... Or whatever I am.

Stuff I learnt/was thinking about today

1. Equipment - Buy the best you can. I spent months uphauling and trying to waterstart using an old rig where the mast would completely fill with water. This made the mast HEAVY as you can imagine and impossible. Buy stuff from at least this century.

2. Downhaul - My old mast was actually 5cm too short for the sail. When I added an extension it was a completely different sail. The other day I was out and the wind dropped to just enough/almost enough to plane so as an experiment i let off the downhaul about 5cm and adjusted outhaul accordingly. My sail instantly became heavy and very hard to handle, a completely different sail. Try it yourself one day. See the difference, it's amazing.

3. Waterstarting (I've got these now ) - Point a bit upwind, about 30-40 degrees. Everything I've read says to place the board parallel. I call bull****. If you're pointing a bit upwind (or at least the sail is, you can always spin the board around when you're up) you can control the power by sheeting in. If you're pointing parallel or a bit downwind sheeting in will turn you into a medieval weapon (that's a catapult).

4. Overall control - Again sheet in. Stay commited. It goes against what you instinctively want to do, sheet out to reduce power, but sheeting out causes the speed wobbles. Now you just have to deal with the excess speed.

5. Watch your board on dry land - sudden gusts from odd directions can turn your board into a kite.

6. Prepare to be addicted.

7. Persistance... have a 'never say die' attitude

8. Work 4 jobs (or find a rich widow to marry ) cos you will always be wanting to buy more and more gear. You will never have enough.

1.yes
2.yes
3.YES YES YES
4.yes
5.yes
6.TOO LATE.
7.yes
8.2 AT LEAST.

evlPanda, ya buggered now digger, you figured it out. then fun is kicking in big time for you now, and an empty wallet

There's a good reason why "drugs and windsurfing" never really took off...nobody can afford both!

Lost my $80 Sunnies...need a new harness...it never ends

dont try an put your feet into the straps until you are planning.

forward sommersault into the sail are fun.

Select to expand quote

evlPanda said...

Everything I've read says to place the board parallel. I call bull****. If you're pointing a bit upwind (or at least the sail is, you can always spin the board around when you're up) you can control the power by sheeting in. If you're pointing parallel or a bit downwind sheeting in will turn you into a medieval weapon (that's a catapult).

From one newbie to another.....I think the reference of parrallel is more suited for sinkers where you need to get moving fast in order to stay afloat.

BTW, I start with my mast square to the wind, helps float it better, but the odd time i've had the board pointing slightly downwind, I've been planing before I've stood up....Awesome feeling!

But, yeah, you're right.....it's definitely easier to be facing slightly upwind, allowing time to get it right!

I'll add one....

9. Sail with more experienced w/surfers (if it's OK with them), they'll help you push your limits, and you'll learn heaps....and be let into the loop....meaning getting the sms's, and calls when the wind's up, or someone's keen for a sail!

Select to expand quote

evlPanda said...

...>>>>>
3. Waterstarting (I've got these now ) - Point a bit upwind, about 30-40 degrees. Everything I've read says to place the board parallel. I call bull****. If you're pointing a bit upwind (or at least the sail is, you can always spin the board around when you're up) you can control the power by sheeting in. If you're pointing parallel or a bit downwind sheeting in will turn you into a medieval weapon (that's a catapult).

>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

I think it depends how well powered you are. If underpowered, pointing a bit downwind, makes it easier to get up, but if you're powered will result in a catapult. If well powered you can point a bit upwind and it gives you more control, but point too far upwind when underpowered and you won't get up.

