Does everybody like quads apart from me?

I am 92kg. Just tried a quad 82L. I found it slow and draggy feeling whereas on my 85 litres single fin traditional board I was planing flat out.

I read reviews that suggest you can use more volume when sailing a quad and the tsered reckon that si great. But is it really the case that you have to use more volume to get away from that draggy slow to plane feeling?

I was thinking about a twin but the 2008 - 2009 models were not liked by many people due to that same slow stuck to the water feel and in some cases lack of upwind ability. Are they still like that?

Now I can see how these feel great on a wave but you have to be able to get there first, and when there is a wind shadow in the break it is a nightmare getting out and I missed jumps as a result.

So do I need a board with volume same as my weight (or even more)? When it is windy I can use a single fin 10L under my weight no problems. Do I need to totally rethink that for a multi fin board?

Comments on quads and twins in the last two model years?

Am about your weight at 93kg
When the wind is on, my preferred board is an 84lt twin fin
Have no issues with pointing upwind, planning on way out or getting enough speed for jumps.

Have not ridden a Quad set up on a wave board (yet) but have been ridding a quad surfboard for the last 4 years so it probably makes sense that I give one a shot.

Have lined up a couple of demos on 82 litre ish quads along with a 92

Am also interested in a light wind wave board (98 + liters) and keen to try the quads and thrusters in that size... But as I absolutely rate my 84 twin fin (have bought an extra one as a spare !!) the quads will have to be farking impressive for me to jump ship.

In the end it's horses for courses:
sure do the research, the reading and the asking of questions but in the end an actual test ride will provide you with the definitive answer of whether or not a board works for YOU

You say the 08 and 09 twins weren't rated highly ?
Rated by who ?
Have you ridden any ?
For my weight, height, ability, stance they are wicked and I would rate them VERY highly... For me !
I also recon the additional 2 liters makes a difference (82 lt twin vs 84lt twin... And yo are also comparing this against an 85lt single )
Here's something else to consider.
One year I bought a commodore wagon over a falcon wagon.
Why ?
the seat in the commodore went further back and at 6"4 that made a big difference to me
Horses for courses, test ride, test ride, test ride !

Thanks Kev that makes me feel a bit better about riding a smaller board.

As to the early twins being sticky / slow, I am talking about a range of reviews I have read about quite a few boards and it was mentioned enough times for me to take note. Then when I have had a few mates use earlier twins and modern quads and hate them, I am a bit cautious now.

Want to test but it is a bit hard when living out of Perth (and restricted to secondhand too )

You wanna demo all those boards here? Free accomodation if you do......

There's quads and there's quads.
The 2010 JP quad, which I just sold (another La Nina summer) planed freely, and went upwind well. The 2011 which I tried out in Maui was a sticky, draggy dog.
The difference was not the number of fins, but the tail rocker.
YMMV etc etc

I have a Fanatic quad and as a wave board it's the best board i've ever ridden, the speed/drive you can generate in a bottom turn and the angle you can cut back off the top far outweighs any single i've ridden. That said there is no doubt it feels 'draggy' compared to a single and doesn't seem to generate the same speed going out through the break. I think the main reason for this is that it has a fairly ridiculous amount of rocker, which is what makes it so good on the wave, but then compromises it in other areas.

I'm 70-72 kg and ride an 86L (mostly due to it being lighter on average in NSW) and when comparing it to the board it replaced ('07 83L JP RWW) I don't think the planing threshold is that much different, maybe a 1kt or so of wind but like I said before it doesn't 'release' and 'go' like a single. You can definitely ride a board of bigger volume as it certainly performs on a wave like a board of much much lower volume, which is good for where it's lighter on average.

Most of the quads' are now onto their 3rd iteration so are pretty damn good and I don't know of anyone who was disappointed with the Fanatics last season; judging by the number I saw down at the beach last summer it seems as though everyone bought one but as WW says if you're unsure it's definitely worth testing out as many as you can.

I find a single, being faster, keeps lots of speed on the wave. Do the quads and twins ride fast, or just turn real good and get more vertical?

I have a twin fin and it fangs down a wave, I clocked 33+ knots dtl at Gerroa.. Although that's my only trick, hit maximum speed and make a B-line dtl for the first lip to catapult off..

For that trick, Quads are a drag..

I don't think once you're on a wave the planing threshold is an issue, look at how much speed just a surfboard can generate on a wave and they don't have wind power as assistance. I also think that since you can drive the board so much harder through the bottom turn you are turning for less time = less speed loss. I only really notice the more draggy nature of the quad when out the back on the 'flat' water.

Mark,
"hard living out of Perth"! You guys get about 5 x 20-25 knot seabreezes a week. In lightwind NSW we get about 1.

it's a shame my wife knows how windy WA is so we have little chance of moving there!

^ haha, this.

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Mark _australia said...
When it is windy I can use a single fin 10L under my weight no problems.

Bit of a myth about perth being windy. By far my most used wave sail is a 6.0.
Quads are draggy. For the first time ever last season i missed a 10 ft margies bomb set wave
Because i couldnt get the top end speed through cross off chop that you need just to keep up with these freight trains. Never happened to
Me on a single.
But that same quad gave me some of the most exciting snaps and late reo airs i have ever had. Albeit on half mast and under. I have seen other brand quads with really fast rockerlines dominate the break for mobility. But i still think a single will handle the first scenario better.

