problem that Mistral haven't addressed...where can you buy the board. They have no importer in Australia or the US currently yet they have gone to all this effort launch the VRTS. Even the in the UK and a few other European countries there are no importers or shops to buy the boards from. Without a good distribution system any product is doomed to failure. It seems this is a product driven by a marketing department that knows how to write PR BS but can't set up a distribution system. SUP and fashion seem to be the focus of most of Mistral's efforts currently.

When the original challenge flex was launched Mistral were at the top of their game, they had multiple world championships to their credit, Robby Naish on their books and were the number 1 windsurfing company. Flush with funds they launched the board yet it still failed in the marketplace. Not sure with their limited resources and distribution they can hope to do any better this time.

It's curious few people have ridden the VRTS and reported on its performance. You'd think being based out of Perth, it would have been thoroughly tested and some GPS numbers posted on it by now. If it's as good as the PR blurb you'd want as many people to try it as possible and get some buzz on the beach for it. Will be interesting to see it go head to head with one of Chris Lockwood's Mistral designs to see how effective it is.

Looks like witchcraft have been doing similar to their wave boards for quite a few years now.





From this page witchcraft.nu/boards/flex-tail/

"A Flex Tail has a flat static rocker and gets more rocker when needed. The first Flextail was invented and patented by Mike Tinkler in the 80´s. The patent was bought by Mistral who brought out a production flex tail with exchangable tails, the Challenge Flex. However it never caught on and disappeared after a year again. More shapers including myself made various attempts in different variations of the concept over the years but all disappeared again. In 2010, wanting to make a new light wind wave board, I was again confronted with the dilemma of the amount of rocker and this got me rethinking the flex tail. I remembered the versions I made before in the 80´s and 90´s with a flexible plate sometimes gave strange effects, not wanting to turn but break out. So maybe such a flexible plate maybe did not flex in the right direction and twisted rather than giving more rocker. So I thought I should make it so it could only bend in one direction by making “hinges”. By cutting wedges out of the deck I could also limit the amount each wedge could flex to stop it from breaking. The first prototype worked quite well. After filming with a Go Pro on the tail I noticed it flexed less than expected so started to make it more and more flexible, getting better results. Attempts to adjust the flex by air pressure failed, too complicated. And basically it worked good as it was. A few other problems occurred with other sailors. When freestyling in waves and sliding backwards down a wave, the tail catches and wants to bend down and broke the tail right off where before it was lasting fine. So we put a strap on the top to stop the tail flexing down.How does it work?When getting planing, you give mast foot pressure and lean forward, the tail stays straight and gives more lift without drag. As long as you are hooked in, you are applying more pressure on the mast foot. When you unhook, your weight on your feet increases, the tail starts to flex. When you enter a turn, G-forces increase the pressure on the tail and bends more to turn tight without increasing drag, it feels like you accelerate in the turn. In a top turn, the sail helps to give more pressure on your back foot so give the most rocker and tightest turn. Basically the flex tail works by itself, the way we sail with a normal board makes a flex tail work, increasing the normal movements we make increases the effects of the flex tail .SummaryA flex tail is the ideal light wind wave board, it planes like a free wave and turns like a full on wave board. It is more forgiving and allows for mistakes. It is like having 2 boards in one. In theory all this is beneficial for any board but there are also some downsides:-Price-Durability in rough conditions.-slight delay in reaction against a highly rockered wave boardA flex tail is not needed when:– tight turning is not important like in flat water sailing, B&J.-early planing is not important, for example if the wind is strong enough to plane well with a more rockered board or if the wind is so light in float n ride conditions that you would not be planing on a flex tail either.-it is not suitable for freestyle.If these restrictions are not relevant, the flex tail is brilliant and we have customers who also have their medium and high wind boards with a flex tail."

You think Mistral won't have a distribution strategy ready to launch? C'mon, seriously..

someone mentioned the complexity/difficulty of finding trim via mast base, fin..etc and the adjustment on the tail would add confusion..it won't. You don't have to touch the dial, it's a plug & play system with the option of further refinement. Remember that half the time you are having trim problems because of the difference in sail designs and the combined performance of the sail and the tail rocker.
Just ask the top end guys with sail sponsors that struggled with Windtech's race boards. Gaastra's leeches were a little tighter than say, NP...problem. VRTS all but eliminated that problem.

So you like cutaway? Think they are cool? Well they do go some way to improving the problems caused by widening and shortening boards. Too much tail pressure at speed bringing the nose down and preventing good trim. I won't start on the huge amount of work done on fins to also try and find that trim-ability. The VRTS goes the best part of the way to eliminating the cutaway.
What it also does is essentially/virtually shorten the boards tail, in effect. Most top shapers will know(I'm not one..I was taught by one) that the part of the tail behind the fin is useless for trim or speed - it's just unwanted drag - and it's only role is to prevent ventilation to the trailing edge of the fin and the resultant cavitation and spin-out. VRTS eliminates the static section of tail, therefore drag, but maintains separation between air and fin. Problem solved.

The carbon plate it durable, also readily replaceable. There is such a fine tolerance in its fitment, the gap is virtually eliminated. Compared to the poorly fitting Tuttle heads and ragged fins most people sail with...there is no issue here.

Full circle indeed - any shaper worth their salt will breath a sigh of relieve that they don't have to stand on the beach and in their shaping bays and beds scratching their heads looking cutaways and wondering..'WTF?'

Ps - Mr Mistral, please put my name on the top of the production list. Kind regards, MOB

The OP did mention that this board was in a 'Freespeed' category, so one would assume that it wouldn't be competing with the Mistral slalom line.

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AJEaster said...

Roo said..
Sad to see Mistral have abandoned Chris Lockwood and his excellent designs. They are some of the best slalom boards I have ever ridden and his speedboard holds the record for production boards. The only reason Mistral weren't more successful with them is they had no money to invest in marketing and distribution, it was all run on a shoestring...and a very short one at that. There wasn't even a distributor in North America where Mistral was previously extremely successful. This new board looks like a rehash of the Challenge Flex from the late 80s. It didn't do too well back then. I'm not sure if this new gimmick will do any better. They had great designs by Chris, shame they have given up on them and him.

I am certain that the designs by Chris will be used again by another innovative brand quite soon. Stand by..........

They will all get longer. The rocker is not new..it's about 27yrs old it exists in a slalom board I watched Neil make for his partner at the time which she took to Maui and caned everyone with resulting in a spondorship offer from NP. The same rocker as a current Lockwood similar sized board.
Goes to show that Chris's software is very very good - it just didn't have a variable rocker application.
I love Chris' boards..I own one. I also love a flex tail..I own one that I made with Neil in 2013. Different design, same theory.
Goes good. Over 30kn in ocean chop I think only my 7th sail in 12 months. Didn't feel that fast - probably due to control...and definitely the KaRace sail and the Lockeood fin!!