until you have good control of the power I usually suggest to angle the board 45deg into wind as generally your back foot will bring the tail of the board around for you :)

ok time for a bit more advice if anyones up for it (sorry to hi-jack ya thread panda). took note of this thread a while ago and found it a bit of help, but as for water starts ive been practicing in shallow water where i can stand up, which is all good. i can manage to water start by setting myself up while standing then lying down in the water and setting my feet up on the board and getting lifted out, no real probs, have done it now maybe a dozen times. but with that extra confidence i went out today in a decent breeze and even more decent swell, and was in all sortsa trouble. just couldnt get the board and rig into a position quick enough b4 getting swamped by another wave. biggest problem was getting the rig out of the water and above my head. guess i should probly go get a lesson on this stuff but will probly only get taught in controlled conditions and in shallow water which i can already do..... sooo i feel like theres something obvious missing in my technique. could some of you hot sailors think way back to when u first got it or for that matter panda or any of the other beginners who have got it more in recent times to what may help with this problem. cheeeeers people

Select to expand quote

x sport guy said...

ok time for a bit more advice if anyones up for it (sorry to hi-jack ya thread panda). took note of this thread a while ago and found it a bit of help, but as for water starts ive been practicing in shallow water where i can stand up, which is all good. i can manage to water start by setting myself up while standing then lying down in the water and setting my feet up on the board and getting lifted out, no real probs, have done it now maybe a dozen times. but with that extra confidence i went out today in a decent breeze and even more decent swell, and was in all sortsa trouble. just couldnt get the board and rig into a position quick enough b4 getting swamped by another wave. biggest problem was getting the rig out of the water and above my head. guess i should probly go get a lesson on this stuff but will probly only get taught in controlled conditions and in shallow water which i can already do..... sooo i feel like theres something obvious missing in my technique. could some of you hot sailors think way back to when u first got it or for that matter panda or any of the other beginners who have got it more in recent times to what may help with this problem. cheeeeers people

i used to suck at water starts , but im good at them now .

to help , try and find somewhere flat and deep to sail in first and get the hang of them there , ide consider myself competent at them now but the other day i was in the surf at augusta and found them a real struggle when the waves are smashing you while you are trying to get up. i found its mostly timing, inbetween the waves do each step ie line up gear , fly sail ect.
never let go of your boom or you will have to start again. and when it blows just get up and get the hell out of the way of the next wave!

Easiest way to fly the sail is drag the boom across the back of the board.
If boom doesn't reach boom, put one hand on back of board and use that arm to support boom.

If the clew digs in, don't raise the boom, it will only dig in more! If you've managed to get board flotation to help you, pull down slightly on boom, and the clew will slowly pop out.
If you can't engage the back of the board for help, pretend you're a scared kid in bed, and pull the mast over your head as you would the sheets.

In waves, that are very frequent, I point the mast out to sea and sink the rig, hang on to boom and one of the footstraps and let the waves push me out of the impact zone.

Select to expand quote

x sport guy said...

ok time for a bit more advice if anyones up for it (sorry to hi-jack ya thread panda).
...
just couldnt get the board and rig into a position quick enough b4 getting swamped by another wave. biggest problem was getting the rig out of the water and above my head.

When learning the art, it can sometimes help to put your boom in a position where it just touches the back of the board. So when you come off, move the sail so that the board floats the sail. Much less effort and quicker than some of the other ways. Note that this method can get you into bad habits regarding a low boom height, but as a beginner the speed of a quick waterstart will probably outweigh the advantages of a higher boom.

To get board and rig into the right position, grab the back strap with one hand, and the boom with the other. Move the boom over the back of the board. Now swim aggressively upwind with your legs (frog kick), it helps here to have the mast pointing downwind and then as you swim you rotate the mast so it's at 90 degrees to the wind. This will release the sail from the water. As soon as this happens, let go of the back footstrap and grab the boom with both hands. Put your back leg onto the board, kick with the front leg with straight arms as you sheet in, and you're up and away in less time than it takes to read this paragraph

Select to expand quote

decrepit said...

If you can't engage the back of the board for help, pretend you're a scared kid in bed, and pull the mast over your head as you would the sheet.