Right now though i have found board nirvana- i belive this shape woul kill it with 1 ,2,3 or 4 fins

So Matt what are the faster rockered ones?
And do they still turn better than a single?

may have been yellow/ gold quattro looking things

never saw one do an amazing turn though
- but looked mobile as (ironing board rockerlines)

RRDs looked fast and turney too - purely judging on Ben Arthur's ridiculous mobility last season. That may have been a twin or 3 fin set up - cant be sure

Saw Scott lay down some monster gouges on his SB Quads / twin protos

Nudes were the most mobile - judging by Mr Severne's mobility and ridiculous surfing turns - thats the way i ended up going. (x2)

Obviously Jaeger was ripping on Stoney 3 fin set ups.

My 2c is that with muti finned boards the 1 board quiver is much harder to achieve unless you go more volume than you previously would.
I am still using an 09 Twin 84L (I'm 6'3" & 85kg) and I find it a pure pain in the @rse......plus the best board I've owned.
When the wind is a bit light on (5.7m) it refuses to track upwind, still planes quickly but will not go where I want it to, sticky, boggy and generally just crap - nothing like a single fin 84L I used to have. I have almost left it on the beach once after shouting at it and repeatedly flipping it the bird...!

On the flipside once the wind fills in (5.3m - 4.2m) it's got it all and I would not swap it for anything. In the past I would have been on a 78L single fin anyway but when powered the twin is lightyears in front. Best days sailing has been on this board.

If I was looking for a 1 board quiver I'd look to +5L on whatever I used to consider in a single - that said I have 2 boards.
That's my theory.



AB....

Arrgghhh now after reading replies here and lots of reviews I am just more undecided. I need to test 5 or 6 boards pronto!

I think maybe we are just going too short and over-rockered now.
The shortness to get reduced swing weight, has resulted in skittish boards that require concaves etc to tame them ...... but don't handle chop well.
Too much rocker to make the wave riding perfect, but at the expense of upwind performance and early planability.

That is why I asked - when the reviews state you can use a bigger board in a multifin setup ..... is it really the case that you have to use more volume .........?

Best board I have ever used is my 2008 RRD Wave Cult 85. Early planing for its size and tears waves up. You can still B&J it, and it has plenty of vee.
Dunno if I want something that rides waves soooo much better but I lose out on every other aspect of board performance.

My problems is probably that I want it all lol

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Big Al said...

I have almost left it on the beach once after shouting at it and repeatedly flipping it the bird...!


AB....

too funny1 reckon i have done this in the past a few times with boards that have spun out mid bottom -turn- always on a super sweet section that its taken half an hour to line up.

A good all rounder should be fast and loose. A good board is a good board no matter how many fins it has - i will always sacrifice a touch of looseness to keep a board fast. slow boards are punishment squared.

But now i dont have to!

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Reflex Films said...
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A good all rounder should be fast and loose. A good board is a good board no matter how many fins it has - i will always sacrifice a touch of looseness to keep a board fast. slow boards are punishment squared.

But now i dont have to!

Agreed. Seems the new school is the other way, sacrifice the speed for looseness, maybe we have freestyle to blame for that

When u say you now don't have to, I assume you refer to your Choppers?

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Mark _australia said...

Agreed. Seems the new school is the other way, sacrifice the speed for looseness, maybe we have freestyle to blame for that

Half the freestyle board have zero tail rocker, and they all haul ass.. The myth that they are slow was perhaps perpetuated by some of the early models and some FSWs.... But we can thank freestyle for killing nose kick.. God Damn nose kick sucks, I'm glad we won't see any 255cm Bananas Boats any time soon..

And yeah I reckon he is referring to the chopper..

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In the last couple of hours I got to make a decision on the number of fins in my latest monstrosity.. It was a pretty easy call, singles require a big fin, so never an option, and quads are too much work, "4 boxes? 4 fins? No thanks".. Twin fin ftw..

Why not thruster - so if you don't like it you have the single option.
Twin you have no options.

But yeah no more 1995 pointy nose with 2ft of it out of the water like a gondola - designed for putting holes in sails

I struggled to get the fanatic quad 86 going as well and found it pretty draggy, the thing is a freakin banana. Thou CJW seems to plane at the same time on it as I do on my 100L FS board with the same sail. Part of it is definitely down to technique!

I think fins also make a big difference as a lot of boards come with extremely rubbish fins. I now have a JP twin as my main waveboard and before I got some decent fins for it, it was a complete pig. Definately keen to try one of the nude choppers when I'm in WA this summer thou.

From what I can understand you go 5-10L larger on a multifin (in particular quads) to get the same low end planing ability as an equivalent single, but even being a tad bigger they maintain better control on the top end. It should mean that you can sail a floater board which you can stay on for longer when it really starts blowing. But some people skew the curve as they are just bloody talented and could get a surfboard planing in 15kts with a 3m sail (Kauli???). Anyway, being in WA you probably have the luxury of testing a lot of gear first.

Also FS boards are just straight out fast, top end as well. Just a bit hard to keep under control in the chop with inboard straps and considering most of them are 63-64cm wide.