Yep, this is what got me past the stage you're at. Grab back footstrap with downwind hand, boom near the mast with upwind hand. Fling that sucker over your head like you're doing a weird javelin throw over your head sideways. The clew will clear the water, the sail will be flying, use the back hand on the footstrap to adjust the board angle to the wind according to the windstrength (ie/ light wind = downwind; strong wind=upwind), put that back hand on the boom, sheet in and go. All this becomes easier as your sail size decreases - flipping a 4.2 out of the water is childs play compared to a 6.5. Anything larger than 6.5 I have no experience with. Good luck!

Easiest to fly sail from tip of mast, more leverage if you need it. Raise mast with back hand, work your way down to the boom using legs and free arm keeping the sail flying.

Of course if you are in the surf you may want to fly ASAP from the boom.

I'll update my point a little upwind for waterstarts tip - as above, upwind a little in strong winds, down wind a little if you need more power to get out.

Only problem I'm having now is 5 knot tides against the wind moving everything around the wrong way. Or tide going same speed and direction as the wind and having no leverage. Or being overpowered, getting up to instantly catapult. Or having to swim back because of either of these problems through dirty, out-flowing, (possibly) shark infested tides. It really freaks me out!!!

Select to expand quote

evlPanda said...

Easiest to fly sail from tip of mast, more leverage if you need it. Raise mast with back hand, work your way down to the boom using legs and free arm keeping the sail flying.

Dont do this if you are a beginner. The whole "grab the tip, then walk down the sail" thing only works once you know how to waterstart reliably.

cool as, thanx guys, its almost like your were all out there watching me. flying the rig was definately the major problem and i really didnt have the ideas to get it up. love the tip about using the back of the board to help keep the rig up will be trying that and the other ideas next time out.... whenever that will be... sigh. just not enough time to feed the growing addiction, the good news is thanx to some other tips i was given here im now getting into straps and have much more control overall.

Select to expand quote

mineral1 said...

evlPanda, ya buggered now digger, you figured it out. then fun is kicking in big time for you now, and an empty wallet

mineral1 why's it i have now the same situation

well I am buggered then

Select to expand quote

jp747 said...

mineral1 said...

evlPanda, ya buggered now digger, you figured it out. then fun is kicking in big time for you now, and an empty wallet

mineral1 why's it i have now the same situation

1. That thing that comes with your new mast, that's a "shim". It goes on underneath the boom head and protects the mast from rubbing.

Yes I just figured that out.

No my printed indicators on the mast aren't there anymore.

No I don't really care about the indicators.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

2. Marginal winds are your friend.

Go out in crappy winds to practise tacking, gybes etc. I found a great little channel between two sandbanks the other day, about 15 - 20 seconds from side to side where I had to constantly tack/gybe.

Practise sailing about 80% of the time with one hand on the boom - I didn't realise how uncommited I really was.

Practise clew first beach/water starts - sail control. Actually I was amazed how much power is in the sail when backwards, took me off my feet coupla times in 12 knots.

-------------------------------------

And yes prepare to be addicted.

I thought that was just a humorous figure of speech. It is just like any other vice (although healthier) - arguments with family, money (bought 3rd board last night ), withdrawl symptoms, anxiety, manic highs, its own language. Help. Me.

Further tip..
Always try and park your car downwind, so when you turn your back to grab the boom while rigging up and your sail takes off, it wont hit someone else's car..

Also for those trendsetters with ankylosing spondilitis, who have limited neck rotation a large sign on the sail stating "stand clear may crash jibe at any time".

Go captain chaos

One great tip I learnt against catapulting straight after waterstarting was from a Guy Cribb dvd. You use what he calls "drop ya guts", in other words hang from the boom so you're essentially squating on the board and only stand up when you fully in control. So you can drop you're guts as soon as you get up from a waterstart or you're about to lose control. I used to catapult all the time in overpowered conditions but this simple tip has saved me tons of times. It obviously won't work if you're in the harness at the time.

Select to expand quote

evlPanda said...


And yes prepare to be addicted.

I thought that was just a humorous figure of speech. It is just like any other vice (although healthier) - arguments with family, money (bought 3rd board last night ), withdrawl symptoms, anxiety, manic highs, its own language. Help. Me.

yep had a cool day today, and starting to think about a 2nd board for the kit, dunno how ill hide that from the chief financial officer.... the odd sail or small bit of equipment can dissapear in amongst the junk.... but a whole board..... hmmm

so today thanx to the dude who gave me a few pointers to iron out a couple of my problems with water starts, i had em totally sussed by the end of the day.... whichhh got me thinkin about a smaller board to add to the kit.

.....of course i can justify it though, i figure that a skinnier board than my 69cm wide 120 litre will ride a bit softer in the chop due to less surface area slapping the waves... does that sound right.. and if so any suggestions for size and type. (i weigh about 70 kgs and am lookin to do freeride and bay sailing and heading towards some small wave stuff.

speaking of chop did my first (accidental) chop hop today which ended in a spectacular wipe out and me trying to laugh hysterically underwater.... lost control of the board i think coz i wasnt in the footstraps at the time.... does that sound right too.

as for anxiety and withdrawal symptoms, as if $#@king &ptus taking a month to get my internet connected, after moving house, and not being able to get get out for a sail for 1.5 months due to said house move, finally i got a good outing in and i feel in a much better mood, ahhhh... and so does gf after she went for a good day shopping today.... all is nearly back to normal in the world and am hoping for some good lovin tonight.

Good on ya x sport guy, congrats on the water starts and chop hops!

Not having the net is like not being able to buy bread and milk... Good to hear you're getting back on track though.

About 90 litres would be a good start, probably 57-60 cm wide? Lots of different brands have something along these lines, you're right, a smaller board will bounce around a lot less. It will feel too small when you first get on it, but you CAN sail it, and once you get it going it will feel so much more alive, you'll step back on your 120 litre board and wonder how you ever found it exciting A board that's your weight (in kg's) + 20 litres is still able to be uphauled, so if the wind drops out you're not completely stuffed. Let us know how you get on.

Select to expand quote

nebbian said...
It will feel too small when you first get on it, but you CAN sail it, and once you get it going it will feel so much more alive,

You are not wrong there! I bought Reds old Sonic 95 and got to try it out over the last couple of days. Well what a difference to the GO 155! I feel like I have gone right back to the beginning again. The GO is obviously very forgiving and now I know just how important foot placement is. I managed to get a few runs but spent more time in the water than on it. I think I will need a few days of solid 15 knots just to get used to it rather than the 20 - 25 we had yesterday lol. Have to say though once I was up and going, it was awesome.

Dont headbutt your sail and rip a 2 foot tear right through the panel - LIKE I DID TODAY.

I think Im gonna cry, then look for a new sail. Not happy. Although it was good fun up until that point.

Gotta sort out whether to try to get repaired or too far gone. Any idea anyone?

Depends what the rest of the sail's like, replacing a panel is no big deal for a competent sail maker.
If your head's real sore, that means the material's still strong, but if you went thru the panel without much resistance, it's probably suffering from UV exposure, and the other panels won't be long in going.

The sail is about 4 years old - NP V8 6.6. - It seems in good nick and no discolouration or similar. However it did seem to break pretty easy. I was very suprised it happened.

Can anyone recommend a repairer in NSW or Vic. Might be worth the postage to at least get them to have a look at fixing it.

For a my water start issues I got a lesson and its was priceless. The best advice was as per a lot of the below cooments. 'Use the board as leaverage' it really really helps! Water starting is now begining to see how fast I can get up rather than a pain in the A@# and dread!
Hey Wet Willy - I just got a new Naish Elite harness! 5 hours on the water yesterday with a 6.4 and the harness was awsome and it really helped being able to raise by boom to.

Don't run in thongs!

Today's near death experience while packing up:

- Car is parked on beach side of road.

- Put board on roof, throw straps across from upwind side and...

- ... quickly run around to other side before wind blows board off (a lull), step on own thong, fall on road in front of oncoming car.